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Thread: Bill Frank's story about brainwashing (thread merge)

  1. #241


    Quote Originally Posted by Synthia View Post
    I believe they were talking about David Mayo, no?
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  2. #242
    Crusader Sindy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnonyMary View Post
    oops, better I go and have that 1st cup of coffee. Apologises
    "Scientology: The only game in the universe where the rapist is your ethics officer." - HelluvaHoax

    "Yes Scientology at this point is nothing but its own funeral. You might as well leave early and beat the traffic. " - Thrak

  3. #243
    Gold Meritorious Patron
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    I have moved


    Thanks for posting this Bill and also, welcome to the Board!

    I consider this information very valuable, especially for those of us who are trying to decipher this mess.


  4. #244
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    Mr Franks,

    Why now? What made you decide to speak up about this?

    I do welcome any info on how we were brainwashed. The info about O/W's is quite astounding for me. Little by little if we can take all those lies fed to us and replace with the truth can only help us.

  5. #245
    Angelic Poster TG1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daisy View Post
    Mr Franks, Why now? What made you decide to speak up about this?
    Good question. Why now, Bill?

  6. #246
    Patron with Honors chuckbeatty's Avatar
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    Hi Bill,

    It's amazing and incredible to hear you posting.

    This point about ARC Break causing blows, as the most fundamental reason, fits in with my thoughts that the LIC, and L4BR, and Green Form, Green Form 40, the repair lists of Scientology, are simply WAY MORE helpful, than the focus on False Purpose Rundown Auditing for 'evil pruposes' which after 1982-1983 became the focus again.

    This is a huge important tech idea you bring up.

    Also, the original "Book of Case Remedies," written in 1964 by LRH, ALSO says roughly what you say above Bill.

    Pages 21 to 27 speak of the pc being given wins in auditing, and that "blows" occur simply by reason of not having enough wins. And what causes the lack of wins are ARCXs, Problems and Overts, the rudiments.

    To me, the LIC and C/S 53, the Green Form 40, it you look at what the Case Crackers at the FSO use to "crack" cases, it is just assessment of the main large correction lists, and they really do (or did) find the right bypassed charge, and handle it. And overts and "evil purposes" (which later in 1982-1983 the whole damn focused False Purpose Rundown campaign, with the "red coat" trainees at Int which happened then) became a serious control thing like in line.

    I'd be interested if the people who had to deal with the 1982 vintage LRH traffic at R Tech Comps then under the Senior C/S Int office, how they dealt with that 1982 traffic about the "security checking for false and evil purposes" which has since then DOMINATED how the auditing is done on the RPF. "Security Checking for False and evil purposes" IS the guts of the style of auditing on the RPF. LRH did reiterate that that was to be the style of auditing on the RPF, he wrote, in 1982ish.

    And during my 7 years on the RPF, my subjective perception of those around me who "graduated" (I never graduated, I would agree this "ARC Break" LRH admission to you and David Mayo, I'd admit that the "ARC" reason is subjectively "true for me", when I chose and did route out), but the graduates to me looked a bit artificial. They looked like they were putting on a show, as ever so slightly under the surface. Particularly, on the RPF today, the big auditing rundown one does is the "Truth Rundown" and due to the situation, if one's superiors in the Sea Org treated one like shit, and ARC broke the hell out of one, and if one uttered some "black propaganda" about one's "well intentioned superiors" or had one uttered some "black propaganda" about any of the "well intentioned units" in the Sea Org, even IF those superiors and units were indeed acting viciously and irrationally, then you are on the RPF, you get all your uttered "black propaganda" "rolled back" (traced back to when you said it and when you took those black propaganda viewpoints), and the Truth Rundown is the auditing procedure you do as the primary auditing rundown today, and you have to reverse your black propaganda "viewpoints" of those superiors and units, and the "tech" is the finding of your BIG overts that relate to those superiors or units, and tracing it back to the evil purposes and "prior confusions" at the very bottom, down the pasttrack.

    So in effect, in the final history of the tech, as LRH refined it in his final years, he tied in the "prior confusion" underneath the evil purpose, underneath the wholetrack chain of overts, on the RPF for the RPFers, relating to the RPFer's black propaganda utterances against superiors and superior units of the Sea Org who ARC broke the HELL out of one!!!!!

