Reincarnation

[thefiredragon]

I went to the library the other day and read almost all books they had about reincarnation.
I know, that some of you who had a bad experience in Scientology do not believe in past lives.
But I talked to the wife of my friend (she is a psychic) and she told me that people who believe in reincarnation, will reincarnate and remember it. And others will forget that they ever lived before.
BTW,she is not a Scientologist.
I have a daughter who is almost three and she talks about her past lives all the time. None of my other kids do the same.
I told that to pastor in Christian Church and he freaked out. Then I talked about it in Bible class and I;ve been told some weird things.I posted it in one of my posts

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=15603

Last week I went to the same Church that my soon to be ex husband used to atend and had a weird conversation.

My bible school theachers ‘ name starts with L and P. (there are two of them)
Me: I’m thinking of leaving this Church but I will bring kids here once in a while if you don't mind. You guys don’t even consider a possibility of people being able to communicate with spirits and reincarnate.
P: Why is that,when we talk about religion,we think we can choose what to believe. Why do we think it’s O>K to pick different things from different religions and put them together?
Me: I think,you guys should be more open mined.Why do you all think,if a person can communicate with spirits,there is something evil about it?
L: Because the Bible says so. Satan is very powerfull. He tremends people.
Me: Come on,guys! My 2year-old daughter keeps talking about her past lifes and a few weeks ago I told you a story how she was communicating with me before she was even born.She also told me how she died.She said ,a man in China shot her from the gun when she was 4.She felt down and died.
L: I believe she saw that pics.The question is who put them there?
Me: Come on,guys!Are you trying to say that my daughter is possessed by a demon? (A few weeks ago somebody already said something like that to me in Church)
L:I’m not saying she is posesed but Satan is trying to control her and you. He can see your past and he can make you to believe you’re talking with spirits when really you are talking to him.
Me: come on,guys! Are you serious? There are so many psychics around that can communicate to the
Spirits
Then they gave me a lecture about a woman from the bible who was able to see the future and about what happened to her.

I mean...I don't know what to say..I did not say anything and just left.
Feel very bad though. They gave a lot of Christmas presents to my kids when
I needed them but I can't keep pretending to be a part of a group that I'm not.

[La La Lou Lou]

You cannot believe what you are told to believe.

These 'experts' don't know their own religion.

The Bible was written over a long period, the early part talks as if there is more than one god, and that the Hebrew god is the god Yaveh, not that there is only one god. It also tells you that you mustn't mix fibres, yes poly-cotton is against the Bible. You mustn't eat shellfish and you can't have sex with your daughter or someone of the same sex. Are Astrologers still bad people even when they follow a star to Bethlehem? When David and Jonathan kissed it didn't stop god from loving David. Why was it OK for Lot's daughters to get him drunk and have sex with him, when it wasn't for Lot's wife to turn round and look behind her. What has Sodom and Gomorrah got to do with gay relationships, nothing it's about a group of men who wanted to rape a man that Lot was giving hospitality to, not making love but mass rape because he was an outsider. How could the slaughter of Cananites and Philistines be approved by the god of love.

It's an interesting book but no one accepts the whole thing. It does contradict itself and reason, so people pick and mix as they choose. The Bible doesn't say that slavery is wrong, but it does say you cant wear poly-cotton shirts.

Carry on thinking for yourself, girl.

[thefiredragon]

Yeah..
I told to the bible class teacher about something I watched on TV and he told me he never watches TV,does not even own one..

[Challenge]

I had a similar conversation with the Catholic Priest from whom I was receiving instruction in their belief.
I had married a Catholic ( a Jesuit) who insisted on sending or daughters to Catholic schools. I thought the Catholic school system provided a much much better education than the Public schools ( of the time and location), so I wanted to join the Church.
I mentioned the idea of having lived before, or of consecutive lifetimes, and that was the end of my career in Catholicism. I kept asking "what do you mean, then, "immortal soul"?
It got very frosty. The answer was not forthcoming, but it was something like " we live in Jesus forever".
Oh.
It looks to me like people get buried in boxes so that they can be taken up to Heaven in their box. More convenient, doncha know, than having a bunch of putrid remains mucking up the place. I geddit.

Challenge

[anonomog]

Thefiredragon,
We are all on our individual spiritual journey whether we choose to investigate it further or not.

I believe no one can prescribe a rigid spiritual path to anyone but themselves, spirits which are ephemeral and eternal find it uncomfortable to conform to a path that is wrong for that spirit. So why try?

Find your own path, you really don't need to follow anyone else or anyone else's idea of spiritual growth. Why would anyone else know what is best for you? They are just flawed humans like everyone else.

Have faith in your own knowing and if you feel happy and comforted that Jesus is a hamster with pink and purple striped fur, then take comfort in that. If it soothes your soul, what does it matter what anyone else thinks?

I just advise that confronting individuals with views that they believe are heretical is just going to cause drama and not be helpful to you or anyone else.
Why do you want to belong to groups but go out of your way to be so antagonistic to the group's belief systems that you are rejected?

