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Voltaire's Child
24th December 2007, 03:28 AM
Regarding the recent unpleasantness memorialized in the "Fluffy" thread.

I just wanted to let you guys know that I'd had no intention of bringing it up on any forum.

I'm not on Arnie's forum where it occurred and I wasn't planning to post about it here or on OCMB.

"Ailill" created the thread here

And I responded to it as did a few others.

But I wanted everyone to know that had that thread not been created, you wouldn't have seen mention of the matter (by me) on any forum.

Back-channel is, of course, another story.

It works like this. I don't start it, but I sure as fuck will finish it.

ExScnDude
24th December 2007, 03:51 AM
Regarding the recent unpleasantness memorialized in the "Fluffy" thread.

I just wanted to let you guys know that I'd had no intention of bringing it up on any forum.



No worries, Fluffy. I got quite the laugh over the "He is currently deep undercover on a project (that may come to light later) and is terribly busy and taxed emotionally by the work he is doing."

I got an image of him laying in bed under half a dozen blankets spanking his monkey.

Alan
24th December 2007, 05:14 AM
It works like this. I don't start it, but I sure as fuck will finish it.



Kinda dumb computation! :lol:

namaste
24th December 2007, 05:19 AM
No worries, Fluffy. I got quite the laugh over the "He is currently deep undercover on a project (that may come to light later) and is terribly busy and taxed emotionally by the work he is doing."

I got an image of him laying in bed under half a dozen blankets spanking his monkey.

Yeah, that's pretty much how that line struck me too. :D

Anyway, no problem fluffy.

Voltaire's Child
24th December 2007, 05:25 PM
Kinda dumb computation! :lol:

It's neither computation nor dumb.

I do not know of anyone who does not deal with allegations and/or attacks and threats as they come up, if they come up.

I know you sure wouldn't fail to do so.

Alan
24th December 2007, 06:09 PM
It's neither computation nor dumb.

I do not know of anyone who does not deal with allegations and/or attacks and threats as they come up, if they come up.

I know you sure wouldn't fail to do so.



Depends on who's yapping! :)

Still one of the oldest and most powerful Tech's - is - matching terminal tech -as it defines one's level and quality of game playing. :omg:

Silence can be devastating to some! :lol:

Alan

TheSneakster
24th December 2007, 07:08 PM
not important

Alanzo
24th December 2007, 07:36 PM
Then you are clearly not trying to devastate Fluffy. So what is the point of this public ridicule, Alan ?

The Sneakster

I don't see Alan's posts as public ridicule of Fluffy.

TheSneakster
24th December 2007, 09:04 PM
not important

Voltaire's Child
24th December 2007, 09:14 PM
Oh, I don't think Alan's ridiculing me, but he definitely does not approve of me- which I already knew- and he's showing it.Again.

Voltaire's Child
24th December 2007, 09:21 PM
Depends on who's yapping! :)

Still one of the oldest and most powerful Tech's - is - matching terminal tech -as it defines one's level and quality of game playing. :omg:

Silence can be devastating to some! :lol:

Alan

There are a number of people to whom I don't reply and to whom I haven't replied in months or years.

In fact, I got a lot of flak for killfiling a very well known high profile critic on a.r.s. And you know what? I've not written one response to that person since I killfiled him. Not one.

If something does come up, I reserve the right to reply to whomever and whenever I wish-if I wish to do so. As do you.

Again, there are people to whom I've not responded in years. But it's not going to be everybody.

Also, there's a reason they're called "discussion groups", I think.

I know full well that a friend of yours does not approve of my arguing back, though it's certainly ok for that person to write extremely nasty ad homs, post personal info about me that I'd never posted, and to completely change things I've written then complain about the revised version that wasn't any text of mine.

This person has repeatedly stated that it's wrong for me to respond.

Well, there is wrongdoing in the equation- on the side of the person doing the attacking.

