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Thread: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

  1. #51
    Crusader Sindy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by HelluvaHoax! View Post
    ...

    Just moments after I posted that last mention of how entertainment industry professionals are being fed a daily diet of scary stuff about what Scientology is doing to covertly infiltrate & manipulate the world of tv and movies, I see new articles being posted on Google News.

    Within the last hour several media sources ran headlines about how Paul Haggis has Scientologists going thru his garbage. Here are a couple of them with headlines:

    Director says scientologists are trying to discredit him
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...m-6290582.html

    Crash Director Says Scientologists Are Rooting Thru His Trash
    http://www.queerty.com/crash-directo...rash-20120115/



    "Dear God, please help our family through these tough economic times. Help our son heal from his recent accident. Please, send someone to stalk us and go through our trash. We love you God. Amen."
    "Scientology: The only game in the universe where the rapist is your ethics officer." - HelluvaHoax

    "Yes Scientology at this point is nothing but its own funeral. You might as well leave early and beat the traffic. " - Thrak

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  3. #52
    Crusader freethinker's Avatar
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    Default Re: John Travolta

    He doesn't have to say anything, his face is the promotion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lohan2008 View Post
    Actually I have not heard of JT promoting Scientology when he represents Qantas.

    Airport Journal:
    http://www.airportjournals.com/Displ...anner&kw=Flash
    "The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." ~ Albert Einstein

    "Sometimes experts use their experience not to explore the future, but merely to protect the past."
    ~ Dr. Michael Hewitt-Gleeson

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  5. #53

    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthia View Post
    ... Either make a proper argument showing how your point of view is superior or stop the "ad-hominem-through-emoticon" strategy. It's not an intelligent way to argue.
    It's not an 'ad hominem'. {clear the phrase if you don't understand it.}

    It is an expression of an emotional reaction, something which you have recommended as therapeutic. Or is that only for those emotions which you like?

    The fact is that neither Travolta, nor Cruise is responsible for the abuses of the church. Neither has it been shown by anyone on the board that either one of them is engaging in promotional actions dishonestly or while themselves having direct personal knowledge of the abuses of church management. Neither is really guilty of anything except possibly 'being a scientologist'. Of course, for some on the board that alone seems to be sufficient cause for ...

    Both T & C are celebrities. They are apparently content to remain 'in'. They are NOT directly & personally responsible for the abuses of the church. They are not inhuman monsters, even if Cruise is Miscavige's pal.

    Being a celebrity scientologist does not equate with criminal co-conspirator. If you want to complain about criminal abuses then focus on those who have actually perpetrated them.

    Many non-celebrity ex's have committed far worse ethical lapses than anything that can be attributed to Travolta or Cruise. Yet you aren't seen to be hammering all those who may have so transgressed for their past actions no matter how unprincipled or destructive they may have been. Nor does having left the church suffice to 'clean the slate' completely.

    Targeting celebrity scientologists just because of their social prominence simply comes across as sour grapes, disgruntlement, & envy. It is not an indication of having taken a principled & moral stand on church abuses. .

    Gut yontiff.


    Mark A. Baker
    "Hubbard is alive and well. He lives through his
    creations."
    - Purple Rain



    "Because nothing has the be true forever. Just for long enough, to tell you the truth."

    - T. Pratchett, The Truth

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  7. #54
    Crusader Sindy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    It's not an 'ad hominem'. {clear the phrase if you don't understand it.}

    It is an expression of an emotional reaction, something which you have recommended as therapeutic. Or is that only for those emotions which you like?

    The fact is that neither Travolta, nor Cruise is responsible for the abuses of the church. Neither has it been shown by anyone on the board that either one of them is engaging in promotional actions dishonestly or while themselves having direct personal knowledge of the abuses of church management. Neither is really guilty of anything except possibly 'being a scientologist'. Of course, for some on the board that alone seems to be sufficient cause for ...

    Both T & C are celebrities. They are apparently content to remain 'in'. They are NOT directly & personally responsible for the abuses of the church. They are not inhuman monsters, even if Cruise is Miscavige's pal.

    Being a celebrity scientologist does not equate with criminal co-conspirator. If you want to complain about criminal abuses then focus on those who have actually perpetrated them.

    Many non-celebrity ex's have committed far worse ethical lapses than anything that can be attributed to Travolta or Cruise. Yet you aren't seen to be hammering all those who may have so transgressed for their past actions no matter how unprincipled or destructive they may have been. Nor does having left the church suffice to 'clean the slate' completely.

