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Thread: Bill Frank's story about brainwashing (thread merge)

  1. #251
    Crusader Sindy's Avatar
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    Oh my goodness. It's just so basic.

    Bottom line is that people don't like paying an organization to treat them like crap, mishandle them, degrade and invalidate them or treat them like second class citizens. They didn't become part of a religion to be lorded over.

    In the real world, that's why they have "Customer Care Reps" and "Suggestion Boxes" and "How are we Doing? Surveys" and "Client Retention Programs" and, and, and.....

    When I tried to leave aol (7 years ago), they actually made it impossible. I still use aol. They gave it to me for free! They begged me and gave me the red carpet to stay.

    If aol had used the church model they would have blamed me for their shitty service and made me pay for an upgrade that didn't do anything while they had covert agents call all the other Internet service providers to tell them what a deadbeat I am.

    The C of S has horrible "customer care" built right into the tech. It is a joke. Forget about O/Ws and ARCX...It's just common f--king sense.
    "Scientology: The only game in the universe where the rapist is your ethics officer." - HelluvaHoax

    "Yes Scientology at this point is nothing but its own funeral. You might as well leave early and beat the traffic. " - Thrak

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  3. #252
    Crusader Div6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HelluvaHoax! View Post
    And it is ludicrous to believe that Scientology either:

    1) Knows the reason people blow.

    2) Could do anything about it even if they did know the reason.

    EXAMPLE (true one): Before I left the Sea Org I got a review and it ended up with the Green Form.

    'Continuously Committing Present Time Overts' is what read--and was taken up with the L & N "WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO PREVENT?"

    My LFBD F/N item was: "Restimulation from Scientology".

    Now what, technophiles?

    Whadyagonnadonow?

    [CENTER]------everything above this is true------

    Well, the instructions on the XGF show something like this:
    First, L/N - What are you trying to prevent? and R3R the item out. Second, 2wc committing continuous overts to EP.

    We might have to do a "who or what would represent Restimulation from Scientology" to get the item to erase.
    "Deception is the ethics of war." - John Singleton Mosby

  4. #253
    Crusader lkwdblds's Avatar
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    Default Nice summary of the basics!

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthia View Post
    Oh my goodness. It's just so basic.

    Bottom line is that people don't like paying an organization to treat them like crap, mishandle them, degrade and invalidate them or treat them like second class citizens. They didn't become part of a religion to be lorded over.

    In the real world, that's why they have "Customer Care Reps" and "Suggestion Boxes" and "How are we Doing? Surveys" and "Client Retention Programs" and, and, and.....

    When I tried to leave aol (7 years ago), they actually made it impossible. I still use aol. They gave it to me for free! They begged me and gave me the red carpet to stay.

    If aol had used the church model they would have blamed me for their shitty service and made me pay for an upgrade that didn't do anything while they had covert agents call all the other Internet service providers to tell them what a deadbeat I am.

    The C of S has horrible "customer care" built right into the tech. It is a joke. Forget about O/Ws and ARCX...It's just common f--king sense.
    Synthia, very nice summary of the theme of this thread. It cuts right to the heart of the topic of why people leave an organization!

    Nevertheless, in the case of C of S, there are so many interesting and incredible side issues present and it is full of anecdotes involving LRH, Franks, Mayo, DM and others.

    To me understanding these anecdotes is interesting and entertaining but most of all it is informative and yields understanding. For those of us who were taken in by C of S and invested huge amounts of our time, energy and money to their cause, it is very helpful to really understand what scheme was used upon us to illicit so much of our support.

    C of S seems to be imploding now and as the dust settles, the more we can understand the phenomena of what took place, the better off everyone will be, both the perpetrators, the victims and just observers who mainly want to understand what this furor is all about.
    Lakey aka Gary
    "I have never understood why it is "greed" to want to keep the money you've earned but not greed to want to take someone else's money."
    -Thomas Sowell

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  6. #254
    Patron Meritorious Ulf K. Maier's Avatar
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    Default The real Why

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthia View Post
    Oh my goodness. It's just so basic.