[thefiredragon]

Yeah.I talked to so many different people about their believes they all had a different opinion and then I read something somewhere that a spirit,after he
dies has a choice what to do. Most of the time his decission is baced on his
"believes" that he learned when he had a body..
I want to reincornate again. I think,it's cool.

[AnonKat]

I mean...I don't know what to say..I did not say anything and just left.
Feel very bad though. They gave a lot of Christmas presents to my kids when
I needed them but I can't keep pretending to be a part of a group that I'm not.

Search for comunities you feel welcome in.

My Advice: Make a Youtube Befriend this member.

http://www.youtube.com/user/discoverngc

[TheBellMare]

Hi firedragon, courageous post. I agree, yeah, maybe there are past lives. I think there are a whole lot of things out there (or in there) that we don't understand -- yet.

Don't worry about the Christians telling you Satan is tryin' to git ya. That too is just their agenda. They are kind of fear-driven. Sounds like you are attending a fundamentalist Christian Church. I remember when the Southern Baptist lady just across the hall told me I shouldn't study geology because "Fossils Are The Sport of The Devil". Yeah right, give me a break. These entire mountain ranges then, this earth beneath our feet "The Sport of the Devil?" Sort of contradicts the book of Genesis where God made the earth, ya know?

I have known some really kind, loving fundamentalist Christians, but the whole movement only goes so far, ya know? Here it is in the Bible so it must be true. . .?? (Sort of like LRH saying, I said it, and only I have the handle on truth, therefore it's true.) Hogwash. I personally believe a person keeps searching for truth their whole life.

Find a different Christian Church. Personally I found the Unity Church of Christianity to be pretty accepting, caring and open minded. Is there one in your area?

I think past lives need to be corroborated by evidence, and tons of evidence. Does your daughter remember specifics -- names of towns, people, dates, etc? Can that be separated from something she may have seen in a movie, that is, do you know what movies she has seen since she was born? Does she remember the language? In all the stuff you read, what kind of evidence was presented? I have not read as much as you have on the subject.

My husband had a past life experience that he remembered in auditing. Unfortunately it did not include specific names, places, etc., just a strong feeling and a remembered death incident.

All the stuff written in Have You Lived Before This Life (LRH) was not corroborated by any evidence so I discounted it all as crap. LRH was not much of a scientist.

And what about all the people who remember that they were Napoleon or King Louie the 16th in a past life? How do you get past that one -- either it's all a false memory --- or King Louie had a really split personality and when he got guillotined it really fragmented, hmmm that's an interesting phenomenon. . . See what I mean. Real past lives would be hard to prove.

The way I look at it is this; there are a number of things that we as a species did not understand in the past (fire, the wheel, metallurgy, a round planet, astronomy, lightning and electricity, chemistry, biology, radio waves, are examples). These are just physical phenomena that were studied, finally understood, corroborated with evidence, and found to be useful. Some other things which we as a species believed in the past were studied equally, but were not corroborated with evidence, and not found useful (sea dragons, magic, alchemy, a flat earth, witchcraft are examples), and those have gone by the wayside.

So I think we are on a path of understanding things in our universe and we look for evidence and set up experiments to understand it. I am curious what will be the outcome of controlled experiments to determine whether or not a person has multiple lives. That could be quite useful. However, until then -- and it could be centuries before that is proven, if ever -- it is an interesting concept.

And I am REALLY PISSED that LRH took advantage of people and hijacked the threme of this simple human curiosity and simple human search for understanding just to fill his crazy con man pockets with cash

Best wishes and hug your daughter for me. I don't think she should be invalidated because she thinks she lived before, and you should not be invalidated by the Christians because you think she might be talking about some kind of phenomena that we as a species just don't understand yet.

[AnonKat]

I had a similar conversation with the Catholic Priest from whom I was receiving instruction in their belief.
I had married a Catholic ( a Jesuit) who insisted on sending or daughters to Catholic schools. I thought the Catholic school system provided a much much better education than the Public schools ( of the time and location), so I wanted to join the Church.
I mentioned the idea of having lived before, or of consecutive lifetimes, and that was the end of my career in Catholicism. I kept asking "what do you mean, then, "immortal soul"?
It got very frosty. The answer was not forthcoming, but it was something like " we live in Jesus forever".
Oh.
It looks to me like people get buried in boxes so that they can be taken up to Heaven in their box. More convenient, doncha know, than having a bunch of putrid remains mucking up the place. I geddit.

Challenge

Keep what helps you, Get rid of what holds you back.

[La La Lou Lou]

We'll all find out in the end, or not if we no longer exist.

But if it's the latter you wont be there to worry about it anyway.

Live this life, that's the key. No one has brought back film of Saint Peter at the pearly gates or black eyed girls in gardens with milk running in streams or implant stations or anything else. Nor could they, these are simply earth bound attempts to picture something that is purely abstract, a contradiction in terms. So why bother talking about it. Just get on with life and look after yourself and the people you care about. Do what you can to help people around you, live with love. Let the 'isms fight amongst themselves.