I will bet every person on this forum a latte that if anyone were to make a concerted decade long attack on Alan Walter or on a friend of his, that he would not be silent on the subject. I know this for a fact.

Hell, I'll even spring for an extra shot and some whipped cream.

Voltaire's Child
24th December 2007, 09:25 PM
In any event, the purpose of this thread -before it got derailed- was to say that the recent commentary by Roan on Arnie's forum was something I was not going to post about.

I'd have kept it off the forums.

I'm truly sorry that this nonsense has come and polluted ESMB.

I am not going to discuss that matter on ESMB anymore or on any other forum.

Other matters may be a different story- but not that one.

MissDorfl
24th December 2007, 09:32 PM
In any event, the purpose of this thread -before it got derailed- was to say that the recent commentary by Roan on Arnie's forum was something I was not going to post about.

I'd have kept it off the forums.

I'm truly sorry that this nonsense has come and polluted ESMB.

I am not going to discuss that matter on ESMB anymore or on any other forum.

Other matters may be a different story- but not that one.

fluffy,

don't worry! I'd have brought it up, if Ailill hadn't started it first. I actually would have brought it up before, if Roan hadn't deleted his post, so I didn't have anything to go by, anymore.

Voltaire's Child
24th December 2007, 10:19 PM
Oh, hey, doll, it's all good.

Merry Christmas!

Alan
25th December 2007, 06:46 AM
Originally Posted by Alan

Depends on who's yapping!

Still one of the oldest and most powerful Tech's - is - matching terminal tech -as it defines one's level and quality of game playing.

Silence can be devastating to some!

Alan



You quoted the exact service fac computation that has ruined my life continuously! :)

That of: Originally Posted by fluffy: - It works like this. "I don't start it, but I sure as fuck will finish it."

The reason the computation ruined my life was it put me in a continuous involuntary replicating Games Condition with destructive people.

When this erased I left Scio.




There are a number of people to whom I don't reply and to whom I haven't replied in months or years.

In fact, I got a lot of flak for killfiling a very well known high profile critic on a.r.s. And you know what? I've not written one response to that person since I killfiled him. Not one.

If something does come up, I reserve the right to reply to whomever and whenever I wish-if I wish to do so. As do you.

Again, there are people to whom I've not responded in years. But it's not going to be everybody.

Also, there's a reason they're called "discussion groups", I think.

I know full well that a friend of yours does not approve of my arguing back, though it's certainly ok for that person to write extremely nasty ad homs, post personal info about me that I'd never posted, and to completely change things I've written then complain about the revised version that wasn't any text of mine.

This person has repeatedly stated that it's wrong for me to respond.

Well, there is wrongdoing in the equation- on the side of the person doing the attacking.

I will bet every person on this forum a latte that if anyone were to make a concerted decade long attack on Alan Walter or on a friend of his, that he would not be silent on the subject. I know this for a fact.

Hell, I'll even spring for an extra shot and some whipped cream.



Still depends on who's yapping! :)

Alan

Mick Wenlock
25th December 2007, 05:07 PM
as we say back home - is this a private fight or can anyone join in?

Voltaire's Child
25th December 2007, 07:42 PM
Well, I don't think it's a fight, at least I'm not pissed off...but yeah, Mick, you can join in...Anytime, dollink.

Voltaire's Child
25th December 2007, 07:45 PM
Alan,

It does depend on who's yapping. And there are people I don't respond to. It depends on the situation.

See, early on, my life was almost ruined by my not standing up for myself. And, now, I'm just not that kind of person anymore.

The thing is, my life is different from yours. This is a different set of circumstances, involving different people.

I appreciate your taking the time to explain your thoughts to me (not being sarcastic) and I wish you a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

Alanzo
25th December 2007, 08:08 PM
Alan,

It does depend on who's yapping. And there are people I don't respond to. It depends on the situation.

See, early on, my life was almost ruined by my not standing up for myself. And, now, I'm just not that kind of person anymore.