    Bottom line is that people don't like paying an organization to treat them like crap, mishandle them, degrade and invalidate them or treat them like second class citizens. They didn't become part of a religion to be lorded over.

    In the real world, that's why they have "Customer Care Reps" and "Suggestion Boxes" and "How are we Doing? Surveys" and "Client Retention Programs" and, and, and.....

    When I tried to leave aol (7 years ago), they actually made it impossible. I still use aol. They gave it to me for free! They begged me and gave me the red carpet to stay.

    If aol had used the church model they would have blamed me for their shitty service and made me pay for an upgrade that didn't do anything while they had covert agents call all the other Internet service providers to tell them what a deadbeat I am.

    The C of S has horrible "customer care" built right into the tech. It is a joke. Forget about O/Ws and ARCX...It's just common f--king sense.
    I agree, but I'll go ya one more basic:

    People who are upset (ARCXen) with Scientology ALL have something in common:

    THEY WERE PROMISED SOMETHING WHICH WAS NEVER DELIVERED.

    I'll go even further and point out that:

    THERE WAS NEVER NEVER ANY INTENTION TO DELIVER WHAT WAS PROMISED, AS IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE TO DO SO.

    Why?

    THE "TECH" OF MAKING HOMO SAPIENS INTO HOMO NOVIS IS A CALCULATED SCAM, WHICH CANNOT LIVE UP TO ITS HYPE.
    IT IS, HOWEVER, EFFECTIVE AT MAKING WILLING SLAVES OF PEOPLE, WHICH WAS ALWAYS ITS GOAL, AS PER HUBBARD'S ADMISSIONS.


    "What a lot of people don't realize is that Scientology is black magic that is just spread out over a long time period. To perform black magic generally takes a few hours or, at most, a few weeks. But in Scientology it's stretched out over a lifetime, and so you don't see it. Black magic is the inner core of Scientology --and it is probably the only part of Scientology that really works." Ron DeWolf, AKA L. Ron Hubbard Jr.

    I have yet to see or hear of someone disproving what Nibs said.

    So, Mr Franks, are you still intent on salvaging the parts of the "tech" that work?
    If so, you will meet with unmitigated opposition.
    Ulf


    @OSA: I am not auditing you... THIS is the session.

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  8. #255
    Gold Meritorious Sponsor HelluvaHoax!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Div6 View Post
    Well, the instructions on the XGF show something like this:
    First, L/N - What are you trying to prevent? and R3R the item out. Second, 2wc committing continuous overts to EP.

    We might have to do a "who or what would represent Restimulation from Scientology" to get the item to erase.


    Okay, I have plenty of hours on account.

    Let's do the standard tech handling you have C/Sed me for:

    1. R3R the item out. After dozens of hours of R3R no basic was found and nothing blew. The auditor then asked me "DID IT ERASE ALREADY?" I said: "How is restim from Scn going to erase moron when you are still giving me Scn commands?"

    2. 2wc committing continuous overts to EP. Dozens more hours were spent 2-Way-COMing about how it is an overt to be part of Scientology or to allow someone to handle my mind with Scientology. That didn't go so well either.

    3. L & N: "Who or what would represent Restimulation from Scientology?" We listed that too.


    L & N

    WHO OR WHAT WOULD REPRESENT
    RESTIMULATION FROM SCIENTOLOGY?

    You, my auditor LF

    These commands you keep giving me LF

    Your senior Ron Hubbard LF

    The tech that doesn't work LF

    The half million dollars I lost on this con game LF

    The fact that you have threatened and terrorized me telling me I would die
    and suffer endless eternal anguish if I didn't buy more hours and keep up
    this torture until I felt good about the fact that Scientology is making me insane.

    LFBD F/N ---Item Indicated.


