What Went Wrong !?

[AnonKat]

The original (stated) intent of LRH was something along this line too. To clear individuals and thus create a positive impact on mass consciousness. This would however have required a more efficient method. Auditing technology has not proven to yield constant and stable results to create a positive impact. The current state of affairs is enough proof of the contrary.

My Hypothesis is that LRH at least was familiar with Scweitzer

The more efficient method would be Democracy instead of Tyrancy. One vote each. But I prefere all dead agening structures gone like OSA RTC SO CTS "and so on, and so forth" than I don't mind somebody practicing something I myself would not. On that note America as a nation failed to confront this Cancer called the C of $

Schweitzer lived when Hubbard was alive. I think he ripped him of too like Freud and Bhudism. Sounds to familiar to me .

Albert Schweitzer:

Thought cannot avoid the ethical or reverence and love for all life. It will abandon the old confined systems of ethics and be forced to recognize the ethics that knows no bounds. But on the other hand, those who believe in love for all creation must realize clearly the difficulties involved in the problem of a boundless ethic and must be resolved not to veil from [humankind] the conflicts which this ethic will involve [us], but allow [us] really to experience them. To think out in every implication the ethic of love for all creation -- this is the difficult task which confronts our age.�

[AngeloV]

No organization can be corrected or self-corrected using QA techniques into a successful operation whose very foundation is based on paranoia. The fear of evil 'psychs', the medical profession, drug companies, the media and a multitude of phantom 'SPs' will continue to drive scio along a downhill course of madness and ruined lives.

Scio ethics is good for one thing - it acts like a giant throttle on the organizations success.

[phoenix]

Well....
thanks...
this certainly seems to be an interesting thread.

I certainly Enjoy listening to Rons lectures and often find that I have great realisations.
I have had fantastic realisations and greater happinesses because of better understandings.... and had and done some great auditing.

so I dont have any 'problem' with the tech....
just the main body of scientology apears to be 'out of tune' with its own ethos.

and so.... is it the unable to correct itself.... as it states it can ?

very interesting that some have noted that others... the public are now holding that dropped function...... mmmm.... i agree.... that is a very scientological perspective..... a good point that perhaps the 'public' are now holding that function and perhaps at some point will 'correct ' the organisation perhaps by way of severe reality adjustment.

so...
just how is this QUAL self correcting mechanism MEANT to work ?

anyone know ?

[Zinjifar]

so...
just how is this QUAL self correcting mechanism MEANT to work ?

anyone know ?

The *intention* was to allow Ron to apply any strictures, mandates or rules he chose completely arbitrarily, without Himself being bound by them.

It works admirably.

Zinj

[NeXTep]

just how is this QUAL self correcting mechanism MEANT to work ?

This can only work if you assume that the tech actually can be made to work on the majority of cases and actually is able to actually transform emotional charge with the end result of having enlightened beings. (call them clears or OTs if you want)

The Qual division, by keeping the (assumed functioning) technology 100% standard and getting results, would thus assist the org in clearing the basis to a point that there would be no place for DMs and cohorts within such an organization. In fact he would not be able to prey upon such subjects as there would be no resonance and he would either be a decent leader or gone.

[RogerB]

In my view, based on personal experience in the trenches, the reason there has been a chronic failure to self correct in the orgs is that the "corrective action" designated in the org board structure as being in the Qual Div got usurped by the Dept. of Ethics.

I don't know if you've particularly noticed, but virtually all efforts in the org to correct anything and render "severe reality adjustments" et al are done via ethics "handlings" or otherwise under the threat and duress of ethics handlings..

Wrong action, wrong who to be doing it!

Originally when the Awareness Levels and related org board structure based on it were released, Awareness Level 14 and Department 14 were named REVIEW. It later got changed to "CORRECTION."

That of course is a screw-up because it omits the vital step of the inspection that would comprise a review in order to adequately and accurately evaluate if and/or what ought be corrected.

Department of staff training was ?is? there in Qual also . . . and this would enable corrections and upgrading of staff performance . . . . if it were allowed to happen instead of the incessant hitting with ethics handlings and bullyings by idiots from "management" strata above and other Product Officer demands and stupid interference posing as "management."

As an organism, the orgs long ago ceased being able to think, analyze and do the right and proper corrective actions. It all went out the window when the Department of I&R and Ethics Officer posts along with HCO were given too much power . . . or that those functions were usurped by idiots or those whose sense of improvement and betterment were grossly "warped" (to say the least).

This loss of ability to think and order org affairs in an optimum manner occurred in about 1966 after the implementation of I&R and Eth Officer functions in orgs.

Today, orgs cannot think. Nor can they analyze with a view to upgrading of performance . . . they can only react and punish.

And that, unfortunately, is a sad commentary on what started out with some real promise, even if flawed.

Orgs are ruled by fear, not reason. Punishment has replaced enhancement.

RogerB

[wiseman_of_the_watchtower]

This is exaclty what is happening in 2009/2010. HCO and SNR HCO are in complete control. To a more extreme degree, CMO operates entirely on aggression and fear. They aren't part of HCO, but they all operate like ethics officers on steroids.

