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Thread: You're The One Breaking Up The Family!

  1. #21
    Silver Meritorious Patron Blue Spirit's Avatar
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    The Universe" Award for the 29th year running,
    The actual route to be free and return all of your true spiritual operating abilities is a total positiveness and the ability to forgive all (you too) for everything done and accept each being as you find them. In granting full beingness to yourself and others you will have ability to stop resisting the negative, which in turn assures that your full beautiful powers and abilities will bear fruit.
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  2. #22
    Patron Papabear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Still In View Post
    chris, please post more stories from this point in time (if you so choose). i am currently going through the same thing.. battling with my family, being "the one between them and the church", its very frustrating.. reading your account of how things went for you is more helpful than you can being to imagine for me.
    Well, I will do what I can to help. Honestly, if my family actually listened to me and I was actually heard (like they took me seriously) I wouldn't be talking to all of you here.

    Thank you all for your responses, they are very healing somehow. I suppose I feel like someone who has been there can really hear what I am saying.

    I haven't posted about the abortion "request" before that I can recall.

    I have had my own run in with Cary. I was a public in Miami org, he walks up to me and tells me I should start a mission. Stat Push anyone? I hope he is doing better now.

    The CO CMO EUS at the time was Matt Henderson. Tall, red hair, bit of a know it all prick...He also pushed my wife to divorce me. We are still together, 23 years this Jan 1st. So there...

    So here's another time during my dad's "handling" of me. He straight out asked my what my overt was. Of course, I knew this was coming, all the questions before this were indirect variations of this theme. I was ready.

    "I can tell you exactly what my overt was." was my instant reply, a hint of a grin peeking out.

    Father is a bit surprised having not quite caught on to the direct question/direct answer gambit I was playing.

    "You can?"

    "Oh yeah, I've given a lot of thought to this subject, I wondered myself. It was when you first got us involved in Scientology. I guess we were around 10 or 11 years old. I didn't like doing it. I didn't like the assists, the Dianetic auditing, the courses, any of it. But I violated my integrity, because I figured what the hell do I know, I'm just a kid. That's my overt!"

    (Stunned silence) I think he was expecting something more like I robbed a bank?

    We discussed this for a bit, and really he took it personally from what my brother told me later. I still take full responsibility that I didn't stand up for myself then. I don't blame my parents for what happened, really, I don't. They did the best they could with what they had, I didn't. I could have listened to myself, but I didn't. Lesson learned.

    It's much harder to lie and live a lie than it is to just be honest. You may not be able to articulate why you do or don't want to do something and that's ok. Follow your heart. You'll be glad you did later, when it makes more sense. (I hope I'm making sense!)

    Merry Christmas y'all! I love you!

    Chris
    Three things cannot be long hidden: the sun, the moon, and the truth. - Buddha

    Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear. - George Orwell

    In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - (Attributed to) George Orwell

    "It took me a long time to learn that being miserable does not alleviate the world's misery." Hannah Tennant-Moore, The Sun Magazine Issue 404

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  4. #23
    Crusader Wisened One's Avatar
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    Thank you for sharing your story, Chris. I know it was not fun or easy!

    Michelle
    The night I escaped Staff:
    http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost....2&postcount=33

    I get really tired of hearing about how the lower bridge has value. The lower bridge has the sole purpose of getting the PC to reach for more bridge. The fact that many people improved their circumstances as a result of a good intentioned auditor being interested and caring about his PC is not worth the long term and intended result of Scientology technology. GT

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  6. #24

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    Origianlly posted by papabear,
    You see, I realized Scientology had made me into a liar, and I had decided as soon as I left Scn I wouldn't be a liar anymore. If anyone asked a direct question, I assumed they wanted and were ready to know, and I answered it honestly.


    First thing I recall 'learning' in scn ... how to be a good liar... for the greatest good (naturally).



    It is a great feeling to just answer any questions ... and not have to use the 'party line' now.

    Great posts papabear.

    Happy Christmas.




    The birds they sang, at the break of day
    Start again, I seemed to hear them say
    Do not dwell on what has passed away
    or what is yet to be ...

    Leonard Cohen.




