Rex Fowler Charged With 1st Degree Murder!

[TheSneakster]

They finally charged him!

Denver Post Article (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14248447)

Michael "The Sneakster Hobson"
I am *not* anonymous. I *do* forgive.

[Dulloldfart]

I wonder if he will plead guilty.

Paul

[Wisened One]

:ohmy: Oh Wow. :no: :sad: Sad. The whole situation is, on both sides. Hope we'll learn the whole story, soon.

[Anonycat]

What a sad, insane person. Just tragic. Sending love to the victim's family and loved ones.

[thetanic]

I'm glad he was charged.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

About time we get some information on this. I hope they don't let Fowler have bail.

[Smurf]

I can tell you what will happen next with the cult.

Just as it occurred in the case of Scientologist Reed Slatkin, convicted of running a Ponzi scheme, the cult will now declare Rex Fowler as an SP so to quickly disassociate themselves from him...

Let him fend for himself and busily retch up the propaganda machine to issue PR releases that Fowler was an insignificant member of Scientology and had very little presence in the cult.

This is a bad PR flap they will work hard to disassociate themselves from. I wonder where Fowler's PR folders are at this very moment??

[thetanic]

About time we get some information on this. I hope they don't let Fowler have bail.

Generally not in first degree cases, especially with an apparent suicide attempt.

[Zinjifar]

Since I don't know him, I'm hoping he *doesn't* plead guilty

I'd like to hear the testimony about how it came to the tragedy and not have it swept under the rug.

Zinj

[Good twin]

I agree with Zinj. A trial will be more damaging to the cult than Fowler. It really depends on how "pan-determined" his thinking is. You see he's gotta be past the "I must protect the church" thought process. He by neccesity has moved into self protection mode.

He has to realize that he has a chance of being found not guilty in wog court. In Scientology on the other had his Comm Ev hasn't even been called and he is definitely guilty in the eyes of the cult. He knows that he will never be accepted back into the church. He MIGHT be accepted back into society outside of the church.

If he can look at this and realize that his Scientology options are nil, he might just do the right thing and spill his guts in open court and plead for mercy. Or if he's really stupid he might think that applying Scientology is the only thing that can save him and he'll say he did it and get declared and have no life except for the fantasy that he'll be taken care of next lifetime.

Damn. No wonder he shot hisself. :omg:

[TalleyWhacker]

I can tell you what will happen next with the cult.

Just as it occurred in the case of Scientologist Reed Slatkin, convicted of running a Ponzi scheme, the cult will now declare Rex Fowler as an SP so to quickly disassociate themselves from him...

Let him fend for himself and busily retch up the propaganda machine to issue PR releases that Fowler was an insignificant member of Scientology and had very little presence in the cult.

This is a bad PR flap they will work hard to disassociate themselves from. I wonder where Fowler's PR folders are at this very moment??

Those folders as well as all ethics folders have been delivered to the police investigators with all overts (imagined and real) , bad thoughts etc. culled out and listed with separate notations. Rest assurred, all such details were completed with proper and standard Flag FESing done so as to save the police (press dead-agenting or MAA) time and effort.

STANDARD OPERATING PROCEDURE.

And since this poor sap has been subjected to years (every six months over years) of this enforced confessional shit in order to stay on OT 7, I have no doubt they can come out of this with a sterling reputation.

"One of the flock has strayed from our teachings. Here's what we were dealing with regarding him."

Don't ya feel warm and comfy now???????????????????????????????????

The "Church's" present tactics are nothing different then any other suppressive regime in history that has ever existed.

If I were ever in that situation, which I would never be again, I wouldn't give them anything but my name, rank and serial number.
It's a fucking war!

[Winston Smith]

Uh, I just turned 58. Whew! Glad I am not in critical condition with a first degree murder charge facing me. No good comes from that Scientology stuff.

[HelluvaHoax!]

My prayers go out to Rex Fowler that his petition to do an extension course while incarcerated awaiting trial is approved.

Can I suggest he do a retread on the "How to guarantee that your Postulates work". That will launch him like a rocket out of jail.

But just in case there is a com lag, while they are processing his leaving routing form, he can do the "Overcoming Wog Injustice and other human attacks on upstat Operating Thetans"

Rex is, sadly, just more proof that when you reach soaring levels of spiritual freedom (like Ron & Mary Sue) the SP's launch these insane attacks.

The very idea of an Operating Thetan in a penitentiary is such a joke and they don't even get it.

Don't they know he can exteriorize any time he wants?

Does anyone have the link to donate money to Rex's defense fund?

[SomeGuy]

Does anyone have the link to donate money to Rex's defense fund?

Sure:

http://thetadollars.com/exteriozed-donations-only-no-wog-dollars-accepted/index.htm

[TalleyWhacker]

Uh, I just turned 58. Whew! Glad I am not in critical condition with a first degree murder charge facing me. No good comes from that Scientology stuff.

Critical condition?...he has a self inflicted bullet hole up through the front part of his skull and he killed a husband and father of what--four kids????
That goes beyond the medical diagnosis of "critical".

58?
Damn, sorry to hear that.
How's your erectile dysfunction?

And I thought the next step on the Bridge would handle that for me...
*&^*&^$%^$%34534!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TalleyWhacker]

My prayers go out to Rex Fowler that his petition to do an extension course while incarcerated awaiting trial is approved.

Can I suggest he do a retread on the the "How to guarantee that your Postulates work". That will launch him like a rocket out of jail.

But just in case there is a com lag, while they are processing his leaving routing form, he can do the "Overcoming Wog Injustice and other human attacks on upstat Operating Thetans"

Rex is, sadly, just more proof that when you reach soaring levels of spiritual freedom (like Ron & Mary Sue) the SP's launch these insane attacks.

The very idea of an Operating Thetan in a penitentiary is such a joke and they don't even get it.

Don't they know he can exteriorize any time he wants?

Does anyone have the link to donate money to Rex's defense fund?



Damn...aint that the truth?!?!?!?

[TalleyWhacker]

My prayers go out to Rex Fowler that his petition to do an extension course while incarcerated awaiting trial is approved.

Can I suggest he do a retread on the the "How to guarantee that your Postulates work". That will launch him like a rocket out of jail.

But just in case there is a com lag, while they are processing his leaving routing form, he can do the "Overcoming Wog Injustice and other human attacks on upstat Operating Thetans"

Rex is, sadly, just more proof that when you reach soaring levels of spiritual freedom (like Ron & Mary Sue) the SP's launch these insane attacks.

The very idea of an Operating Thetan in a penitentiary is such a joke and they don't even get it.

Don't they know he can exteriorize any time he wants?

Does anyone have the link to donate money to Rex's defense fund?



Anyone need a link to my PayPal account?????

[HelluvaHoax!]

Anyone need a link to my PayPal account?????


Sure, but only if you are sooooo OT and sooooo cause over life that SPs targeted you with so many attacks that you went total effect.

We are not going to just send donations to you without proof that the WHY for your collapse is that you are Flourishing & Prospering. :D

[degraded being]

If he is headed for the slammer, and no way out, what options does he have for damage control. Only one that I can see. Plead insanity. Now wouldn't that be good for OSA COS? Let's do a reg cycle on that from Les Dane:
"Offer them a choice".
To OSA:
So, how would you like to get yourself further into the shit with this? Would you like to have a PR flap about an OT 7 Scientologist who murdered someone, attempted suicide, and went to jail for the remaining years of his life, or would you like to get further into the shit with a PR flap about an OT 7 Scientologist who comitted murder, attemped suicide, but did not have to go to jail because he was insane???????

I guess OSA stats are rather crashed, eh what?

[GreyWolf]

The absolute nerve of Fowlers wife. Her ridiculous claimes that they would not understand what they read. Her main fear and the fear of scientology is that they would read and understand the papers. Also, one shot would be self defense. Three shots is murder. She is full of S**T.

[Feral]

This is so tragic, I've drilled and studied along side of this bloke at FLAG, he, like me, thought he was going OT, able to get into a frame of mind where he could breast this universe with ease. Cause over life!

I knew I was struggling with the level of pressure being on lines caused me, I didn't know everyone else was too.

I certainly wouldn't have guessed he was under such pressure that murdering someone would be a possible 'solution' for him.

This is the fraud of the 'bridge to total freedom'.


Police also found a briefcase and a typed note, dated Dec. 30 and signed by Fowler, that advised there was nothing confidential in the satchel and that it should be given to his wife, Janet.

When Janet Fowler was interviewed by detectives, she told them she wanted the briefcase returned immediately.

"It is important to me and my church. It is religious material and I want it now," she said to investigators. "Even if you looked at it, and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant. I want it back right now."

This is his solo nots material. We were all implanted to protect the confidentiality of the materials at all cost. This might explain why the note was dated the SAME day as the shooting.

Can you imagine the level of duress you would have to put on someone that would make them think of their PC folder on the day they'd shot their business partner?

Well, that's the amount of implant the cult lays in with their six month checks. Bloody hell!

[Panda Termint]

Yes, Feral, I had exactly the same thoughts.

[Feral]

To be honest I feel sick to my bones about this.

It's just too real, I keep thinking about the family of the deceased. Fowler's wife and kids.

I know the kind of pressure he was put under by the cult. I did over 20 of those six month checks and each one would tighten the screws further.

It's not easy being an "OT" when your life is crumbling and your miserable.

Remember that poor fellow who was Nancy Cartright's ex?

I'm afraid we're going to see an awful lot more of this amongst the "elite".

The Church has destroyed these lives, make no mistake.

[TheSneakster]

This is so tragic, I've drilled and studied along side of this bloke at FLAG, he, like me, thought he was going OT, able to get into a frame of mind where he could breast this universe with ease. Cause over life!

I knew I was struggling with the level of pressure being on lines caused me, I didn't know everyone else was too.

I certainly wouldn't have guessed he was under such pressure that murdering someone would be a possible 'solution' for him.

This is the fraud of the 'bridge to total freedom'.



This is his solo nots material. We were all implanted to protect the confidentiality of the materials at all cost. This might explain why the note was dated the SAME day as the shooting.

Can you imagine the level of duress you would have to put on someone that would make them think of their PC folder on the day they'd shot their business partner?

Well, that's the amount of implant the cult lays in with their six month checks. Bloody hell!

If that note is authentic, it would seem like pretty clear evidence of premeditation of at least his own attempted suicide. No Scio who knew that was his Solo NOTS materials would have left it at the crime scene, either.

Now here is an odd thought. Those materials are only kept with you when solo auditing or travelling to/from Flag or The Freewinds. Why were they even there at the business office ?

Michael "The Sneakster" Hobson
I am *not* anonymous. I *do* forgive.

[degraded being]

The absolute nerve of Fowlers wife. Her ridiculous claimes that they would not understand what they read. Her main fear and the fear of scientology is that they would read and understand the papers. Also, one shot would be self defense. Three shots is murder. She is full of S**T.


But I love the way she just hands the motive to the police, and I love the way she drags SCIENTOLOGY into it, even suggesting that violence would be natural for a scientologist. She may have been using that defensively, but in the circumstances it's a bad!! strategy if she wants any leniency for her hub.
Ooooops! OSA didn't get to her quickly enough to coach her.

[Truth&Honesty]

Ideal Scene -

Cult leaves Fowler in the dust......court appointed defense attorney (Fowler's broke remember) advises him that he must have been insane (which he was) and therefore recommends a plea of insanity.

Fowler interviews with a psych.....mmmm....psych seems like such a nice and compassionate fellow. Psych explains how brain washing works.....big cognition!!!!! Psych testifies that Fowler was totally brainwashed and not thinking rationally.

Fowler destimulates in Jail. Fowler comes out a few years later, having full access to the internet during his incarceration. He is howling mad and writes a bestseller about the dangers of the cult.



T&H

[Enthetan]

They finally charged him!

Denver Post Article (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14248447)

Michael "The Sneakster Hobson"
I am *not* anonymous. I *do* forgive.

So his severance was $9,900. Doesn't seem like enough for a business owner to shoot a guy over.

I'm thinking that Ciancio was steamed over the $200K that was skimmed out of the company



Employees of the software company, which reportedly had suffered financial difficulties since 2008, related in part to the transfer of as much as $200,000 to a church or charity by Fowler, told investigators that Ciancio arrived around 10 a.m. Dec. 30 to collect his check.


I'm thinking that Ciancio blamed this for the state of the company, considered part of it to be HIS money as a partner in the company, and wanted it.

[Feral]

If that note is authentic, it would seem like pretty clear evidence of premeditation of at least his own attempted suicide. No Scio who knew that was his Solo NOTS materials would have left it at the crime scene, either.

Now here is an odd thought. Those materials are only kept with you when solo auditing or travelling to/from Flag or The Freewinds. Why were they even there at the business office ?

Michael "The Sneakster" Hobson
I am *not* anonymous. I *do* forgive.


We were all expected to audit 6 times a day, it necessitated auditing at work as well as traveling with the materials.

[Carmel]

Yep, a tragedy for all concerned. Too sad.

Given that this incident happened, yeah, I too hope that the opportunity this presents (to expose much), is made the most of, as part of the effort to prevent such tragedies in the future.

[Winston Smith]

Critical condition?...he has a self inflicted bullet hole up through the front part of his skull and he killed a husband and father of what--four kids????
That goes beyond the medical diagnosis of "critical".

58?
Damn, sorry to hear that.
How's your erectile dysfunction?

And I thought the next step on the Bridge would handle that for me...
*&^*&^$%^$%34534!!!!!!!!!!!!

Asshole.

[degraded being]

Ideal Scene -

Cult leaves Fowler in the dust......court appointed defense attorney (Fowler's broke remember) advises him that he must have been insane (which he was) and therefore recommends a plea of insanity.

Fowler interviews with a psych.....mmmm....psych seems like such a nice and compassionate fellow. Psych explains how brain washing works.....big cognition!!!!! Psych testifies that Fowler was totally brainwashed and not thinking rationally.

Fowler destimulates in Jail. Fowler comes out a few years later, having full access to the internet during his incarceration. He is howling mad and writes a bestseller about the dangers of the cult.



T&H

I see....Fowler leaves the secure ward for his first session with the psychatrist. Psych tells him to sit down and says:
"Could you please pick up the cans........
I am NOT auditing you..."
Later that evening Fowler found dead in room. Suicide sucessful. PTS SIT terminatedly handled.

[HelluvaHoax!]

If he is headed for the slammer, and no way out, what options does he have for damage control----clipped----

Degraded, so true!

And so tragic because the WHY could have been avoided so easily.

Ya see, Rex Fowler was applying policy. He actually did not know that the Fair Game Policy was canceled! So he was doing what Ron said...

When he got the briefing, the OSA guy said Fair Game was canceled. But Rex mis-obnosed his nervous twitches and thought the guy was winking.

All so unnecessary, if people only did what Ron really said...errr, if they only did what Ron didn't say. You know what I mean! (twitch, twitch, twitch....)

[skollie]

In Fowler's vehicle, detectives say the found several personal letters between Fowler and a female employee of his.

The letters discuss the financial issues with Ciancio.

Investigators say in one of the notes, the woman told Fowler she did not trust Ciancio and that their problem needed to be resolved.


From 9News
http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=131288&catid=339

[Mick Wenlock]

To be honest I feel sick to my bones about this.

It's just too real, I keep thinking about the family of the deceased. Fowler's wife and kids.

I know the kind of pressure he was put under by the cult. I did over 20 of those six month checks and each one would tighten the screws further.

It's not easy being an "OT" when your life is crumbling and your miserable.

Remember that poor fellow who was Nancy Cartright's ex?

I'm afraid we're going to see an awful lot more of this amongst the "elite".

The Church has destroyed these lives, make no mistake.


Kev,

It is a frightening thought that these walking time bombs are being created week in and week out.

I feel sorry for Fowler and his family - I feel a damn sight sorrier for Thomas Ciancio and his family.

No winners only losers.

Dammit.

[Mick Wenlock]

first degree murder in Colorado carries the death penalty.

[Mrs Pattycake]

This is so, so terrible ... I am sorry for the whole damn thing.

During my time on OTVII, I experienced (and saw many other OTVII's endure the same) constant badgering by the regs to donate to the many varied projects and front groups as well as services whilst on the OTVII treadmill. In fact it was part of the routing form to see all the regs for the various "projects". It was at its worst on my last visit to Flag - the release of the Basics sent the entire base into reg mode - I can only imagine that it has become even worse over the last two years.

I can hear the stupid lines REX would of been told, about how it was his duty as an OT VII, and how he should just donate right NOW and he should not go into agreement with the MEST universe, he was OT and he would be able to make it go right.

But then the economic downturn and no matter what he did - it would not be going right enough ... the pressure, the invalidation of himself as an OT, because he couldn't make it go right. Then a partner questioning his decision and disagreeing with the sizable donation ... more pressure ... counter intention to him making things go right ...

I hope that the reg or regs responsible for putting Fowler into such a predicament are able to confront their part in this crime ! I hope his wife wakes the fuck up and realizes what really caused the situation and takes some responsibility.

To the victims - I am so sorry for your loss and the hurt you are now going through - I think all of us exes are here because were want to stop things like this from occurring - I am sorry we did not make enough impact in time - but we will continue the fight against the insanity of the C of S .

.

[Tom of Helatrobus]

So let me get this right here.

First he gives over $200K to Scientology, with no regrets. Then he shoots Ciancio 3 times in the head over $10K? Wrong target? Do you think?

I just can not believe that Fowler software gave 200K to Scientology. Well, I believe it but...

"It is important to me and my church. It is religious material and I want it now," she said to investigators. "Even if you looked at it, and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant. I want it back right now." - Janet Fowler.

Thanks Janet. I've read all that stuff on the internet, but thanks for sounding crazy! BTW, by "normal person" do you mean a person who doesn't go around shooting people?

I'm glad to hear that charges are being pressed. I hope they don't let him out on bail. I live in Denver, you know!

[ARC]

If you want to digg the story, here is a link: http://digg.com/world_news/OT_VII_Scientology_minister_charged_with_murder

[BAYCB]

It's strange that per the Ethics book "First degree murder, arson, disintegration of persons or belongings" is a High Crime but also has "Public disavowal of Scientology or Scientologists in good standing with Scientology Organizations." also as a High Crime.


How can the later even come close to the act of murder?


I feel sad for all the victims (both families) in this case.

[Gail Pike]

"One thing I need is his briefcase," Jan Fowler said in the affidavit. "It was taken out of his office. It is important to me, my church, and it is religious material and I want it now!"

Detectives had not reviewed the briefcase yet, so they told her she could not have it.

"Even if you looked at it and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant," she responded.

[I told you I was trouble]

"One thing I need is his briefcase," Jan Fowler said in the affidavit. "It was taken out of his office. It is important to me, my church, and it is religious material and I want it now!"

Detectives had not reviewed the briefcase yet, so they told her she could not have it.

"Even if you looked at it and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant," she responded.

Yep, amazing isn't it?

Even with her Husband half dead and another person actually dead she still managed to "get her priorities right" ... and attempt to protect the cofs (her Tr's must have been out though).

:whistling:

Robotic, would be the word that comes to mind (amongst others).

:omg:

Ferals and Mrs P's data on the harassment they would have tolerated from the cofs make this story terribly sad and quite scary ...

Welcome BTW.

:eyeroll:

[Mockingbird6]

My take on this now is really going off the deep end:

Suppose you were on OTVII and being driven crazy?