    Oh well, I guess it's back to the C/S to come up with the next standard action that will totally handle all this restim from the previous actions?
    ________________________

    Scientology literally saved my life! Without Ron's books I would have frozen to death!!! (see avatar)

    Scientology in one word? HelluvaHoax!

    I never felt as free as when I freed myself from "Total Freedom".

    For offended Scientologists reading this blasphemy about L. Ron Hubbard---my apologies for talking about real life without lying to you, like Scientology, with goo-goo theta-talk. I know you don't have a floating needle right now. You're not supposed to.

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  10. #256
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    Quote Originally Posted by Div6 View Post
    Well, the instructions on the XGF show something like this:
    First, L/N - What are you trying to prevent? and R3R the item out. Second, 2wc committing continuous overts to EP.

    We might have to do a "who or what would represent Restimulation from Scientology" to get the item to erase.
    that's funny as hell

    If retards had an official language it would be scilon

  11. #257
    Silver Meritorious Patron Arthur Dent's Avatar
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    Hello Bill,
    You've had many gracious welcomes here and now mine is among them.

    Your original post is really counter to the lynchpin of what is holding, I'd say, most of the active or semi-active scientologists in the church and making them pay the big bucks. With any luck it will cause many more blows!

    It would be of much value to link the continuity of the diminutive one's behavior stemming from 30 years ago to present. More about your imprisonment at Int, violations of human rights and if there were, specifically, any physical attacks to yourself or others may help to do this.

    There are lots of subjects to address and hopefully you will start other threads as well.

    This thread has well over 7000 hits so far. That should tell you something! There are many lurkers out there as well as members. This board is an amazing wealth of information, history, insights and stories of the church and its operations. Your posts will add to that wealth. I hope you will benefit from its healing as well as from contributing to it.
    Arthur Dent.



    http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=16696
    http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?24109



    Lurkers, hate to disappoint, but it really is a cult. Sorry.

  12. #258
    Crusader ChuckNorrisCutsMyLawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synthia View Post
    Oh my goodness. It's just so basic.

    Bottom line is that people don't like paying an organization to treat them like crap, mishandle them, degrade and invalidate them or treat them like second class citizens. They didn't become part of a religion to be lorded over.

    In the real world, that's why they have "Customer Care Reps" and "Suggestion Boxes" and "How are we Doing? Surveys" and "Client Retention Programs" and, and, and.....

    When I tried to leave aol (7 years ago), they actually made it impossible. I still use aol. They gave it to me for free! They begged me and gave me the red carpet to stay.

    If aol had used the church model they would have blamed me for their shitty service and made me pay for an upgrade that didn't do anything while they had covert agents call all the other Internet service providers to tell them what a deadbeat I am.

    The C of S has horrible "customer care" built right into the tech. It is a joke. Forget about O/Ws and ARCX...It's just common f--king sense.
    And even if it was the O/Ws and ARCX,

    so what?

    It was never anything more than a con game to begin with. I can't think of a simple aspect of Scientology that was not implemented strictly to make the cult look like something it's not, not a single one.

    It's all about building an illusion and brainwashing it's members into devoting their lives to continuing the illusion.

    The majority of people left in the cult do not want to understand what Scientology really is, or know what it is but are so messed up they would rather live in Hubbard's delusional role playing game than deal with reality. Those are the OT nerds who are still pretending they are something more than suckers.
    Yes lurkers you are not alone, everyone thinks Scientology is creepy, it's not just you

    http://www.mediacurves.com/Religion/...logy/Index.cfm

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  14. #259
    Patron with Honors chuckbeatty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnonyMary View Post
    I think this post is not by Bill Franks and that the last think Bill Franks would want is to be involved in anything scientology. The OP posted this on 3 separate threads with 3 variations in the title. Looks like spam to me.

    Pls read the below:

    Bill Franks to Dresher (from Lisa case)
    From: "Jeff Jacobsen" <cultxpt@ev1.net>
    Subject: Bill Franks to Dresher (from Lisa case)
    Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 05:14:09 -0000
    Message-ID: <vni491shfb7m1d@corp.supernews.com>

    Dresher & Dreshery P.C.

