Synopsis of an Old Kid

[grundy]

I am reposting from my story over at ESK.

Part of this is in a "synopsis" mode - short, terse, to the point.

And then I become more verbose as I fill in more detail.

And yes, I do believe in past lives so there: :p

Trained at St. Hill. Cleared at St. Hill.

Joined the Sea Org. Did OT1. Offloaded/Left/was under some ethics action.

Died.

Born to parents on staff at an org run by friend from St. Hill. Father's mother was on the ship. This looks like a good place.

Parents left staff (but not scientology). Did TRO as a kid. (Our parents version of a time out.) Had Covert Hostility defined. Favorite game growing up with siblings: "You're just being covertly hostile."

Mother dies. Funeral at the org. I get free auditing. Dianetics session to run out mother's death. Something isn't right here ....

Did course. Joined staff. Sent to flag to train. Out-Int (case condition) on M1 co-audit. C/S 53 (general repair list). "Are you clear?" BIIIIGG response. Reason for out-interiorization: Dianetics session and already clear. Walk into recruiter's office and sign Sea Org contract.

Work at local org for 2 years. Need Clear Certainty Rundown. Get sent to advanced org for CCRD (father pays). Go back to org. 2 weeks later, off to Sea Org ....

[grundy]

When last we left our intrepid explorer, he was 18 and joining the Sea Org. Maybe this is more properly for the War Stories forum. But it's part 2 of my story. So ... back into synopsis mode:

Joined Sea Org. Came to LA. Going up to Gold. Did EPF. Can't go to Gold.

Traded to Service Organization, Tech Post, replace person that goes to Gold.

Within 1st month retreading tech class (am flag trained). Commanding Officer hates me. (eventually commanding officer blows because he was having an affair). (next CO hated me, ended on RPF, next CO liked me, he ended up NOTs auditor.

ANYWAYS .... I end up going to Flag Command Bureax at one point, but within 2 months was back because my former post wasn't being handled by the people that replaced me. By the time I got back, was new CO that hated me. She ended on RPF. Another CO that like me. Ended up NOTs auditor.

Get into a 2d situation that is/was considered unethical. We never had sex, but she wasn't in the Sea Org. :omg:

I ended up getting a comm ev, wanting to get kicked out, IAS event about IRS happens, all Comm Evs cancelled. :angry:

Eventually did get married to this woman. She joined. Sex my first time on my wedding night. I shoulda practiced earlier. :oops: But it was a great 2 day honeymoon - right before I get sent to flag for evolution.

Got to flag. Immediately REAMED A NEW ASSHOLE by Int management executive monitoring evolution because why?

I had a beard.

I wish I was kidding.

I had a beard because my wife liked beards.

Shaved my beard, did the program, went back to org.

Next CO (my last in SO) didn't trust me.

I've skewed the timeline on COs a little. Messed it all up a little to protect my anonymity. But basically correct. Part 3 will be on how I got out.

[grundy]

As we left our intrepid explorer, he had come back from Flag, and it was the beginning of the end. What will he do next?

Back to synopsis mode:

Came back from Flag. Big kahunna now. Big opinion leader for whole of organization because of special training. Short talk on stage at event. BIG event. Am consulted due to special training.

Still, wife had to leave SO. No blowup yet. Go back to Flag for special training. Come back. Start spending one night week sleeping with wife. Told no one. None of thier business.

Get sent on tours. RTC rep blows up. I am bad person. :bigcry: SP Directive (Scn Policy Directive - or SP means what you want :devil:) comes out about SO and having kids. Situation comes up where they find out I am out-2D for sleeping with wife. :confused2:

Have to start divorce proceedings. Be good SO. Be good Scntologists. Start to go a little odd. :screwy:

Decide I must leave SO for SO be better. End up on EPF again. End up on decks being watched by security with other horrible malcontents (their opinion not mine) who are leaving. Most leave. Only one left.

Work in another org doing renovations on my org. Have fun doing this job. Not part of either org. Do what I want. Do what I want mostly for rest of stay - no one watches.

Get told am SP. Get told I will be drug addict. Get told I am leaving to be with wife (divorce almost over) Get cajoled to stay.

Finally, getting sec checks to leave. Have problem, no metabolism. Can't sleep. No energy. Go to Dr. Get medicine. Get sec checked. Get through all steps. Done. Get on plane to go home.

-------

Part 4 will deal with starting life on the outside ...

[grundy]

As a side note, to wrap up part 4, the only reason I was allowed to leave is because I insisted on leaving for months and months and was not swayed. I put up with the abuses, allegations, comments and accusatory stares. I kept to myself. Otherwise, I would be there still ....
*********************
I won't go back to "synopsis mode if I can avoid it. It just looks a little terse. And I will speak in the third person, because it is fun.
*********************
As we enter the 4th and final stage of our explorer's story, he has left the Sea Org, the only home he has known since he was a teenager.

He has no High School diploma, as he left the last year of High School because he was uncomfortable with people his own age.

He has had extensive training in Scientology, but no references other than the churches he has worked for. And being ex-Sea Org doesn't qualify him for a good word.

He knows no one who is a wog. He doesn't feel comforable in bars and at party's because these, up until now, have been places of out-ethics and degradation.

He has no idea where he will live, or what he will do.

Luckily, his family welcomes him back, although he has been absent for years. Promises to visit have been broken. No one really knows him.

He moves in with his father and starts working very part time for a pittance. After all, his father is doing him a favor (and he was too).

Gradually, he starts to learn to speak to wogs again, and gets into philisophical debates about his religion vs others.

He tries to "debunk" negative comments about Scientology because he truly believes in it. He has experienced a lot of good with the bad. He visits with his closest Scn friends and ex-wife a couple of years later and it is friendly.

Gradually he gains experience to the point where he has taken over his father's position at the company.

Then, he starts getting calls. Repeated calls to buy books. He learns of a dear friend having been declared. This friend was highly trained and a very trusted terminal. This doesn't make sense.

So he goes to the web and searches for the name to try to find his friend. And what site does he find? Ex-Scientologist forums.

He begins to read and begins to learn of what has been happening in the church. Learns some secrets which explain things he has seen. Learns that there are a LOT of people who have left and are happy for it.

He starts reevaluating his experiences while looking more less "scientologically" at his past. He lets go of the blind faith and starts being willing to listen.

So, where is he now?

He still is sadly lacking, even years later, in certain social skills. He is a bit of a dork.

He has certain knowledge of his field and is respected in his circle of acquaitnences.

He is a workaholic, almost unable to take a day off.

He will cope with almost unbearable cicrumstances because to him, this is normal.

He still will not do any street drugs, and will only indulge only to the slightest degree with alchohol.

He cannot enter into a casual sexual relationship as this seems wrong.