    And THAT is the Truth Rundown procedure, which to me, arguably, is the final most correct target for brainwashing.

    So, subjectively, to me, this revelation of yours is RIGHT ON THE MONEY.

    I really hope someone leaks the Truth Rundown issues into the public domain.
    They are candidates, including the circumstances of how those issues are being applied, for actual brainwashing. The people who graduate the RPF, are truly "broken" people, in my subjective opinion, today.

    Anyways, I think the 1991 edition of the Book of Base Remedies (written by LRH in 1964) is the closest publicly to his admission he wrote to you and David Mayo.

    Thanks so much Bill.

    I would very much like to interview you about your hindsight views of the executive style of Sea Org officers, and if that style is positive or negative, and if you think there is any possibility that Scientology administratively is redeemable.

    It's truly amazing to see you posting Bill!

    Thankyou so much.

    Chuck Beatty
    one of the old Int Training Org staff, when you were ED ITO, and I remember the LRH traffic even then, to you, as CO ITO, from CO ITO you rose then to ED Int. The history in your head deserves a book!
    412-260-1170 Pittsburgh
    Last edited by chuckbeatty; 27th February 2011 at 07:17 PM.
    Chuck Beatty
    ex Sea Org (1975-2003)

    "I think a lot of my father's stuff doesn't work. So I false report whenever I need to. Personally, I think my father's crazy."
    - Quentin Hubbard Class 12 Scientologist, statement to Dennis Erlich

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  8. #247
    Gold Meritorious Sponsor HelluvaHoax!'s Avatar
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    While it is MORE sane to say people blow from ARC-Xs than to say they blow because of O/W's......that is not really the total picture either.


    What if someone escaped a concentration camp?

    Was it because they were ARC-Xen?

    I don't think so.

    That is a very odd, culty way to look at things.

    They escaped because they were being tortured, terrorized and killed.

    What's wrong with English?

    So why did Scientologists "blow"?

    The first part of the answer is THEY DID NOT BLOW.

    They escaped.

    And they didn't escape because of their "case" (ArcX, O/W, etc...)

    They escaped because they became smart enough or strong enough to escape.

    Or thru sheer desperate self-preservation.

    That ain't no ArcX.

    That's sanity.

    Scientology literally saved my life! Without Ron's books I would have frozen to death!!! (see avatar)

    Scientology in one word? HelluvaHoax!

    I never felt as free as when I freed myself from "Total Freedom".

    For offended Scientologists reading this blasphemy about L. Ron Hubbard---my apologies for talking about real life without lying to you, like Scientology, with goo-goo theta-talk. I know you don't have a floating needle right now. You're not supposed to.

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  10. #248
    Silver Meritorious Patron Ladybird's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TG1 View Post
    Good question. Why now, Bill?
    I can't speak for Bill, but my answer is: "Why not now"?

    I have posted tons of stuff and maybe Bill has too, but often it seems nobody reads it or remembers it. Plus some of us have been villified and black PRed by "OSA"

    Just because some people have 10's of thousands of posts does not make them "experts". Just because some supposed "experts" call real ex-SO damaged goods doesn't mean we shouldn't be listened to. Funny how it is mostly ex Sea Org who get called loons. I am sure there is some truth to that, but there are very few of us still standing and willing to speak out. Many of the EX-Sea Org I know are too afraid and too devastated to speak out.

    It is always a good idea to consider the source of the information before you believe any thing. Scientology and L.Ron Hubbard would be a case for that point.

    [Extract from "Information Disease: Have Cults created a New Mental
    Illness?" by Flo Conway and Jim Siegelman. Science Digest January 1982

    "A very effective thought control technique could also be worked out from
    Scientology, which could be used to make individuals into willing slaves."
    -L Ron Hubbard

    [description of the authors' research into the long term effects of
    involvement with various cults]

    Two groups in particular showed signs of inflicting the most
    severe physical, mental and emotional harm on their members: the Hare
    Krishna and the Church of Scientology. Among all groups, Krishna and
    Scientology tied with the Unification Church in reports of physical
    deprivation. Their members reported getting the least sleep per night and
    having the most deficient daily diet.
    The rituals of the Church of Scientology bear little resemblance
    to those of any other cult. With its extensive program of "training
    regimens" and expensive "auditing" counseling, Scientology operates
    successfully as both religion and mass-marketed therapy. According to
    those who responded to our survey, however, Scientology's may be the most
    debilitating set of rituals of any cult in America. Onetime Scientologists
    who answered our questionnaire reported that it took them, on the average,
    more than two years (26 months) before they felt fully rehabilitated- more
    than *twice* the time of those from other major cults [Hare Krishna: 11.1
    months, Divine Light Mission: 12.3 months].