    23679 Calabasas Road
    PMB 338
    Calabasas, California 91302 - IS02

    I

    Dear Mr. Dresher, 23 May 02

    Thank you for your letter, I appreciate the opportunity to correct some of the assumptions that you have made.

    Firstly, you have thrown me into the category of anti-scientologist. I am not and have never been. I believe that Gerry Armstrong and others have made 2 life's career out of being an ex-scientologist. That does not apply to me and ample time has passed to prove my point. Since being asked to leave the church in late December of 1519 1 have made it a point., with an exception in the Christofferson case in Oregon in 85, to get on with things.

    Since receiving the subpoena, I have done a little research as to who my predecessors were and find the names of Hana Eltringham Whitfield and Jesse Prince. Both these two have made a living at being ex scientologists. I have tried to stay away from anything that smells of such a "jihad".

    Secondly, you are right in that I was served a subpoena, but you are wrong in saying that there was any "subterfuge" in this event. I was entrapped you might say and did not play any game so indicated. Factually, over the years, I have found myself coming to the Tampa/Clearwater area on business many many times- Your employers no doubt can vouch for this as about four years ago they chased me out of a public park opposite the Sand castle in Clearwater while sitting on the park bench making business calls.. Furthermore, when I received this subpoena, I was not a little pissed off and immediately drove to Dandees office to demand an explanation. As far as Greenway goes, I was discussing some real estate, or that is why I went to the restaurant I met her through Peter Alexander who I know you guys have a thing for, but believe me; It had no connection to whatever he is into.

    Mr. Drescher, when Scientology and I parted ways twenty some odd years ago, a decision was made by me to go in a decidedly opposite direction. Consequently, I have limited my associations to people of non-scientology backgrounds. I do not have an ax to grind and do not want to be around those who do.

    Finally, the subpoena was a surprise and indeed, I felt that I had been entrapped.

    Suggestions that I am a party to this hearing that you mention or the Liebreich case- are far from the truth.

    Ten years or so ago, I was subpoenaed in another one of these wacky suits.

    I believe it was against the church and also Miscavage personally. Bent Corydon had me subpoenaed and I was advised that there was no legal remedy other than showing up. So I did indeed show at the depositions, however, my behavior and actions at the sessions, adequately displayed what I thought of the suits and the chicanery that got me into that situation of forcibly having to testify. So, Mr. Drescher, in twenty-one years I have avoided this kind of activity, with the above noted exception, why would I want to get into this now. You guys have proved the point that it is a loser to go against you in court or otherwise. Plus, I have no personal interest in it-absolutely none.

    Thus I was not pulling your chain in my April note. Evidently, Dandar was telegraphing what he had in mind and had yet actually done- Furthermore., I have been so out of the church activities I do not know why I have been ordered to participate in this and I can't imagine what I could bring to the party.

    When I received this subpoena I eventually got some legal advice other than ken Dandaft. I have been advised that I am now under court order. Since I have been doing business in Florida and have for some time I come down there with some frequency.

    Do you have any suggestions? My indifference to this kind of movement against the church has been expressed dramatically over the years with my silence. I do not want to be involved.

    This threat of yours just gives me another problem on top of the other one that Dandar has presented me with. I know you won't do it, but why don't you just throw some money at this thing and make it go away so that we can get back to better things. I am sorry for this young woman's fate, but there is no way that the church killed her or participated in her death. I don't know much about this case but I wonder why someone would try to pull me into such a case when I know that standard church procedure, as I knew it, would not have allowed this to happen. And that is all that I would have to say pertinent to this matter.