He will put up with things that most people find offensive. (He recently recieved a $50 check promised to him 9 months ago for completing a survery, and was only surprised that once the organization actually found the error of not having sent it last year, they still sent the check. I mean, who does that?? Keeping promises?? I try to, but promises to me - that's just wierd.)

He still believes and finds value to Scientology procedures and technology, but finds that the organization has strayed a long way from common decency and respect.

He does some things that are considered "out-ethics." Random trips to a casino a couple of times a year, every birthday he goes to a strip club and gets 3 or 4 lap dances, he on occasion looks at :yikes: pornography (still tending to feel guilty for it). Almost can't admit it to people when it comes up.

People come to him for help, and for guidance, and for a shoulder to cry on. He has loyalty to those who know him.

He will acknowledge those that disagree with him. He respects the rights of people to attack his former church. He passes on what he knows and can explain to those who ask.

He remains friends with Scientologists and will not decry them for it.

He likes movies and tv shows. He could care less about celebrities.

He reads a lot.

He plays computer games and surfs the net.

He still has respect for those that he worked with. He still feels that there are things that can be learned from and that there is value in the unaltered materials of L. Ron Hubbard. But he no longer has blind reverence for him and will idly stand by is someone calls him a con man and scammer.

He belives in past lives and admits that if it is true, he'll probaby be involved with Scientology next time around.

So, where does that leave him?

Is he a two faced liar for not openly telling the church to screw off?

Is he a good person for maintaining his beliefs or a bad one?

Is he unethical for allowing attacks and criticism?

Is he a spiritual man or a deluded one? A cynic or an optimist?

Is his life a comedy or a tragedy? A drama or science fiction?

All such things must be decided by the audience.

And so, my friends, I leave you with this:

"I am a free person.
"I go where I go.
"I know what I know.
"No one can make me do anything I don't want to do.
"No one can make me believe anything I don't want to believe.
"I am a free person.
"And so are you ...."

[grundy]

Another thing that I thought of that might be of note:

When I first joined staff, during the summer between my junior and senior year of high school (I was 15 years old), it was helping out on the weekends, doing flyers.

At some point, it was decided that they wanted to send someone to Flag to train to be the Basic Courses Supervisor.

So, I went down to Flag. Now of course, this created an issue of the fact I wasn't in school. But in my home state, you can leave school when you are 16. I would be 16 before the December 1 date for that school year. In effect thought, I took a "sabatical."

So I went down to Flag in July, did my HPCS (Hubbard Professional Course Supervisor) training, came back to my home state in April of the next year. (I was at Flag in effect 8 1/2 months). (Checksheet time except internships - which were NEVER completed on time.) I actually finished my training in March, but my org hadn't paid yet, so I was waiting for the details to be worked out.

So the next August/Sept, I start my senior year of high school, (16 going on 17, the age that most do their senior year although some are 17 going on 18). I was going to school during the day, and supervising students from 12 to 70 years old on the evenings and weekends.

It was wierd trying to fit in. I wore a shirt and tie to school, because after school, I had to go to the org to go onto post. In an urban public high school which was very diverse, I was really strange, because I was the only one wearing professional business attire to school every day.

I couldn't do it. I couldn't relate to people my own age. I couldn't take the schedule of working 50 hours a week at the org ang going to school 8AM to 3PM monday through friday as well. I had to drop out and opt to (eventually) get a GED.

I upset the counseler because when I went to "terminate my high school education," here was this professionally dressed, very literate and professional 17 year old basically saying that the high school had nothing to offer me. I turned in my books and didn't take the time to do the paperword to get my deposit back on my school books. When I told the person in the office I wasn't interested in getting the money back, she stated in a shocked tone "We will take it as a donation to the school system."

As this conversation was happening, there were two typical teenage girls in the office that I had seen around the school (it was a different school than the school I did my freshman through junior grades in) who were looking at me like I was an alien.

The wierd thing is that for a number of years, especially right after I left the Sea Org (which I had joined a couple of years later), I had strange dreams of trying, as a 27 year old, to attend high school to finish my senior year, while working a full time job as well as an educator.

My dreams for several years were a concatenation of imagery from my job, high school, sea org and women that I had attractions too. For example, on my current job and trying to go to school and the girl I really like was talking about joining the Sea Org. WTF?????? (The girl this gem was about was a wiccan lol)

I don't consider these nightmares, because such things never scared or upset me. They were just WIERD!

Anyway, posting something elsewhere reminded me of this. So I thought, Hey! A new installment of my story which wont count as post whoring! :p

[grundy]

Strictly speaking, some of the following has not much or nothing to do with my experiences in Scn. They explain possibly why I enjoyed the sense of community of the church, or why I operate the way I do. It also explains how I got into Scientology.

Some things that shaped who I am:

From the ages of 12-15 my family and myself delivered newspapers to help make ends meet.

When I was 11 there was a drive in the local school looking for paperboys. I signed up because it was a way to make some money.

So two days before my 12th birthday, I get a call. Now, my mother was freshly divorced from my father and we were living on welfare. My mother tended to be sickly and it was hard to find regular employment. Child support wasn't sufficient alone, and welfare didn't cover everything.

The manager of the district had big problems. One of the major set of routes was uncovered because the person up and quit. So my mother had the bright idea of not only ME delivering newspapers but the whole family.

So 1 day shy of 12, there I am out at 4:00 in the morning. Not hard but a lot of walking. We started with three routes. Within a couple of days we picked up more. We were all getting up at 2:00 in the morning to start.

I had routes that covered a total of 4 linear miles in the early days. My older brother had a similar amount. My younger brother (11) was with my mother and his route was 2 1/2 linear miles. My older brother had a similar amount to me as well as my sister.

Within a few months, we had routes that covered 2 square miles of the suburbs, a total of about many linear miles and up to 700 newspapers a day and about 1000 on sundays. If for some reason another carrier was ill or some such, we would pick up the slack and there were days we covered all 3 1/2 - 4 square miles of the district. By the end my route was much longer and our total area was significant (when you realize that my sister had left because our mother was crazy).

For the picture of our district, my route and my families delivery area by the end, click http://i253.photobucket.com/albums/hh53/grundy_album/routes.jpg

We would be dropped off at a certain start point and bundles of newspapers would be dropped at various locations throughout the routes by our mother, sister and/or brother. Depended on who had cars. We got other people roped into helping us. My mother's best friend, my mothers "boyfriend" (I will have to explain that later too), my father on rare occasion.

We would start around 2 AM. Work until 7:12 or so (if we weren't late because of blizzards, rain, late delivery by the company, etc). Go to school. Get home from school and collect money on the routes from 4:30 until 9:00 - 10:00 at night. Rinse and repeat on weekends except no school and work was all day.