Is what ruined your life back then still happening now?

If someone questions your ideas - as happens frequently to you on message boards all over the Internet - are they really trying to ruin you?

Or is the situation different now?


The thing is, my life is different from yours. This is a different set of circumstances, involving different people.

I appreciate your taking the time to explain your thoughts to me (not being sarcastic) and I wish you a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

Fluffy.

You remember every perceived slight, every disagreement, every insult that has ever been made to you. You have never forgotten even one. You take every opportunity to remind those involved and everyone else not involved that they occurred, often embellished from your own viewpoint with little or no regard to the viewpoint of the Evil One who slighted you.

My question to you is, "Can you see yourself as others see you?"

Can you accommodate the possibility that you could be a pain in the ass to someone else, and forgive them for feeling that way about you? Can you just laugh at it and move on?

Will "moving on" ever be part of your bag of ticks?

Should it be in there?

I hope you take this holiday season as an opportunity to weigh the benefits and costs of "forgiving and forgetting".

To ask yourself really what carrying all these incidents around with you really accomplishes, especially since they were all gathered from message boards whose defining characteristic is conflict and slighting those viewpoints you disagree with.

The slights you get on message boards are JUST NOT THAT IMPORTANT.

I hope that you privately consider my ideas here.

And I also hope that you have a Merry Christmas and a very successful and very Happy New Year.

Voltaire's Child
26th December 2007, 01:31 AM
The purpose of this thread is to say sorry about the nonsense with the stupidity from the Lermanut board.

I'd had no intention of bringing up Roan's post or the one that precipitated it on this or any public forum.

For the record, those weren't "slight" or "slights"-they were very strongly worded and extreme in a number of ways- and they weren't something I was holding onto. It was a recent situation that was brought to my attention in an email from a friend last Wednesday, and the posts themselves were five days old at that time.

Once put on the table, I decided to join my friends in discussing it.

My plan before "Ailill" brought this out into the open was to just discuss it my own way, back channel, with those who brought it to my attention in the first place.

As far as anything else goes, it depends on what's happening currently and if it's a situation where someone has spent years doing the same exact thing.

I can name several critics with whom I'm now friends who used to be hostile to me in varying degrees. I would do anything I could for them. We mended fences, it was fine.

If they were still fucking with me, it would be a different situation and we would obviously not be friends.

I do know that Alanzo indicated great distress over my flaming someone on the (now absent) bitching post who'd just, that week, said pretty rank things about my husband.

So obviously it's not a matter of someone thinking I'm hanging on. The idea is that I should not say anything even right then, the same week, as the situation is taking place.

As I said before, it depends on what the situation is and who's saying what.

I haven't written responses to several different people in literally years and I know for a fact that they've mentioned me a number of times during this period. Doesn't matter, I'm done with them. Because I know it's never going to be any good.

And there are still others whom I used to really not like and now we're calling each other, emailing each other, even meeting. I would go a long way to do a favor for those people.

I recently mended fences with someone whom I considered extremely tough to deal with- who just seeing that person's name or post was enough to annoy the hell out of me. I will never ever ever go back to not getting along with that person. If that person ever needs me- which they probably won't, but just sayin'- I'm there. Totally.

So it depends on the person and if the situation is ongoing and what the situation was to begin with.

I would suggest that those who are upset by my decisions to review their own actions, motives, and above all, to keep in mind what each and every single one of us needs to keep in mind regarding the personal decisions and lifestyle choices of others- it's not your life, it's not your business.

Don't read the threads if there are objections to my commentary.

It works for me the same way it works for most. If I want advice or help- I'm not shy about asking for it. In fact, I just PM'd someone a couple days ago whom every single one of you knows- to ask for advice. I ended up taking it, too.

I'm not perfect,but those who take it upon themselves to publicly reprove me- no way am I going to listen to them. Ever.

