Page 30 of 56 FirstFirst ... 202122232425262728293031323334353637383940 ... LastLast
Results 291 to 300 of 552

Thread: Bill Frank's story about brainwashing (thread merge)

  1. #291
    Patron Meritorious MostlyLurker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    606

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by olska View Post
    ...
    So. Thanks to this thread, we have all learned another great lesson! and that lesson is:

    rather than thinking things out for themselves, many people will only believe something when it is spoken or written by people with "altitude," whose opinions they value more than their own.

    All righty then.

    Now tell me again, how was it that people got sucked into and lost so much in the scam called "scientology"?
    I don't see any "altitude" from Bill Franks at all, I see him humble, and that is appreciated.

    On FB, to the question by Robin Scott and Dennis Erlich if he was willing to take back the post of ED Int he wrote:
    Dear Dennis and Robin, I think my days of trying to Clear the Planet are definitely over. The info I have provided about the intentional corruption of the tech by Hubbard is however true and I pass it along for someone who has the fotitude to fix it as it was used to make us all crazy and perhaps a bit more controllable. I hardly think I would or could be the one to fix the tech. I am quite content being an SP. Thanks for the interst though.Dennis, you always had a great sense of humor. Best, Bill
    Also chosing the screen name of "wogman" is a sign of no altitude to me. (I see he has Bill Franks as screen name here, maybe Emma helped him and created the account with his name, but originally, he attemped to register as 'wogman')

    About the message Bill wanted to be posted on ESMB, many (most) of people who left Co$ already knew that the equation blow=overt/withhold is bulshit. Different thing is to know that LRH himself knew it, yet he lied to keep ruling Scientology and people's lives.

    Bill is thanked for his willigness to share his knowledge.
    “It is simply not true that we are trapped in this universe. There is no way out of this trap for the simple reason that it wasn’t a trap in the first place. Therefore, any sign-post that purports to point to "the way out of the trap" must either be meaningless or else point the way into a trap.” ― from Letter to a Scientologist by Per-Olof Samuelsson

  2. Thanks ClearEyed says "thank you" for this post
  3. #292
    Crusader RogerB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    7,441

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by olska View Post
    Who is Bill Franks? With no disrespect to the man intended,...

    In the world OUTSIDE scientology, he is apparently "just another guy" with about the same amount of influence on those close around him (family, friends, business associates, and community connections) as the rest of us.

    In the world INSIDE scientology and now INSIDE the "ex"scientology community, he's a guy with big, big altitude.

    It's really lovely and helpful that Bill, an "opinion leader" in scientology who is now an "opinion leader" in EX-scientology, has come out with the big revelation that:

    upsets (ARCx), not overts and withholds, are the reason people blow (leave).

    Well strike me blind and dumb! Some of us who were never, and are still not, "opinion leaders" (in either or any other group) have been pointing that out for some time now, and have been pointing out how "confession" in scientology is used not to "help" but rather to control people ... but obviously our opinions just didn't carry enough weight because hardly anyone seemed to notice.

    So. Thanks to this thread, we have all learned another great lesson! and that lesson is:

    rather than thinking things out for themselves, many people will only believe something when it is spoken or written by people with "altitude," whose opinions they value more than their own.

    All righty then.

    Now tell me again, how was it that people got sucked into and lost so much in the scam called "scientology"?
    Nah, Olska,

    The issue isn't as you express above . . . as I said earlier on the thread, we knew about ARCX's, BPC and blows in 1963.

    Of course Hubbard kept "adding" new ideas as to new "tech" . . . . :D And these new flavors of the month became the enforced new "reality" of what was correct, standard tech.

    The real deal in Bill's post is that Hubbard revealed the truth, the correct tech point and would not let these guys use it, and enjoined them to hold the truth secret for fear . . . as Hubbard stated: "he'd lose control of the orgs and $cn."

    That, in the paragraph above is the revelation.

    And only Bill or David M could have made it.

    I can assure you that there are a number of old-timer techies who knew and practiced the truth regarding ARCXs, BPC and Blows regardless of who else said what.

    Rog
    Life is supposed to be enjoyed, Mate!