    Bill Franks

    P.S. I hope that the address label on your envelope to me is not indicative that I have made it to your mailing list.

    www.lisamcpherson.org
    http://www.holysmoke.org/lm/lm249.htm

    ps: One can confirm with Bill Franks by contacting him through Facebook. He and his wife have Rinder as a friend. I may be wrong about him not wanting contact with anything scientology, now that I have seen facebook, but I still doubt he wrote this post and the 2 other identical ones with varying titles. He would just post it at Marty's blog if it really happened.
    http://www.facebook.com/people/Bill-...00001929720618
    The situation predicament is Scientology would absolutely WISH for all former senior people, particularly people with uncomplimentary firsthand accounts of LRH, Scientology wants senior ex members to NOT go public about the history they experienced around Hubbard or around any of the leaders of Scientology.

    Bill Franks, like any citizen, is free, at least here in America, unless he signed a legal gag and was paid and doesn't wish to face the legal problems that breaking that agreement might bring, Bill is FREE to tell his history.

    Bill Franks was the first Executive Director International. Approved by LRH.

    Bill Franks has a long Sea Org officer history. He had his ups and downs, mainly ups, the downs related to his subordinates living under some intense pressure due to Bills style of executiving at times.

    Bill has a mathematician methodical type of thinking, one time during one of his lecture/threat moments with me, he told me of his mathematics professor in university. Bill was/is extremely methodical. He really knew how to live as an "executive on LRH's lines." Bill was, I believe a junior officer (Lieutenant) in the US Army or Marines. He could be really tough sometimes, I had two incidents,which I posted about, but overall he was very meticulous in following administrative policy, and very adept at playing Sea Org management politics, getting things done for his area he was over. Bill was CO ITO when I was the OEC Course Sup.

    Bill knew how to get things done, despite all the internal Sea Org politics.

    I looked upon Bill is sort of the middle brother, to the three tough guy Sea Org officer trio, Alex Sibersky being the oldest brother, Bill the next brother, and Kerry Gleason being the youngest brother.

    There's a whole context and bonding of those 3 in Sea Org history.

    Bill was meticulous, he knew how to use LRH administrative orders to get things done for the position he held as a Sea Org officer, he knew how to use LRH's orders.

    He was part of the famous or infamous Boston Command Team, that LRH praises in one of the LRH ED's about 5.4Xing org production. That was Alex, him, Kerry, and David Light. My first wife now ex wife, Ann Halblom Beatty (Ann was the FBO Flag for years, later Commodore's Staff Aide Div 3, and she was Sea Org Reserves under Bill's first Exec Strata setup, a temporary Exec Strata setup that existed at the FLB in 1979, Ann bombed and was RPFed, Ann had been under Bill at Boston Org, Nancy Many was there at Boston Org also, and Ann I don't think Bill wanted Ann as Treasury Exec Int, but Ann held some Treasury or Reserves position while the CS-Aides were transitioning into oblivion and the new Exec Strata was forming, there in 1979-1981ish).

    Bill Franks was successul at LAD as CO.

    Bill had been a successful CO DC org for years, when DC org was one of the top 3 or 4 producing Class 4/5 Orgs on the planet in the 1970s. Jeannie Danilovich (Hare, Franks, Bogvad) Sonnenfeld was very pivotal to DC's success (as she was later to ITO's growth and success).

    When he was CO Int Training Org, after a stint in the RPF, the CO ITO went from 8-10 staff up to 60-70 staff. He and his wife Jeannie (now Sonnenfeld, she's the ED Cinncy today) really knew how to build the ITO, Jeannie and Craig Ferrera did recruiting, the ITO traffic from LRH, Bill ran with that traffic, Bill picking up from where Greg Wilhere the 1st CO ITO left off, with Paul Koval as temp CO ITO inbetween, Paul not doing really anything but treading water until Bill came and with Jeannie then boomed ITO.

    Bill was a dynamic Sea Org officer who embodied the OEC FEBC materials, in all those materials BAD and PLUSES. He and Jeannie DID build ITO, some say Jeannie did most, but I'd say Bill knows and knew Sea Org internal push and shove politics, and used the LRH traffic to ITO to get the all important approvals and not being blocked from "just doing it."