You consider suicide as a way to protest what the church is doing to you, but what if you've heard about other suicides and how they all got swept under the rug? How can you contrive your suicide so that it can't be hidden or denied?

Wow, kill someone else first! What a brilliant, twisted, crazy idea! But you're already being driven crazy, remember, so it fits! Oh, and the victim has to be a non-Scientologist, or else it still might be hushed up by an agreement within the group not to say anything about it.

IF you wanted to go out in a manner that couldn't be swept under the rug, THIS would serve.

And poor Ciancio is PTS to Rex being PTS to the CoS. How's that for a bad stroke of luck?

[Zinjifar]

I'll be interested in these 'letters' and whether they're really with a female 'employee' or someone from the 'Church' and whether the 'don't trust' element has to do with the 'Church'.

And, the 'religious documents' in the briefcase could be interesting too.

Wouldn't it be ironic if it was something like this that turned out to be the loose thread that finally unraveled the Scientology sweater?

Zinj

[Mystic]

Ah the battles over the useless Hubbard-spewed information spewed into language and then spewed onto paper, with ink no less. Well, OK. I think we have seen here an iceberg-tip of the chaos which will magnify in time as the cult continues to die. This is a really ugly occurrence for all parties involved. My heart goes out to them. But! Methinks the inner happenings among the cultists is just going to get worse...and worse...and worse...and ....

[Feral]

I'll be interested in these 'letters' and whether they're really with a female 'employee' or someone from the 'Church' and whether the 'don't trust' element has to do with the 'Church'.

And, the 'religious documents' in the briefcase could be interesting too.

Wouldn't it be ironic if it was something like this that turned out to be the loose thread that finally unraveled the Scientology sweater?

Zinj

Interesting point. The brief case will contain his priest penitent data, including his daily rudiments, ARCXs, PTPS and WHs. Data about his relationship and difficulties with his victim will be there.

Less significantly it will contain notes and records describing his NOTS handlings.

If he was so troubled by Ciancio that he shot him all of the past problems and data will be there in the form of brief notes, that undoubtedly will form part of the polices case.

It will certainly be very enlightening about the incidents that led to this tragic out come, but may not be very flattering for the CofS.

If the police need any help interpreting those worksheets I'm sure dozens of Solo NOTs auditors will be eager to explain the mumbo jumbo in them so even a 'normal' person could understand them..

[Gus]

Wow, even the murder weapon, purchased by his kid, was traced to to the kid's address on L. Ron Hubbard Way. The thread of Scientology is woven all through this mess.

Gus

[Iknowtoomuch]

I wonder if this was planned the whole time. The gun, folder, letter killing. Like he knew he was fucked either way. So he made an attempt on his own life.
Just thinking out loud here.

[Feral]

In a recent security upgrade we were instructed to put a note on our safes, (which BTW is bolted and glued to the floor and wall and hidden inside a purpose built cabinet with the solo nots W/Ss inside a locked briefcase within this, all of this MUST be within a locked building with a back to base alarm)

The note needed to read; "The materials herein have no comercial value, should they be found and returned to me, tel xxxx xxxx a reward of $500 will be paid in the case they are unopened and intact".

Rex possibly had this in mind on the 30th Dec some time before shooting himself. His note tends to say he had his materials on his mind either before or after shooting his partner Cianco.

The other thing that keeps playing in my head is the $200,000 donation. I can just hear the reg fending off Rex's protests that he has responsibilities to his partners with; ''Well, when we save the planet every one will thank you, remember they are on this dirtball on the same terms as the rest of us, it's the greatest good that you donate this money, and you're sure to make it go right as an OT!"

Just some thoughts from having been there at the "friendliest place on earth"

[Thrak]

This really makes me sick. This is what "the bridge" does to people. I can totally relate to the pressure one experiences from the constant regging and constant invalidation of one's need to survive. And putting yourself in a really tight position totally at the mercy of events you can't control. It makes people go insane.

You are promised these incredible states so amazing that it is worth EVERYTHING you can get your hands on to attain them and so in the process commit more and more destructive acts against yourself and others. It turns you into a sort of animal just searching for your next scrap of food and ready to bite the hand off anybody who tries to take a bit of what's yours. And when you have to - are expected to - lie to yourself and everybody else about the "wins" that aren't materializing, and have to suppress the thoughts that none of this was worth it, it starts to send you over the edge.

I think david miscavige is probably the most deplorable human being I know of. I know "ron" started this whole thing, but people are here and now and have choices as to what they do. "ron" is DEAD. Most of us here played along for a while but then said "this is a fucked up game and I'm not playing anymore". dm could have made the same decision like the rest of us instead he decided his own ego was more important than anything including human life. And he has shown time and time again that he views people as expendable and couldn't care less what happens to them as long as he get what he wants from them. Think about it, they promise helping yourself, your family, and everyone on the planet but in reality they are only conning people in to participating in their own destruction.

I'm sure he'll never realize that people who make their fortunes from destroying people never end up happy and usually end up insane. It's far too late for him to realize anything. May he rot in hell.

[TalleyWhacker]

Nasty business that OT 7 along with the unrelenting sec checks and reg cycles...I had it and the associated costs paid for years...only awaiting my arrival.
Quite pleased with my decesion some years ago not to go for that one. The idea of someone having a periscope up my ass for 5-8 years was just damned unappealling to me.
I sympathize for the families and their losses.

[TalleyWhacker]

This really makes me sick. This is what "the bridge" does to people. I can totally relate to the pressure one experiences from the constant regging and constant invalidation of one's need to survive. And putting yourself in a really tight position totally at the mercy of events you can't control. It makes people go insane.

You are promised these incredible states so amazing that it is worth EVERYTHING you can get your hands on to attain them and so in the process commit more and more destructive acts against yourself and others. It turns you into a sort of animal just searching for your next scrap of food and ready to bite the hand off anybody who tries to take a bit of what's yours. And when you have to - are expected to - lie to yourself and everybody else about the "wins" that aren't materializing, and have to suppress the thoughts that none of this was worth it, it starts to send you over the edge.

I think david miscavige is probably the most deplorable human being I know of. I know "ron" started this whole thing, but people are here and now and have choices as to what they do. "ron" is DEAD. Most of us here played along for a while but then said "this is a fucked up game and I'm not playing anymore". dm could have made the same decision like the rest of us instead he decided his own ego was more important than anything including human life. And he has shown time and time again that he views people as expendable and couldn't care less what happens to them as long as he get what he wants from them.

I'm sure he'll never realize that people who make their fortunes from destroying people never end up happy and usually end up insane. It's far too late for him to realize anything. May he rot in hell.



Thrak--He's there now. Can't you smell it?

And he's paying retail every day and every day that passes, the price is going up.

[DavidM]

TV coverage:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WmfwTDMiJg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfOztY4Ncmc

A terrible tragedy. I can't imagine what Ciancio's family must be going through right now.

[Dulloldfart]

If that note is authentic, it would seem like pretty clear evidence of premeditation of at least his own attempted suicide. No Scio who knew that was his Solo NOTS materials would have left it at the crime scene, either.

Now here is an odd thought. Those materials are only kept with you when solo auditing or travelling to/from Flag or The Freewinds. Why were they even there at the business office ?


What materials? I agree with the evidence-of-premeditation angle. I would guess that the satchel/briefcase was what he *usually* carried his confidential materials in, but this time they weren't there. The note doesn't make sense otherwise.

Paul

[degraded being]

Forget about scientology VS the religion of scientology.
Forget about Ratty going against the COS VS LRH.

In this episode they are all tied up together.
L Ron Hubbards's name.
The "religious" documents.
The "religious organization" that was paid huge sums of money.
Its all part of the same disaster.

OSA will not have an easy job trying to compartmentalise itself or its "religion" away from this disaster (PR flap).

[Mick Wenlock]

the scientology connection is making tis way into the reporting

Denver Post article (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14248447)

[Good twin]

OSA will not have an easy job trying to compartmentalise itself or its "religion" away from this disaster (PR flap).

The only good news about this whole tragedy.

[anonyvix]

When Janet Fowler was interviewed by detectives, she told them she wanted the briefcase returned immediately.

"It is important to me and my church. It is religious material and I want it now," she said to investigators. "Even if you looked at it, and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant. I want it back right now."


Perhaps some ex's might like to offer their services to the police to help them translate the contents of the satchel as it might shed light on his motives and state of mind.

[Enthetan]

"It is important to me and my church. It is religious material and I want it now," she said to investigators. "Even if you looked at it, and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant. I want it back right now." - Janet Fowler.


Her "No, don't look there!" just guaranteed the investigators would take a deep interest in those materials, and that they would also try to contact people who could explain the materials to the investigators.



Thanks Janet. I've read all that stuff on the internet, but thanks for sounding crazy! BTW, by "normal person" do you mean a person who doesn't go around shooting people?

I'm glad to hear that charges are being pressed. I hope they don't let him out on bail. I live in Denver, you know!

There is no way Fowler would be given bail.

[Enthetan]

They finally charged him!

Denver Post Article (http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14248447)

Michael "The Sneakster Hobson"
I am *not* anonymous. I *do* forgive.

Um, guys?

The article says


Investigators say the gun was registered to Andrew Hyung Fowler, 26, who lived at 1413 L. Ron Hubbard Way in Los Angeles, when it was purchased. In interviews with police, Andrew Fowler said he gave the gun to his father for Christmas in 2007.


1413 L. Ron Hubbard Way is
the street address of ASHO!

Trying to conceal the Scientology connection just became totally impossible.

[AngeloV]

My sympathy to the family of the deceased.

From the 9News article:

"The document also said the 9mm handgun found at the scene was registered to Fowler's son, with an address of L. Ron Hubbard Way in Los Angeles, Calif. Hubbard is the founder of Scientology."

The words "9mm handgun", scio and LRH in the same sentence. What a disaster for their PR machine.

OTs killing wogs...frightening stuff.

[Cherished]

To be honest I feel sick to my bones about this.

It's just too real, I keep thinking about the family of the deceased. Fowler's wife and kids.

I know the kind of pressure he was put under by the cult. I did over 20 of those six month checks and each one would tighten the screws further.

It's not easy being an "OT" when your life is crumbling and your miserable.

Remember that poor fellow who was Nancy Cartright's ex?

I'm afraid we're going to see an awful lot more of this amongst the "elite".

The Church has destroyed these lives, make no mistake.

It's when I see what a mess made by Rex Fowler and the awful tragedy that was the end of Steve Brackett's life (http://forums.whyweprotest.net/123-leaks-legal/steve-brackett-ot-commits-suicide-47025/), that your own escape from the hell of being a public OTVII is made all the more "real" to me, Feral.

[Wisened One]

When Janet Fowler was interviewed by detectives, she told them she wanted the briefcase returned immediately.
"It is important to me and my church. It is religious material and I want it now," she said to investigators. "Even if you looked at it, and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant. I want it back right now."


Oh the arrogance of it all... :eyeroll:

[Enthetan]

Investigators say the gun was registered to Andrew Hyung Fowler, 26, who lived at 1413 L. Ron Hubbard Way in Los Angeles, when it was purchased. In interviews with police, Andrew Fowler said he gave the gun to his father for Christmas in 2007.


Given that the address is ASHO, which would imply that Andrew Fowler was a SO member (or perhaps an outer-org student on training at ASHO), does anybody else think that HCO might not approve of a guy owning a handgun while in residence at ASHO?

[Div6]

Wow. They even noticed the ESMB\WWP communities:



Several websites that scrutinize Scientology have been following this case, with links to records that allegedly reveal Fowler was a senior Scientologist. The sites claim that Fowler Software was a member of the World Institute of Scientology Enterprises.



Article was updated just a short time ago: http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14251372

[TalleyWhacker]

OSA Lurkers--Pay attention to this one:
Solution to having Church involved and throwing all remaining members of the Fowler family under the bus....he can cop a plea and avoid capital punishment and then become the first OT 7 "in-house" Criminon supervisor.

Think of the wins!!

[Mockingbird6]

Not a lawyer myself, but I have heard of a thing called "FRAUDULENT CONVEYANCE" which I believe is applicable here.

When your company is not doing well, if you "pass" money in some way to another group (perhaps you have some personal interest in that group?) it is

- ILLEGAL!!!!!

It would behoove the Ciancio family to look into this as a means of getting the investment back.

I have heard of the CofS/IAS refunding donations when the money was obtained illegally (Heilig in Germany was one). Have them give it all to the Ciancio's--a very small repayment for a man's life.

[Thrak]

I just hope this stories has legs. Of course we can't presume we know what happened at this point, but an "OT" committing murder and attempting suicide with all of these scn connections in plain view hopefully can show people what scn can do to people and how they operate.

[TalleyWhacker]

Not a lawyer myself, but I have heard of a thing called "FRAUDULENT CONVEYANCE" which I believe is applicable here.

When your company is not doing well, if you "pass" money in some way to another group (perhaps you have some personal interest in that group?) it is

- ILLEGAL!!!!!

It would behoove the Ciancio family to look into this as a means of getting the investment back.

I have heard of the CofS/IAS refunding donations when the money was obtained illegally (Heilig in Germany was one). Have them give it all to the Ciancio's--a very small repayment for a man's life.



So they are all of sudden going to change their ways and become a benevolent and compassionate organization??????????????????????

That will be a cold day in Hell.

[Mick Wenlock]

Given that the address is ASHO, which would imply that Andrew Fowler was a SO member (or perhaps an outer-org student on training at ASHO), does anybody else think that HCO might not approve of a guy owning a handgun while in residence at ASHO?

don't know. It never used to be a problem when I was at Flag.

[Mick Wenlock]

Not a lawyer myself, but I have heard of a thing called "FRAUDULENT CONVEYANCE" which I believe is applicable here.

When your company is not doing well, if you "pass" money in some way to another group (perhaps you have some personal interest in that group?) it is

- ILLEGAL!!!!!

It would behoove the Ciancio family to look into this as a means of getting the investment back.

I have heard of the CofS/IAS refunding donations when the money was obtained illegally (Heilig in Germany was one). Have them give it all to the Ciancio's--a very small repayment for a man's life.


:goodposting::iagree:

[Zinjifar]

I suspect the mere mention of Reed Slatkin would have the 'Church' scrambling to return donations. Some anyway. The ones they couldn't hide.

Of course, the money may not be the *only* PR fiasko here.

Zinj

[Enthetan]

Not a lawyer myself, but I have heard of a thing called "FRAUDULENT CONVEYANCE" which I believe is applicable here.

When your company is not doing well, if you "pass" money in some way to another group (perhaps you have some personal interest in that group?) it is

- ILLEGAL!!!!!

It would behoove the Ciancio family to look into this as a means of getting the investment back.

I have heard of the CofS/IAS refunding donations when the money was obtained illegally (Heilig in Germany was one). Have them give it all to the Ciancio's--a very small repayment for a man's life.

Possibly this is what Ciancio threatened to do. As a partner/investor in the firm, he would have a right to contest the $200K payment is being unrelated to the business of being a software firm. The threat of what might happen to Fowler should IAS (or whoever it was) being forced to cough up the money may have caused Fowler to snap.

[Enthetan]

don't know. It never used to be a problem when I was at Flag.

I would think that if lots of SO members owned guns, it would only be a matter of time before one decided that he didn't feel like being RPF'ed, or prevented from blowing.

[Axiom142]

Well the situation seems to have panned out pretty much as we speculated, but the details are shocking and very, very damaging for the CoS.

Firstly, the person being charged with murder, Rex Fowler, is at the pinnacle of the Scientology Bridge to spiritual enlightenment. Therefore, by Scientology’s own definition, should be one of the most ethical and sane people on this planet. But, Fowler’s actions put the lie to this.

I have no doubt that Fowler viewed Ciancio as an SP who threatened him and his ‘religion’ and had to be stopped. Cultists think like this and they are unable to see the consequences of their actions.

We have seen murders in the CoS before, but the world is a different place now and people everywhere are beginning to join up the dots.

From the article: “Employees of the software company, which reportedly had suffered financial difficulties since 2008, related in part to the transfer of as much as $200,000 to a church or charity by Fowler, told investigators that Ciancio arrived around 10 a.m. Dec. 30 to collect his check.”

I think we can guess where that $200,000 went. This immediately paints a picture of a businessman being coerced to give money to the cult. Money that his company could ill afford, given their poor financial position. The media won’t have to go far to find many other cases where Scientologists have been made to give money to the cult, resulting in financial collapse. This is inevitably going to cause a lot of distress and quite probably suicidal thoughts.

Even Fowler’s wife has to butt in with a Scientologist’s typically blinkered and inappropriate rhetoric: ‘Janet Fowler also reportedly told investigators that her husband "is a Scientologist and would not have gone without a fight. He would have grabbed a gun in a struggle and would not have let someone shoot him."’

Way to go Janet! Just in case anyone missed that Fowler was a Scientologist and you imply that Scientologists are aggressive. This is also very sad, because here we can see that Mrs Fowler is unable to believe that her husband was talking to a man at his desk, pulled out a gun and shot him 3 times in the head. She seems to have convinced herself that somehow Ciancio was the aggressor, and that Fowler heroically fought him off even after being shot once in the head and then wrestled the gun from Ciancio and then shot him 3 times in the head.

I mean, how delusional can you be? She probably thinks that this is all a plot by the ‘psychs’ to discredit Scientology.

Hopefully, she will come to see the part that the cult of Scientology has played in wrecking their lives.

And to cap it all, his son who gave him the gun, lives on L Ron Hubbard way!

“Investigators say the gun was registered to Andrew Hyung Fowler, 26, who lived at 1413 L. Ron Hubbard Way in Los Angeles, when it was purchased. In interviews with police, Andrew Fowler said he gave the gun to his father for Christmas in 2007.”

Since I don’t know too much about US gun laws, could someone who might know, tell us if it would be legal for one person to buy and register a gun and then just give it to someone else? Could the son face criminal charges?

This is obviously a terrible tragedy for everyone involved. I have to agree with Feral that it is highly likely that we will see other cases like this as the cult starts to unravel and those who have gambled their whole lives on the dream of Total Freedom have the shocking realisation that they have thrown everything away on a con. When I had my run-in with OTVIII George Baillie, it was very graphically brought home to me, just what being at the top of the Bridge and refusing to see the truth could do to someone’s sanity. The anger, fear, and frustration resulting from knowing that you have been betrayed and wasted you whole life, is enough to send anyone over the edge.

Barring Fowler claiming to have been driven insane by the teachings of this church, it is difficult to see how this could be any worse for the ‘church’ of Scientology.

Axiom142

[Zinjifar]

Since I don’t know too much about US gun laws, could someone who might know, tell us if it would be legal for one person to buy and register a gun and then just give it to someone else? Could the son face criminal charges?

It'd depend on the local ordinances and whether a 9mm pistol would need to be registered at all. There's no particular national law on registration or private sales/gifts. That he gave his address on Elron Way though is meaningful. Was that actually his residence in LA? We don't know. He might be liable if he gave false information or if Colorady/city has specific rules.

Zinj

[Dulloldfart]

That he gave his address on Elron Way though is meaningful. Was that actually his residence in LA? We don't know.

Yes we do. It wasn't. It's ASHO's address (http://losangeles.citysearch.com/profile/map/53471/los_angeles_ca/american_st_hill_organization.html).

Paul

[Zinjifar]

Yes we do. It wasn't. It's ASHO's address (http://losangeles.citysearch.com/profile/map/53471/los_angeles_ca/american_st_hill_organization.html).

Paul

But, was he Sea Org and that his *only* address? It is illegal to give false info.