    Don't show me the money . . . give me the TRUTH!
    Visit: http://knowledgism-practice-group.org

  4. #293
    Crusader RogerB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    7,441

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TG1 View Post
    Roger,

    Although it's a minor point, I have gotten the impression for some time that when exes reference the term "severe reality adjustment" it is with an intimation that it was an insider term created and used within Scientology organizations.

    However, to my knowledge "severe reality adjustment" is not a Scientological term. It's slang term that's been around for decades and decades.

    This minor point isn't really germane to your point above -- but one that I've been meaning to comment on for some time.

    TG1
    Yes, 'tis so. Where I've seen it outside of the Cof$ it's tended to be used kindly or even in in an "OMG" fun kind of way. And it is a good point and distinction you raise.

    When I first saw it used in the Cof$ in '67-'68 it was used in the dominating, threading overwhelming way to affect, in essence, a brainwashing.

    This first caught my attention because I saw it used by idiot young ethics officers who'd not lived a life, and who didn't know WTF*** the realities of life were that should or should not be adjusted but they sure as hell wanted folks to think the way they thought folks should think And of course, they were typically not tech trained as in auditor trained. All they knew was their limited exposure to HCO P/Ls.

    And it is in this last sense that it is used/mis-used in the Cof$.

    R
    Life is supposed to be enjoyed, Mate!

    Don't show me the money . . . give me the TRUTH!
    Visit: http://knowledgism-practice-group.org

  5. Thanks Boojuum says "thank you" for this post
  6. #294
    Patron with Honors
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Benicia, calif
    Posts
    448

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    I have no idea if anyone would be interested in knowing how this story of Brainwashing from Bill started out but I thought I'd tell it anyway.
    I recently found Bill on FB. He and I were pretty good friends at AOLA back in the 60's and early '70's. Before he became a hard ass SO officer.http://www.forum.exscn.net/images/smilies/yes.gif I friended him and started a dialog. Mainly I wanted to thank him for having my, then husband, Jack Pearlman, declared back in '73. That ended my years of resentment towards Bill and re-habed what had once been a good friendship.
    About a year ago I started reading about the current COS online. Up till then I hadn't been interested in looking at what was going on. It had been so many years and I still had a huge ARCX I was willingly and knowingly holding onto. Anyway, once I learned about the hideous, degraded mess that the COS had become and blew a ton of charge, I realized that I felt grateful to Bill for getting Jack declared and myself leaving with him. Who knows where we'd be now in regard to the "church." I'd like to think we would have gotten out sooner rather than later but I'll never know. Heber and Gretchen Wedow Schwartz did try to recover us at one point but we weren't having it..thank God! Ah geeze...I have a habit of digressing like this..sorry.
    As I mentioned earlier, Bill and I started a dialog on FB. Later joined by my former brother-in-law, Murray Pearlman. At some point Bill told us his story. Another of Bill's FB friend"s, Scott saw it and encouraged Bill to let the story be published. Greg Wells kindly published it here for Bill.
    As so many have already posted here, I too believe it's essential to the healing process to get the pieces of the puzzle put together. I have not admitted this anywhere else but I will now, in case it helps someone. After I left Scn. I became chronically, and seriously depressed. At one point, in 1995 I tried and almost was successful at committing suicide. What was truly frighting to me about that was that I didn't think there was any help out there for me. I wouldn't have been caught dead going to a psychiatrist. Probably still wouldn't. It has been only recently that I realized the direct line to my chronic depression was Scientology and what ended up happening in the end.http://www.forum.exscn.net/images/smilies/duh.gif
    I won't go into another long winded explanation but suffice to say that I feel that the depression has lifted. If it ever happens again, at least I know what the trigger is. It's a total BS trigger where I make myself wrong and the "church" right and I recognize it as such now. So you see Bill, your info is valuable on more than one level.
    I don't know how much Bill will want to be involved on this board but I sure do thank and admire him for what he has given so far.
    I am still "looking." Marcy Pearlman Sorensen
    Marcy, I'm glad that you have recovered and yes I agree that this info is valuable for those others who need to recover. The best to you.