    Targeting celebrity scientologists just because of their social prominence simply comes across as sour grapes, disgruntlement, & envy. It is not an indication of having taken a principled & moral stand on church abuses. .

    Gut yontiff.


    Mark A. Baker
    When you say, that when someone asserts something, that they are I don't care if you use a cute little computer character to assert your point, you are making a comment about them personally and not using good argumentation to take up the actual issue -- thus, ad hominem. You clear that, okay?

    Secondly, because I don't have time to cover all that you said, the fact that you think that I sound like I am envious of anyone trapped inside a cold, calculating, mind numbing psychotic cult makes me wonder where your head is at. I really don't know what else to say.

    Good night Mark. I learned long ago that arguing with you is like running around chasing my tail. I'm too tired to do that right now.

    Synthia E Fagen
    "Scientology: The only game in the universe where the rapist is your ethics officer." - HelluvaHoax

    "Yes Scientology at this point is nothing but its own funeral. You might as well leave early and beat the traffic. " - Thrak

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  9. #55
    Silver Meritorious Sponsor HelluvaHoax!'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post

    The fact is that neither Travolta, nor Cruise is responsible for the abuses of the church. Neither has it been shown by anyone on the board that either one of them is engaging in promotional actions dishonestly or while themselves having direct personal knowledge of the abuses of church management. Neither is really guilty of anything except possibly 'being a scientologist'. Of course, for some on the board that alone seems to be sufficient cause for ...

    Neither has "direct personal knowledge of the abuses of church management"?

    LOLOL. OMG. Bravo!!!

    You have just been awarded the WordClown Medal of Mendacity.

    More than a dozen top level CoS Senior Management Executives come forward with corroborative and consistent testimony that COB engaged in a long term campaign of psychological terrorism, imprisonment and physical beatings.

    It's all over the newspapers and internet.

    Scientologists are pulled into Ethics to "handle" and dead agent the facts.

    Tom Cruise even issues a formal statement thru his attorney denying that it happened.

    And here we are in 2012 with Mark Baker pathetically trying to sell the idea that Cruise and Travolta have nothing to do with it.

    Remarkable deception, self and otherwise.
    ________________________

    Scientology literally saved my life! Without Ron's books I would have frozen to death!!! (see avatar)

    Scientology in one word? HelluvaHoax!

    I never felt as free as when I freed myself from "Total Freedom".

    For offended Scientologists reading this blasphemy about L. Ron Hubbard---my apologies for talking about real life without lying to you, like Scientology, with goo-goo theta-talk. I know you don't have a floating needle right now. You're not supposed to.

  10. #56
    Genuine Meatball SchwimmelPuckel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    <snip> The fact is that neither Travolta, nor Cruise is responsible for the abuses of the church. </snip>
    Those two putknuckers have a moral responsibility to warn people OFF The Sinister Scam Cult of Scientology!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    Neither has it been shown by anyone on the board that either one of them is engaging in promotional actions dishonestly or while themselves having direct personal knowledge of the abuses of church management. </snip>
    Well, how much does it take then? - There are a LOT of respectable 'scientologists' telling of the abuses.. It's been amply reported in the media.. But your idea that we all need to have personal and direct knowledge before we can know about it.. Well, that's what any mafia gang needs to protect the leaders and continue the scam.

    Those two putknuckers do know! - Thus they ARE dishonest!

    Arguably they don't know, in which case they are both stupid and willfully ignorant. Both attributes, incidently, are important parts of Scientology doctrine... If that is the case they are still dishonest.

    A lie is still a lie, even if you believe it. Telling lies you believe in doesn't make you honest, it just illustrates your stupidity.

    Last edited by SchwimmelPuckel; 17th January 2012 at 08:17 PM.
    Ask not what Scientology can do for you, ask what the F#*¤CK is going on!

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  12. #57

    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by SchwimmelPuckel View Post
    Those two putknuckers have a moral responsibility to warn people OFF The Sinister Scam Cult of Scientology! ...
    ONLY should either decide for himself that is what he needs to do.

    NOT because someone else thinks that they should.

    The complaint with so many on the board is how they did things while they were 'in' NOT because they thought it was a good idea but because they were told by others in the chain of command that they MUST do so in order to conform to expectations of ethical behavior. .

    Coerced or conformist ethics are inherently unethical.

    Morality is conforming to what others expect. Ethics entails action based on an individual's OWN views of right & wrong.