I did this for a few years. 12-15. 3 1/2 years total. It changed all of a sudden when my mother died. I will leave that part of the story for a later time.

But my grades suffered horribly. Never enough sleep. Fell asleep at school. (Kind of amazing that I got a 29 on my ACT at 14, perfect scores on statewide tests and so forth during this whole time, isn't it?) (And my older brother always had better scores then me when possible {when it wasn't a 100% type of test}. Kinda pissed me off.)

My brother and sister had it much worse then me. They were older and got the brunt of my mothers insanity. They had to shoulder the load when she was too sick, and my brother did when she died.

My younger brother was her favorite, so he had it easier. But that's like saying someone is in pain 80% of the time instead of 85%. And my older brother was closer to 92%. And my sister closer to 98%. So I can't blame her for leaving to get the hell out. I would have too I suppose, if I was older.

I will leave the rest for later or tomorrow or whatever.

[grundy]

The Day My Mother Died

It was a typical day, except my mother had been ill for a few days. My older brother just turned 18 5 days earlier, my younger brother 14 2 days earlier, my mother 41 16 days earlier and I was 15 (and a couple months).

My brothers and myself got up at 1:30 AM, got to our paper routes, delivered the papers, went to school. Came home from school and at 4:30 my older brother and myself went out to collect on the routes so that we would have money to eat for the next day. We would have reported to my mother, but when we left she was sleeping, and was breathing quite loudly (now I know what "death rattles" are, this is what it was). My younger brother, at the ripe age of 14, stayed home and slept.

So, at 10:30 that night we get home. My brother goes to the licqour store that we lived above and I go up to tell my mother we are home. It's unusally quiet. I go into the first room down the hall, and my mother and brother are asleep, about 6 feet from each other. I go to wake up my mother and she doesn't respond, and her skin is cold to the touch. My brother is snoring loudly close by and I do not want to waken him until I talk to my older brother. I go down and tell him "I think mom's dead."

He comes up and verifies this. We talk to each other and decide to try to get my mother dressed (she was a nudist and didn't wear much at home) and get her to the truck and take her to the hospital. We get her dressed and carry her down to the truck. Moving her air moved out of her and I thought for a second she was breathing again.

We get her down to the truck and decide at that point to call an ambulance. My brother calls my father's vice president to help reach my father who is in LA doing some auditing or some such. My father's friend and her husband show up to help us as needed, and my father is reached. He will not be able to get back for a couple of days (he is 3000 miles away after all) (and my sister, who also is in LA has to be talked to and so forth).

The ambulance had come and taken her away and myself and my brother had to wake up my younger brother to tell him the news. Now, my older brother and I had decided not to wake him up until she was gone. It would have been too painful we felt. Looking back, I wouldn't have done it differently.

By the time this was all done, it's 1:00 in the morning. We have our routes to do in an hour. So we drive the 5 miles to the paper drop off point and sleep for a few minutes until the manager shows up. We tell him what happened and that things are going to be chaotic. We start our routes.

Now through extreme tiredness, confused logistics because it's only us three, and the fact that it's late fall/early winter, things are quite slow. We are later and later all morning. By the last street I am 2 1/2 hours late (9:30 AM). I get to the last house on the second to the last block and the customer comes out to recieve his very late newspaper.

"Why is this so late?" (kinda pissed off)

"I'm sorry, sir. My mother passed away last night."

"Well, that's not my fucking problem. You should have gotten someone else to deliver."

"I'm sorry, sir." And I turned and walked away.

The next night we delivered the routes backwards because the earlier routes, never being late, would be more understanding if we were late for a couple of days.

***********************

The customer is always right got drilled into me quite early. The rest of all this, and how my experiencies led me into Scientology, later.

[grundy]

Well, over at ESMB chat, they were urging me to finish this (I was ready to abandon it). So here goes.

**************
As to the earlier comment about my mother's "boyfriend", he was a fairly well off much older guy. And i found out later through a comment my mother made to someone else that it was all about the money she got from him, not any real "emotional connection."

I don't find fault with her on this. It was tough economic times, and she was doing what in her mind she had to do to help her family survive. When the old guy passed, it closed that chapter. I think the guys son gave her his old car (it was a nice late model chrysler).

But it was a shock as a 14 year old to find out such things about your mother ....

And, after 2 more months of delivering newspapers, we just dropped the routes (after warning the district manager that was going to happen so he could be prepared). It was financial reasons as my mother, who was the person of record, owed money to the newspaper company, and she died, so in order to avoid paying her old bills, my father had us just stop one day.

I did have a much easier time the rest of that school year after that.

**************

My mother was a scientologist, so the funeral was in the org.

Because my OCA graph was down the toilet (low on communication), I was given book one auditing. Didn't do anything for me. I found out later that I was a "past life clear" and so Dianetics was ... innappropriate. The L1C I got later actually did more for me.

However, I did the HCC (Hubbard Communication Course). Which was basically TRs at a basic level. It was a blast. Even the ashtray drill.

I joined staff on a part time basis as soon as the school year was done. Weekends in Div 6 helping pass out flyers.

So, all of a sudden, the org needs to send someone to flag for supervisor training to run basic courses. I was div 6 part time staff. So I sign a 5 year contract, complete Staff Status 1 (I finished Staff Status 2 first thing at flag), and was packed off to flag for 8 1/2 months. At 15 years old.

And that takes me back to where I was at the beginning of this thread.

So, for me, working 60 hours or more a week and 16 hour or longer days is something I have done since the day before my 12th birthday.

Doesn't do much for my social contact. I never went to a party in high school. Never did drugs, alchohol - who had the time? Never did extra cirricular activities at school - I was working to help support my family.

The plus side of this is that growing up, I always had more money on me (even though my family was dirt poor) than anyone else in my school. I never worried about 5 or 10 dollars.

The miles of walking every day for years and years and the lifting and carrying made me unusually strong and unusually healthy. I could deal with whatever the SO threw at me (until I left), because it wasn't as bad as my early teenage years.

And truth be told, I probably could have stayed too. But I felt that I couldn't contribute. For reasons as stated earlier.

Throughout my sea org career, I was known by execs as someone willing to help out on whatever hill 10 was currently happening, while still keeping my stats up. I got special duties. I did well at almost any assignment given to me with the least amound of fuss or direction.

My experiences actually trained me to fit in in the SO. But they made me a loner too.

I never needed to have deeply personal relationships with those around me. My mother was the hermit type, I became the hermit type. I could go off and amuse myself, playing video games or reading books, and I counted such things as great fun.

Full time training I excelled at (I mean, who gets to sleep 7 or 8 hours a night??), and was exceedingly accomplished at dealing with peoples' difficulties as a tech terminal.

So, there it is, my addendum to my story.

