The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

[Auditor's Toad]

I think you make some good points but IMO may have over generalized a bit. I don't fully agree that music exists only when it is being played unless that includes it being played in a person's mind as well as in the physical universe.

Also, there are those who study musical scores and get pleasure and understanding from reading a non played score.

As far as it existing independently of it's creator, I agree only in part. I believe if one knows the history of how the music came into being, the composer's life story and struggles, the state of music in the time and place where it was introduced, etc. one can get more enjoyment out of the music. BTW, this is at least as true for popular music as for classical.

Also, your comment about existing independently of its creator is not always the case in modern times what with copyright laws, etc. If someone owns the legal rights to the music, they can control its being played and being marketed. If such an owner wanted to they could keep a musical score from being played.

Things of this nature have happened in film making. The owners of film rights for a specific movie can and have banned showing of that film for decades.
Lakey

How many times has one to be a live - but small - performance where ,say , an extremely talented player will do B.B. King almost better than B.B. King ? I Have. The music is, of course, copyrighted but the performer will do it for himself or a few freiends............surely many music lovers have seen that.

Also, some people hearing a classical piece for the first time may have NO CLUE who wrote it, have no idea it was Mozart or Beethoven ( not everyone grows up with classical music! ). Does that music not exist independant of the composer for that particular listener ?

And, OMG, do I have to know it was the London Philharmonic that played it ?
Does that music not exist for me entirely separtae from not knowing which orcherstra gave that performance ? ( Nevermind who the guest conductor was! )

What if I don't know who was first violin ? Again, does that mean that music does not still exist for me ?

Music exists at the time one hears a performance of it without knowing who wrote the piece, who played the piece or the names of the principal players or conductor.
Well, unless one considers when I turn on my radio and there is a piece being played that I do not know who wrote it, who did the lyrics, who played it ( hell, maybe even what studio it was recorded in! ) that it does not exist until I know all that.

No one this thread is widely read. It is ribald humor !

And, I sort of find it more than funny for someone to think for a long dead composer personal preferences would be for an instrument of this choice rather than that choice!

Most great creators would tend to want the best possible presentation of their work but surely each would be allowed their own preference in that. Sheesh.

Would Shakespeare reject modern stage lightings and PA systems as not being "period "? Wonder what he'd think of flying sets, eh ?

[lkwdblds]

This performance is about the closest possible that one can come to watching and hearing a late 18th century piano and orchestra performance live:

Robert Levin is playing the 1785-1790 type of 5 octave piano and all of the orchestral pieces are also from that period as well. Check out the French Horns! There are no valves and the players have to create notes through usage of their lips plus moving their hands around inside the bell of the horn.

That piano is surprisingly good! It appears to be a very advanced action for it's time period. It is very different from a modern piano. It lacks in some areas but it seems to make up for is deficiencies in other areas. The sound it makes is a bit similar to that of a harp.



Lakey

[Leon]

No one dispuits that music played on original instruments can be lovely and inspiring. It is a jooy to hear.

But that in no way negates the thrill of hearing Bach being adapted by Busoni for the piano.

[FoTi]

This performance is about the closest possible that one can come to watching and hearing a late 18th century piano and orchestra performance live:

Robert Levin is playing the 1785-1790 type of 5 octave piano and all of the orchestral pieces are also from that period as well. Check out the French Horns! There are no valves and the players have to create notes through usage of their lips plus moving their hands around inside the bell of the horn.

That piano is surprisingly good! It appears to be a very advanced action for it's time period. It is very different from a modern piano. It lacks in some areas but it seems to make up for is deficiencies in other areas. The sound it makes is a bit similar to that of a harp.



Lakey

LUV IT!!!!!!

[Terril park]

No one dispuits that music played on original instruments can be lovely and inspiring. It is a jooy to hear.

But that in no way negates the thrill of hearing Bach being adapted by Busoni for the piano.

With you Bro!

I see you also have evil transcriptionists and editors.

I expect the spell check process handles that. Sadly I'm at a lower level. :(

But then, ...... I think this bach Busoni transcription is Bach's greatest testament.

Currently, and under the influence of the georgeous Helene I even find it greater than the "Art of Fugue".

This is really HARD. For hundreds of years it was considered merely an intellectual effort. An exersise not really music to be listened to.

Ho!

Just searched U-tube and have found my favorite version where Lional Rogg completes the final 4 part fugue!

Years ago asked the record company if they would release it on CD and they said there were problems including London underground trains being too noisy.

Gird your loins. You need to enjoy!

And Emma but not for you I would never have found this earlier dream
of mine.

[Leon]

The Keller Quartet remains my all time favourite for this.

And for Beethoven Symphonies the recordings done back in the late 1950's by Bruno Walter with the Columbia Orchestra have never ever been equalled.

[Terril park]

The Keller Quartet remains my all time favourite for this.

And for Beethoven Symphonies the recordings done back in the late 1950's by Bruno Walter with the Columbia Orchestra have never ever been equalled.

Never heard of the Keller Quartet. But there's some on U-tube.
Very interesting!



I very much like Herman Scherchen with orchestra.

[Terril park]

Never heard of the Keller Quartet. But there's some on U-tube.
Very interesting!



I very much like Herman Scherchen with orchestra.

When it comes to Bach and new music one of the greatest Is
Herman Schershen

[Hatshepsut]

duplicate

[Hatshepsut]

That sounded 'tinny' tony ear and I found myself waxing sentimental in the end. It kind of brought to mind the sublime joy I luxuriated in towards the end of this film. Director Peter Weir used the music of Boccherini in his epic film about 1805 fictional hero Captain Aubry.





I know the one is really simplistic compared to the skills of the other but I just love this.