    You don't like scientology. Evidently they do. They are under no moral or ethical compulsion to adopt your views as their own.

    If you expect the right to choose for yourself then you have to be willing to grant the same right to others; celebrities not excluded.




    Mark A. Baker
    Last edited by Mark A. Baker; 19th January 2012 at 04:19 AM.
    "Hubbard is alive and well. He lives through his
    creations."
    - Purple Rain



    "Because nothing has the be true forever. Just for long enough, to tell you the truth."

    - T. Pratchett, The Truth

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  14. #58
    Crusader freethinker's Avatar
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    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    This is ad hominem.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    It's not an 'ad hominem'. {clear the phrase if you don't understand it.}

    It is an expression of an emotional reaction, something which you have recommended as therapeutic. Or is that only for those emotions which you like?
    This is not a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    The fact is that neither Travolta, nor Cruise is responsible for the abuses of the church.
    This is not a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    Neither is really guilty of anything except possibly 'being a scientologist'.

    This is a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    Both T & C are celebrities.

    This is not a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    They are NOT directly & personally responsible for the abuses of the church.
    It's done a lot here. Marty for example.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    If you want to complain about criminal abuses then focus on those who have actually perpetrated them.

    This is not a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    Many non-celebrity ex's have committed far worse ethical lapses than anything that can be attributed to Travolta or Cruise.

    This is not a fact. Marty et al.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    Yet you aren't seen to be hammering all those who may have so transgressed for their past actions no matter how unprincipled or destructive they may have been.

    This is not a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    It is not an indication of having taken a principled & moral stand on church abuses.





    This is not a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    The complaint with so many on the board is how they did things while they were 'in' NOT because they thought it was a good idea but because they were told by others in the chain of command that they MUST do so in order to conform to expectations of ethical behavior. .

    This is a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    Coerced or conformist ethics are inherently unethical.

    This is not a fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    Morality is conforming to what others expect. Ethics entails action based on an individual's OWN views of right & wrong.
    This is not a fact.
    They are under a moral, ethical and legal obligation to report any form of abuse
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    You don't like scientology. Evidently they do. They are under no moral or ethical compulsion to adopt your views as their own.
    "The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." ~ Albert Einstein

    "Sometimes experts use their experience not to explore the future, but merely to protect the past."
    ~ Dr. Michael Hewitt-Gleeson

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  16. #59

    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by freethinker View Post
    This is ad hominem.

    This is not a fact. ...
    If you have dox to show that either one is knowingly a participant in criminal or abusive practices of the church then put up.

    If not ....

    And no "working on 'just say no' for the church" and other imaginary imputed crimes don't count as such things are neither abusive nor criminal.

    The fact is the only 'crime' either one is guilty of is actually liking & promoting scientology. That is neither inherently abusive or criminal. It is something you just "can't have" or allow.

    Mark A. Baker
    "Hubbard is alive and well. He lives through his
    creations."
    - Purple Rain



    "Because nothing has the be true forever. Just for long enough, to tell you the truth."

    - T. Pratchett, The Truth

  17. #60
    Silver Meritorious Sponsor HelluvaHoax!'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Olivia Newton- John , John Travolta Reunited

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A. Baker View Post
    The fact is the only 'crime' either one is guilty of is actually liking & promoting scientology. That is neither inherently abusive or criminal. It is something you just "can't have" or allow.

    ***** WORDCLOWN ALERT! *****

    When Tom Cruise gives tens of millions of dollars to Miscavige and hundreds of millions of dollars of free publicity to the Church of Scientology and then publicly denies that Miscavige and the Church are imprisoning and beating people, that is inherently abusive and criminal.

    No one can claim that these celebrities "don't know" when they are issuing lies and propaganda to the media to protect Scientology's crimes.

    It doesn't matter whether you use Scientology's delusional "tech" to pretend that other's "can't have" case-condition is the real problem. That is a feeble lie, even for you Baker.

    By defending their amorality you, yourself, likewise become an amoral facilitator and enabler.
    ________________________

    Scientology literally saved my life! Without Ron's books I would have frozen to death!!! (see avatar)

    Scientology in one word? HelluvaHoax!

    I never felt as free as when I freed myself from "Total Freedom".

    For offended Scientologists reading this blasphemy about L. Ron Hubbard---my apologies for talking about real life without lying to you, like Scientology, with goo-goo theta-talk. I know you don't have a floating needle right now. You're not supposed to.

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