Zinj

[Mockingbird6]

Cultists think like this and they are unable to see the consequences of their actions.
Axiom142

Love ya, and although I like a lot of your analysis, I disagree with this statement. True Scios see the results of their actions very well when those results would be bad PR for the church. Their lives are ruled by "what would the church think of me, what would people think of the church, if I did X?" (Everyone raise your hand if you were "in" and never had this thought!)

That is why I think Rex Fowler had reached the breaking point and was deliberately trying to bring bad repute on the church by his actions--see my earlier post elaborating on this.

I agree that further insanities existed, but I still think his basic statement, by what he did, exposes the church in ways they cannot cover up, and that was his intention.

[Axiom142]

It'd depend on the local ordinances and whether a 9mm pistol would need to be registered at all. There's no particular national law on registration or private sales/gifts. That he gave his address on Elron Way though is meaningful. Was that actually his residence in LA? We don't know. He might be liable if he gave false information or if Colorady/city has specific rules.

Zinj

Thanks for that Zinj.

I know that I am straying into very dangerous territory here, but the thought that someone can buy a powerful handgun and then just give it to another person to do with as they please and no one has to get a license or inform the police makes me very sad.


Axiom142

[Smurf]

Yes we do. It wasn't. It's ASHO's address (http://losangeles.citysearch.com/profile/map/53471/los_angeles_ca/american_st_hill_organization.html).

Paul


It's confirmed on this 2005 list as well - under "1413 L Ron Hubbard Way, Los Angeles, CA 90027-5903 -"ASHO"

http://www.lermanet.com/2005-scientology-california-staff-list.htm

[Free2Dream]

Since I don’t know too much about US gun laws, could someone who might know, tell us if it would be legal for one person to buy and register a gun and then just give it to someone else? Could the son face criminal charges?
Axiom142

It is unfortunate, but the state of Colorado does not require the registration of firearms, there are no regulations regarding bringing a firearm from another state, and there are no restrictions on the transfer of firearms to another person unless that person is a federally licensed firearm dealer.

The gun may have been registered by his son when he initially bought it, but there isn't anything stopping him from giving it to his father.

I think the only way his son could be implicated would be if he knew his father was going to use it in the commission of a crime. Since his son gave it to him in 2007, I doubt he would have had knowledge that it would eventually be used to murder someone.

[Feral]

What materials? I agree with the evidence-of-premeditation angle. I would guess that the satchel/briefcase was what he *usually* carried his confidential materials in, but this time they weren't there. The note doesn't make sense otherwise.

Paul


The materials more than likely were in there. The note is a red herring, see my earlier post on the matter.

The materials only leave the briefcase while you are auditing. SOP.

[Mick Wenlock]

It is unfortunate, but the state of Colorado does not require the registration of firearms, there are no regulations regarding bringing a firearm from another state, and there are no restrictions on the transfer of firearms to another person unless that person is a federally licensed firearm dealer.


Not unfortunate at all - speaking as a Colorado resident.

The good things about the info is that it establishes that Fowler brought the gun to the meeting.



The gun may have been registered by his son when he initially bought it, but there isn't anything stopping him from giving it to his father.

I think the only way his son could be implicated would be if he knew his father was going to use it in the commission of a crime. Since his son gave it to him in 2007, I doubt he would have had knowledge that it would eventually be used to murder someone.


Don't think, based on the evidence thus far, that the son had anything to do with it. Kind of weird to buy a gun and register it in LA and then give it to his dad in Colorado.

[Thrak]

Hopefully, she will come to see the part that the cult of Scientology has played in wrecking their lives.

Axiom142

It's a pretty sad thing to think about. Imagine waking up one day to realize a man is dead, your husband is charged of the murder with whatever permanent injuries, your'e bankrupt, and the organization that fanned all of these flames and instigated the whole mess is just a fraud. What a nightmare. She probably never will.

How many deaths have there been just in the last year due to cult mind fuck? 4 or 5 that I know of. I think we should make it a point to keep various journalists and politicians aware of these things as they happen.

[Axiom142]

Love ya, and although I like a lot of your analysis, I disagree with this statement.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion and to disagree with me Mockingbird6. Doesn’t stop you from being wrong though. :p


True Scios see the results of their actions very well when those results would be bad PR for the church. Their lives are ruled by "what would the church think of me, what would people think of the church, if I did X?" (Everyone raise your hand if you were "in" and never had this thought!)

That is why I think Rex Fowler had reached the breaking point and was deliberately trying to bring bad repute on the church by his actions--see my earlier post elaborating on this.

I agree that further insanities existed, but I still think his basic statement, by what he did, exposes the church in ways they cannot cover up, and that was his intention.

I see what you are saying and you certainly raise an interesting point with regard to Fowler. Was this a ‘cry for help’ taken to its most extreme and shocking?

Could be, but I think the simplest explanation is that Fowler, under the colossal pressures placed upon him and his business by the cult of Scientology, suffered a psychotic break and attacked the nearest target that looked like an enemy. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if he or perhaps one of the Ethics Officers at his org had identified Ciancio as an SP. This would have enabled him justify murder in his own mind and he was really doing the ‘greatest god etc’.

Obviously looking at this whole situation from an exterior and rational viewpoint, Fowler’s actions are going to be very damaging to the CoS, perhaps not so much with the general public, but to the Scientology public and staff. I know that if I was still ‘in’ and read of this, I would have been severely shaken by it. An OTVII committing murder and then trying to suicide? Unthinkable!

I agree that Scientologists are often made to worry about how their actions may adversely affect the ‘church’, but the problem is, that their cognitive thinking has been so warped by their experiences, especially if they have been ‘in’ for a long time, that they are unable to fully appreciate what their actions cause.

Take for example, Tommy Davis. He has made goof after goof on TV and in the press. These make him and the CoS look like crazy cultists. Yet, he thinks he is doing the right thing by attacking critics. The BBC Panorama team made a TV program, which wasn’t very interesting. It mainly centred around allegations that the CoS were a weird and sinister cult that harasses it’s critics. So how does the CoS respond? By sending PIs and cameramen to follow and harass the TV crew and reporter! Then, Davis uses ‘Black Dianetics’ to provoke John Sweeny into losing his temper. So, Davis thinks he has won a victory with that. But, it simply turns a non-descript programme into compulsive viewing and gains massive publicity in the media.

Tom Cruise spouts a load of rubbish and even verbally lays into a talk show host (Matt Lauer) calling him ‘glib’ when discussing psychiatric medication. When I was ‘in’, I thought that this was the right thing to do and so did Cruise. Now, most people think that Cruise is a nutjob.

I’ve seen Scientologists protest outside a couple’s home and we’ve seen (on YouTube) other protestors mount counter-demonstrations against people like Mark Bunker and Tory Christman using all sorts of derogatory and insulting and even threatening language. George Baillie thought that he could cave me in my calling me “Crazy, nuts, insane!” and telling me that I would “Die alone and in pain and in the dark”. They all thought that this was the right thing to do, but in fact resulted in very damaging negative publicity and even in a law suit.

The list of own goals or footbullets by Scientologists is endless. If any of them had really thought through their actions and considered the consequences, they would have seen that it might not have been such a good idea. But, they were so intent of ‘defending their church’ or ‘attacking the attackers’ because they’ve been told to, that they are unable to look far enough ahead to see what the results might be.

Scientologists are constrained by their ‘rules’ which were written by Hubbard and now also by Miscavige. This will be their undoing because they have no flexibility to change and adapt.

Axiom142

[Enthetan]

Since I don’t know too much about US gun laws, could someone who might know, tell us if it would be legal for one person to buy and register a gun and then just give it to someone else? Could the son face criminal charges?
Axiom142

The law in California (http://www.calgunlaws.com/index.php/faq/63-range-and-club-issues/290-can-i-legally-transfer-ownership-of-a-firearm-to-another-family-member-without-the-waiting-period-without-processing-the-transfer-through-a-firearms-dealer-or-without-registration.html)says transfers between immediate family members are OK without prior paperwork, but within 30 days paperwork must be filled out reporting the transfer. If the police discover that any required paperwork was not filled in, they may try to hold that over the son in an attempt to get him to talk in greater detail.

[Dulloldfart]

The materials more than likely were in there. The note is a red herring, see my earlier post on the matter.

The materials only leave the briefcase while you are auditing. SOP.

I guess we'll have to wait and see, then. Calling something "Confidential" without further reference is meaningless. It means something in the CofS, but again, further reference is needed even in that group: Clear and above? OT3 and above? etc. etc. A note meant for non-scios that uses the word without further explanation is meaningless.

Paul

[Feral]

I guess we'll have to wait and see, then. Calling something "Confidential" without further reference is meaningless. It means something in the CofS, but again, further reference is needed even in that group: Clear and above? OT3 and above? etc. etc. A note meant for non-scios that uses the word without further explanation is meaningless.

Paul

I think as the note was written on the 30th Dec. Rex may have been under pressure and rushing his communication.

I'm almost certain that his folder and W/Ss are in that briefcase.

There is no other explanation for the note.

[VI of Hearts]

When I first read of this the first week of January I remember thinking that Rex was the LAST person I could imagine doing this. I couldn't have been much more shocked.

But knowing what duress he has most certainly gone through in the "modern" Church of Scientology I guess I'm less surprised.

I met Rex the day he walked into Gary Knutson and Mike Brisnehan's Scn Mission of Boulder back in about 1975. The "good old days". He'd read a promo piece we'd put out - the "Auditor 13" ('PHILOSOPHY WINS AFTER 2000 YEARS' was its banner.) I sold Rex the Dianetics book, he read it and was off like gangbusters. I can't think of very many guys who seemed more alive and vibrant. He was so uptone, competent and engaging. Politically he was the first Libertarian I had met. He was passionate about anything he put his mind to. And I think he was usually successful in what he attempted.

When he met and then later fell in love with Jan (who I had known for a few months and had had a budding but "not destined to blossom" relationship) I had real mixed emotions. I had a real bond with her - she was a wonderful woman - a talented and caring artist - and I recall my suppressed tears as I watched them say their wedding vows a couple of years later. "That should be me up there", I was thinking.

The next year I left Boulder and lost touch with Jan and Rex. My own Scn career gyrated like a Tilt-o-Whirl. In the SO at Flag for a couple of years. Blew. "Made up the damage" and got heavily involved as a volunteer. Then off lines for a looong time then finally back "on lines" in the mid 90s "for good" and doggedly trained from the bottom ("New Golden Age of Tech Student Hat!") to Class VI. (And to REALLY make up any damage, racked up $100K+ in debt to save us all via the IAS!)

It was late in this training that I ran into Rex again (about 2004). Surprised the hell out of me. Older and grayer but still the wonderful chap I remembered. (Now that I think back however he wasn't quite as vibrant as before. I overlooked it at the time.) I coached him through a few of the "tougher" drills on the Pro Metering course. He was good too.

Turns out, although I didn't have the full story, his TIP (Technical Individual Pgm.) was to train through Cl IV Auditor training to get back on OTVII. I thought at the time it seemed a bit odd. I wondered what he (who had always been so competent) had (or hadn't) done that made this a necessity.

Over the next couple of years he would be out from Denver for a week or two of training, obviously making bit by bit progress. The last time I saw him he was with Jan and I got to see her for the first time in almost 30 years. I know she had been on (perhaps off, too) VII for a long time. I guess I expected some sparks or something in my universe (hers?). No, not really. I imagined she was "happy" (but secretly wondered a little).

I knew their son (goes by 'Alex') casually as he worked in Treasury at ASHO Fdn. He was adopted - of Asian heritage. A nice young man, always seemed genuinely friendly. I don't understand his buying his dad a pistol!! Seems like a very odd gift.

I can only imagine his regrets now.

And (unrealistically I'm sure) maybe Jan's that she didn't stick with me.

And my own I guess... that I sold Rex that Dianetics book almost 35 years ago.

I wish he'd seen the light in time and gotten himself and his family and business out from under the influence of what the C of $ has become.

My heart truly goes out to the Ciancio family.

[dchoiceisalwaysrs]

Perhaps some ex's might like to offer their services to the police to help them translate the contents of the satchel as it might shed light on his motives and state of mind.

Welcome anoyvix. Yes, I do think that if a couple of ex VII's and even a Solo Nots C/S could reach out to the DA and offer assistance it would help reveal the facts. I never did the OT levels, but I understand those on that level need to be able to GET in session by flying their rudiments somehow.That would /could reveal a lot of what was going on with Fowler. If the DA uses help from the CoS, there is huge potential for mis-direction and cover up.

The amount of tragedy and suffering that is precipitated is just horrendous. Read Nancy Many's book http://mybillionyearcontract.com/ where in she talks about the mental torture/trauma that she, Lisa McPherson, and Greg Bashaw went through.

My condolences again to the families. And to all scientologists who on such a dangerous path, stop, look around. What kind of bridge are you on that has you enslaved and your fellow scientologists trying to or are commiting suicide.

Thank you all who are contributing to the end this cults atrocities.

[Enthetan]

My heart truly goes out to the Ciancio family.

They are probably very upset and distraught right now, and the people they are getting advice from are likely to only be thinking about how to keep this flap off Scn lines.

They could probably use an old friend.

[Zinjifar]

Thanks for that Zinj.

I know that I am straying into very dangerous territory here, but the thought that someone can buy a powerful handgun and then just give it to another person to do with as they please and no one has to get a license or inform the police makes me very sad.


Axiom142

Naturally, the police (and anyone else with a gun) may disapprove of other people having them. Luckily, in the US that disapproval isn't enough.

People with *legal* firearms very seldom commit illegal acts with them. Did they in this case? Dunno if Fowler's gun was legal.

Zinj

Zinj

[Dulloldfart]

People with *legal* firearms very seldom commit illegal acts with them. Did they in this case? Dunno if Fowler's gun was legal.


I think murder is illegal in Colorado.

Paul

[Winston Smith]

Naturally, the police (and anyone else with a gun) may disapprove of other people having them. Luckily, in the US that disapproval isn't enough.

People with *legal* firearms very seldom commit illegal acts with them. Did they in this case? Dunno if Fowler's gun was legal.

Zinj

Zinj

First, a 9mm is not a "very powerful" gun. It is, like every single firearm in the world, lethal. Very powerful to me means .45 cal, or .357 magnum, or .44 cal, or many other types. Responsible gun owners to not chamber a round and whack people.

Like any property, it is permissible to give it away as a present, unless you happen to live in areas of the US where the US Constitution is ignored.

Situations as this, as tragic as they are, do not reflect on firearms. I know many gun owners and all of us exercise extreme caution and sanity around our weapons. The facts of this case make no sense--taking of life, a sentence in prison for life or execution, causing greivous bodily harm to oneself (maybe to include paralysis) for what, $9000? And destroying your family and that of another human being? Not worth it in a billion years, Sea Org contract or not.

Yes, Dulloldfart, murder is illegal everywhere in the US. But in cases of self defense it is not murder. That does not enter into this case....Fowler evidently is an unstable criminal, unable to control his actions. I for one would NEVER pick up a weapon if I were angry. This is why firearms safety courses are vital.

[Panda Termint]

I think as the note was written on the 30th Dec. Rex may have been under pressure and rushing his communication.

I'm almost certain that his folder and W/Ss are in that briefcase.

There is no other explanation for the note.
The folder would also contain the various *Highly Confidential* Solo NOTs Correction Lists and Attachments. Maintaining the security of these materials is paramount to anyone on OTVII and is what the CofS would be most concerned about in regards to the materials.

[Winston Smith]

Thanks for that Zinj.

I know that I am straying into very dangerous territory here, but the thought that someone can buy a powerful handgun and then just give it to another person to do with as they please and no one has to get a license or inform the police makes me very sad.


Axiom142

Laws vary across the country, however, it is illegal in most places to purchase a gun and immediately give it to a third party. That would be classified as trafficking in weapons and it is obvious why it its illegal. In the Fowler case though this does not seem to be the case. If CA required notification of the transfer within 30 days, that is a material fact in this case.

[Tom of Helatrobus]

I was out walking today when I saw Rex Fowler's picture on the front page of the Denver Post. I live in Denver. The headline is "Exec held in office slaying." It is the same article linked to earlier, but there is more information in the print article...

There is more of the Scientology angle brought up in the end of the article:


"Janet Fowler also reportedly told investigators that her husband 'is a Scientologist and would not have gone without a fight. He would have grabbed a gun in a struggle and would not have let someone shoot him.'

"She slso told investigators that Ciancio had sent e-mails to Rex Fowler, threatening to hire an attorney and sue over money he said was owed him.

"Adam's County officials said that Fowler is in custody but would not say where he is being held. he was last known to be at Denver Health Medical Center, but his name no longer appears on patient rosters.

"No court date has been set for Fowler.

"Ciancio's family members said they did not want to comment on the case. Calls to Fowler's Broomfield home and to the Church of Scientology were not returned Friday.

"Several websites that scrutinize Scientology have been following the case, with links to records that allegedly reveal Fowler was a senior Scientologist. The sites claim that Fowler Software was a member of the World Institute of Scientology Enterprises.

"According to the arrest affidavit, Ciancio's brother gave investigators four binders of Scientology material that Fowler had given to Ciancio, asking him to study the religion.

"Ciancio was raised a Roman Catholic, his family said, and had attended New Hope Presbyterian Church in Castle Rock."

[Tom of Helatrobus]

BTW at the end of the article is the name, telephone number and email address of the authoring journalist. "Jeremy P. Meyer: 303-954-1367 or jpmeyer@denverpost.com"

[anon2019]

The arrest affidavit can be found here

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2010/0123/20100123_022551_fowleraffidavit.pdf

[Mockingbird6]

I see what you are saying and you certainly raise an interesting point with regard to Fowler. Was this a ‘cry for help’ taken to its most extreme and shocking?


Hi Ax,
I won't include all your statements but I do see what you mean, especially about Tommy Davis! LOL I will stay tuned for more info. M6

[skollie]

The arrest affidavit can be found here

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2010/0123/20100123_022551_fowleraffidavit.pdf

Reading that made me so very sad for all parties involved.

[Panda Termint]

Reading that made me so very sad for all parties involved.
I agree. This is a tragedy for all concerned.

[8-8008]

Did the church give back those 200,000 ??? I am sure they are going nuts. Security in PAC must have had a special briefing to their staff, demanding that all of the weapons, knives... be removed from the doorm.....
...................... and of course, their answer to that was "let's expand, let's get more money out of people to get ready to fight back" :grouch:

[Kookaburra]

Yes we do. It wasn't. It's ASHO's address (http://losangeles.citysearch.com/profile/map/53471/los_angeles_ca/american_st_hill_organization.html).

Paul

If he was SO then that is where all his mail would go. Any mail for the complex, any org, gets delivered to 1404 Catalina and sorted in the main mail room, then forwarded on to the correct org's Dept 2. So it is as correct an address as he could give.

[GreyWolf]

I see another big IAS special Briefing Event comming up.

[Free2Dream]

Did the church give back those 200,000 ???


All that was stated in the affidavit was that Fowler made an apology via email to all of his employees for what he had done. It was also stated that Fowler had initially refused to give Ciancio any final pay because he somehow owed Fowler Software Design $160,000. Sounds like Fowler was trying to pin the missing money on Ciancio. How convenient...

Fowler also personally wrote the software program he used to move the money around. Again, how convenient until Ciancio and another former employee caught him. That's where all the trouble started.