    Bill got things done, to say the least.

    Lots of people praise him for doing things, I know lots, including myself, had some rough moments under Bill.

    To me, he was MORE real deal Sea Org officer than say Kerry Gleason, who was also a pretty sharp exec, but Bill yelled and screamed a lot less than Kerry screamed and ranted. Bill was more quiet and brooding, and frankly more scary, he had a threatening presence to back up his ethics presence, frankly, and I tried hard to do my job perfectly and by the book, so as NOT to give Bill reason to get mad at me. I don't agree with LRH's "Ethics Presence" policy letter, but Bill was good at applying the "Ethics Presence" policy. He did have it. I thought Bill ought to have had more ARC and light touch, but I got along mostly almost fine with Bill, and he backed me up tremendously in the OEC department, in fact if not for him, I'd not have had students to supervise, since Bill knew the politics in the management ranks HOW to get cooperation agreement in the Flag Bureaux, and Kerry Gleason was then CO FB, to get the OEC trainees sent to Flag. There was an LRH program called the "Oscar" program, and Bill pushed that program, thus ITO had people to train.

    When Bill was promoted from CO ITO to the ED International position, we in ITO at various times, read over the ITO LRH traffic.

    The LRH traffic to Bill, I thought was highly complementary, and some parts of that LRH traffic still sticks in my head today. LRH praised Bill for Bill's old tough Sea Org officer style. That was significant to me.

    I so wish we had ALL of LRH's traffic in the public domain, to today reflect on how LRH was playing the whole big "piano" of the Sea Org management people.

    Despite all of LRH's grievous faults, LRH did expend a massive amount of attention in his final years to SO MANY Sea Org officers who were doing myriad jobs in all echelons of the movement.

    LRH was like a Mussolini on steriods in terms of micromanaging, one might critically say.

    And were us observers of the Scientology movement, those interested in the details, to have a convention of ALL of the whole entourage of Sea Org members that LRH was in daily weekly communication with, by the old telex traffic / advices, we'd see just how extensive and intense LRH's full breadth of attention played out.

    LRH had a LOT of things going, LOT of orders, lot of directions he was urging action.

    IN all of this maelstrom of "change" of the late 1970s, LRH DID approve of Bill Franks, and did promote Bill to the first Executive Director International position.

    My opinion is Bill needed more allies, because when he rose to the lofty ED Int position, then it was not Bill pushing and getting his superiors to align with Bill's position as a lower down Sea Org officer trying to follow LRH's individual orders to his smaller zone, but NOW, as ED Int, Bill had a huge vacuum of people to help him do the ED Int position. To me he floundered at that point due to a few more things I'll go into later.

    I really want to have some discussions with Bill, longer range, on the Executive STrata.

    LRH in 1982, comes out strongly with much more about the Executive Strata, and Bill was driven out of the Sea Org, mainly I'll bet by Miscavige, so Bill did NOT have the luxury of seeing the LRH traffic to Bill's predecessor, Guilliaume Leserve.

    I have a decent memory of the LRH traffic on Exec Strata, most of it came out WHEN Bill was still ED Int and over Exec Strata, but there was ONE very crucial piece of Exec Strata LRH traffic that came out to Guilliaume, and I so wish we had it here in the public domain to chew over.

    I myself, still have the unreal hope that Scientology administratively will heal itself, fix itself.

    My experience, and I fear Bill will confirm it, is that almost one for one, the senior execs who defect or get pressured OUT of the Sea Org, think the administrative setup is unredeemable.

    I have always hoped the Exec Strata staff WOULD attain the "think tank" role that LRH wrote for them in LRH ED 339R Int.

    To build a real think tank, of top execs over their zones of Scientology, to me it is something that the "old" tough guy Sea Org executive style is inevitably going to clash with.

    In my opinion it takes a good decade to make some Exec Strata think tank experts that can actually strategically think with our current culture, and make the changes and reforms to knock out the "cult" out of the Scientology movement. (I'd send the Exec Strata members out to college, as part of their training lineup, frankly.)