    Moreover, former Scientologists surpassed all others in reported
    incidents of physical punishment while in the group (35 percent) and, upon
    departure, they claimed the highest rates of sexual dysfunction (22
    percent), violent outbursts (28 percent) [average is 14 percent],
    hallucinations and delusions (28 percent) [average is also 14 percent] and
    suicidal or self-destructive tendencies (44 percent) [average is 21%]. On
    average, former Scientologists surveyed reported more than *twice* the
    combined negative effects of all the other cult groups.

    Ironically, although claiming the most severe long-term effects,
    former Scientologists surveyed reported the *lowest* total of hours
    per week spent in ritual and indoctrination. This apparent discrepancy
    seems to support opinions we have expressed earlier that, in combination,
    Scientology's training regimens and "auditing" counseling sessions
    (conducted on an E-meter, a kind of crude lie detector) may have an
    intensifying and compounding effect on the nervous system that goes beyond
    that of simpler cult rituals. And that, *hour for hour, Scientology's
    techniques may be more than twice as damaging as those of any other major
    cult in America!* In our view, this could be a vital direction for further
    research by scientists working in the field of neurophysiology.

    "The overall impact? Devastating!" wrote one ex-member. "I still
    tend to view the world in Scientological terms: 'Truth is only an
    illusion.' 'People are robots.' 'People are basically insane and dangerous.'"
    Another was even more bitter: "The only thing I got out of this scam was
    deep suicidal depression coinciding with the fear of death within five
    years after separation. We were told that ninety percent of all 'refund
    cases' eventually commit suicide."
    "There is nothing as wild in the books of Man as will probably happen here on will happen and be allowed to happen simply because all this is so incredible that nobody will even think of stopping it until it is far, far too late"~LRH in "A History of Man"

  11. #249
    Gold Meritorious Sponsor HelluvaHoax!'s Avatar
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    And it is ludicrous to believe that Scientology either:

    1) Knows the reason people blow.

    2) Could do anything about it even if they did know the reason.

    EXAMPLE (true one): Before I left the Sea Org I got a review and it ended up with the Green Form.

    'Continuously Committing Present Time Overts' is what read--and was taken up with the L & N "WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO PREVENT?"

    My LFBD F/N item was: "Restimulation from Scientology".

    Now what, technophiles?


    ------everything above this is true------

    ------everything below this is an Ideal Hoax-----

    I'd like to indicate that your item is
    "Restimulation from Scientology"

    Wow, yeah! That's it alright.

    Well, I'll just turn this into the C/S and
    get the next standard Scientology handling for that.

    Uhhhh, did you f*cking understand
    what I just said?!


    Scientology literally saved my life! Without Ron's books I would have frozen to death!!! (see avatar)

    Scientology in one word? HelluvaHoax!

    I never felt as free as when I freed myself from "Total Freedom".

    For offended Scientologists reading this blasphemy about L. Ron Hubbard---my apologies for talking about real life without lying to you, like Scientology, with goo-goo theta-talk. I know you don't have a floating needle right now. You're not supposed to.

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  13. #250
    Crusader SweetnessandLight's Avatar
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    Sunny Southern Teegeeack

    Smile Big hugs to thread posters!

    Thanks everybody! This is all good useful information and valid viewpoints. I know that this discussion is going to help a lot of people to understand and heal more...

    Keep it up!
    Yes, you can fly, but first you have to break out of that cocoon. You are capable of self rescue at all times. "Every blade of grass has its own special angel watching over it and whispering, 'grow...grow'." -The Talmud "I am still determined to be cheerful and happy, in whatever situation I may be, for I have learned from experience that the greater part of our happiness or misery depends upon our disposition, and not upon our circumstances." -Martha Washington

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