[Mockingbird6]

If he was SO then that is where all his mail would go. Any mail for the complex, any org, gets delivered to 1404 Catalina and sorted in the main mail room, then forwarded on to the correct org's Dept 2. So it is as correct an address as he could give.

Hi all,
At the bottom of page 10 of the Affidavit for arrest warrant cited in an earlier post on this thread, it says that the police talked to Alexander Fowler (who purchased the gun and gave it to his father) who lives in Santa Fe New Mexico.

Doesn't sound like he's in the Sea Org at this point.

[Dulloldfart]

Hi all,
At the bottom of page 10 of the Affidavit for arrest warrant cited in an earlier post on this thread, it says that the police talked to Alexander Fowler (who purchased the gun and gave it to his father) who lives in Santa Fe New Mexico.

Doesn't sound like he's in the Sea Org at this point.

Was he ever in the Sea Org?

Paul

[Mockingbird6]

From page 9 of the Affidavit for Arrest Warrant
"Detectives found emails dated December 28 from Laura Zaspel to William Fowler telling William Fowler she did not trust William Ciancio and their problem needed to be resolved."

On Dec 29 Ciancio gets told they are going to write him a check.

On Dec 30 he arrives and is murdered.

Now, I think Laura Zaspel better be talking and talking and talking to save her own skin because this reads just like a Mafia Hit order!

Yes, I am way too wrapped up in this! Partly because I keep thinking of the "Suicide 7's"--those who tried to tell us something by committing suicide but kept getting covered up.

[Enthetan]

Was he ever in the Sea Org?

Paul

Fowler, Alex H appears in the ASHO staff list at HolySmoke.org (http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/sea-org-staff-name-list.htm)

[Enthetan]

From page 9 of the Affidavit for Arrest Warrant
"Detectives found emails dated December 28 from Laura Zaspel to William Fowler telling William Fowler she did not trust William Ciancio and their problem needed to be resolved."

On Dec 29 Ciancio gets told they are going to write him a check.

On Dec 30 he arrives and is murdered.

Now, I think Laura Zaspel better be talking and talking and talking to save her own skin because this reads just like a Mafia Hit order!

Yes, I am way too wrapped up in this! Partly because I keep thinking of the "Suicide 7's"--those who tried to tell us something by committing suicide but kept getting covered up.

I think it likely that detectives are taking a good hard look at Laura, and all her connections with Scn mgmt, and particularly with any phone calls between her and OSA during the period in question.

Her wording on the emails would appear damning to any investigator, and pretty damn suspicious to any jury. If I were a police detective, I would be going over her life with a microscope. This is particularly likely given the prominence of the Ciancio family in the area.

[Zinjifar]

http://www.spoke.com/info/p66RGSD/LauraZaspel

http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/stats/by-name/l/laura-zaspel.html

http://www.facebook.com/people/Laura-Zaspel/100000264035942# (yes, this is her, since she includes Alex Fowler among her friends)

Zinj

[Dulloldfart]

Fowler, Alex H appears in the ASHO staff list at HolySmoke.org (http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/sea-org-staff-name-list.htm)

Great, thanks very much. So he does.

Paul

[AnonyMary]

All that was stated in the affidavit was that Fowler made an apology via email to all of his employees for what he had done. It was also stated that Fowler had initially refused to give Ciancio any final pay because he somehow owed Fowler Software Design $160,000. Sounds like Fowler was trying to pin the missing money on Ciancio. How convenient...

Fowler also personally wrote the software program he used to move the money around. Again, how convenient until Ciancio and another former employee caught him. That's where all the trouble started.

From my understanding of the terms used in the affidavit, billing and so forth, it appears that Fowler Software was owed money, was not getting money from some billed clients and as a result he was making Ciancio responsible lack of payment. Perhaps Fowler wanted Cancio to pay for the clients he worked on who didn't pay the company what it owed. Perhaps the economy had somnething to do with the bils not being paid?

As well, if you read it carefully, there is also a hint that Ciancio might have been originally being hit up for money owed the company, like WISE training fees they paid out for him, which he refused to repay while in negotiations. The settlement obviously came about and Ciancio, probably taking a losss on his investment in the company as a limited partner, settled for a getting a$9,900 check that Fowler never intended to pay. probably because there was no money to pay it. Very sad situation.

[AnonyMary]

They are probably very upset and distraught right now, and the people they are getting advice from are likely to only be thinking about how to keep this flap off Scn lines.

They could probably use an old friend.

I don't think that is the case. I think the Ciancio family is keeping quiet because they wanted to await the police decisions and information and then they are probably planning to sue the authorities for the terrible unprofessional way the whole thing was handled over at Fowler Software. They left Tom in there for hours before checking to see if he was alive. All based, it seems, on bad decisions and acting on presumptious information. The affidavit is very clear time wise but the facts of what went on to create all that time in between the hours to not help the man or investigate properly is going to be a big issue later down the line.

[Enthetan]

I don't think that is the case. I think the Ciancio family is keeping quiet because they wanted to await the police decisions and information and then they are probably planning to sue the authorities for the terrible unprofessional way the whole thing was handled over at Fowler Software. They left Tom in there for hours before checking to see if he was alive. All based, it seems, on bad decisions and acting on presumptious information. The affidavit is very clear time wise but the facts of what went on to create all that time in between the hours to not help the man or investigate properly is going to be a big issue later down the line.

I screwed up in my partial quote. I meant Jan Fowler as the person who could use a friend right now. She is likely thoroughly screwed, as Flag and OSA will blame her for her husband going nuts, and also blame her for not securing the Solo NOTs materials. People are going to want to make her one of the chief "Who"s

[Axiom142]

I screwed up in my partial quote. I meant Jan Fowler as the person who could use a friend right now. She is likely thoroughly screwed, as Flag and OSA will blame her for her husband going nuts, and also blame her for not securing the Solo NOTs materials. People are going to want to make her one of the chief "Who"s

Yes, the inevitable witch hunt has undoubtedly started already. The CoS is going to look at all family members, associates and friends to find the SP/s responsible.

And, you can bet your bottom dollar that any technical staff involved in Fowler’s OTVII cycle are going to be hauled over the coals and severe punishments handed out.

All of this is really to deflect attention away from the real cause of this.

Axiom142

[Mick Wenlock]

I screwed up in my partial quote. I meant Jan Fowler as the person who could use a friend right now. She is likely thoroughly screwed, as Flag and OSA will blame her for her husband going nuts, and also blame her for not securing the Solo NOTs materials. People are going to want to make her one of the chief "Who"s

Reading the affidavit from the Detective I am not at all sure that Jan Fowler needs a 'friend" - maybe a good attorney and some upcoming debt counselling might be in order.

Sorry if I seem callous her reaction to the whole thing is tawdry in the extreme. Her lack of cooperation with the police is very telling of the Scientology mindset. And if her husband syphoned money out of the Company and 'donated" it then I am fairly sure she was aware of it and possibly basking in the "wow you're so wonderful" adulation that money always generates in the Cof$.

I also wonder about the son - what is his status within the CofS? Santa Fe? Was he on tour there? Is he with CST? Hard to believe he would eb out of the SO because if that had been the case his father would have been off SOLO Nots.

One of the staff interviewed just after it happened seemed to be trying to convince the detectives that it was Ciancio who 'done it" saying how he had talked about hunting and things like that.

Like others on here I think Zaspel had better get herself a good attorney. her statements read like she was pushing Fowler.

It is a tragedy for the Ciancio family. Until I see anything else from Jan Fowler other than reflexive insane attempts to shield the "church" from blame I will assume that she is supportive of the very pressures that were, at least as far as i can tell right now, driving Fowler to this desperate act.

[Enthetan]

The arrest affidavit can be found here

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2010/0123/20100123_022551_fowleraffidavit.pdf

One part I found interesting was on page 2, where Susan Gaut says she heard what she thought was something falling. I've heard a lot of gunfire at firing ranges, and even muffled by being a couple of rooms away pistol shots sound nothing like something falling.

I think Susan is going to be subject to more interviews, and her answers better be good.

As others have noted, it seems Fowler blamed Ciancio for clients not paying their bills. Meanwhile, I'm guessing that Ciancio blamed Fowler for the company not having the funds to operate properly because of money Fowler siphoned off for Scn. As an thoroughly indoctrinated OT7, Fowler could never see paying money to Scn as the Why for his business difficulties, so therefore Ciancio had to be his Why.

[Smurf]

I'm curious whether Killer Rex did background checks on his employees before he hired them. Turns out that Ubaldo Ciminieri, his VP of Sales & Marketing (and the person the victim first went to see - but wasn't in his office) is a registered sex offender in Denver Colorado.

1415 WASHINGTON ST - 12/30/1975 - MALE - WHITE - ENTICEMENT OF A CHILD (Page 3 of 10)

http://www.denvergov.org/DenverMaps/downloads/maps/citywide/registeredsexoffenders.pdf

Also, Rex's son Alex is no longer in the Sea Org.

http://www.facebook.com/people/Alex-Fowler/100000110749149

[Kathy (ImOut)]

One part I found interesting was on page 2, where Susan Gaut says she heard what she thought was something falling. I've heard a lot of gunfire at firing ranges, and even muffled by being a couple of rooms away pistol shots sound nothing like something falling.

I think Susan is going to be subject to more interviews, and her answers better be good.

As others have noted, it seems Fowler blamed Ciancio for clients not paying their bills. Meanwhile, I'm guessing that Ciancio blamed Fowler for the company not having the funds to operate properly because of money Fowler siphoned off for Scn. As an thoroughly indoctrinated OT7, Fowler could never see paying money to Scn as the Why for his business difficulties, so therefore Ciancio had to be his Why.

If Fowler saw giving all that money to the CofS as the Why for his business difficulties, then he would've had to admit that Scn didn't work.

We were all told at one time or another, that the next action would make us more able and we could earn more to pay the debt paying for the service created.

Maybe the clients weren't paying because they didn't get what they were promised. That's the way the real world works, pay after the delivery of something (home repairs, groceries, clothing, utilities, etc.) - that way if it's not to your satisfaction you don't pay. Unlike Scn, where you pay first and then pay again because it wasn't right the first time. And then we you've realized you've paid for the same thing 2 - 5 times :duh: you then pay again to get unF*cked from the experience.

Maybe Fowler got the idea from all the Bridge he did, that he, too, didn't have to deliver what he promised.

Having collected money for companies, there are a lot of reasons other companies don't pay their bills. One big reason, it didn't work/function the way you told me it would.

[Enthetan]

Having collected money for companies, there are a lot of reasons other companies don't pay their bills. One big reason, it didn't work/function the way you told me it would.

Having been in business for a long time, my observation was that customers would pay promptly if they were happy with the product and, as a consequence, they also wanted to do further business with me in the future. The value of satisfactory future products would be greater than what they would get from being slow to pay me.

Similarly, I would strive to deliver the best product I could, because I wanted more future business from that customer. The value of the anticipated future business was worth more, in my mind, than any savings from skimping on quality on the current product.

What keeps the money flows smooth is the anticipated future relationship, on both sides.

Non-paying customers indicates customers who have no interest in any future relationship.

[Dulloldfart]

Also, Rex's son Alex is no longer in the Sea Org.

http://www.facebook.com/people/Alex-Fowler/100000110749149

Interesting Facebook friends Alex has. One is a black guy called Al Baker, who doesn't seem to look like the black Al Baker I knew in ITO but that Al Baker has friends like Marcy Sargeant (Mike Henderson's sister), Leisa Collins (was PR Aide OSA Int and is now back in NZ), and Mary Chris Hines (Bruce Hines' ex). So I guess it is the same Al.

Paul

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Having been in business for a long time, my observation was that customers would pay promptly if they were happy with the product and, as a consequence, they also wanted to do further business with me in the future. The value of satisfactory future products would be greater than what they would get from being slow to pay me.

Similarly, I would strive to deliver the best product I could, because I wanted more future business from that customer. The value of the anticipated future business was worth more, in my mind, than any savings from skimping on quality on the current product.

What keeps the money flows smooth is the anticipated future relationship, on both sides.

Non-paying customers indicates customers who have no interest in any future relationship.

Exactly. I had my customers paying at 30 days, per their invoice. The bigger companies paid at 35 - 45 days. But not due to "poor quality", they followed GAAP (Generally Accepted Accounting Procedure) which meant 30 days from when they received the invoice. I fixed that problem - I faxed them their invoices. LOL!!!

[8-8008]

I think the church is doing its investigation and looking at any possible psych behind the scene or behind the crazyness of Rex :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[degraded being]

Interesting Facebook friends Alex has. One is a black guy called Al Baker, who doesn't seem to look like the black Al Baker I knew in ITO but that Al Baker has friends like Marcy Sargeant (Mike Henderson's sister), Leisa Collins (was PR Aide OSA Int and is now back in NZ), and Mary Chris Hines (Bruce Hines' ex). So I guess it is the same Al.

Paul

Do you know what's up with Leisa Collins Paul? She must have had an important SIT to go back to Kiwiland. Can't find anything.......

[Dulloldfart]

Do you know what's up with Leisa Collins Paul? She must have had an important SIT to go back to Kiwiland. Can't find anything.......

I have no idea. But she seems to have routed out, and be doing her art stuff. She was an artist before the SO — I remember writing to her when I was a Letter Reg at SH around 1978. I can still remember her address from then, funnily enough, although I don't know where she lives now.

Paul

[Pooks]

As well, if you read it carefully, there is also a hint that Ciancio might have been originally being hit up for money owed the company, like WISE training fees they paid out for him, which he refused to repay while in negotiations. The settlement obviously came about and Ciancio, probably taking a losss on his investment in the company as a limited partner, settled for a getting a$9,900 check that Fowler never intended to pay. probably because there was no money to pay it. Very sad situation.

Yep, it sounds like Fowler was trying to write up some kind of Freeloader Debt for Ciancio.

[Thrak]

It really hard to make any sense of this. I guess Fowler just totally went off the deep end. I mean really, 3 direct shots to the head? He must of been in some psychotic state and thought Cianco was a "psych" or something like that and chose to assassinate him. I mean there is no logical explanation. To me the most mind boggling thing though is Fowler survived the suicide attempt. There's some "ot" powers. I haven't heard anything about his condition and what mental facilities he still has. Gun shot through the head is going to leave a mark.

[Dulloldfart]

I haven't heard anything about his condition and what mental facilities he still has. Gun shot through the head is going to leave a mark.

Yeah. He might end up a bit crazy.

Paul

[Div6]

According to the charging document, Fowler's whereabouts are "unknown".

?????


Was he released from the hospital?

Where does a person go after shooting themselves in the head?

Or is it just boilerplate for an arrest warrent?

[Dulloldfart]

Adams County officials said Fowler is in custody but would not say where he is being held.

Read more: http://www.denverpost.com/ci_14251372

Paul

[Mick Wenlock]

Interesting Facebook friends Alex has. One is a black guy called Al Baker, who doesn't seem to look like the black Al Baker I knew in ITO but that Al Baker has friends like Marcy Sargeant (Mike Henderson's sister), Leisa Collins (was PR Aide OSA Int and is now back in NZ), and Mary Chris Hines (Bruce Hines' ex). So I guess it is the same Al.

Paul


Hey that was a stroll down memory lane - Jeez - Darcy Hollingsworth looked rough. Also sad to see Linda McCarthy is still working for that organization especially after what happened to david.

[Div6]

Adams County officials said Fowler is in custody but would not say where he is being held.

Read more: http://www.denverpost.com/ci_14251372

Paul

Ah, thanks Paul.

[Lurker5]

Does anyone know, is Fowler's business still open for business? And is his wife running it? Or is it shut down? Or being run by employees? Where is his wife now?

I feel for the victim and his family. Fowler, hopefully, will get what is coming to him. I am thinking, his frontal lobe might be partially missing, and therefore he won't be able to defend himself in a trial. His wife will probably have conservatorship, and maybe she will plead him guilty in order to short circuit anymore publicity, as in a trial, and in return the CoS will not put her into Ethics, or whatever, or maybe CoS would even reward her ??? I don't know that much about how it works on the inside - but my guess is, she will bail on her husband, and hang him out to dry, so to speak, if there is anything in it for her. But maybe I am wrong.

Anyone know about the business and the wife of Fowler?

[Lurker5]

I thought Colo had rather stringent gun laws, can't just own a gun, must apply for first, than take a gun safety class/course (somehow conneced to state supervision)? Does anyone know about that?

Perhaps Fowler will be, or already has been, charged with illegal poccession of a fire-arm too. Not that it makes much difference now, but the DA usaully does that.

[Dulloldfart]

Does anyone know, is Fowler's business still open for business? And is his wife running it? Or is it shut down? Or being run by employees? Where is his wife now?

Call them and ask. :)

(303) 499-5499

Paul

[Div6]

Does anyone know, is Fowler's business still open for business? And is his wife running it? Or is it shut down? Or being run by employees? Where is his wife now?

I feel for the victim and his family. Fowler, hopefully, will get what is coming to him. I am thinking, his frontal lobe might be partially missing, and therefore he won't be able to defend himself in a trial. His wife will probably have conservatorship, and maybe she will plead him guilty in order to short circuit anymore publicity, as in a trial, and in return the CoS will not put her into Ethics, or whatever, or maybe CoS would even reward her ??? I don't know that much about how it works on the inside - but my guess is, she will bail on her husband, and hang him out to dry, so to speak, if there is anything in it for her. But maybe I am wrong.

Anyone know about the business and the wife of Fowler?

I think a good Defense lawyer could plead Insanity as a mitigating circumstance.....

Oh the irony! :duh::duh::duh:

[Lurker5]

Some companies were directly and negatively affected by the economic crash, in that they pay/paid the bills with credit lines. This is not unusual at all. Many companies bankroll this way, the cash flow in and out. The banks pulled in loans, and stopped renewing credit lines (on good compnaies as well as bad - I know of extremely good 'excellent credit rating' companies who lost credit lines because of this). Companies financially stressed to begin with, went belly up, or were/are so hard pressed for cash, that they cannot pay bills. The solid companies have had to curtail production levels and/or lay-off employees. Shit rolls down hill. It isn't always about bad product.

[Enthetan]

I thought Colo had rather stringent gun laws, can't just own a gun, must apply for first, than take a gun safety class/course (somehow conneced to state supervision)? Does anyone know about that?

Perhaps Fowler will be, or already has been, charged with illegal poccession of a fire-arm too. Not that it makes much difference now, but the DA usaully does that.

Colorado's gun laws (http://csp.state.co.us/faq_Guns.html), as described by the CO State Police, do not require registration, nor is there any paperwork required to simply own a gun. You need to get a license to carry a gun concealed on you on the public streets.

Fowler would only be subject to "illegal possession" charges if he was a felon, judged mentally incompetent, or certain other circumstances, and I don't think it likely that a felon or mental case would have been accepted onto OT7 in the first place.

[Mockingbird6]

Someone from Anon was asking for suggestions for picket signs. I like:

__________________

| REX FOWLER
|
| DENVER POST.COM
|_________________|


It might get someone to actually look it up and find out what has gone on. Because I doubt anyone in the church is telling anyone else in the church. Having several people in a row carrying just this one thing might impinge and get Scios asking what can be meant by this.

[Mick Wenlock]

I thought Colo had rather stringent gun laws, can't just own a gun, must apply for first, than take a gun safety class/course (somehow conneced to state supervision)? Does anyone know about that?

Perhaps Fowler will be, or already has been, charged with illegal poccession of a fire-arm too. Not that it makes much difference now, but the DA usaully does that.