  7. #295
    Crusader Sindy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    6,131

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TG1 View Post
    Good post.
    I'm not "believing" it because he said it...do you know who you are referring to exactly? That communication that he imparted from Hubbard is neither surprising nor revelatory. Correction, I can't say that what he said was not revelatory, of course it was, but the idea that ARCX are the cause of blows is obvious. Although, that is not an absolute either, like Scientology wants the tech to be. People leave for all sorts of reasons, O/Ws included. To say that others want to hear what he has to say because somehow it has some force or altitude would be missing the point.
    Last edited by Sindy; 27th February 2011 at 09:53 PM.
    "Scientology: The only game in the universe where the rapist is your ethics officer." - HelluvaHoax

    "Yes Scientology at this point is nothing but its own funeral. You might as well leave early and beat the traffic. " - Thrak

  8. #296

    Default

    I am very excited about the ripple effect here with Bill Frank's revelation. This is a major crack in the barrier for us as a 'group of exs', who, after all, seek truth so they we can be free of the lies that bind us to the past.

    It is truth that sets us free from the lies. Every bit of truth about scientology and Hubbard that is posted on the internet makes it possible for readers to overcome the past. This latest from Bill demonstrates that one of the biggest lies out
    of scientology was from the old man himself and that is hugh for those who believe Hubbard was at the root of it all. It may well help many leave Scientology, knowing that it is OK to leave when you cannot agree any more to a lie. No one deserves to be tortured with sec checks ( and made to pay for them) for wanting to walk away from the insanity and move on in life.)

    What a wonderful thread this is becoming. To see Marcy Pearlman Sorensen and Glenn Samuels posting here as well has really made my day. Welcome to you both!

    I suspect we shall see more from the past who were a part of the history which still needs to be revealed. The more who speak up, the more we know, the less control the past has on us as individuals and as a group.

    Hope to see more exs from the past come and tell their stories and support the truth.
    ~ Mary McConnell, my nom de plume
    Internet Resources on Scientology for newcomers
    Narconon Reviews Get the facts about Narconon.
    Reaching For The Tipping Point A place to keep up on what is being done to expose Scn & it's front groups, like Narconon, CCHR etc to the general public. Lots of up-to-date info. Join us
    My Scribd Scn & Narconon Legal Dox
    Ex-Sea Org Helpline "...leaving the confines of Scientology is a process, not a single event."

  9. #297
    Crusader RogerB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    7,441

    Default

    Mary,

    As usual, well said, Mate! ^-^-^

    Rog
    Life is supposed to be enjoyed, Mate!

    Don't show me the money . . . give me the TRUTH!
    Visit: http://knowledgism-practice-group.org

  10. #298
    Crusader Sindy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    6,131

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    I have no idea if anyone would be interested in knowing how this story of Brainwashing from Bill started out but I thought I'd tell it anyway.
    I recently found Bill on FB. He and I were pretty good friends at AOLA back in the 60's and early '70's. Before he became a hard ass SO officer.http://www.forum.exscn.net/images/smilies/yes.gif I friended him and started a dialog. Mainly I wanted to thank him for having my, then husband, Jack Pearlman, declared back in '73. That ended my years of resentment towards Bill and re-habed what had once been a good friendship.
    About a year ago I started reading about the current COS online. Up till then I hadn't been interested in looking at what was going on. It had been so many years and I still had a huge ARCX I was willingly and knowingly holding onto. Anyway, once I learned about the hideous, degraded mess that the COS had become and blew a ton of charge, I realized that I felt grateful to Bill for getting Jack declared and myself leaving with him. Who knows where we'd be now in regard to the "church." I'd like to think we would have gotten out sooner rather than later but I'll never know. Heber and Gretchen Wedow Schwartz did try to recover us at one point but we weren't having it..thank God! Ah geeze...I have a habit of digressing like this..sorry.
    As I mentioned earlier, Bill and I started a dialog on FB. Later joined by my former brother-in-law, Murray Pearlman. At some point Bill told us his story. Another of Bill's FB friend"s, Scott saw it and encouraged Bill to let the story be published. Greg Wells kindly published it here for Bill.
    As so many have already posted here, I too believe it's essential to the healing process to get the pieces of the puzzle put together. I have not admitted this anywhere else but I will now, in case it helps someone. After I left Scn. I became chronically, and seriously depressed. At one point, in 1995 I tried and almost was successful at committing suicide. What was truly frighting to me about that was that I didn't think there was any help out there for me. I wouldn't have been caught dead going to a psychiatrist. Probably still wouldn't. It has been only recently that I realized the direct line to my chronic depression was Scientology and what ended up happening in the end.http://www.forum.exscn.net/images/smilies/duh.gif
    I won't go into another long winded explanation but suffice to say that I feel that the depression has lifted. If it ever happens again, at least I know what the trigger is. It's a total BS trigger where I make myself wrong and the "church" right and I recognize it as such now. So you see Bill, your info is valuable on more than one level.
    I don't know how much Bill will want to be involved on this board but I sure do thank and admire him for what he has given so far.
    I am still "looking." Marcy Pearlman Sorensen
    Wow. Great stuff Marcy. Thanks for the clarification.