As a side note:

My mother's big failed purpose in life, and when she started being extremely sickly, was when on a trip to the org in LA (LAD or ASHO I'm not sure) she wanted to join the Sea Org and couldn't, because she had once taken acid.

She was a trained field auditor - I don't know what if any classification she had. Audited her best friend on processes and procedures from the basic books and other things. His folders ended going to LRH on the ship because of things that had been found/processes results or something.

But after that trip to LA, her e-meter sat on a shelf collecting dust.

[grundy]

Sorry, for posting all at once. It's a bit of a story, and there is always more. But that is all for the moment.

[Zinjifar]

Sorry, for posting all at once. It's a bit of a story, and there is always more. But that is all for the moment.

Grundy, I've appreciated your offerings to ESMB since you began. I haven't always 'agreed' with them, but, I've appreciated them.

Now I know why.

I think you will reorganize your story more as you continue to get out of it, but, thanks for what you've told us so far.

Note; as much as I may appreciate your narrative, I don't necessarily agree with your 'conclusions'. That's not a bad thing. Agreement is low, but, affinity is high. :)

Zinj

[Free to shine]

Grundy I understand you more now! :)
It's hard to imagine your life as a teen, and the weight of responsibility you shouldered. It seems to me from my own personal experience, that in order to survive such events, personal emotions get squished into insignificance, made irrelevant. That can have a lot of repercussions later in life, and one way to examine the whole thing is to write it out.
You're doing good! :thumbsup:

[Good twin]

Aw, grundy your story is enthralling. Thank you so much for filling us in on where you came from and how you arrived here with us. I am glad you are here.
Good Twin

[Marie]

The Day My Mother Died

It was a typical day, except my mother had been ill for a few days. My older brother just turned 18 5 days earlier, my younger brother 14 2 days earlier, my mother 41 16 days earlier and I was 15 (and a couple months).

My brothers and myself got up at 1:30 AM, got to our paper routes, delivered the papers, went to school. Came home from school and at 4:30 my older brother and myself went out to collect on the routes so that we would have money to eat for the next day. We would have reported to my mother, but when we left she was sleeping, and was breathing quite loudly (now I know what "death rattles" are, this is what it was). My younger brother, at the ripe age of 14, stayed home and slept.

So, at 10:30 that night we get home. My brother goes to the licqour store that we lived above and I go up to tell my mother we are home. It's unusally quiet. I go into the first room down the hall, and my mother and brother are asleep, about 6 feet from each other. I go to wake up my mother and she doesn't respond, and her skin is cold to the touch. My brother is snoring loudly close by and I do not want to waken him until I talk to my older brother. I go down and tell him "I think mom's dead."

He comes up and verifies this. We talk to each other and decide to try to get my mother dressed (she was a nudist and didn't wear much at home) and get her to the truck and take her to the hospital. We get her dressed and carry her down to the truck. Moving her air moved out of her and I thought for a second she was breathing again.

We get her down to the truck and decide at that point to call an ambulance. My brother calls my father's vice president to help reach my father who is in LA doing some auditing or some such. My father's friend and her husband show up to help us as needed, and my father is reached. He will not be able to get back for a couple of days (he is 3000 miles away after all) (and my sister, who also is in LA has to be talked to and so forth).

The ambulance had come and taken her away and myself and my brother had to wake up my younger brother to tell him the news. Now, my older brother and I had decided not to wake him up until she was gone. It would have been too painful we felt. Looking back, I wouldn't have done it differently.

By the time this was all done, it's 1:00 in the morning. We have our routes to do in an hour. So we drive the 5 miles to the paper drop off point and sleep for a few minutes until the manager shows up. We tell him what happened and that things are going to be chaotic. We start our routes.

Now through extreme tiredness, confused logistics because it's only us three, and the fact that it's late fall/early winter, things are quite slow. We are later and later all morning. By the last street I am 2 1/2 hours late (9:30 AM). I get to the last house on the second to the last block and the customer comes out to recieve his very late newspaper.

"Why is this so late?" (kinda pissed off)

"I'm sorry, sir. My mother passed away last night."

"Well, that's not my fucking problem. You should have gotten someone else to deliver."

"I'm sorry, sir." And I turned and walked away.

The next night we delivered the routes backwards because the earlier routes, never being late, would be more understanding if we were late for a couple of days.

***********************

The customer is always right got drilled into me quite early. The rest of all this, and how my experiencies led me into Scientology, later.

Not to detract from his story, but this is to Grundy.

I felt bad leaving, but I was not doing well there. For a long time I wanted to appologize to You (and my other brothers) for leaving. I took care of most things before I left. But mom's answer to me when I told her "this is not fair" was "life is not fair and you are the girl....:angry:

I felt (and still sort of do feel) guilty that she had died, because I would force her to go to the hospital, or make her eat before I left. And I was not there to do that.

[Marie]

But he is also right, the SO was very easy after all of that....

[Pliny Younger]

That is QUITE a story. Thanks to you (and Marie) for sharing it.

[Colleen K. Peltomaa]

As a past lifer too I wonder if there will be any scientology for me to join by the time I can recall it. And what condition will it be in? Like you, my past life Clear cog was BIIIIIIIG!






As a side note, to wrap up part 4, the only reason I was allowed to leave is because I insisted on leaving for months and months and was not swayed. I put up with the abuses, allegations, comments and accusatory stares. I kept to myself. Otherwise, I would be there still ....
*********************
I won't go back to "synopsis mode if I can avoid it. It just looks a little terse. And I will speak in the third person, because it is fun.
*********************
As we enter the 4th and final stage of our explorer's story, he has left the Sea Org, the only home he has known since he was a teenager.

He has no High School diploma, as he left the last year of High School because he was uncomfortable with people his own age.

He has had extensive training in Scientology, but no references other than the churches he has worked for. And being ex-Sea Org doesn't qualify him for a good word.

He knows no one who is a wog. He doesn't feel comforable in bars and at party's because these, up until now, have been places of out-ethics and degradation.

He has no idea where he will live, or what he will do.

Luckily, his family welcomes him back, although he has been absent for years. Promises to visit have been broken. No one really knows him.

He moves in with his father and starts working very part time for a pittance. After all, his father is doing him a favor (and he was too).

Gradually, he starts to learn to speak to wogs again, and gets into philisophical debates about his religion vs others.

He tries to "debunk" negative comments about Scientology because he truly believes in it. He has experienced a lot of good with the bad. He visits with his closest Scn friends and ex-wife a couple of years later and it is friendly.

Gradually he gains experience to the point where he has taken over his father's position at the company.

Then, he starts getting calls. Repeated calls to buy books. He learns of a dear friend having been declared. This friend was highly trained and a very trusted terminal. This doesn't make sense.