In order to have a concealed carry permit one must show that one has been trained to safely handle the weapon and understand the law.

There are no requirements - other than federal - about gun ownership. If one buys a weapon privately there is no need at all to register it.

The only "illegal possession" would be if he stole it - possession of a firearm is totally legal in the state of colorado and here is noregistry for gun ownership. Thankfully.

[Axiom142]

Someone from Anon was asking for suggestions for picket signs. I like:

__________________

| REX FOWLER
|
| DENVER POST.COM
|_________________|


It might get someone to actually look it up and find out what has gone on. Because I doubt anyone in the church is telling anyone else in the church. Having several people in a row carrying just this one thing might impinge and get Scios asking what can be meant by this.

I was thinking of:

REX FOWLER = OTVII = MURDERER?

The question mark is because he hasn’t actually been convicted yet.

Axiom142

[thetanic]

Fowler would only be subject to "illegal possession" charges if he was a felon, judged mentally incompetent, or certain other circumstances, and I don't think it likely that a felon or mental case would have been accepted onto OT7 in the first place.

Not a convicted felon, no. There's certainly a lot of accusations about molestation by Wally Hanks (but no indictment or conviction), and he's done OT VIII.

[HelluvaHoax!]

I think a good Defense lawyer could plead Insanity as a mitigating circumstance.....Oh the irony! :duh::duh::duh:

Scieno-Scenario: Rex Fowler's wife gets a call from Tommy Davis.

FOWLER'S WIFE: His lawyer wants him to plead insanity, but we want Church approval before we decide what to do.

TOMMY DAVIS: An OT VII cannot plead insanity. Have you thought of what Ron would do in a situation like that?

FOWLER'S WIFE: Uhhh, make it go right? Take responsibility? Use postulates? Apply Danger? Fair Game the Prosecutor?

TOMMY DAVIS: No, no, no. What did Ron the OT do when, like Rex, he reached the top of the Bridge?

FOWLER'S WIFE: (a profound realization dawning on her).........Research advanced OT levels???

TOMMY DAVIS: So, do you know what to do?

FOWLER'S WIFE: Certainly, sir, I will help Rex join Ron's research org to continue his spiritual enhancement.

[HelluvaHoax!]

I was thinking of:

REX FOWLER = OTVII = MURDERER?

The question mark is because he hasn’t actually been convicted yet.

Axiom142

Ax, I like it!

Variation on your theme (not nearly as good but worth mentioning cuz it's slightly delicious):


WHY DID A-MORAL OT VII
REX FOWLER
RUN A-FOWL OF THE LAW?

[Zinjifar]

FOWLER'S WIFE: Certainly, sir, I will help Rex join Ron's research org to continue his spiritual enhancement.

Rex has already been there; done that; got the hole to prove it. Of course, he didn't 'make it go right', so, so much for the 'ability' of an OT.

Zinj

[thetanic]

Rex has already been there; done that; got the hole to prove it. Of course, he didn't 'make it go right', so, so much for the 'ability' of an OT.

I prefer to look at it this way:

His CSW to join Ron on Target 2 was denied.

[Axiom142]

Scieno-Scenario: Rex Fowler's wife gets a call from Tommy Davis.

FOWLER'S WIFE: His lawyer wants him to plead insanity, but we want Church approval before we decide what to do.

TOMMY DAVIS: An OT VII cannot plead insanity. Have you thought of what Ron would do in a situation like that?

FOWLER'S WIFE: Uhhh, make it go right? Take responsibility? Use postulates? Apply Danger? Fair Game the Prosecutor?

TOMMY DAVIS: No, no, no. What did Ron the OT do when, like Rex, he reached the top of the Bridge?

FOWLER'S WIFE: (a profound realization dawning on her).........Research advanced OT levels???

TOMMY DAVIS: So, do you know what to do?

FOWLER'S WIFE: Certainly, sir, I will help Rex join Ron's research org to continue his spiritual enhancement.

Spot on HH! :thumbsup:

I have no doubt that this is exactly the scenario that Miscavige and co. will be hoping happens. It’s a bad situation, but this way, most of the difficult questions never get asked and there is no chance that Fowler will blame Scientology for his behaviour.

They will be desperately hoping that this gets recorded as ‘just another desperate executive in financial difficulty freaks out’ incident.

I take no delight whatsoever in this tragedy, it is a terrible thing for all involved parties, but I hope that the abuses (and their consequences) of the ‘church’ of Scientology are made public for all to see.


Axiom142

[Zinjifar]

R2-9mm is a squirrel process.

Zinj

[HelluvaHoax!]

Rex has already been there; done that; got the hole to prove it. Of course, he didn't 'make it go right', so, so much for the 'ability' of an OT. Zinj

I believe that we have now witnessed, for the first time, an OT Footbullet...

Footbullet: Unintentional shooting of self.

OT Footbullet: Intentional shooting of self that misses.

[HelluvaHoax!]

R2-9mm is a squirrel process.
Zinj

:roflmao: holyHell that's funny!

[Mockingbird6]

:roflmao: holyHell that's funny!

^^^^that^^^^(Zinj's R2-9mm is a squirrel process)

[Mockingbird6]

I was thinking of:

REX FOWLER = OTVII = MURDERER?

The question mark is because he hasn’t actually been convicted yet.

Axiom142

Darn, I totally forgot to put the OTVII on my picket sign suggestion. Thanks for catching that. And yes, the murderer? thing is eye-catching. So my sign would now be:

REX FOWLER
OT VII
MURDERER?
see DENVER POST.COM

But now it might be too long. Oh well...

[HelluvaHoax!]

Spot on HH! :thumbsup:I have no doubt that this is exactly the scenario that Miscavige and co. will be hoping happens. It’s a bad situation, but this way, most of the difficult questions never get asked and there is no chance that Fowler will blame Scientology for his behaviour.They will be desperately hoping that this gets recorded as ‘just another desperate executive in financial difficulty freaks out’ incident.I take no delight whatsoever in this tragedy, it is a terrible thing for all involved parties, but I hope that the abuses (and their consequences) of the ‘church’ of Scientology are made public for all to see. Axiom142

Even if the criminal case goes away because Rex causitively exteriorizes to join Ron, there could be some super-tasty discovery in the civil action vs his estate for wrongful death.

The CoS is undoubtedly running settlement scenarios in the war (whore) room right now.

Imagine the "state of mind" discovery motions vs. the church's assertion of priest-penitant confidentiality issues. I cannot imagine any scenario where the CoS can afford to gamble on OT VII worksheets coming into public view.

That would be a meltdown worse than anything that has ever happened in the history of Scientology's already-abysmal public relations history.

Even the Plaintive Atty's opening question of the first witness would be a nuclear bomb.

"And in your experience as a professional NOTS Case Supervisor, can you tell me your opinion on whether Rex had gotten rid of very many space aliens in the 7 years that he audited himself?"

[Pooks]

"And in your experience as a professional NOTS Case Supervisor, can you tell me your opinion on whether Rex had gotten rid of very many space aliens in the 7 years that he audited himself?"


HH you really make me LOL! Thanks.

[Axiom142]

Even if the criminal case goes away because Rex causitively exteriorizes to join Ron, there could be some super-tasty discovery in the civil action vs his estate for wrongful death.

The CoS is undoubtedly running settlement scenarios in the war (whore) room right now.

Imagine the "state of mind" discovery motions vs. the church's assertion of priest-penitant confidentiality issues. I cannot imagine any scenario where the CoS can afford to gamble on OT VII worksheets coming into public view.

That would be a meltdown worse than anything that has ever happened in the history of Scientology's already-abysmal public relations history.

Even the Prosecutor's opening question of the first witness would be a nuclear bomb.

"And in your experience as a professional NOTS Case Supervisor, can you tell me your opinion on whether Rex had gotten rid of very many Body Thetans in the 7 years that he audited himself?"

Undoubtedly the CoS are between a rock and a very hard place right now and will desperately be trying to whitewash the outhouse before the sanitation inspectors arrive.

I just hope that the prosecuting authorities are aware of just what lengths OSA and Davey’s minions will go to avoid the blame. They will be ready to do whatever it takes to minimise the impact of this.

The worst-case scenario for the CoS would be if Fowler pleads temporary insanity and spills the beans on all the things that he was coerced into doing by the CoS and blames them for sending him over the edge.

Once he starts talking about invisible beings left over from a nuclear Armageddon that happened on Earth 75 million years ago, the prosecution is at least going to have a few doubts about his sanity.

But to cap it all off, he should play ‘Thank You For Listening’ sung by Hubbard and tell them this is the finest recording in the history of the universe. Ever! If that doesn’t convince them he is due for a stay in the funny farm, nothing will! :screwy:

I’m sure Fowler would be able to get an army of professionals ready to testify that Scientology encourages paranoid thoughts (SPs, conspiracies, Marcabs, whole-track psychs, World Bank etc).

This would be the ‘Armageddon Scenario’ (I’ve copyrighted this term, so don’t anyone else even think of using it) for the CoS.

Headlines of “Scientology drives man mad and causes him to commit homicide!” would shake the Cult to the core.

Axiom142

[TheSneakster]

R2-9mm is a squirrel process.

Zinj

Black Humor at it's worst. But, yes.

A .45 ACP - even FMJ (Full Metal Jacket) probably would have actually killed him.

9mm might still have done the job, if he had used hollow points (Federal Hydra-Shok, for instance) instead of FMJ.

Michael "The Sneakster" Hobson
I am *not* anonymous. I *do* forgive.

[HelluvaHoax!]

I’m sure Fowler would be able to get an army of professionals ready to testify that Scientology encourages paranoid thoughts (SPs, conspiracies, Marcabs, whole-track psychs, World Bank etc).This would be the ‘Armageddon Scenario’ (I’ve copyrighted this term, so don’t anyone else even think of using it) for the CoS.

:roflmao:

....and in his divine mercy to the slaves, the Lord sayeth that the Armageddon Scenario shall beget the ImmaGeddonOutofScientology Scenario.

[HelluvaHoax!]

The worst-case scenario for the CoS would be if Fowler pleads temporary insanity and spills the beans on all the things that he was coerced into doing by the CoS and blames them for sending him over the edge.

Seems quite unnecessary to plead insanity when everyone would readily stipulate that OTs are insane.




...if he starts talking about invisible beings left over from a nuclear Armageddon that happened on Earth 75 million years ago, the prosecution is at least going to have a few doubts about his sanity.But to cap it all off, he should play ‘Thank You For Listening’ sung by Hubbard and tell them this is the finest recording in the history of the universe. Ever! If that doesn’t convince them he is due for a stay in the funny farm, nothing will! :screwy:
:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:
Would it be helpful if defense counsel called upon Tommy Davis to do an A Capella rendition in the closing argument? ("...thank you for listening, I lie just for you.....")

[Thrak]

[/I]

Even if the criminal case goes away because Rex causitively exteriorizes to join Ron, there could be some super-tasty discovery in the civil action vs his estate for wrongful death.

The CoS is undoubtedly running settlement scenarios in the war (whore) room right now.

Imagine the "state of mind" discovery motions vs. the church's assertion of priest-penitant confidentiality issues. I cannot imagine any scenario where the CoS can afford to gamble on OT VII worksheets coming into public view.

That would be a meltdown worse than anything that has ever happened in the history of Scientology's already-abysmal public relations history.

Even the Plaintive Atty's opening question of the first witness would be a nuclear bomb.

"And in your experience as a professional NOTS Case Supervisor, can you tell me your opinion on whether Rex had gotten rid of very many space aliens in the 7 years that he audited himself?"

OSA now must be the Nightmare of the Month Club. This one must be one of the worst cases imaginable.

[Enthetan]

[/I]

Even if the criminal case goes away because Rex causitively exteriorizes to join Ron, there could be some super-tasty discovery in the civil action vs his estate for wrongful death.

The CoS is undoubtedly running settlement scenarios in the war (whore) room right now.

Imagine the "state of mind" discovery motions vs. the church's assertion of priest-penitant confidentiality issues. I cannot imagine any scenario where the CoS can afford to gamble on OT VII worksheets coming into public view.

That would be a meltdown worse than anything that has ever happened in the history of Scientology's already-abysmal public relations history.

Even the Plaintive Atty's opening question of the first witness would be a nuclear bomb.

"And in your experience as a professional NOTS Case Supervisor, can you tell me your opinion on whether Rex had gotten rid of very many space aliens in the 7 years that he audited himself?"

One problem the Co$ faces is that there's a lot of potential testimony from ex's about how the Co$ has no problem violating "priest-penitant confidentiality" when it suits them, which undercuts their argument severely.

I could see a judge ruling that, since a Scientologist faces revelation of supposedly confidential confessional materials upon going into bad standing, that there is no true confidentiality. In the Catholic Church, confessional statements remain confidential regardless of excommunication, with priests having a duty to maintain secrets even under torture. Psychiatrists knowledge of patient's secrets remain confidential even if there's a personal falling out. But a Scn's confessions are likely to be actively broadcast to all his friends if he gets declared.

[degraded being]

If I was a betting man it would be on Rex getting an OSA CS for a repair action for his last flubbed audting action. The R2 -whatever.

Rex offing himself will be the maximum amount of damage control for the cult. People could be just left wondering.......as we did about some things. There would not be any danger that wild card rex could do something terrible, like defect to SP times etc.

In a twisted culty way it is an acceptable solution. He gets out. Which is one of the main obsessions of the cult. Getting out. He gets to go and "pick up another body" away from the SP's who did this horrible thing to poor rex (forget about Ciancio - he was a wog). It really is a very attractive solution from a cult perspective, an OSA perspective, considering the devastating alternative possiblities.
Such as: Most likely go to jail. Nice picture of the total freedom that the bridge delivered, Behind bars.
He is already in a reality shattering position. Who knows which way he'll turn, now or in the future. He will not be kept on the COS leash so they will be very aware of their loss of control. They will not want to be seen to be visiting him in the jail, but they will want to try to kept tabs, just in case he decides to do a story for SP times.

The wife and family will be watched like hawks. Actually the wife will get a full time handler.

And maybe her reality will be shattered so much that she will go to the SP times.

Or will it be some of the employees.
OSA must be shitting spiky exploding cactuses.

[Thrak]

If I was a betting man it would be on Rex getting an OSA CS for a repair action for his last flubbed audting action. The R2 -whatever.

Rex offing himself will be the maximum amount of damage control for the cult. People could be just left wondering.......as we did about some things. There would not be any danger that wild card rex could do something terrible, like defect to SP times etc.

In a twisted culty way it is an acceptable solution. He gets out. Which is one of the main obsessions of the cult. Getting out. He gets to go and "pick up another body" away from the SP's who did this horrible thing to poor rex (forget about Ciancio - he was a wog). It really is a very attractive solution from a cult perspective, an OSA perspective, considering the devastating alternative possiblities.
Such as: Most likely go to jail. Nice picture of the total freedom that the bridge delivered, Behind bars.
He is already in a reality shattering position. Who knows which way he'll turn, now or in the future. He will not be kept on the COS leash so they will be very aware of their loss of control. They will not want to be seen to be visiting him in the jail, but they will want to try to kept tabs, just in case he decides to do a story for SP times.

The wife and family will be watched like hawks. Actually the wife will get a full time handler.

And maybe her reality will be shattered so much that she will go to the SP times.

Or will it be some of the employees.
OSA must be shitting spiky exploding cactuses.

Nice theories but at this point we don't know if the guy is ever even going to be able to talk again. One thing I would bet is that the "church" is going to try to settle out of court with the Cianco's. And I bet it'll be more than $200,000. ias $$$$$ at work.

[thetanic]

Nice theories but at this point we don't know if the guy is ever even going to be able to talk again. One thing I would bet is that the "church" is going to try to settle out of court with the Cianco's. And I bet it'll be more than $200,000. ias $$$$$ at work.

I absolutely can't see the CofS getting involved in this at all, except to bully chinbullet (as some WWPers are calling Fowler) and Mrs. chinbullet.

[Mest Lover]

"Even if you looked at it and read it, you would not understand anything in it. Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant," she responded.

Nice to know what the "way above normal" people in SCN do for the regular wogs of life and themselves. Makes you really want to join right on in on that.

[Thrak]

I absolutely can't see the CofS getting involved in this at all, except to bully chinbullet (as some WWPers are calling Fowler) and Mrs. chinbullet.

Yeah but odds are they will sue the Fowlers. Then it all comes out.

[Kookaburra]

Scieno-Scenario: Rex Fowler's wife gets a call from Tommy Davis.

FOWLER'S WIFE: His lawyer wants him to plead insanity, but we want Church approval before we decide what to do.

TOMMY DAVIS: An OT VII cannot plead insanity. Have you thought of what Ron would do in a situation like that?

FOWLER'S WIFE: Uhhh, make it go right? Take responsibility? Use postulates? Apply Danger? Fair Game the Prosecutor?

TOMMY DAVIS: No, no, no. What did Ron the OT do when, like Rex, he reached the top of the Bridge?

FOWLER'S WIFE: (a profound realization dawning on her).........Research advanced OT levels???

TOMMY DAVIS: So, do you know what to do?

FOWLER'S WIFE: Certainly, sir, I will help Rex join Ron's research org to continue his spiritual enhancement.

Helluva Hoax, I think you've actually hit on the most likely scenario. Perhaps not trusting Janet to do it, but certainly offing Fowler and thereby totally aborting the trial would be the least damaging scenario for the cult. As long as they didn't get caught.

It's probably wise that Colorado officials are not saying where Fowler is being held.

[skydog]

Helluva Hoax, I think you've actually hit on the most likely scenario. Perhaps not trusting Janet to do it, but certainly offing Fowler and thereby totally aborting the trial would be the least damaging scenario for the cult. As long as they didn't get caught.

It's probably wise that Colorado officials are not saying where Fowler is being held.

A court ordered psych exam, together with a suicide watch might be appropriate.

[AnonyMary]

A court ordered psych exam, together with a suicide watch might be appropriate.

Yes, I'm sure that they even ordered it. A judge can court order that if the medical doctors believe he'll be a harm to himself or just based upon the fact that he already harmed another. In fact, he may have no say in that decision.

What is interesting is that Rex wrote that there was nothing confidential in the briefcase.

He could have looked on the internet and realized that the stuff is on the net to begin, realized there are no real OT's because he could see from his own situation that he failed as an OT to make it go right, perhaps saying " the hell with it." but most likely wrote that to divert the police from looking closely at the materials.

Anyway you look at it, this is going to be an interesting legal case to follow.

Mary

[LA SCN]

This tragedy lays directly at the feet of the cocksucker David Miscavige.

It is brutally simple. Rex Fowler was under more duress for donations to Cof$ than he could handle and he cracked, mid OT 7. The Cof$ created an enforced must have / can't have in Fowler that ruined him utterly.

He improperly diverted well over a hundred thousand dollars of company funds to the Cof$.

His wife and the President of the company were quite possibly accomplices to this.

The man he shot and killed was aware of the defaults in company receivables due to the recession and the resultant harm to the company cash flow caused by Fowlers' embezzlement and in fact had resigned in protest over it.

Of course in true Scilon fashion, Fowler held Cianco responsible for the shortfall in receivables.

When confronted by Cianco, Fowler had his withhold missed big time. Fowler premeditatedly shot and killed Cianco, then bungled his own suicide and instead lobotomized himself.

His wife immediately went into Cof$ CYA mode.

Let's hope the Denver authorities sort this one out well.