And what does CMO demand? MONEY. in 2005, it was the "Congresses". In 2007 it was the "Basics" All through that, you had IAS stat pushes, and Library donation stat pushes.

And you can't talk back to CMO: they are supposed to be the same as LRH, when you speak with them.

So Qual is not going to correct this today. They stayed up too late selling _____ yesterday. If they do, there actions will be violently stopped by CMO tomorrow.

-WMWT

In my view, based on personal experience in the trenches, the reason there has been a chronic failure to self correct in the orgs is that the "corrective action" designated in the org board structure as being in the Qual Div got usurped by the Dept. of Ethics.

I don't know if you've particularly noticed, but virtually all efforts in the org to correct anything and render "severe reality adjustments" et al are done via ethics "handlings" or otherwise under the threat and duress of ethics handlings..

Wrong action, wrong who to be doing it!

Originally when the Awareness Levels and related org board structure based on it were released, Awareness Level 14 and Department 14 were named REVIEW. It later got changed to "CORRECTION."

That of course is a screw-up because it omits the vital step of the inspection that would comprise a review in order to adequately and accurately evaluate if and/or what ought be corrected.

Department of staff training was ?is? there in Qual also . . . and this would enable corrections and upgrading of staff performance . . . . if it were allowed to happen instead of the incessant hitting with ethics handlings and bullyings by idiots from "management" strata above and other Product Officer demands and stupid interference posing as "management."

As an organism, the orgs long ago ceased being able to think, analyze and do the right and proper corrective actions. It all went out the window when the Department of I&R and Ethics Officer posts along with HCO were given too much power . . . or that those functions were usurped by idiots or those whose sense of improvement and betterment were grossly "warped" (to say the least).

This loss of ability to think and order org affairs in an optimum manner occurred in about 1966 after the implementation of I&R and Eth Officer functions in orgs.

Today, orgs cannot think. Nor can they analyze with a view to upgrading of performance . . . they can only react and punish.

And that, unfortunately, is a sad commentary on what started out with some real promise, even if flawed.

Orgs are ruled by fear, not reason. Punishment has replaced enhancement.

RogerB

[Mark A. Baker]

In my view, based on personal experience in the trenches, the reason there has been a chronic failure to self correct in the orgs is that the "corrective action" designated in the org board structure as being in the Qual Div got usurped by the Dept. of Ethics.

I don't know if you've particularly noticed, but virtually all efforts in the org to correct anything and render "severe reality adjustments" et al are done via ethics "handlings" or otherwise under the threat and duress of ethics handlings..

Wrong action, wrong who to be doing it!

Originally when the Awareness Levels and related org board structure based on it were released, Awareness Level 14 and Department 14 were named REVIEW. It later got changed to "CORRECTION."

That of course is a screw-up because it omits the vital step of the inspection that would comprise a review in order to adequately and accurately evaluate if and/or what ought be corrected.

Department of staff training was ?is? there in Qual also . . . and this would enable corrections and upgrading of staff performance . . . . if it were allowed to happen instead of the incessant hitting with ethics handlings and bullyings by idiots from "management" strata above and other Product Officer demands and stupid interference posing as "management."

As an organism, the orgs long ago ceased being able to think, analyze and do the right and proper corrective actions. It all went out the window when the Department of I&R and Ethics Officer posts along with HCO were given too much power . . . or that those functions were usurped by idiots or those whose sense of improvement and betterment were grossly "warped" (to say the least).

This loss of ability to think and order org affairs in an optimum manner occurred in about 1966 after the implementation of I&R and Eth Officer functions in orgs.

Today, orgs cannot think. Nor can they analyze with a view to upgrading of performance . . . they can only react and punish.

And that, unfortunately, is a sad commentary on what started out with some real promise, even if flawed.

Orgs are ruled by fear, not reason. Punishment has replaced enhancement.

RogerB

Excellent point. Couple this to the associated problems of inappropriate "corrections" ordered by seniors and the failure & unwillingness of seniors themselves to get corrected and you have the basic formula for a high per centage of the Co$ major internal f*ck ups.


Mark A. Baker

[Veda]

Could it be that Scientology is, essentially, the way it's supposed to be, and that Scientology followed a "be, do, have," sequence, and ultimately resulted in monuments to L. Ron Hubbard, just as was envisioned by Hubbard in 1938.

But that may be too much for the faithful to confront.

Could Scientology be the way it is because the founder had a hidden agenda, and that hidden agenda was/is built into the mental-healing-coated personality cult that he established?

Better not think about it.

[phoenix]

Wow,
thanks for some excellant replies.
It looks to me as though there never has actually been a 'command line' from the Qual division to the whole org.
and yet this is what Ron speaks of as the orgs being able to correct themselves.

I think this is somehow an ommision.

and yet is utterly the main outpoint we see now....

most complaints of scientology.... seem to stem from this.

It is very easy for us to now sit here and simly nattter that ... oh its so bad...
and Ron is an idiot and ego and yes yes yes....
but just for a moment here we MAY actually have some folks talking the same language to 'create a new civilisation'

so on a positive note....
perhaps the 'FREE ZONE' orgs would implement and ACTUAL line from QUAL to SOURCE.

and of course that is above ... ethics control ... ie 'legalistic' enforcement.

cheers
Ian