So he goes to the web and searches for the name to try to find his friend. And what site does he find? Ex-Scientologist forums.

He begins to read and begins to learn of what has been happening in the church. Learns some secrets which explain things he has seen. Learns that there are a LOT of people who have left and are happy for it.

He starts reevaluating his experiences while looking more less "scientologically" at his past. He lets go of the blind faith and starts being willing to listen.

So, where is he now?

He still is sadly lacking, even years later, in certain social skills. He is a bit of a dork.

He has certain knowledge of his field and is respected in his circle of acquaitnences.

He is a workaholic, almost unable to take a day off.

He will cope with almost unbearable cicrumstances because to him, this is normal.

He still will not do any street drugs, and will only indulge only to the slightest degree with alchohol.

He cannot enter into a casual sexual relationship as this seems wrong.

He will put up with things that most people find offensive. (He recently recieved a $50 check promised to him 9 months ago for completing a survery, and was only surprised that once the organization actually found the error of not having sent it last year, they still sent the check. I mean, who does that?? Keeping promises?? I try to, but promises to me - that's just wierd.)

He still believes and finds value to Scientology procedures and technology, but finds that the organization has strayed a long way from common decency and respect.

He does some things that are considered "out-ethics." Random trips to a casino a couple of times a year, every birthday he goes to a strip club and gets 3 or 4 lap dances, he on occasion looks at :yikes: pornography (still tending to feel guilty for it). Almost can't admit it to people when it comes up.

People come to him for help, and for guidance, and for a shoulder to cry on. He has loyalty to those who know him.

He will acknowledge those that disagree with him. He respects the rights of people to attack his former church. He passes on what he knows and can explain to those who ask.

He remains friends with Scientologists and will not decry them for it.

He likes movies and tv shows. He could care less about celebrities.

He reads a lot.

He plays computer games and surfs the net.

He still has respect for those that he worked with. He still feels that there are things that can be learned from and that there is value in the unaltered materials of L. Ron Hubbard. But he no longer has blind reverence for him and will idly stand by is someone calls him a con man and scammer.

He belives in past lives and admits that if it is true, he'll probaby be involved with Scientology next time around.

So, where does that leave him?

Is he a two faced liar for not openly telling the church to screw off?

Is he a good person for maintaining his beliefs or a bad one?

Is he unethical for allowing attacks and criticism?

Is he a spiritual man or a deluded one? A cynic or an optimist?

Is his life a comedy or a tragedy? A drama or science fiction?

All such things must be decided by the audience.

And so, my friends, I leave you with this:

"I am a free person.
"I go where I go.
"I know what I know.
"No one can make me do anything I don't want to do.
"No one can make me believe anything I don't want to believe.
"I am a free person.
"And so are you ...."

[grundy]

Not to detract from his story, but this is to Grundy.

I felt bad leaving, but I was not doing well there. For a long time I wanted to appologize to You (and my other brothers) for leaving. I took care of most things before I left. But mom's answer to me when I told her "this is not fair" was "life is not fair and you are the girl....:angry:

I felt (and still sort of do feel) guilty that she had died, because I would force her to go to the hospital, or make her eat before I left. And I was not there to do that.

I actually never thought an apology was necessary. Our mother was quite crazy toward the end there, and it was surprising that ANYONE could have dealt with it. After my sister left, she started in on my brother.

Her best friend pointed that out to her, and pointed out that if it went on, I and then my younger brother (her favorite) would come after. She got ill and passed within a couple of months of that conversation.

My sister got a lot more crap than I ever did.

And Marie, I don't think anyone could have prevented the final physical cave-in. It would have only postponed it.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

What did your mother actually die of?

It totally makes sense why "you were geared" for the SO. Working that hard that early in life.

[Marie]

This was brought on by an auto-immune issue she had. My brother was diagnosed with Job's syndrome, so that is what we think it was.

She was constantly ill, and in the end her heart gave out, it stopped working... She had a heart murmer from birth.

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Marie,

Thanks for the info.

[grundy]

BTW, ImOut - that is my youngest brother who was diagnosed, not me.

[sandygirl]

Okay...is it just me or do a lot of kids get sucked into the SO because they don't have a strong family life?

I'm not saying all but it seems to be a common thread through a lot of stories.

Do you think the church preys on this instead of helping to repair the family-I do.

Grundy, I always enjoy your posts. You sound like a really nice guy! When I was still in I would have liked you for a Sup.:yes:

[NotNuts]

I think this is absolutely right, Sandygirl -- I knew a lot of people in the SO who didn't have a good family life, and the SO "became" their family.

But there are also those of us who grew up in a very strong family and were sucked in anyway, like me. My family has always been there for me -- and honestly, they are the reason I was able to make it out.

I'd just gone to my parents' 60th anniversary party (got a day off to be able to do this, by some miracle -- I missed their 50th because I couldn't get time off) and I returned to Flag to get back to work, after having spent a really nice time with everyone.

That day, it really hit me hard -- the SHOCKING difference between how I was treated by my family and how I was treated in the SO. No respect, no dignity, constant abuse -- and I took it all up to that point, rationalizing it all away because "That's just how it goes when we're saving the planet -- tempers can be short." Oh brother.

Anyway, that's the day I decided to leave and did so. And everyone in my family was immediately there for me, and still is. Now, they are starting to talk to me about what happened when they tried to contact me earlier -- like my brother trying to contact me at Int and being told I couldn't come to the phone. He said, "I'm her brother -- you can't just not put her through to her family," and he was told, "WE'RE her family now."

[CarmeloOrchards]

Grundy, et al.

I left in 1976, so forgive my ignorance.

Reading this thread just started a cascade of tears. You really had it hard.

By contrast, the reason I left was insignificant.


I just have one question for you, "Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the show?"

[grundy]

The show could have been better ....

[sandygirl]

Quote from NotNuts:

That day, it really hit me hard -- the SHOCKING difference between how I was treated by my family and how I was treated in the SO. No respect, no dignity, constant abuse -- and I took it all up to that point, rationalizing it all away because "That's just how it goes when we're saving the planet -- tempers can be short." Oh brother

That is soooo true. I was only a public but a long time one. I really got to the point where I was "double" thinking everything I did, said, and thought! I always felt like I was a "bad" person for spending time with my kids and family instead of being on course or volunteering to sell crap. The constant demands and phone calls were really starting to make me nutty and stressed out.

The thing is I am basically a happy person and really do try to help others and be a KIND person. My life just improved when I finally made the decision that Scientology as it is practiced today was definatlly NOT FOR ME!!!


Also, most importantly, my kids are thrilled that I'm out and back to regular old mom!!!

[grundy]

Little Snippets:

When I first decided I wanted to leave, I was put on the EPF. Again.