(Don't blame the gun - the second amendment is recognition of the right of FREE people to survive and unique to the USA; those who would disagree have been victimized by too much liberal press or just can't handle the nature of life itself in this universe.)

(I don't doubt Fowlers' session worksheets, repair lists and C/S were with him - at Executive Software a special room was set up just for those staff on solo nots so they could get in their daily sessions through the day.)

Don't doubt the Cof$ will work overtime to spin this away - injunctions, lie and deny, etc. ad nauseum.

[I told you I was trouble]

Rex has already been there; done that; got the hole to prove it. Of course, he didn't 'make it go right', so, so much for the 'ability' of an OT.

Zinj





Originally Posted by Zinjifar
R2-9mm is a squirrel process.

Zinj


:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

[Blue Spirit]

This tragedy lays directly at the feet of the cocksucker David Miscavige.

It is brutally simple. Rex Fowler was under more duress for donations to Cof$ than he could handle and he cracked, mid OT 7. The Cof$ created an enforced must have / can't have in Fowler that ruined him utterly.

He improperly diverted well over a hundred thousand dollars of company funds to the Cof$.

His wife and the President of the company were quite possibly accomplices to this.

The man he shot and killed was aware of the defaults in company receivables due to the recession and the resultant harm to the company cash flow caused by Fowlers' embezzlement and in fact had resigned in protest over it.

Of course in true Scilon fashion, Fowler held Cianco responsible for the shortfall in receivables.

When confronted by Cianco, Fowler had his withhold missed big time. Fowler premeditatedly shot and killed Cianco, then bungled his own suicide and instead lobotomized himself.

His wife immediately went into Cof$ CYA mode.

Let's hope the Denver authorities sort this one out well.

(Don't blame the gun - the second amendment is recognition of the right of FREE people to survive and unique to the USA; those who would disagree have been victimized by too much liberal press or just can't handle the nature of life itself in this universe.)

(I don't doubt Fowlers' session worksheets, repair lists and C/S were with him - at Executive Software a special room was set up just for those staff on solo nots so they could get in their daily sessions through the day.)

Don't doubt the Cof$ will work overtime to spin this away - injunctions, lie and deny, etc. ad nauseum.

You do see it as it is.

Miscavige and his Tech sabotage are responsible for thousands of deaths

and ruined lives. LRH also had his fair share which pulled the rug out from

under many others. I've met many from the early years coming back who died

quite shortly after their initial exposures to LRH's out-gradient processes.

Scientology's PR is in a "Graveyard Spiral", that is for certain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graveyard_spiral

[AnonyMary]

You do see it as it is.

Miscavige and his Tech sabotage are responsible for thousands of deaths

and ruined lives. LRH also had his fair share which pulled the rug out from

under many others. I've met many from the early years coming back who died

quite shortly after their initial exposures to LRH's out-gradient processes.

Scientology's PR is in a "Graveyard Spiral", that is for certain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graveyard_spiral

Blue,

please identify those you have met from the early years who died " quite shortly after their initial exposures to LRH's out-gradient processes" and are now back talking about it.

It would be a generality to not do so. Thanks.

Mary

[degraded being]

Nice theories but at this point we don't know if the guy is ever even going to be able to talk again. One thing I would bet is that the "church" is going to try to settle out of court with the Cianco's. And I bet it'll be more than $200,000. ias $$$$$ at work.


They will no doubt be paid to keep their mouths shut, and a little bit of blackmail could help them to decide.....
but is settling out of court for first degree murder an option? Can he stay out of the klink that way?

Actually, who know's? OSA is having meetings about what to offer, who to offer it to, who to blackmail, who should be made to shut up, who should be made to say something useful for OSA who should be sued, who should be "lied to, tricked...." what the shore stories are going to be. What a fucking Engram! There must be a huge intergalactic past lives whole track earlier similar implant by passed charge producing basic at the end of the chain on this one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[AnonyMary]

They will no doubt be paid to keep their mouths shut, and a little bit of blackmail could help them to decide.....
but is settling out of court for first degree murder an option? Can he stay out of the klink that way?

Hardly, lol.
I doubt CoS is going to be implicated in this. All they did was take money from the guy over a year before the murder, accordng to the affidavit the payments were from the previous year.

WISE most likely will be implicated, since they advised Fowler and he ran off of their policies, despite him violating some of them by stealing from his own company. It was those WISE policies that put Ciancio as an enemy in the business - the secular scientology way.

[Truth&Honesty]

*
Someone on this website mentioned the idea that scios on the upper OT levels are walking time bombs, due to the constant duress they are under.

I couldn't agee more.

It will be very interesting to see if the prosecutor brings in a psychiatrist to review Fowlers OT folders. Which would help determine Fowler's state of mind at the time of the murder, and any contributing factors.

The psychiatrist would then be able to give an "expert opinion" as to how and in what manner these processes contributed to increased mental illness (delusions of grandeur, paranoia, anxiety, depression, phobias, suicidal thinking, detachment from reality, personality disorders, etc....).

And if OT levels are found to cause/contribute to mental unstableness or illness, then that will be in the public record.

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

And then let the class action lawsuits begin! I would like to see everyone get their full refund back, to compensate for the total MIND FU*K their sci fi processes put us through. After all, screaming at a ashtray for hours on end, "GET UP! SIT DOWN IN THAT CHAIR!" would certainly be viewed by a jury as NUTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:

T&H

[Daedle]

It will be very interesting to see if the prosecutor brings in a psychiatrist to review Fowlers OT folders. Which would help determine Fowler's state of mind at the time of the murder, and any contributing factors.

The psychiatrist would then be able to give an "expert opinion" as to how and in what manner these processes contributed to increased mental illness (delusions of grandeur, paranoia, anxiety, depression, phobias, suicidal thinking, detachment from reality, personality disorders, etc....).

And if OT levels are found to cause/contribute to mental unstableness or illness, then that will be in the public record.

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

And then let the class action lawsuits begin! I would like to see everyone get their full refund back, to compensate for the total MIND FU*K their sci fi processes put us through. After all, screaming at a ashtray for hours on end, "GET UP! SIT DOWN IN THAT CHAIR!" would certainly be viewed by a jury as NUTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
T&H

This could probably be one of the worst things that could happen IMO. If a Psychiatrist declares the OT levels to be dangerous and serious action starts against Scientology because of that then the cult will simply start shrilling "We were right! The psychs are out to get us!". It will simply push people defensively back into the cult, leaving them open to more exploitation and could even end up Jonestown style.

[Thrak]

They will no doubt be paid to keep their mouths shut, and a little bit of blackmail could help them to decide.....
but is settling out of court for first degree murder an option? Can he stay out of the klink that way?

Actually, who know's? OSA is having meetings about what to offer, who to offer it to, who to blackmail, who should be made to shut up, who should be made to say something useful for OSA who should be sued, who should be "lied to, tricked...." what the shore stories are going to be. What a fucking Engram! There must be a huge intergalactic past lives whole track earlier similar implant by passed charge producing basic at the end of the chain on this one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No you can't pay your way out of murder - well usually. Fowler will probably plead guilty and be convicted but the Cianco's could I imagine sue the Fowler's in a separate civil case for financial impact of killing the father of a family. That's where a settlement would come in as the cult would not want a trial where their "ot" secrets would be exposed to the world - as if they already aren't.

[Mick Wenlock]

No you can't pay your way out of murder - well usually. Fowler will probably plead guilty and be convicted but the Cianco's could I imagine sue the Fowler's in a separate civil case for financial impact of killing the father of a family. That's where a settlement would come in as the cult would not want a trial where their "ot" secrets would be exposed to the world - as if they already aren't.

There is an 800lb gorilla in this room.

If the Ciancios sue one of the main defendants will be the insurance company, yes Fowler and his "estate" will be part of it too but, from the sounds of it, he does not have a lot of assets but that may well be wrong.

There are some interesting possibilities and I hope the attorney's for the Ciancio family start searching the internet and find this place. The $200,000 of course is one starting point, the money that Fowler has on account at various orgs all are grist to the mill.

Back to the insurance company - they are going to wish to get this settled asap and as cheaply as they can. They will not care about whether Scientology gets "exposed" all they will wish to do is to pay the least they have to. they are not going to want to go to court especially if Fowler is convicted beforehand.

Ciancio was killed at work. There are workmen's comp claims to consider as well.

All very bureacratic I know but, I am hopeful, that Mr Ciancio's family will be able to get a very good settlement that will enable them to get on with their lives.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

There is an 800lb gorilla in this room.

If the Ciancios sue one of the main defendants will be the insurance company, yes Fowler and his "estate" will be part of it too but, from the sounds of it, he does not have a lot of assets but that may well be wrong.

There are some interesting possibilities and I hope the attorney's for the Ciancio family start searching the internet and find this place. The $200,000 of course is one starting point, the money that Fowler has on account at various orgs all are grist to the mill.

Back to the insurance company - they are going to wish to get this settled asap and as cheaply as they can. They will not care about whether Scientology gets "exposed" all they will wish to do is to pay the least they have to. they are not going to want to go to court especially if Fowler is convicted beforehand.

Ciancio was killed at work. There are workmen's comp claims to consider as well.

All very bureacratic I know but, I am hopeful, that Mr Ciancio's family will be able to get a very good settlement that will enable them to get on with their lives.

He didn't work there anymore, so I doubt workmen's comp will come into play.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

This tragedy lays directly at the feet of the cocksucker David Miscavige.

It is brutally simple. Rex Fowler was under more duress for donations to Cof$ than he could handle and he cracked, mid OT 7. The Cof$ created an enforced must have / can't have in Fowler that ruined him utterly.

He improperly diverted well over a hundred thousand dollars of company funds to the Cof$.

His wife and the President of the company were quite possibly accomplices to this.

The man he shot and killed was aware of the defaults in company receivables due to the recession and the resultant harm to the company cash flow caused by Fowlers' embezzlement and in fact had resigned in protest over it.

Of course in true Scilon fashion, Fowler held Cianco responsible for the shortfall in receivables.

When confronted by Cianco, Fowler had his withhold missed big time. Fowler premeditatedly shot and killed Cianco, then bungled his own suicide and instead lobotomized himself.

His wife immediately went into Cof$ CYA mode.

Let's hope the Denver authorities sort this one out well.

(Don't blame the gun - the second amendment is recognition of the right of FREE people to survive and unique to the USA; those who would disagree have been victimized by too much liberal press or just can't handle the nature of life itself in this universe.)

(I don't doubt Fowlers' session worksheets, repair lists and C/S were with him - at Executive Software a special room was set up just for those staff on solo nots so they could get in their daily sessions through the day.)

Don't doubt the Cof$ will work overtime to spin this away - injunctions, lie and deny, etc. ad nauseum.

I think you nailed it.

The gun did NOT kill Ciancio - Fowler murdered him.

[GreyWolf]

As far as Fowler being mentally unballanced goes, if I was on the upper levels and every time I got to the EP of a level and originated that I had no BT's left, then found out on the next level that it was not quite true, I would more than likely be nuts too.

[skydog]

What is interesting is that Rex wrote that there was nothing confidential in the briefcase.

He could have looked on the internet and realized that the stuff is on the net to begin . . .
Mary

I was thinking the same thing when I read it. There is no longer any confidential information on the internet. Maybe this was all just a big fuck you from Rex to COB!!! Cutting off one's nose to spite his face seems pretty common reaction from the clams.

[Mick Wenlock]

He didn't work there anymore, so I doubt workmen's comp will come into play.

Yes it does -he was there to finish off his work commitment and to be compensated.

[AngeloV]

This is such an extreme good news, bad news situation.
Good News
1. CoS has the biggest PR disaster since the death of Lisa M.
2. A large revenue stream will most likely be dammed up.
3. A civil suit brought by the family of the deceased may expose OT materials and the extreme duress caused by church regging practices.
Bad News
Someone had to die. :no:

[Mockingbird6]

Since Ciancio was shot in "the courseroom", it looks like Fowler Software may have been a "Model of Admin Knowhow" award winner from WISE (one of the stipulations is an in-house courseroom teaching Hubbard Business Management--Scientology Policy/Comm Course/etc.--to all staff). This is a further tie-in to show the influence of Scientology in the whole mess.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Yes it does -he was there to finish off his work commitment and to be compensated.

I just don't know the laws about this. And I couldn't find anything on the Colorado's Workers Comp website.

[byte301]

This is so sad on so many levels. I feel so sorry for the deceased's family.

[Axiom142]

They will no doubt be paid to keep their mouths shut, and a little bit of blackmail could help them to decide.....
but is settling out of court for first degree murder an option? Can he stay out of the klink that way?

Actually, who know's? OSA is having meetings about what to offer, who to offer it to, who to blackmail, who should be made to shut up, who should be made to say something useful for OSA who should be sued, who should be "lied to, tricked...." what the shore stories are going to be. What a fucking Engram! There must be a huge intergalactic past lives whole track earlier similar implant by passed charge producing basic at the end of the chain on this one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can’t see this happening. Even the CoS aren’t that stupid.

At the moment, they are in line for some very bad publicity, but this is just one more example on top of all the bad publicity they’ve had over the past few years.

But, if they attempt to interfere with a murder investigation, that becomes a very serious matter. Obstruction of Justice carries a hefty punishment and if they get caught, this would go all the way to the top (remember that Tommy Davis stated that Miscavige was in charge of the CoS and we have several witnesses that could testify that nothing happens at a strategic level without his approval). If Miscavige went to jail, the demise of the ‘church’ of Scientology would follow very soon afterwards.

I have never heard of a court (at least in a country with a proper judicial system) allowing a perpetrator to buy his way out of a murder charge. And, I cannot see why the DA would settle for a plea bargain when they clearly have Fowler banged to rights for a capital crime.

If Fowler has any sense, he will go for the insanity defence. Of course, given his (self-inflicted) injury he actually might not have any sense left, in which case his defence lawyer might enter a plea for him.

Axiom142

[Axiom142]

…

Back to the insurance company - they are going to wish to get this settled asap and as cheaply as they can. They will not care about whether Scientology gets "exposed" all they will wish to do is to pay the least they have to. they are not going to want to go to court especially if Fowler is convicted beforehand.

Ciancio was killed at work. There are workmen's comp claims to consider as well.

All very bureacratic I know but, I am hopeful, that Mr Ciancio's family will be able to get a very good settlement that will enable them to get on with their lives.

I don’t know how personal liability insurance works in the US. Is it usual for a person to have cover to pay the victims if they murder someone?

And, since it happened at a work place, is it possible that Fowler Software might get prosecuted for a breach of Health and Safety regulations and sued for allowing one of its employees to have a gun a work?

Axiom142

[Kathy (ImOut)]

I don’t know how personal liability insurance works in the US. Is it usual for a person to have cover to pay the victims if they murder someone?

And, since it happened at a work place, is it possible that Fowler Software might get prosecuted for a breach of Health and Safety regulations and sued for allowing one of its employees to have a gun a work?

Axiom142

Companies usually write their own gun policies. In TX, even tho you are allowed to keep a gun in your vehicle, some companies do NOT allow you to have a gun in your vehicle while on company property. (The people of TX are currently trying to change that law.) And if you have a carry permit, some companies can still write into their company policy that you can NOT carry the gun on you while in the building of the company.

When I was in CO last summer, I could keep my gun in my trunk, but not in the cab, while I was in the state. (Granted, it doesn't do me a lot of good in the trunk, but I did follow that rule, since getting caught with it where I wasn't allowed to have it would be bad.)

[Zinjifar]

I don’t know how personal liability insurance works in the US. Is it usual for a person to have cover to pay the victims if they murder someone?

And, since it happened at a work place, is it possible that Fowler Software might get prosecuted for a breach of Health and Safety regulations and sued for allowing one of its employees to have a gun a work?

Axiom142

I think it's called 'A Hostile Work Environment' :)

Zinj

[Mark A. Baker]

Companies usually write their own gun policies. In TX, even tho you are allowed to keep a gun in your vehicle, some companies do NOT allow you to have a gun in your vehicle while on company property. (The people of TX are currently trying to change that law.) And if you have a carry permit, some companies can still write into their company policy that you can NOT carry the gun on you while in the building of the company.

Property owners are normally allowed to determine who has a right to carry arms on their own property. Denial of that right would arguably be an infringement of property holder's rights. Carry permits do not apply to private property.

For obvious reasons insurance companies are loath to encourage arms being made readily available at insured companies workplaces. :whistling:


Mark A. Baker

[Enthetan]

9News:Ex-employee remembers hearing 1 final shot in workplace shooting (http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=131475&catid=339)


ADAMS COUNTY - Ubaldo Ciminieri remembers hearing three shots. Then he remembers hearing silence. And then he remembers hearing one final shot.

After that, "it was just chaos," the former employee of Fowler Software Design said. He didn't know it at the time, but now he knows precisely what Adams County investigators suspect.

They believe the founder of the company, Rex Fowler, shot and killed the company's former Chief Operating Officer on Dec. 30, 2009, shortly after Tom Ciancio arrived to pick up a nearly $10,000 severance check. They also believe Fowler used the final shot to shoot himself in the head. He survived the shot, and is now in custody at an "undisclosed location" according to the Adams County District Attorneys Office.

Prosecutors have charged Fowler with one count of first-degree murder. He was advised of his rights "by phone" on Monday.

"(Ciancio) was a really good friend to me and my wife," Ciminieri said on Monday.

Ciancio resigned from the company in late November.

"He was extremely frustrated because he felt like he couldn't get the support that he needed to correctly run the technical division and to correctly manage projects," Ciminieri added.

Ciminieri is well aware of the business' connection to the Church of Scientology.

"The majority of the members were Scientologists," he said.

Yet he quickly added, "There was never any pressure on me to join the church. You know, they never really said or brought in the church aspect, but it was there."

Ciminieri told investigators Fowler had taken around $160,000 of the company's money without asking a few years ago. He added Fowler later explained he gave it to "a charity in Africa or something like that." That eventually, according to Ciminieri, led to the company promoting someone else as its CEO.

Another employee told investigators he and Ciancio had been able to see "several large withdrawls by William (Rex) Fowler totaling in the area of $200,000 to $250,000."

Court documents suggest "Thomas Ciancio did not like William Fowler taking the company's money and causing a financial hardship on the company... (Ciancio) became frustrated with the way the company was being run and resigned in November 2009."

Ciancio showed up at Fowler Software Design on Dec. 30, 2009, expecting to pick up a check from the company. Shortly thereafter, investigators believe, Fowler shot Ciancio three times in the head.

"It was (Ciancio's) son's birthday and he wanted to close this part of his business life and move on," Ciminieri said.

Ciminieri now works for a company called "Business Controls" which is specifically geared for dealing with workplace violence.

"It just happens to be the perfect place where I feel I can use my experience to help people prevent workplace violence," he said.

[AngeloV]

9News:Ex-employee remembers hearing 1 final shot in workplace shooting (http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=131475&catid=339)


ADAMS COUNTY - Ubaldo Ciminieri remembers hearing three shots. Then he remembers hearing silence. And then he remembers hearing one final shot.

After that, "it was just chaos," the former employee of Fowler Software Design said. He didn't know it at the time, but now he knows precisely what Adams County investigators suspect.

They believe the founder of the company, Rex Fowler, shot and killed the company's former Chief Operating Officer on Dec. 30, 2009, shortly after Tom Ciancio arrived to pick up a nearly $10,000 severance check. They also believe Fowler used the final shot to shoot himself in the head. He survived the shot, and is now in custody at an "undisclosed location" according to the Adams County District Attorneys Office. I'm beginning to think the "undisclosed location" is one of Denver's psychiatric hospitals.