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  8. #25
    Silver Meritorious Patron Megalomaniac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Papabear View Post
    I haven't posted about the abortion "request" before that I can recall.
    The following is my opinion and I don't pretend to know enough to advise you, ok?: Pressuring women to abort their babies is about the worst offense I know of that is prevalent in Scientology. It is the total opposite of everything I thought Scientology was supposed to be about. Once I became convinced this was actually happening, I stopped donating money and soon after was openly criticizing Scientology. It was one of two stories that were a tipping point for me. I believe that an overwhelming majority of Scientologists, still in, if they knew this was happening and condoned from the highest levels, would immediately withdraw all support from CoS, as I did. I think that those who have first hand experience with this, and are willing and able to do so, should not simply tell their story. I think they should testify under oath to what they observed. This is not just a splashy scandal, this is criminal and should be dealt with as such. My 2cents.


    Quote Originally Posted by Papabear View Post
    Merry Christmas y'all! I love you!

    Chris
    Merry Christmas, you, too! I know you have a good family and they will realize that you really are a family and that it's important. Have faith in that.
    It will come to an end. My argument is, it does not have to end badly. -- Ron Paul

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  10. #26
    Crusader freethinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Papabear View Post
    So, when I was several months into my parents knowing I was leaving Scn, with them doing a handling there were some very surreal moments I thought I would share.

    The most bizarre had to be when my mother came to my house, (all the handlings had been at their house) walked right up to me and my wife and made the statement "You're the one breaking up the family!" pointing at me.
    Now, this shocked the hell out of me, as all I had been doing is living my life and answering their questions. It was not my fault their cult was paranoid!

    So I repeat to her. "I'm breaking up the family?!" I was so pissed, I told her to get out. A few hours later I was still too pissed to go next door to talk to my dad, so the wife went. Wife looks at both of them, and dad says, "Mom here says Chris told her he was breaking up the family." Well, the wife sorted that out with the truth, thank you very much.

    What I figured out from that, was mom had been instructed (she's OT8) to make sure I knew I was breaking up the family, and then let everyone else know. So she used tone 40 intention or something. Anybody else get that treatment?

    Ok, the next one is also funny. Mom talks me and the wife to go out for breakfast, shortly before the above happens. We go to the Egg Platter on Hwy 19. The place is full of people. We get a table and just as we get our food (after all the small talk) mom says something like,

    "Chris, how can you be helped?"

    "Say what?" says I

    "How can you help others?" Mom replies

    "Mom, that's a help process, you're running a process on me." Says I, smiling
    Meanwhile the wife's jaw is on the table and she's speechless

    "No I'm not! How can you be helped?" is her only answer.

    I straighten up in my chair, almost tempted by my long term conditioning to play along, but it is overcome, thank god! "Mom, even LRH said the tech won't work if the PC doesn't agree to the session!"

    "How can you help others?" she asks again, like nothing had happened.

    "I'm not going to do this. Can we just eat please?" and she finally gives in. We eat our breakfast, and she cries on the way to the car. I hug her and try to reassure her that all is fine but it seems to have little effect.

    Again it seems someone ordered her to do this, but I can't say for sure. We had already been out over 2 years and that really helped to resist just towing the line.

    Ok, last one for now. Been talking to dad for a few hours. The conversation goes downhill and I can see he is getting upset, his TR's are out. I stand up and say, "well, I think that's enough, I'm going home, we can talk more later,"

    "Well, just remember, you're the one leaving!" dad says as I round the corner of his desk to get to the door behind him.

    "I know I'm the one leaving dad." I say, grasping the door handle and twisting it.

    "Yeah, well, you're the one leaving!" he repeats as I realize me must be referring to Leaving and Leaves, Overts, Blowing policies etc.

    "What are you saying? I need your authority to leave? That I have overts? I know I'm the one leaving!" I say hotly, losing my cool more quickly now.

    "Well, you're the one leaving!" again he says as we both stand in the hallway outside his office door.

    I get to within 3 inches of his face and I scream "I.KNOW.I.AM.The.ONE.LEAVING!" as loud as I can. I then turn around and walk to the back door through the Florida room where my mom tries to intercept but is too late.

    "What's happened?" she cries out.