Every single one of the people who've made a fuss on the forums about my posting rebuttals has themselves either behaved quite poorly or has supported others who have. So I consider it to be self serving. I don't take advice from self serving people.

For those who want to reform me- hey, if I want to hear from someone like that, I'll unzip my pants and bend over.

This forum is chock full of people who discuss the things that happened to them in CofS, often naming names. OCMB, Lermanut and ARS, too. I think that's good. Those things should be exposed. Those people should be. I think that if something's happening, it's up to the person who's on the receiving end to deal with it. And his or her way of dealing with it, may not be someone else's.

I don't believe, though, that if the person doesn't want to sweep it under the rug, that they should do so. And I think the same standard applies to anything else that's going on in "pt".

I'm not trying to get back at the missionholders who screwed me over, just as I'm not trying to get back at that kid in the schoolyard or my 5th grade teacher-because I've gotten the ultimate revenge. I'm living well and living large.

However, if they were here now and were doing something detrimental to me now, I'd act.

See, when I was on Beliefnet (well, I still am, but it's pretty much dead as a doornail) and there were some OSA types, they used to blather about people who discussed their misadventures in CofS, accusing them of whining.

It's the same thing. There are things some people do not want you to talk about.

If you study history or even current events, you will see that when people try to silence someone who's discussing what happened to him or his family or friends, that the would-be silencers have ulterior motives.

The Puritans. The Roman Catholic Church during medieval times. The Russian Communists. The Chinese Communists. The Church of Scientology (I almost wrote "Silentology". That's good. I'm gonna use that) and some critics here and there.

Frankly, all the above named groups and/or individuals are on a par, morally and ethically.

So, look- I am going to reiterate this one more time for those who may need it--

I was NOT going to bring up the commentary on Lermanut publicly.

And I'm not going to discuss what happened on that board the other week any further.

If it stays in the pages of history and doesn't once again become a current event, you will not see me discussing it.

Mojo
26th December 2007, 05:20 AM
You are indeed quite the character Fluffy. Which statement I offer in a good/peaceful/non-confrontational way. Lol.

I can attest that despite our previous internet entanglements, ever since we privately emailed one another, you have been quite civil to me. Of course the fact I haven't posted but one or two posts here since then might have had something to do with that. But I'm takin the high road here and assuming that in spite of our past differences of perceptions and opinions we are both mature enough to be decent with each other. Which I very much appreciate.

The point of my writing this post is this: Perhaps Alanzo has a point that is good for all of us to consider? Being this (he wrote): "Can you see yourself as others see you?". To which the answer for us all is either yes, or no, or maybe, or some combination inbetween (as you say, it depends).

For me the answer (honestly realized) by any individual is a sort of book mark of where that individual is in terms of their spiritual development. Show me a person that is easily or consistently upsettable by the mere speech of another (regardless of how cruel, deceptive or offensive that speech is) and I'll show you a person that is at some level sleeping, spiritually. Not to mention my showing you a projection of myself (appearing as 'them').

This you taught me. Or I should say I learned via my interactions with you on the internet. On numerous occassions I went to bed wounded by your words. I felt that you hated me and you wanted others to hate me too. You ridiculed me and discounted me and generally diminished me by constantly implying that my words were insincere or insignificant or unworthy of being received by others because I had offended you by using numerous and various nicks on various message boards over the previous 7 years or so. You seemingly turned my ability to 'see' both sides and to 'be' both sides into an in-ability to be honest and genuine. And you did so in what I felt was a vicious manner.

So be it. As I said above I learned from our exchanges. Specifically I learned how to see myself as you were seeing me. And to experience myself as being insincere, insignificant and unworthy of being received by others. Which experience of seeing myself that way was a real eye opener. Did I mention it cut to the bone? (lol) well it did. But sometimes a good carving is just what is needed (in spirit).