[snip]

"It was (Ciancio's) son's birthday and he wanted to close this part of his business life and move on," Ciminieri said. This really sucks the big one. Poor kid. :no:

Ciminieri now works for a company called "Business Controls" which is specifically geared for dealing with workplace violence.

"It just happens to be the perfect place where I feel I can use my experience to help people prevent workplace violence," he said.
My comments in bold.

[degraded being]

I can’t see this happening. Even the CoS aren’t that stupid.

At the moment, they are in line for some very bad publicity, but this is just one more example on top of all the bad publicity they’ve had over the past few years.

But, if they attempt to interfere with a murder investigation, that becomes a very serious matter. Obstruction of Justice carries a hefty punishment and if they get caught, this would go all the way to the top (remember that Tommy Davis stated that Miscavige was in charge of the CoS and we have several witnesses that could testify that nothing happens at a strategic level without his approval). If Miscavige went to jail, the demise of the ‘church’ of Scientology would follow very soon afterwards.

I have never heard of a court (at least in a country with a proper judicial system) allowing a perpetrator to buy his way out of a murder charge. And, I cannot see why the DA would settle for a plea bargain when they clearly have Fowler banged to rights for a capital crime.

If Fowler has any sense, he will go for the insanity defence. Of course, given his (self-inflicted) injury he actually might not have any sense left, in which case his defence lawyer might enter a plea for him.

Axiom142

It was a rhetorical question.

[Thrak]

I can’t see this happening. Even the CoS aren’t that stupid.

At the moment, they are in line for some very bad publicity, but this is just one more example on top of all the bad publicity they’ve had over the past few years.

But, if they attempt to interfere with a murder investigation, that becomes a very serious matter. Obstruction of Justice carries a hefty punishment and if they get caught, this would go all the way to the top (remember that Tommy Davis stated that Miscavige was in charge of the CoS and we have several witnesses that could testify that nothing happens at a strategic level without his approval). If Miscavige went to jail, the demise of the ‘church’ of Scientology would follow very soon afterwards.

I have never heard of a court (at least in a country with a proper judicial system) allowing a perpetrator to buy his way out of a murder charge. And, I cannot see why the DA would settle for a plea bargain when they clearly have Fowler banged to rights for a capital crime.

If Fowler has any sense, he will go for the insanity defence. Of course, given his (self-inflicted) injury he actually might not have any sense left, in which case his defence lawyer might enter a plea for him.

Axiom142

I agree with most of what you said. The point I was making about buying you're way out was in reference to O.J. It is possible, but I doubt he has that kind of cash. And once again remember that the guy is probably missing a significant part of his brain and I'm sure his eventual condition will be a big factor in how things proceed. I doubt we will see a lot of wrangling here or some wild self defense theory if he can't talk or think right. The insanity defense would be epic fail - for CofS at least.

As for where he is, I'm sure it's some secured medical facility and he's probably restrained, sedated and definitely on suicide watch. They don't like to let murderers off themselves before trial.

[Mockingbird6]

The reason why Fowler is being held at an undisclosed location is because the police are so F'ing tired of having the reges drop in unannounced to try to get another donation!!! LOL

Or at the very least, OSA dropping in to try to tell Rex what happened.

LOL again.

[Feral]

The reason why Fowler is being held at an undisclosed location is because the police are so F'ing tired of having <SNIP> OSA dropping in to try to tell Rex what happened.

LOL again.

I know you were joking, but there is every possibility that could happen.

After all, in Scientology isn't 'reality' just the 'agreed upon' version of the circumstances?

So, what is it to the cult if thet get Rex to 'agree' to their version of the truth? To them that would be 'reality'.

[Zinjifar]

The 'Church' position is predictable, although, It's doubtful that it will be spoken out side of the 'Church', since it's out gradient for wogs.

Rex was PDHed

Zinj

[Panda Termint]

... by scientology.

[smartone]

I'm curious whether Killer Rex did background checks on his employees before he hired them. Turns out that Ubaldo Ciminieri, his VP of Sales & Marketing (and the person the victim first went to see - but wasn't in his office) is a registered sex offender in Denver Colorado.

1415 WASHINGTON ST - 12/30/1975 - MALE - WHITE - ENTICEMENT OF A CHILD (Page 3 of 10)

http://www.denvergov.org/DenverMaps/downloads/maps/citywide/registeredsexoffenders.pdf

Also, Rex's son Alex is no longer in the Sea Org.

http://www.facebook.com/people/Alex-Fowler/100000110749149

It could be another Ubaldo Ciminieri maybe. How do we know he's one and the same Ubaldo Ciminieri on that list?

Why are there so many male sex offenders? :unsure:

[Kookaburra]

I don’t know how personal liability insurance works in the US. Is it usual for a person to have cover to pay the victims if they murder someone?

And, since it happened at a work place, is it possible that Fowler Software might get prosecuted for a breach of Health and Safety regulations and sued for allowing one of its employees to have a gun a work?

Axiom142

No, I'm pretty sure you can't get insurance to pay to your murder victims.

Unless the US constitution has been dramatically eroded recently, there is no law I know of in the US against having a gun in the workplace.


The reason why Fowler is being held at an undisclosed location is because the police are so F'ing tired of having the reges drop in unannounced to try to get another donation!!! LOL

Or at the very least, OSA dropping in to try to tell Rex what happened.

LOL again.


I know you were joking, but there is every possibility that could happen.

After all, in Scientology isn't 'reality' just the 'agreed upon' version of the circumstances?

So, what is it to the cult if thet get Rex to 'agree' to their version of the truth? To them that would be 'reality'.

There is more than every possibility. They had a guard outside his door at the hospital keeping people out. I'm sure it was OSA's top priority to get to him.

[smartone]

Once he starts talking about invisible beings left over from a nuclear Armageddon that happened on Earth 75 million years ago, the prosecution is at least going to have a few doubts about his sanity.

But to cap it all off, he should play ‘Thank You For Listening’ sung by Hubbard and tell them this is the finest recording in the history of the universe. Ever! If that doesn’t convince them he is due for a stay in the funny farm, nothing will! :screwy:

Axiom142

:lol:

[HelluvaHoax!]

Scieno-Scenario: Secretly recorded audiotape of emergency meeting of OSA's top 25 Execs to strategize how to handle the hill ten...

OSA EXEC #1: We have to get to Fowler immediately and protect the Church!

OSA EXEC #13: And safeguard the only technology to free mankind to Operating Thetan!

OSA EXEC #22: But he's under 24-hour police protective custody. No way to get to him!

NEW OSA RECRUIT: Excuse me...I know I am new here, but may I ask a question?

OSA EXEC #1: What is it?

NEW OSA RECRUIT: Can't we just get our OT's to go exterior and do it telepathically?

(Technical Malfunction: At this point, the audiotape becomes garbled with what sounds to be all of the OSA Execs hysterically line charging )

[skollie]

A comment at the SPTimes.


meme555 wrote:

Isn't it ironic that the Scientology haters consistently go off-topic and then resort to name calling? But, to comment on the Fowler incident: to be accused of a crime is not the same as being convicted of one. And, btw, both men had guns. Both men were shot. I would dare say, let our justice system bear this ine out. However, if you think someone is guilty just because they are a Scientologist then you have clearly crossed the line into the realm of bigotry.



:melodramatic:

[Anonycat]

Interesting to see how this unfolds ...

[Nurse Pinch]

What a tragedy.

My sincere condolences to the Ciancio family.

I hope they find a special place in hell for that Fowler prick.

Pinchy.

[Kookaburra]

A comment at the SPTimes.


meme555 wrote:



Isn't it ironic that the Scientology haters consistently go off-topic and then resort to name calling? But, to comment on the Fowler incident: to be accused of a crime is not the same as being convicted of one. And, btw, both men had guns. Both men were shot. I would dare say, let our justice system bear this ine out. However, if you think someone is guilty just because they are a Scientologist then you have clearly crossed the line into the realm of bigotry.

:melodramatic:


One starts to notice that one can smell a Scientologist a mile away due to the brown goo oozing out of it's ears. :duh:

My god, all those Scios still left inside must be vying for the Monty Python Gullibility Award.

So the OSA PR line must be that there was a shootout. Of course, OT VII Fowler was defending himself.

Note to lurking Scios: When you blow, bring a copy of the DA pack on this murder, will you please. It will be worth a couple hundred grand to the Ciancio family for the slander.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

meme555 wrote:
Quote:
Isn't it ironic that the Scientology haters consistently go off-topic and then resort to name calling? But, to comment on the Fowler incident: to be accused of a crime is not the same as being convicted of one. And, btw, both men had guns. Both men were shot. I would dare say, let our justice system bear this ine out. However, if you think someone is guilty just because they are a Scientologist then you have clearly crossed the line into the realm of bigotry.

Just because both men were shot, does NOT equal both men had guns. This person is so stupid.

No where have I seen that there were two guns involved. Does this person not realize that a person can actually shoot themself?

Or does this person think that just because Fowler is a Scn on OT VII, they wouldn't shoot themself?
:duh::duh::duh:

[Dulloldfart]

Or does this person think that just because Fowler is a Scn on OT VII, they wouldn't shoot themself?


Maybe he was just shooting the suppressive body thetan that offed the other guy.

Paul

[Panda Termint]

<....snip>
Or does this person think that just because Fowler is a Scn on OT VII, they wouldn't shoot themself?
I know a few OTVIIs who would think that being forced to continue on this Level was more than reason enough!

[Thrak]

What a tragedy.

My sincere condolences to the Ciancio family.

I hope they find a special place in hell for that Fowler prick.

Pinchy.

I personally don't feel that way about Fowler. I've had enough exposure to this organization to know what they can do to a person's mind. The bodies are piling up while little Dave enjoys his $50k stereos, privates jets and $5000 suits and empty million$$$$ houses. That's the guy who needs the reserved spot in hell.

[degraded being]

A comment at the SPTimes.


meme555 wrote:



:melodramatic:

All scientologists are guilty by association.

[Mockingbird6]

It could be another Ubaldo Ciminieri maybe. How do we know he's one and the same Ubaldo Ciminieri on that list?



Like, are there two Ubaldo Ciminieri's in the whole world?

[Kookaburra]

I personally don't feel that way about Fowler. I've had enough exposure to this organization to know what they can do to a person's mind. The bodies are piling up while little Dave enjoys his $50k stereos, privates jets and $5000 suits and empty million$$$$ houses. That's the guy who needs the reserved spot in hell.

^^^^^THIS^^^^^

[Feral]

One starts to notice that one can smell a Scientologist a mile away due to the brown goo oozing out of it's ears. :duh:

My god, all those Scios still left inside must be vying for the Monty Python Gullibility Award.

So the OSA PR line must be that there was a shootout. Of course, OT VII Fowler was defending himself.

Note to lurking Scios: When you blow, bring a copy of the DA pack on this murder, will you please. It will be worth a couple hundred grand to the Ciancio family for the slander.

This is a classic example of OSA changing the facts to match their reality, after all reality is just agreement!

Let's all agree there were two guns! Woo hoo Scientology is the road to truth!....OSAs truth.

[Lurker5]

As an outsider, listening, hearing, what Jan Fowler, the wife of shooter, has said, about Rex being a scn'ist, about the dead man 'threatening' Rex with a lawsuit over moneys owed, blah blah, that Rex wouldn't go (give in?) without a fight - 'he's a scientologist', etc (-or whatever specifically the press has said she stated), I get the IMPRESSION, as a wog, ahem, that she believes that BECAUSE her husband is a scn'ist, he could shoot someone - anyone - for bringing a lawsuit against him - and it is not a crime, like the bad guy here is the dead man because he wanted money (owed to him).

The f'g AUDACITY ! :omg: - that a WOG would so threaten a scn'ist with a lawsuit - over money ! Such Wogs don't deserve to live, and it's not a crime to 'remove' them from existance.

This is how it comes off to the uninitiated - IMO. It is such a ludicrous justification. Jan Fowler, Rex - have both gone over the edge. Scn - me thinks - is sawing away, as Jan speaks, as I write, at the ropes holding them from the long, long fall (if they haven't already hit the bottom - clueless).

If it weren't so tragic, for the dead man and his family, and yes, for the Fowlers too, for all scn'ists, this would be funny - or night time tv 'movie of the week' fodder.

Hey - that's not a bad idea . . . if producers / tv execs have the guts to take it on.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Maybe he was just shooting the suppressive body thetan that offed the other guy.

Paul

:dieslaughing::dieslaughing::dieslaughing:

My husband put it another way, but I can't remember. But it was funny, also.

[Axiom142]

It was a rhetorical question.

And your point is? :confused2:

If someone posts something on a public forum, then it is highly likely that someone will respond to that post (especially if it concerns guns and US citizens are involved :whistling:), whether a question was asked or not.

Most people are very glad to get quoted by me. :whistling:

Ax

[Div6]

As an outsider, listening, hearing, what Jan Fowler, the wife of shooter, has said, about Rex being a scn'ist, about the dead man 'threatening' Rex with a lawsuit over moneys owed, blah blah, that Rex wouldn't go (give in?) without a fight - 'he's a scientologist', etc (-or whatever specifically the press has said she stated), I get the IMPRESSION, as a wog, ahem, that she believes that BECAUSE her husband is a scn'ist, he could shoot someone - anyone - for bringing a lawsuit against him - and it is not a crime, like the bad guy here is the dead man because he wanted money (owed to him).

The f'g AUDACITY ! :omg: - that a WOG would so threaten a scn'ist with a lawsuit - over money ! Such Wogs don't deserve to live, and it's not a crime to 'remove' them from existance.

This is how it comes off the the uninitiated - IMO. It is such a ludicrous justification. Jan Fowler, Rex - have both gone over the edge. Scn - me thinks - is sawing away, as Jan speaks, as I write, at the ropes holding them from the long, long fall (if they haven't already hit the bottom - clueless).

If it weren't so tragic, for the dead man and his family, and yes, for the Fowlers too, for all scn'ists, this would be funny - or night time tv 'movie of the week' fodder.

Hey - that's not a bad idea . . . if producers / tv execs have the guts to take it on.

If Rex Fowler went "PTS" to this situation, it would mean even more "review" and sec-checking at Solo NOTS rates.....

For PTSNess, the mantra is "Handle or disconnect".

It seems he went a bit overboard on the former and botched the latter.....IF he is culpable.

[Mockingbird6]

As an outsider, listening, hearing, what Jan Fowler, the wife of shooter, has said, about Rex being a scn'ist, about the dead man 'threatening' Rex with a lawsuit over moneys owed, blah blah, that Rex wouldn't go (give in?) without a fight - 'he's a scientologist', etc (-or whatever specifically the press has said she stated), I get the IMPRESSION, as a wog, ahem, that she believes that BECAUSE her husband is a scn'ist, he could shoot someone - anyone - for bringing a lawsuit against him - and it is not a crime, like the bad guy here is the dead man because he wanted money (owed to him).


I myself am speculating wildly all over the place but this one is missing the mark.

What Jan Fowler said was that her husband would not give in to someone attacking him with a gun without putting up a fight. This was when she actually thought Ciancio had started it. She did not say Rex would not give in to someone bringing a lawsuit without shooting him.

Come to think of it, Lurker 5, you are right that it appears he "did not give in to someone bringing a law suit without shooting him." :duh: I'm only saying that is not what Jan Fowler meant.

[Lurker5]

Thank you, Mockingbird6, for that correction. You are right, that is what she meant, now that I think back on it. I wonder how many in the general public mis-heard / 'mis-understood' it too?

[Thrak]

As an outsider, listening, hearing, what Jan Fowler, the wife of shooter, has said, about Rex being a scn'ist, about the dead man 'threatening' Rex with a lawsuit over moneys owed, blah blah, that Rex wouldn't go (give in?) without a fight - 'he's a scientologist', etc (-or whatever specifically the press has said she stated), I get the IMPRESSION, as a wog, ahem, that she believes that BECAUSE her husband is a scn'ist, he could shoot someone - anyone - for bringing a lawsuit against him - and it is not a crime, like the bad guy here is the dead man because he wanted money (owed to him).

The f'g AUDACITY ! :omg: - that a WOG would so threaten a scn'ist with a lawsuit - over money ! Such Wogs don't deserve to live, and it's not a crime to 'remove' them from existance.

This is how it comes off to the uninitiated - IMO. It is such a ludicrous justification. Jan Fowler, Rex - have both gone over the edge. Scn - me thinks - is sawing away, as Jan speaks, as I write, at the ropes holding them from the long, long fall (if they haven't already hit the bottom - clueless).

If it weren't so tragic, for the dead man and his family, and yes, for the Fowlers too, for all scn'ists, this would be funny - or night time tv 'movie of the week' fodder.

Hey - that's not a bad idea . . . if producers / tv execs have the guts to take it on.

She probably didn't know what had happened when she said that but yes you are right a big part of the scio head fuck is this phony superiority like all scios are superior to "wogs". scientologists really believe they have have taken the next step forward in evolution to "homo novus" and believe their "cause" is so important it would be justified taking out a "wog" if he were threatening a scio or his church.

But then again you have to realize only a small percentage would take it this far but I believe the combination of the extreme and in my opinion homicidal push for money from the "church", the nature of the ot levels, and the constant implanting one receives while at any "org" are enough to send people over the edge. And it has happened that in numerous cases.

[Axiom142]

A comment at the SPTimes.

meme555 wrote:



Isn't it ironic that the Scientology haters consistently go off-topic and then resort to name calling? But, to comment on the Fowler incident: to be accused of a crime is not the same as being convicted of one. And, btw, both men had guns. Both men were shot. I would dare say, let our justice system bear this ine out. However, if you think someone is guilty just because they are a Scientologist then you have clearly crossed the line into the realm of bigotry.


:melodramatic:

I saw that too. I thought about responding, but then I thought “What is the point?” Deluded Scientologists tend to lose the capacity to hear ‘entheta (i.e. anything that disagrees with their worldview). Obviously this ‘person’ (OSAbot?) hasn’t bothered to actually study the facts.

In the police report, there is no mention of another gun, therefore it didn’t exist. Ciancio was seated at a desk and at least 2 rounds were fired into his head from behind. Other witnesses have described a gap between the first set of 3 shots and the final one. The inescapable conclusion is therefore that Fowler was talking to Ciancio at the desk, was enraged by this ‘wog’ who dared to leave and expected to be paid, thus robbing Fowler of valuable money that should rightfully go to his beloved ‘church’. This, coupled with the problems that he had been experiencing in his auditing and pressures from the CoS for more money and time, resulted in him losing all self-control. So, he pulls out his Glock Model 19 and removes the immediate ‘cause’ of his problems.

After a few seconds, reality hits home and he sees the enormity of his actions and is unable to confront the consequences and so tries to ‘solve’ this problem by forcible self-exteriorisation.

I’m sure that Kooka is right and that OSA are already spinning a ‘new reality’.

In this scenario, Ciancio is a psych patient and has been programmed to destroy Fowler. Ciancio arrives at the office and demands to see Fowler. When they are alone, Ciancio pulls out his Colt M1911 and rams it under Fowler’s chin, demanding that he announce over the company PA that L Ron Hubbard was a conman.

Obviously, Fowler would rather lose his body that ever do this, and refuses. Ciancio is insistent and threatens to kill Fowler unless he agrees to his dastardly plan. Bravely, Fowler summons up all of his OT powers of confront and uses his knowledge of the ARC triangle to get into communication with Ciancio and defuse the situation.