    Building top Scientology administrative leadership, it's a personnel problem of perpetual underestimated magnitude, and with current Scientology leadership (the one man extremely ignorant brutish dictator David Miscavige) who is NOT building up Watchdog Committee nor the Exec Strata, I personally think the cult atmosphere Scientology displays is gonna go on for a decade until new leadership and when parishioner ranked Scientologists finally get fed up and revolt, sort of like the 1981 or 1982 Mission Holders revolt, which I believe Bill was on the Mission Holders' side of that turmoil.


    The authoritarian "tough guy" Sea Org style transferred, I believe, by osmosis, my opinion, from the Bill Franks, Alex Sibersky, Kerry Gleason, leadership years, and it transferred to David Miscavige, Steve Marlowe,

    During the late 1970s, like 1977-1979, there was still quite a bit of LRH weekly traffic, to the CO's of the various Flag (remember this was the period when at the Flag Land Base, all of management was there, the Commodore's Staff Aides were still in existence and failing, the Flag Bureaux was the day to day, week to week management of the conts and orgs


    There is SO MUCH history Bill Franks has been a part of.

    If I had 50 Gs, I'd like to take 3 years off, and write Sea Org history.

    Bill was a really a HUGE player in Sea Org history.

    I hope to meet and interview Bill for Sea Org and LRH history.

    Bill Franks lived during the transformation from the old Commodore's Staff Aides and Flag Bu management setup, to the Watchdog Committee and Int Exec Strata setup that exists today.

    And Bill was a productive org executive, knew how to get his LRH orders complied with, and he had a good relationship with LRH, and LRH respected Bill as a Sea Org officer.

    What I think would be incredibly amazing, is for Bill Franks, Alex Sibersky, and Kerry Gleason to interview each other about their Sea Org careers, and history!

    The 3 were and might still be friends, I believe, and co lived a lot.

    Bill Franks posting, is very very historical.
    Last edited by chuckbeatty; 27th February 2011 at 07:50 PM.
    Chuck Beatty
    ex Sea Org (1975-2003)
    412-260-1170
    chuckbeatty77@aol.com

    "I think a lot of my father's stuff doesn't work. So I false report whenever I need to. Personally, I think my father's crazy."
    - Quentin Hubbard Class 12 Scientologist, statement to Dennis Erlich
    http://www.lermanet.com/exit/quentincoroner.htm

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  16. #260
    Crusader Sindy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkwdblds View Post
    Synthia, very nice summary of the theme of this thread. It cuts right to the heart of the topic of why people leave an organization!

    Nevertheless, in the case of C of S, there are so many interesting and incredible side issues present and it is full of anecdotes involving LRH, Franks, Mayo, DM and others.

    To me understanding these anecdotes is interesting and entertaining but most of all it is informative and yields understanding. For those of us who were taken in by C of S and invested huge amounts of our time, energy and money to their cause, it is very helpful to really understand what scheme was used upon us to illicit so much of our support.

    C of S seems to be imploding now and as the dust settles, the more we can understand the phenomena of what took place, the better off everyone will be, both the perpetrators, the victims and just observers who mainly want to understand what this furor is all about.
    Lakey aka Gary
    Hey, I'm with ya! If you read through this entire thread, you will see just how much I was pushing for Bill to come on to the board. I'm all about what you're saying. It's just sometimes, when people start talkin' this list and that list, and this tech reason or that tech reason, it all starts to sound surreal and over significant.

    It's like someone giving me painstakingly detailed directions somewhere when I could use Mapquest or my GPS. That's probably not the best analogy but I'll let it suffice.

    Note: I'm not bashing Chuck's post here, it's an overall view. I liked his post.
    "Scientology: The only game in the universe where the rapist is your ethics officer." - HelluvaHoax

    "Yes Scientology at this point is nothing but its own funeral. You might as well leave early and beat the traffic. " - Thrak

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