The saving grace for me was what I believe Alanzo was/is offering you. Which is a realization (consequential to the pain of the truth) that in the overall scheme of things the opinions, beliefs, certainties, words and speech of others, in regard to you, are inconsequential to the truth of who you are.

And as Alan said (or hinted) engaging in a 'personal defense' is an invitation better suited for those inclined for lesser games than the game of a Thetans Awakening. Lol. Ok, with apologies to Alan (damn, now I'll probably get it from him!).

Lastly, 20 years ago a spiritual mentor of mine asked me what I would be like in 20 years from then. I said I didn't know. He said, well make something up and go for it. His point being I could always improve (so long as I had the ability to postulate such improvement).

Alas I failed him, but he still likes me anyway.

Lar

Voltaire's Child
26th December 2007, 02:12 PM
Mojo,

I acted toward you the way you acted toward me. Better, actually.

I don't care how many nicks a person uses. It's what they do with them that causes me to have an opinion about those posts.

We've discussed this in PM. The subject is now closed. I'm putting you back in my killfile which also means you cannot PM me.

This is my last post on this thread as it's been hijacked enough by those with personal grievances.

For those wishing to continue on with that, then my response to you is "See previous post(s). Thanks, C".

Alanzo
26th December 2007, 02:14 PM
Well, that....

And the fact that criticizing the Church and the actions taken against one while one was being exploited for one's spiritual vulnerabilities, as opposed to being criticized for one's opinions on a message board are two very different things. Yet Fluffy is always giving them equivalence.

They're not.

One is a game where one EXPECTS to be challenged, criticized, even insulted - and the other is a corruption of the stated intent of the activity.

People criticizing you on a message board, Fluffy, even calling you names and being horrible to you, just CAN NOT be considered as important as you make it out to be.

Like I've said repeatedly, it's like complaining that you got tackled while playing football.

So while you never intended this thread to be about all the harm you have received by people criticizing you on a message board, it has become once again, all about that.

What the hell are you doing on so many message boards if you don't like being criticized for your views, and your job, and your style of dress, your husband's proclivities and even the cat food you give your cats?

You love it, Fluffy.

So don't be such a wuss about it.

You aren't fooling anyone.

Alan
26th December 2007, 02:33 PM
Mojo - I'm curious - have you used various nicks? :)

Mojo
26th December 2007, 09:55 PM
Mojo - I'm curious - have you used various nicks? :)

Lol!

I think such a profoundly deep question is worthy of a thread all it's own entitled something like: The 'tech' of (Conscious) imaginary Identities Subtitled: Everything you always wanted to know but were afraid to ask about pretending to be something or someone you're not.

After all, a persons given name at birth is a mere nick that's been afforded the luxury of the 'status' (Hi Alanzo) of being 'real'. Lol!

In fact, truth be known, the word 'human being' is a mere nick for a Thetan/Spiritual Being. Not to be taken too awfully seriously as being something in and of itself. Remember, the meaning of a thing preceeds the expression of it, thus nicks are mere wanna-be's to begin with. So to speak.

Of course as Loveroftruth0777 I might have said: What you say is true but there is much more to it than that...

as Augustus: Certainly you are entitled to your opinion but that doesn't mean you are right...

as Silicon Salley: Forget Nicks look at these tits, got em by postulating em (thanks to scientology)...That's right, postulation and $2,500.00 bucks baby. Thanks Ron.

as Johnathan Livingston: I tend to exist above nicks...tsk tsk mere mortals...Cast off the human shackles that blind your spiritual eyes!

as Herc: Look, I'm gonna tell you this one time and one time only, if you get it great, if not, that's not my problem...nicks are for dicks.

as Laughinglion: Lol.

as Sir Charles Rothenbuck : Here's the correct data on that: A nick is a valence the Thetan employs to accomodate the creation of an intention in the MEST world. Ron was very clear about that.

and lastly as Mojo: Who me? Nah, I don't use nicks. I'm the man.

Sincerely, (kind of),
Lar