But, Ciancio has been pumped full of a cocktail of mind-altering psych drugs and is totally out of valence and communication. Realising that the situation is hopeless and unwilling to compromise his reality by denouncing LRH, Fowler teleports his Glock from its secure location at his home. But before he can harmlessly shoot the automatic from Ciancio’s hand, his assailant becomes aware of this and pulls the trigger, shooting Fowler through the top of his head. With a superhuman effort, Fowler goes exterior and remotely-controlling his badly damaged body, shoots Ciancio in the head.

To his horror, he realises that Ciancio is so full of drugs that he is not stopping, so Fowler reluctantly fires twice more before Ciancio slumps to the ground. Fowler then calls the police and again uses his complete mastery of bodily processes to partially heal his body and prevent it from succumbing to the grievous injuries it has suffered.

Or something like that.

Unfortunately for OSA, when they start lying like this, they don’t know when to stop. And when the truth does finally get through to their followers, the effect is much worse than if they had just said nothing as it will be clear that they have been lying and people start to ask why.

Axiom142

[Mick Wenlock]

I just don't know the laws about this. And I couldn't find anything on the Colorado's Workers Comp website.


I checked with our counsel here at work and they were definite about it, but they are not the final word I guess. So it will be something to look for as this thing unfolds.

[TalleyWhacker]

I saw that too. I thought about responding, but then I thought “What is the point?” Deluded Scientologists tend to lose the capacity to hear ‘entheta (i.e. anything that disagrees with their worldview). Obviously this ‘person’ (OSAbot?) hasn’t bothered to actually study the facts.

In the police report, there is no mention of another gun, therefore it didn’t exist. Ciancio was seated at a desk and at least 2 rounds were fired into his head from behind. Other witnesses have described a gap between the first set of 3 shots and the final one. The inescapable conclusion is therefore that Fowler was talking to Ciancio at the desk, was enraged by this ‘wog’ who dared to leave and expected to be paid, thus robbing Fowler of valuable money that should rightfully go to his beloved ‘church’. This, coupled with the problems that he had been experiencing in his auditing and pressures from the CoS for more money and time, resulted in him losing all self-control. So, he pulls out his Glock Model 19 and removes the immediate ‘cause’ of his problems.

After a few seconds, reality hits home and he sees the enormity of his actions and is unable to confront the consequences and so tries to ‘solve’ this problem by forcible self-exteriorisation.

I’m sure that Kooka is right and that OSA are already spinning a ‘new reality’.

In this scenario, Ciancio is a psych patient and has been programmed to destroy Fowler. Ciancio arrives at the office and demands to see Fowler. When they are alone, Ciancio pulls out his Colt M1911 and rams it under Fowler’s chin, demanding that he announce over the company PA that L Ron Hubbard was a conman.

Obviously, Fowler would rather lose his body that ever do this, and refuses. Ciancio is insistent and threatens to kill Fowler unless he agrees to his dastardly plan. Bravely, Fowler summons up all of his OT powers of confront and uses his knowledge of the ARC triangle to get into communication with Ciancio and defuse the situation.

But, Ciancio has been pumped full of a cocktail of mind-altering psych drugs and is totally out of valence and communication. Realising that the situation is hopeless and unwilling to compromise his reality by denouncing LRH, Fowler teleports his Glock from its secure location at his home. But before he can harmlessly shoot the automatic from Ciancio’s hand, his assailant becomes aware of this and pulls the trigger, shooting Fowler through the top of his head. With a superhuman effort, Fowler goes exterior and remotely-controlling his badly damaged body, shoots Ciancio in the head.

To his horror, he realises that Ciancio is so full of drugs that he is not stopping, so Fowler reluctantly fires twice more before Ciancio slumps to the ground. Fowler then calls the police and again uses his complete mastery of bodily processes to partially heal his body and prevent it from succumbing to the grievous injuries it has suffered.

Or something like that.

Unfortunately for OSA, when they start lying like this, they don’t know when to stop. And when the truth does finally get through to their followers, the effect is much worse than if they had just said nothing as it will be clear that they have been lying and people start to ask why.

Axiom142



Quite a yarn there, 142.
Under most circumstances, (with normal people) I wouldn't think anyone would go for it but KoolAid drinkers? ...well, I think you're on to something!

Go to print with that one!!! This is BPI!!!

[Lurker5]

I agree Thrak. The pressure on Rex must have been unbearable. He chose to take his life - tried/failed. He saw no other way out. The CoS had him pushed inside a very small box, boxed-in and sealed completely. I just wish he hadn't blamed and taken out an innocent - in his attempt to 'escape' his problems. I understand that is SOP in the CoS - finding someone else to blame. Not my idea of ethics at all. It is not an attractive human trait.

Sooo, will the oblivious public pick up on how big this is? Will the media delve into it, the Scn aspect, or will they quake in their boots and pretend it doesn't exist? That is the question.

Just one more brick in the wall . . .

[Thrak]

I saw that too. I thought about responding, but then I thought “What is the point?” Deluded Scientologists tend to lose the capacity to hear ‘entheta (i.e. anything that disagrees with their worldview). Obviously this ‘person’ (OSAbot?) hasn’t bothered to actually study the facts.

In the police report, there is no mention of another gun, therefore it didn’t exist. Ciancio was seated at a desk and at least 2 rounds were fired into his head from behind. Other witnesses have described a gap between the first set of 3 shots and the final one. The inescapable conclusion is therefore that Fowler was talking to Ciancio at the desk, was enraged by this ‘wog’ who dared to leave and expected to be paid, thus robbing Fowler of valuable money that should rightfully go to his beloved ‘church’. This, coupled with the problems that he had been experiencing in his auditing and pressures from the CoS for more money and time, resulted in him losing all self-control. So, he pulls out his Glock Model 19 and removes the immediate ‘cause’ of his problems.

After a few seconds, reality hits home and he sees the enormity of his actions and is unable to confront the consequences and so tries to ‘solve’ this problem by forcible self-exteriorisation.

I’m sure that Kooka is right and that OSA are already spinning a ‘new reality’.

In this scenario, Ciancio is a psych patient and has been programmed to destroy Fowler. Ciancio arrives at the office and demands to see Fowler. When they are alone, Ciancio pulls out his Colt M1911 and rams it under Fowler’s chin, demanding that he announce over the company PA that L Ron Hubbard was a conman.

Obviously, Fowler would rather lose his body that ever do this, and refuses. Ciancio is insistent and threatens to kill Fowler unless he agrees to his dastardly plan. Bravely, Fowler summons up all of his OT powers of confront and uses his knowledge of the ARC triangle to get into communication with Ciancio and defuse the situation.

But, Ciancio has been pumped full of a cocktail of mind-altering psych drugs and is totally out of valence and communication. Realising that the situation is hopeless and unwilling to compromise his reality by denouncing LRH, Fowler teleports his Glock from its secure location at his home. But before he can harmlessly shoot the automatic from Ciancio’s hand, his assailant becomes aware of this and pulls the trigger, shooting Fowler through the top of his head. With a superhuman effort, Fowler goes exterior and remotely-controlling his badly damaged body, shoots Ciancio in the head.

To his horror, he realises that Ciancio is so full of drugs that he is not stopping, so Fowler reluctantly fires twice more before Ciancio slumps to the ground. Fowler then calls the police and again uses his complete mastery of bodily processes to partially heal his body and prevent it from succumbing to the grievous injuries it has suffered.

Or something like that.

Unfortunately for OSA, when they start lying like this, they don’t know when to stop. And when the truth does finally get through to their followers, the effect is much worse than if they had just said nothing as it will be clear that they have been lying and people start to ask why.

Axiom142

Keep in mind though that the police had reason to believe that that this was pre-meditated as he had left various notes for his wife as if he was going away.

[Mark A. Baker]

Maybe he was just shooting the suppressive body thetan that offed the other guy.

Paul

Now THAT would be an interesting new argument for the defense to propose.

"Your honor, my client is only guilty of having attempted to stop a murder in the process of occurring. He is only guilty of acting in self-defense and in defense of the victim. His actions admittedly proved to be insufficiently timely, yet he sought to prevent the intentional murder of the victim by a hostile and aggressive spiritual entity who had assumed partial control of his own body."

That one would certainly make the law texts right alongside the "Twinkie Defense".


Mark A. Baker

[Axiom142]

Keep in mind though that the police had reason to believe that that this was pre-meditated as he had left various notes for his wife as if he was going away.

Yes Thrak, that’s the shocking part isn’t it?

That there was a note directing that his wife should get the briefcase and the fact that he had brought his gun into work, when it was allegedly usually left at home, could suggest that he had planned this.

If so, this is a very worrying development, but entirely in keeping with the ‘siege mentality’ within the CoS at the moment. “The enemies are everywhere.”

In any case, this may all be moot. What if Fowler is deemed unfit to stand trial because of his injuries? Would he be put in a secure nursing facility or would they have the trial without him?

I’m sure that the CoS would love it if he never got to face charges in court.

Axiom142

[Free2Dream]

Rex was advised via phone of the charges against him. The next court date will be next Monday. I wonder if he'll actually be there?

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14266746

[Mockingbird6]

Rex was advised via phone of the charges against him. The next court date will be next Monday. I wonder if he'll actually be there?

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14266746

Thanks for the link. One more scenario occurs to me: that the police have him in a secure but undisclosed location because they think someone from the church might try to "off" him to prevent his testimony?

[Free2Dream]

MB6, that's entirely possible. It could also be that he's received death threats, since he failed to finish the job himself. I was thinking it might also be so he can't be influenced by any church members, i.e. OSA.

I wonder if his family knows where his is or even gets to visit with him? If they do, do they know or care about how lucky they are? The only way Tom Ciancio's family can visit him is by going to the cemetary.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

More than likely Fowler is in a rehab facility. Getting physical therapy to reteach him how to do the basics - walk, talk, etc. It's much cheaper than being in a hospital, but he still gets the "looking after" that he probably still needs.

[Axiom142]

More than likely Fowler is in a rehab facility. Getting physical therapy to reteach him how to do the basics - walk, talk, etc. It's much cheaper than being in a hospital, but he still gets the "looking after" that he probably still needs.

Wouldn’t it be ironic if some fresh-faced VM turned up to give assists to the patients and said to Fowler “Scientology can help you with your problems!” :ohmy:

Ax

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Wouldn’t it be ironic if some fresh-faced VM turned up to give assists to the patients and said to Fowler “Scientology can help you with your problems!” :ohmy:

Ax

:dieslaughing: :dieslaughing: :dieslaughing:


That is too damn funny.

Fowler's response: that's what got me in this condition/position - Scn. VM run while you can.

[Mockingbird6]

Yet one more scenario for the undisclosed location: the police are trying to prevent Rex from getting his next instructions from the C/S!

It says, "Tell yourself you have permission to go."

[smartone]

Like, are there two Ubaldo Ciminieri's in the whole world?

Maybe more in the US at least.

[Thrak]

There is a new thread here where Larry Anderson is going to speak on Denver radio and in Larry's message he said the the Denver area was "buzzing" about scn due to this story. If you think about it this really could be a major problem and really cross into new territory.

As you know there have been many incidents in the past but most were contained in the scio world. With this we have a hard core upper level scio killing a non scio potentially because of his religious beliefs. Or at least his behavior could well have been - and as we know WAS - influenced by this "church".

This could put some major scrutiny on what has been happening over in Elron Land.

[Iknowtoomuch]

I'm sure DM and his boys are burning any evidence they have of the name Rex Fowler.
I hope the cops photo every page of what's in his OTVII folder.

[Smurf]

New article.:

Suspect's Scientology Faith Ripples Through AdCo Murder Probe - Victim Accused Software Firm Founder Of Diverting $200,000 To Unidentified 'Church'

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/22361297/detail.html

This speaks volumes. Sounds like Janet Fowler is a real piece of work:

"When detectives asked Janet Fowler to speak with them, she had an urgent concern as her husband lay fighting for his life in the intensive care unit. "Janet Fowler quickly demanded the briefcase" containing information about Scientology that detectives had removed from his office, the arrest affidavit stated. "One thing I need is his briefcase," Janet Fowler told detectives, according to the court record. "It was taken out of his office. It is important to me, my church, and it is religious material and I want it now!"

Rex Fowler had left a note dated the day of the shooting instructing whoever found it to "please give the briefcase to Jan." Another note, found on Fowler's work desk along with several keys, explained to "Jan" what each key unlocked.

Detective Gene Claps explained to Janet Fowler that investigators needed to review the briefcase contents. "Even if you looked at it and read it, you would not understand anything in it," the wife replied, the arrest affidavit stated. "Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant." "Janet Fowler then demanded the briefcase be returned again, by saying, 'I want it back now, right now!' " Claps wrote in his statement.

[Zinjifar]

Stupid wogs. They didn't even recognize a tone 40 when receiving it point blank.

Zinj

[HelluvaHoax!]

Stupid wogs. They didn't even recognize a tone 40 when receiving it point blank.
Zinj

She twinned on Tone 40 Drills with Tommy Davis just before he stormed back to Nightline to demand his meltdown interview with Martin Bashir be pulled from airing.

It's not that their tone 40 doesn't work, but as you correctly pointed out, WOGs are dense. They have com lags.

A few weeks from now, that Denver detective is going to wake up suddenly one day and blurt out: "Shit, we need to give that briefcase back right now!"

When the planet is Clear these kind of minor glitches won't happen any more.

[Thrak]

This is for lurkers who don't know how this all works. When you are in scientology you are constantly told through hundreds of hours of Hubbard lectures that there is a state called "OT" and if you persist you can achieve a state where you have near super human powers. Many don't believe it at first and don't get in for that as they would just like to help themselves and their friends, but year after year this MYTH begins to take hold and you begin to believe you can achieve this state and be free from all troubles, and you are taught to believe that if many around the world achieved it, then the positive influence of these individuals would calm the planet and bring sanity and order to it.

Along this way though it becomes assumed by everyone there that these states DO exist and it turns into them saying that the ONLY sane thing you can do is to stay on this route and you should make WHATEVER sacrifices necessary to stay with it as the ENTIRE WORLD needs you to do it. I'm actually understating as they really believe the ENTIRE UNIVERSE needs you to do this.

The problem is that they have been yet to prove that they can create anything like this state but people don't seem to notice and they take this world savior personality to the absolute extreme. Many give up decades of their lives, and give up friends and family as it's THAT important.

A big plan for the church which they sell as the solution to the problems of the world, is to get 10,000 people on "Solo NOTS". That is another name for OT7 which is a very high "OT level" - OT8 is the highest offered. Having that number of people on this high "OT Level" should bring enough calming influence to society as bring order and sanity back to the planet. This level can take over 10 years and auditing on the level is done alone and must be done daily. The materials for this level are deep scientology secrets and expect people in possession of them to defend them with their lives as they are the secret of secrets. Rex Fowler was on OT7 and this is why Fowler's wife said what she said about the briefcase. The idiocy is that the materials are all over the internet and nobody gives a crap except them.

Hubbard was insane by most accounts and came up with a lot of seriously abusive policies as the years went by. When Hubbard went into seclusion and died, David Miscavige muscled his way in to become his unappointed successor and was intent on perpetuating everything abusive ever set up by Hubbard and adding some new ones of his own.

One of his real beauties was the IAS or International Association of Scientologists. This a division of the church that supposedly runs various campaigns to forward the goals of scientology to keep scientology available for all mankind etc. They claim they run programs to get kids off drugs, help criminals return to society and various other humanitarian programs. But from many accounts only a small percentage goes to what they claim, and a lot goes to handling court cases etc. and other indulgences like celebrity birthday parties. Membership in the IAS, even though not set up by Hubbard, has become mandatory if you want to do the services there. I believe a lifetime membership is now $3,000.

The problem is they don't stop there. They have some of the craftiest and most aggressive sales people you could ever imagine. They are constantly asking for more money and we are talking BIG money. Some have "donated" millions to them. The work in teams at times, and if they target a particular person they will surround that person with numerous IAS personnel and basically work you over mentally looking for any button or weakness for as long as it takes until they get compliance. We are talking thousands and thousands for nothing in return except a tax write off. They also have financial specialists who will "help" you get enough loans and credit to come up with the money.

They use many techniques to get compliance. They usually talk about some situation somewhere that is such an emergency that untold numbers of people will die if you don't help and that you are the only one who can as you "get it". They often refer to some specific area so it is consistent with the Fowler case that Africa was mentioned. They also try to get you to believe that there is some sort of Karma entity out there watching you and no matter how destructive this donation seems it would be to you, you will be ok and probably even make the money right back as you've done such an act of good.

Another of the techniques they use is to dangle the "OT" button in the guys face. As I said earlier you are taught to believe that these incredible states exist but if you don't act as expected they might just prohibit you from achieving them. "Your eternity" will be in jeopardy. It's completely extortion but the threat they wave in your face is a total fantasy, you just don't know that at the time.

This behavior has had disastrous results as they will and have pushed people to the point of bankruptcy, mental breakdown and even death. They will not just give the money back. They are in reality unconcerned about the negative effects this has to the person but the Fowler case has the dreaded "Bad PR" which they are very concerned about and will make many attempts to find a way to bury this or distance themselves from it.

I could go into further detail but I'm just trying to give people an idea of what happens. It has not been stated yet if Fowler gave the $200K to the IAS but when any scientologist hears $200K "donation" they immediately think IAS. These guys put EXTREME, LIFE/MENTAL HEALTH THREATENING pressure on people and this was not the first case of it sending someone to the breaking point.

[skollie]

Excellent summary Thrak. I'm reminded of the declaration made by Maria Pia Gardini:


On the 21st of December, 1991, Tito Mazza, who was the
Flag Service I/C [in charge] in Italy, and Marco Puggelli,
who was a Flag FSM [field staff member], came to my home
in Italy seeking a donation for a Class VIII project at Flag.
Shortly after they arrived, Debbie Cook, the Commanding
Officer for the Flag Service Organization in Clearwater,
Florida, called on the telephone concerning this same project.
She told me the cost of executing the program was 2 million
dollars U.S. and she wanted me to finance the entire project.
I told her I would never give them 2 million dollars whereupon
she said she knew I would inherit a large sum of money from
my mother's death just 10 days before and felt I should give
them the money. I continued to say no and asked them to
leave. They would not but stayed and continued badgering
me. Finally, one of them took me into a side room and told
me if I just gave them a check to prove to the Captain of Flag
that I was a good scientologist they would leave. They
repeatedly told me I should be a good scientologist and give
them the money. I was also at this time very vulnerable. My
daughter had died one year before and my mother had now
died 10 days before. I was alone in the world. I finally gave
them a check for $30,000 and they left. At that point I told
them not to return asking me for money.

Much more at the link:

http://www.scamofscientology.nl/pagina16.html

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Excellent summary Thrak. I'm reminded of the declaration made by Maria Pia Gardini:



Much more at the link:

http://www.scamofscientology.nl/pagina16.html

Vultures out for money instead of rotting flesh. Disgusting!!!!

[Lurker5]

Thank you, Thrak. Great explanation.

[Martini]

All scientologists are guilty by association.

This is an excellent point and the lurking Scientologists quietly coming here should not shrug the comment off. By supporting a management that crush sells parishioners who pay hundreds of thousands of dollars of company money that pushes them to the point of murder when caught in their misdeed, they are in fact a close point of CAUSE in this murder. Their support continues the operating basis, continues the operation, continues the chance this could happen AGAIN.

Stop supporting this management, Scientologists.