    I agree with you regarding the healing. I believe there's lots of healing to be had here. Glad you're here.
    "Scientology: The only game in the universe where the rapist is your ethics officer." - HelluvaHoax

    "Yes Scientology at this point is nothing but its own funeral. You might as well leave early and beat the traffic. " - Thrak

  11. #299
    Crusader ChuckNorrisCutsMyLawn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Marcabian Institute of Psychiatry
    Posts
    6,404

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AnonyMary View Post
    I am very excited about the ripple effect here with Bill Frank's revelation. This is a major crack in the barrier for us as a 'group of exs', who, after all, seek truth so they we can be free of the lies that bind us to the past.

    It is truth that sets us free from the lies. Every bit of truth about scientology and Hubbard that is posted on the internet makes it possible for readers to overcome the past. This latest from Bill demonstrates that one of the biggest lies out
    of scientology was from the old man himself and that is hugh for those who believe Hubbard was at the root of it all. It may well help many leave Scientology, knowing that it is OK to leave when you cannot agree any more to a lie. No one deserves to be tortured with sec checks ( and made to pay for them) for wanting to walk away from the insanity and move on in life.)

    What a wonderful thread this is becoming. To see Marcy Pearlman Sorensen and Glenn Samuels posting here as well has really made my day. Welcome to you both!

    I suspect we shall see more from the past who were a part of the history which still needs to be revealed. The more who speak up, the more we know, the less control the past has on us as individuals and as a group.

    Hope to see more exs from the past come and tell their stories and support the truth.
    I'd call it more of a confirmation than a revelation, if anyone reading this board hasn't figured out by now that Hubbard was nothing but a sleazy con man who was only interesting in enslaving victims to serve his cult, they are either in serious denial, or really fucking stupid, or both.

    I'd love to see more people such as Bill Franks come out and tell their first hand accounts of Hubbard, but I'm not sure how many more people want to bother coming out to tell their Hubbard related cult stories, most people have moved on with their lives and probably aren't interested in reliving their youth on message boards, besides most people only want to reminisce about the good times, I doubt many Holocaust survivors want to rehash the years they spent in concentration camps all that often.
    Yes lurkers you are not alone, everyone thinks Scientology is creepy, it's not just you

    http://www.mediacurves.com/Religion/...logy/Index.cfm

  12. #300
    Patron with Honors chuckbeatty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    416