    "You're handling didn't work!" I almost shouted

    "We're not trying to handle you!" she exclaims as I am shutting the door and walking home through the backyard path connecting our houses, steam rising from my ears.

    Later she does admit they were trying to handle me. This occurred in the beginning, and I deeply regret loosing my cool. All I can say is I was under a lot of pressure as my timetable for leaving had been moved up, and I was having to stall for time while trying to remain honest.

    You see, I realized Scientology had made me into a liar, and I had decided as soon as I left Scn I wouldn't be a liar anymore. If anyone asked a direct question, I assumed they wanted and were ready to know, and I answered it honestly.

    This is how I got through the first 2 years. NO ONE asked me the direct question "Have you left Scientology?" I think it was because they really didn't want to know.

    As it turned out, the handling was really to get my dad back onto OT7. I was probably the antagonistic source on his lines, having refused free auditing from him, and telling stories of things like how we were ordered by the CO CMO EUS to abort our second son. Whoops! My bad!

    Soooo, from their viewpoint, I was the one fucking the whole thing up as I was not responding like the tech says! What does that tell you?

    To be fair to my parents, they are really nice people trying to save this sector of the galaxy. Just about anyone who meets them likes them.

    My beef is they have known me my whole life, I was there in the SO and I saw things they never have, and it counted for nothing when I spoke out. So I feel like chopped liver and can only resort to speaking out on forums where perhaps, someday, they will listen.

    Also I eat chocolate and tell my story to anyone interested, but hardly anyone I meet even know what Scientology is! 10 million members, I think not!

    Anyway, that's it for now. I'm gonna go home and hug the wife, eat some lemon bars and cookies our daughter just made, and watch a movie.

    Love y'all!

    Chris aka Papabear
    It seems to me that the most honest people are the ones that get fucked the most by Scientology. P Bear when you related the confrontation with your father I couldn't help but get the feeling that he wants out and he needs you to bring him over the line. had you two been able to really talk at that point, just you and him; nobody else influencing, you might have pulled him out right then. I think he's trying to goad you into getting him out. He wouldn't even talk to you if, in my opinion, he wasn't trying to get you to help him get out. Just thinking. If you don't think this is the case, don't be offended.

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  12. #27
    Silver Meritorious Patron Boojuum's Avatar
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    Hi Papabear

    Thanks for sharing.

    I'd keep reading the stories here on ESMB and see what other people suggest.

    Something that helped me resolve the family disputes was reading everything I could about the "cult personality". Gaining a deeper understanding of the true mental mechanisms at play will give you more control over your family relationships. (not LRH-based stuff) I suggest Steve Hassan's and Margaret Singer's books. You'll feel much better and I suspect your parents will as well.

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  14. #28
    Patron with Honors Mockingbird6's Avatar
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    Default Just a thought...

    Just a thought, Papabear,
    Let's say someone is in the situation you were in with your father, and father of course is being very unreal, playing from a "supposed to say" kind of script, and you asked him with genuine interest, "Please tell me everything you want me to know about all this." Get him into his own head and maybe he'll spill enough that he could let go of some big blockage and start to see YOU. Just a thought...

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  16. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mockingbird6 View Post
    Just a thought, Papabear,
    Let's say someone is in the situation you were in with your father, and father of course is being very unreal, playing from a "supposed to say" kind of script, and you asked him with genuine interest, "Please tell me everything you want me to know about all this." Get him into his own head and maybe he'll spill enough that he could let go of some big blockage and start to see YOU. Just a thought...

    ^^^^^

    That.





    The birds they sang, at the break of day
    Start again, I seemed to hear them say
    Do not dwell on what has passed away
    or what is yet to be ...

    Leonard Cohen.




  17. #30
    Crusader freethinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by because View Post
    Alonzo,
    I total duplicacate you with regards to Cary G.
    Cary ran into me a few years back. I applied debug tech and data coincident tech. Wrote up what i found to Int. Mtg. he was recalled and shortly after declared. He returned eventually applied and did his A-E and is cleaned up no more dramatizing and is a public Scientologist the last I heard. I hope this helps.
    Cary Ghoulston is a fuckhead and if you think he can reform into anything that resembles a human or sentient being, you're fucked

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