No real studying as I had already done and redone the EPF courses. But there was no mechanism in place. I worked, and I ran around doing a lof of mest work, It was good.

At some point, it was decided that all of the people on the base who wanted to leave should be segregated together and watched by security, working as a group on various projects while working on the routing form.

There were two dorms in main building on the second floor, past the area that was completely demolished. One was the men's dorm. The other the women's.

We had fun as a group. There was about 10 of us. We were buddied up and ate together, worked together, etc, etc.

We had a theme song, which we would sing, especially if security came checking.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=MOuEYSJCFqE

Sometimes, our alternate theme, we would sing (which annoyed the security guard to no end - and so it was fun):

http://youtube.com/watch?v=aD21JDMp86c

Eventually, people started completing the form and leaving one by one. Until I was the last. And, being that I wasn't a "blow" candidate, I was pretty much left to myself for a while. Ended up in renos. But still ate, slept, etc. all on my own.

Some of my most extroverted times.

As long as I kept off the radar, no one bothered me. The HAS checked up on me on occasion, but for all intents and purposes, I did worked on what I wanted to work on.

[grundy]

Little Snippets:

I remember my original trip to Flag in the late 80s.

I was 15 years old, living at the Hacienda.

Training was fun. I worked with a lof of the other outer org trainees. We had our groups we bunched up into.

Mine was a bunch of auditor traineers, although I was a supervisor trainee.

Being fairly shy and quiet at first, my place in the group was cemented when I made a joking rejoinder to a comment one of the others made. They all laughed.

Louise (Cunningham?) Garia Northrup. A few others. One of my favorite people, although not at the center of the clique was Pascal Knecht. (I seem to remember the women better than the men :D)

There were a couple of others. I loved this little french girl who always pronounced my name with a european style, although in american the same pronounciation would be a woman's name.

Breakfast was a horrible experience, the eggs always smelled like they died. The only way to make them edible was to drown them in syrup, salt and pepper. We made some awful jokes about them.

Another annoying factor was the alarm clock of one of the guys. It was a CD player so it was the same song every morning.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=2kIZeVoRBuU

In the internship. I was word clearing with a fellow trainee, and one of the words was "stub." We were outside on a break, I was smoking, and I said "let me stub my cigarette out completely." We laughed.

Fun times.

[grundy]

Over at ESMB, Kendra asked, because of how I grew up, if I considered the SO a positive challenge. This was my reply:

It's not that it was a positive challenge or anything else. It was just that it was easier than my earlier life.

I got three meals a day (sometimes beans and rice, but I grew up poor, so beans and rice were not unfamiliar to me) and I had a regular schedule.

My teenage years taught me to deal with anything. Compared to working 2 am to 10:30 pm just about every day, with days where you were slogging through a foot of wet snow, days where you are throwing up and are still out there slogging through, etc, etc, etc, the SO was a piece of cake. Even the RPF would have been easy lol.

However, looking back, the reasons I left were myriad. But one of them was this:

Loss of independance.

I tended to do things my own way, often by myself. I ignored general opinions of "how things should be" that I fealt were limiting or stupid, paying lip service only.

For example, the fact I went off and slept with my wife some nights off base, in no way distracted me from my job. As a matter of fact, I was probably healthier and more cheerful and productive than ever before. But when it got found out, I was in trouble. And it was the beginning of the end.

So the loss of independance, and the attempt to take complete control of every aspect of my life and thought was, for me, the reason. I couldn't operate effectively like that. So I left.

Attempts to make the punishment, the "deck program," harsh and so make it more trouble than I was willing to deal with, was lost on me. I could deal with it, because it wasn't that hard.

Compared to my earlier life? It was a vacation.

[Marie]

Not to detract, but I am amazed at the similarities. We have never really talked about our "leaving" stories, me and my brother.


I got three meals a day (sometimes beans and rice, but I grew up poor, so beans and rice were not unfamiliar to me) and I had a regular schedule..

The reason it was so easy for me also, except....

funny thing, I couldn't stomach beans and rice... Had it too many times as a kid. We at beans/rice and bananas every day for about a year (I am sure there was other things at times, but at 8 this seemed like all we ate) because we had nothing and this would give us our basic nutrition - at least that is what my mom said. When in the SO I alway could come up with something else (you know necessity level), and to this day can't eat a black bea.




Loss of independance.

I tended to do things my own way, often by myself. I ignored general opinions of "how things should be" that I fealt were limiting or stupid, paying lip service only.

...

So the loss of independance, and the attempt to take complete control of every aspect of my life and thought was, for me, the reason. I couldn't operate effectively like that. So I left.

Attempts to make the punishment, the "deck program," harsh and so make it more trouble than I was willing to deal with, was lost on me. I could deal with it, because it wasn't that hard.

Compared to my earlier life? It was a vacation.

So true, I usually just gave lip service to the limits that I was given, and would do as I pleased... Followed basic rules - and the ones I thought were stupid, I skated on.

I think the 2 times they thought about putting me on the decks, I had no reaction, and therefore because my "crime" at those times were so minimal (refusing to wear the uniform of the day, being late for muster, etc) was not worth loosing my skills, I didn't get sent.

Ethics was always easy for me, 1st I knew the policies, I knew more then the EO most of the time... and I never ran into a do or die person on this, so I never got beat up unfairly.

Also I was constantly out int, so missed out on the sec checks, etc... I quess I lucked out (but at the time felt really uncared for). I had to get my own "ethics" in.

When I routed out, I was left to do whatever I wanted. I was always asking what I should be doing, because they didn't know what to do with me.

Funny thing is they also didn't try to keep me there, after I came back to route out. My statement when I came back of "I am here to complete the routing form, but my TM is 6 weeks, either way I will be on that plane" seemed to shock the terminals I had to deal with to finish up.

[Free to shine]

I think it's wonderful that you both are telling your stories like this. :)

[grundy]

So true, I usually just gave lip service to the limits that I was given, and would do as I pleased... Followed basic rules - and the ones I thought were stupid, I skated on.

Our mother basically instilled that in us.

Rules (and laws:omg:) that were idiotic you paid lip service to when you had to, but do what you felt was necessary or right. Be prepared for consequences, but personal volition is high.

If you read my postings on the "pet peeves" thread, you may notice that stupidity is high on my list. ANOTHER thing my mother abhored and would stamp out with us. You couldn't be stupid with my mother.

And lying was easy either. Any lie you told had better be completely insignificant or completely believeable. Because you did NOT want to be caught lying. (And even those types of lies were at best chancy.) So, in the SO, we wouldn't just buckle under and leave it at that, because we were instilled with too much independance as children.

Our mother's philosophy was that her children had better learn very early to think and do for themselves, because the world wouldn't let someone survive who couldn't. Personal responsibility was also big.

If we had wanted to get into drugs, we would have had to be willing to live with the consequences. Also, teenage sex. Our mother was "if your going to do it, be prepared to deal with whatever happens." As a result, I don't think any of us had sex before we were adults.

Observation, confront, the meaning of covert hostility, the art of being independant while acting like you were following along, lying only when there was no chance of being caught out, personal resonsibility and volition, avoiding stupidity.

These were the things we learned.

[grundy]

Little Snippets:

Supervisor's Code.

I think this is what made me what I was as a supervisor. When I first got to Flag for Supervisor training, I ended up helping someone on the Mini Sup Course with the Supervisor's Code even though I had just got there. It was the thing you had to completely duplicate and learn verbatim.

Jeff King his name was, from Seattle. He was having a hard time and so Leif, our supervisor, decided to have me (a 15 year old newbie lol) help him, as I was also at Flag for sup training. (I know most people type supe so it gets pronounced correctly, but we always abbreviated it sup!)

The line he was having the hardest time with was #8 - the longest clause.

"The supervisor should be able to answer any question concerning Scientology by directing the student to the actual source of the data. If a supervisor cannot answer a particular question he should always say so, and the supervisor should find the answer to the question from the source and tell the student where the answer is to be found."

Even 21 years later, I know this. I know it completely. It was my specialty. I knew supervisors that when asked a question would just tell the student to find his MU.

Me, I always listened to the students question and if the question was answered in any reference, I would tell the student where to go. I was famous for being able to answer all the tough ones in the blink of an eye. I was accused by the director of training as trying to set myself up as source. She was a supervisor too.

http://freezoneamerica.com/Clearbird/study2004/sup/02supcode.htm

[Colleen K. Peltomaa]

Our mother basically instilled that in us.

Rules (and laws:omg:) that were idiotic you paid lip service to when you had to, but do what you felt was necessary or right. Be prepared for consequences, but personal volition is high.

If you read my postings on the "pet peeves" thread, you may notice that stupidity is high on my list. ANOTHER thing my mother abhored and would stamp out with us. You couldn't be stupid with my mother.

And lying was easy either. Any lie you told had better be completely insignificant or completely believeable. Because you did NOT want to be caught lying. (And even those types of lies were at best chancy.) So, in the SO, we wouldn't just buckle under and leave it at that, because we were instilled with too much independance as children.

Our mother's philosophy was that her children had better learn very early to think and do for themselves, because the world wouldn't let someone survive who couldn't. Personal responsibility was also big.

If we had wanted to get into drugs, we would have had to be willing to live with the consequences. Also, teenage sex. Our mother was "if your going to do it, be prepared to deal with whatever happens." As a result, I don't think any of us had sex before we were adults.

Observation, confront, the meaning of covert hostility, the art of being independant while acting like you were following along, lying only when there was no chance of being caught out, personal resonsibility and volition, avoiding stupidity.

These were the things we learned.

Aren't moms fantastic! You could never have learned that from school teachers. What school would ever have a class on survival in the real world and teach children how to Ack an order and then go and do their own thing. I did not learn that until about 3 years ago. Don't worry, I'm making up for lost time :coolwink:

[grundy]

Living with Indoctrination:

I had oppurtunity recently for some self examination.

I was having a conversation with my brother, who makes significantly more money than I do. As a point of curiousity, I asked him how much he made per hour (he had told me before but it had slipped my mind).

After answering he asked why I had inquired. I answered, quite honestly (or so I thought), that it was curiosity only.

He pressed and I thought about it. I told him that I was to a small degree jealous that he had the resources to buy "toys" on a whim.

He doesn't really do it, just about everything that he buys has some future return. But there are a couple of things that he owns that are for just playing with (PSP, Digital VCR to capture things for his phone). He commented that I probably have some toys.

I thought about it and I could not think of one thing that I have bought that has just been for the sheer joy of playing with or owning. Everything I purchase has to have some use to me.

He asked me what toy I would like. And I could not think of one thing that I have seen and desired that would qualify as a toy.

After a couple of hours, I thought of an item (IPOD). But even that seems to me to be frivilous. What use would an IPOD be to me in my job?

It made me realize that I am completely incapable of buying something just for the sheer joy of it. I, for the most part, spend money on what I need, not what I want. (Except my vice - lottery tickets. But even that .. well, I'll explain.)

Now, part of this is my upbringing. Growing up poor doesn't lend itself to spending money on frivolities. But even growing up poor there were things my mother bought and bought for us that had no practical value. We had some toys (not many), so it isn't entirely this.

I then realized that it was my time spent on staff that taught me to only spend money on those things that I felt I absolutely needed. It's the culture of scientology that you don't spend money unless it has to do with things you MUST have (or scientology of course).

According to the book the problems of work by hubbard, life is 70% work. But experience in working in Scientology is life is 90% work. Another 9% are things that have to DO with work. So life is 99% is work. Anything else must fit into 1% of your resources.

You know how you might buy a lottery ticket, especially if there is a big jackpot? The funny thing is that when I imagine what it might be like if I won, the things I might fantasize about have to do with spending money on my work, making things easier, and so forth. I don't fantasize about buying a house (except it would be nice to buy a house right next to work so I could just walk to work) or new cars (except it might be nice to have to spend less money on gas getting to work) or taking a vacation (although there are conventions and seminars that might be nice to visit to make me better at my job).

(Although I have to admit I spend about $120 a year on my game site. I feel sooooo guilty.)

So, even though I have been off of staff for a number of years now, the indoctrination is still firmly in place.

[Free to shine]

You are so right and I also understand. :)
It took me years not to feel guilty buying flowers or a magazine or clothes that were special rather than everyday.

The indoctrination only holds power while you are unaware of it. So you are doing well! :happydance:

[Marie]

Sorry if this is off topic, again some of this is directed at Grundy - we never really talk about this stuff, though we see each other alot.


Living with Indoctrination:

I thought about it and I could not think of one thing that I have bought that has just been for the sheer joy of playing with or owning. Everything I purchase has to have some use to me.

It took me quite a while to change this “think”. Some of it is self-esteem (am I really worth doing stuff just for myself) – that is the hardest part, actually.

I still feel guilty for buying something that has no purpose, but I have added entertainment as a purpose:p …


Living with Indoctrination:

According to the book the problems of work by hubbard, life is 70% work. But experience in working in Scientology is life is 90% work. Another 9% are things that have to DO with work. So life is 99% is work. Anything else must fit into 1% of your resources.

Transition had a bit to do with work, it is 99 percent of your life in the SO, but even before that my life was about “supporting the family” or before that “taking care of my brothers”… From the ripe old age of 9 when my mom and dad were working 18 hours a day trying to build a business.

None of this truly changed until started thinking I was worth something, more important then anything else. That work, while still very important, is not the sole purpose in life:duh: .


Living with Indoctrination:
So, even though I have been off of staff for a number of years now, the indoctrination is still firmly in place.

I think my life really started when I started working a 9-5 job. For the first 10 years after I left the SO, I was trying to figure it out…

Even working a regular job was hard for reasons:

1. Were my skills real, or just “Scn” skills? With no high school diploma let alone a college degree, there was that worry that I would be perceived as unskilled. – I did my GED (what a stupid test, took me in total 85 minutes, which they made me do in 2 days – the test is supposed to be 5 sections of 45 minutes a piece. Taking it 3 times faster then it was supposed to be I scored 98 percentile… what a joke… anyway) – I took some college classes.

Note re OEC/FEBC: some things very useful, some things seemed to be just fill-in stuff that did not really make sense – especially in areas that were not LRH’s “cup of tea” – or he couldn’t find someone to “borrow” from, it probably is of no use in SO/Scn/real world… Oh no, I think that will get me declared, I know he was an expert on everything:omg: .

2. I worked for my Dad, and leaving him in a lurch was hard – but I worked too many hours, too much stress, not enough money. I was also feeling guilty because what I was doing for him was way over my head – I was untrained to handle, but of course I should be able to do it because that is the way it worked in the SO, right. (You can do any job, of course. Make it go right. You are able to control your environment, and all things around you. Don’t present a problem without a solution. Sorry I am ranting). So I screwed up big time, and didn’t know how to fix it…. That didn’t help my self-esteem.

3. What was I supposed to do with all of this time, and money. Now I make a lower middle class wage, but still there is more money then your used to. I found things to spend it on that were to “help” people, and found that helping people who won’t help themselves is a waste:angry: .

Boy, am I behind, and I missed out on so much… Just a statement, I have gotten over the upset of this (mostly), and actually am happy with life.

More this is a word of warning for anyone else is this same situation…. I never thought anyone ever was in a similar situation, till I found this website. Though I wasn’t born into SO, I think I still have some of the problems that come with that, maybe why being in the SO was not all that hard from me.

[Dulloldfart]

I thought about it and I could not think of one thing that I have bought that has just been for the sheer joy of playing with or owning. Everything I purchase has to have some use to me.


Here is my solution to that one, having also had a life of almost poverty until after I had left the SO at age 46. Per Hubbard's Havingness Scale, Have comes above Waste, and you have to be able to Waste something before you can Have it. So in order to be able to Have money, you need to be able to Waste money.

So every now and then, instead of being careful with my money as usual--and I still am--I simply waste money on something deliberately, knowing it to be a waste. Sometimes I literally throw money away into the trash. I've torn up paper money, but usually that is to sort of impress people too so it's not strictly wasting it.

But it covers toys with no justifiable beans-for-beans reason for buying them. :)

Paul

[grundy]

BTW - how common is it to be (sexually) attacked as a child?

I thought of the time when someone attempted to molest me when I was in Kindegarden

Nothing really happened - mostly cause I looked at the dude who tried it like he was completely out of his mind. Older kid (maybe 15 or 16) tried to reach into my pants in the bathroom of the school. I just yelled at him "What are you doing?" very loudly and pretty much stared him down.

But it was something that some of the stories on here brought to my mind. I thought it was rare - but maybe it's not.

[Dulloldfart]

BTW - how common is it to be (sexually) attacked as a child?



Write a poll about it. :)

Paul

[Zander]

I am reposting from my story over at ESK.

Part of this is in a "synopsis" mode - short, terse, to the point.

And then I become more verbose as I fill in more detail.

And yes, I do believe in past lives so there: :p

Trained at St. Hill. Cleared at St. Hill.

Joined the Sea Org. Did OT1. Offloaded/Left/was under some ethics action.

Died.

Born to parents on staff at an org run by friend from St. Hill. Father's mother was on the ship. This looks like a good place.

Parents left staff (but not scientology). Did TRO as a kid. (Our parents version of a time out.) Had Covert Hostility defined. Favorite game growing up with siblings: "You're just being covertly hostile."

Mother dies. Funeral at the org. I get free auditing. Dianetics session to run out mother's death. Something isn't right here ....

Did course. Joined staff. Sent to flag to train. Out-Int (case condition) on M1 co-audit. C/S 53 (general repair list). "Are you clear?" BIIIIGG response. Reason for out-interiorization: Dianetics session and already clear. Walk into recruiter's office and sign Sea Org contract.

Work at local org for 2 years. Need Clear Certainty Rundown. Get sent to advanced org for CCRD (father pays). Go back to org. 2 weeks later, off to Sea Org ....

Grundy, did you check out who you were in that past life? There can't have been many people who would have fitted the bill.

If you haven't, could you tell me why not?

And you speak about the past life with such certainty, is your memory of it so clear or was it something that came out in session?

I don't mean to criticise you in any way for those views, I just want to be clear about how much of it is 'belief', as you said you 'believe in past lives'. I feel that there are many people in the cofs who display such certainty about these kind of things, where the certainty is not warranted at all.

By the way, it was great to read the rest of your story too :)

Zander

[grundy]

Actually, it came out in session - different sessions, sec checks, etc.

But for the long and short of it, I realized - it doesnt really matter in the end. I wrote most of my story when I first got here. Now - it doesnt matter quite so much to me.

I was there, I am here, good enough for me.

[grundy]

Write a poll about it. :)

Paul

Might be upsetting. I thought about it when I asked.

[uncle sam]

I just finished reading all your posts. Thanks for sharing your story-I was enthralled. Your history is so opposite that of my own. One thing stands out-you're a "good guy"-that's about the best compliment that I give. Your story certainly helps to explain all your other posts which I had some trouble with, now I know where you are coming from. Good for you!

[grundy]

Well, thank you.

Actually, the whole point of the thread is so that people can see where I am coming from.

Cause compared to many, I know Im a bit wierd.

It IS kinda funny though - in all of my sec checks, repairs, L1Cs, etc, etc, only a very little of this story (post 1 mostly) is actually in my pc folders. So even someone who has audited me would not know who I am from what I have said.

[Good twin]

Well, thank you.

Actually, the whole point of the thread is so that people can see where I am coming from.

Cause compared to many, I know Im a bit wierd.

It IS kinda funny though - in all of my sec checks, repairs, L1Cs, etc, etc, only a very little of this story (post 1 mostly) is actually in my pc folders. So even someone who has audited me would not know who I am from what I have said.

Oh Grundy, It's so funny you said this. I've felt the same way after coming here. I find myself telling you guys here things that never came up in all my years and hours of auditing. ESMB is a safer terminal then any of my past auditors. Isn't that Bizarre?
(I agree Uncle Sam....he's a good guy)
GT