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Robot View Post
    I have no idea if anyone would be interested in knowing how this story of Brainwashing from Bill started out but I thought I'd tell it anyway.
    I recently found Bill on FB. He and I were pretty good friends at AOLA back in the 60's and early '70's. Before he became a hard ass SO officer.http://www.forum.exscn.net/images/smilies/yes.gif I friended him and started a dialog. Mainly I wanted to thank him for having my, then husband, Jack Pearlman, declared back in '73. That ended my years of resentment towards Bill and re-habed what had once been a good friendship.
    About a year ago I started reading about the current COS online. Up till then I hadn't been interested in looking at what was going on. It had been so many years and I still had a huge ARCX I was willingly and knowingly holding onto. Anyway, once I learned about the hideous, degraded mess that the COS had become and blew a ton of charge, I realized that I felt grateful to Bill for getting Jack declared and myself leaving with him. Who knows where we'd be now in regard to the "church." I'd like to think we would have gotten out sooner rather than later but I'll never know. Heber and Gretchen Wedow Schwartz did try to recover us at one point but we weren't having it..thank God! Ah geeze...I have a habit of digressing like this..sorry.
    As I mentioned earlier, Bill and I started a dialog on FB. Later joined by my former brother-in-law, Murray Pearlman. At some point Bill told us his story. Another of Bill's FB friend"s, Scott saw it and encouraged Bill to let the story be published. Greg Wells kindly published it here for Bill.
    As so many have already posted here, I too believe it's essential to the healing process to get the pieces of the puzzle put together. I have not admitted this anywhere else but I will now, in case it helps someone. After I left Scn. I became chronically, and seriously depressed. At one point, in 1995 I tried and almost was successful at committing suicide. What was truly frighting to me about that was that I didn't think there was any help out there for me. I wouldn't have been caught dead going to a psychiatrist. Probably still wouldn't. It has been only recently that I realized the direct line to my chronic depression was Scientology and what ended up happening in the end.http://www.forum.exscn.net/images/smilies/duh.gif
    I won't go into another long winded explanation but suffice to say that I feel that the depression has lifted. If it ever happens again, at least I know what the trigger is. It's a total BS trigger where I make myself wrong and the "church" right and I recognize it as such now. So you see Bill, your info is valuable on more than one level.
    I don't know how much Bill will want to be involved on this board but I sure do thank and admire him for what he has given so far.
    I am still "looking." Marcy Pearlman Sorensen
    Thankyou, huge historically important service you did here.

    Thanks!!!

    The Scientology/Hubbard saga is basically the life of L. Ron Hubbard.

    I thank ANYONE who helps flush the story in all its personal historical details OUT into the public domain.

    The chat sites on Scientology I views as raw information treasure troves of details, that expert observers of Scientology history can piece together the whole big Hubbard impact.

    The ongoing operation of official Scientology is abusive still as we speak.

    It's an abusive operation.

    I guess your post means that Bill is NOT watching the responses to his thread though.

    As one of the posters on this thread stated, likely Bill is like that poster, gotten on in life, and NOT wishing to stir up weeks and months of his life in the Sea Org turmoil and history.

    Please pass my chuckbeatty77@aol.com email to Bill, I was his subordinate, and I sent him also a Facebook message, which I hope he will in the rest of his life, allow some interviewing of himself for the history books on what happened surrounding Bill's ousting from the Sea Org.

    There's so much MORE history in all Bill's "short" 15 or so years of the Sea Org.

    How we ended up today with the decimated leadership collapse, with the sole dictator David Miscavige at the top, and NONE of the Exec Strata wearing their hats and dealing with Scientology most major controversies, IS the ongoing big Scientology problem.

    The official movement has the wealth that ALL of us ex members ALSO contributed in accumulating, and I feel ex senior leaders have a right to comment and give their public opinions about Scientology's future!

    thanks very much for getting gwells to post Bill's story!
    Chuck Beatty
    ex Sea Org (1975-2003)
    412-260-1170
    chuckbeatty77@aol.com

    "I think a lot of my father's stuff doesn't work. So I false report whenever I need to. Personally, I think my father's crazy."
    - Quentin Hubbard Class 12 Scientologist, statement to Dennis Erlich
    http://www.lermanet.com/exit/quentincoroner.htm

  13. Thanks ClearEyed says "thank you" for this post
Page 30 of 56 FirstFirst ... 202122232425262728293031323334353637383940 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Hubbard Explains Brainwashing
    By AnonKat in forum L Ron Hubbard
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 29th July 2013, 06:35 PM
  2. Brainwashing (Long)
    By Ogsonofgroo in forum General Scientology Discussion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 25th April 2010, 01:52 PM
  3. Scientology Brainwashing Tape
    By AnonKat in forum Chanology and Anonymous videos (Scientology-related)
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 21st March 2010, 02:17 PM
  4. Brainwashing
    By UkAnony in forum General Scientology Discussion
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 19th October 2008, 02:43 AM
  5. Brainwashing Manual Parallels
    By Veda in forum Great Web Sites and Links
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 14th June 2008, 10:24 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •