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Thread: VV: Scientology - Mike Rinder on "The Hole," Indoctrination, Confessions, ...

  1. #111

    Default Re: VV: Scientology - Mike Rinder on "The Hole," Indoctrination, Confessions, ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mick Wenlock View Post
    Never fear, Marty KNOWS, deep down inside, in the shriveled place where there used to be a heart and some courage, that he really does not deserve any respect at all.

    He got pwned a long long time ago.
    Most eloquent.

  2. #112

    Default Re: Ortega and Rinder

    Quote Originally Posted by Jquepublic View Post
    Terril, I've seen the way he talks to you in the comments - you may be a friend to him, but he's not YOUR friend, and you should just tell him to eff off and get on with your life.
    I won't darken the doors of his blog again.

  3. Likes johnAnchovie liked this post
  4. #113
    Crusader RogerB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    New York

    Default Re: Ortega and Rinder

    Quote Originally Posted by lurkanon View Post
    You are on the right track here. There are people - five at least - who SAW Lisa McPherson's folders, albeit culled, at the early stages of the trial. Those 5 people know what was in the folders.

    Lisa was suicidal after her Sunshine Rundown. Repairs were run. What was bothering her was the "outethics" of her employer, Beneta Slaughter, and Lisa was troubled by them. On that origination in her pc folder, was written in red ink:

    "BS is an upstat OT8 in good standing", with a note "Route to Ethics".

    So, following Lisa's originations that she was bothered by what she had seen of BS's unethical business practices, she became a target for Ethics, because of what she knew. After that, Lisa's folders indicated that she was being pushed deeper and deeper into psychosis.

    Many people were involved, and not only DM.

    There are 5 people, out of the Church, ostensibly critics, who saw those folders. Yet not one of them has come forward to testify about this.

    There is something very, very wrong and unresolved with the Lisa McPherson case, and Mike Rinder and Marty DEFINITELY know more. As do five others. Of the five others, only one is still a public critic, the other four are quiet.

    Until Mike and Marty come clean with full disclosure about what happened to Lisa, they cannot expect their karma to resolve, and Lisa McPherson will continue to haunt them.
    Very interesting, Lurkanon . . .

    This is the first time I've seen this point regarding her reporting/worrying about the out-eth of her employer who had "status in the Cof$," only to then be spun in with denials of her comm and wrong indications and wrong handlings heaped on her . . . all based on her honest concerns and communication of the out-eth eth observed in one of the "church's" favorites.

    This is a bit of a WOWZER! to me . . . I did not have this info . . . and now it all becomes understandable.

    She revealed an unpalatable truth (even if mistaken) and she got technically wrongly handled based on the prejudices the Cof$ has for protecting its and its "upstats" good name and PR.


    How criminally insane and despotic is that!

    It is possible the girl was already spiritually fragile . . . but to have an important communication (at least to you) refuted and to be wrongly accused for delivering it, is a sure way to cave anyone in!

    The Cof$ has become such an evil monster . . . .

    Life is supposed to be enjoyed, Mate!

    Don't show me the money . . . give me the TRUTH!

  5. #114
    Crusader RogerB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    New York

    Default Re: Ortega and Rinder

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Laws View Post
    You may be right, but these questions were more intimate and real and difficult than any interview I remember Mike doing. I have the fortune or misfortune of being his friend, who is a clearly stated ex/non scio. I believe the real decompression doesn't start until people speak about things, and do what they can to take responsibility. Mike is really, barely, 2-3 years into a process in my experience that takes 5-10 at best for lifetimers/ex kids. But unfortunately, he is also a public figure, which IMHO makes the healing process and recovery much more difficult, perspectives swing and change radically in the recovery process, if he expresses such publicly he is called a liar, hypocrite, etc. It is impossibly to satisfy everyone, it is a position I wouldn't want to be in.

    As a friend, he wouldn't have said or opened up with a quarter of what he did in this interview even a year ago, especially expressing self doubt as to why he did what he did, 1-2 years ago he "knew" all the answers, so I consider it positive. Do I consider he, I and most exes still have a long way to go? Absolutely, and we talk about it frankly every time we visit. IMHO this was a good move in the right direction. Do I consider more of this beneficial to him and others? Absolutely.

    IMHO we don't even start to get a sustainable and stable idea of who we are and what we did or are about until a couple years out.

    I believe the route out is much tougher and more painful than we realize or can handle in one step. A gradual disentanglement as we were gradually entangled.
    I agree, Mike.

    I personally was very grateful he has opened up and speaking as he did there.

    Too many people expect "perfection" (in the terms of their own hidden, unobtainable standards, unfortunately) . . . . that can only occur at the right time and in the right context.

    Right now, Mike R did a wonderful interview that will help many.

    He is to be applauded and thanked for it.

    More will come later . . . .

    Right now, public opinion is being swung against the Cof$ . . . later, the heavier guns can be brought to bear to more fully handle the monster.

    He struck me as honest, well considered and credible. Nice!

    Life is supposed to be enjoyed, Mate!

    Don't show me the money . . . give me the TRUTH!

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  7. #115
    Diamond Invictus SP Type4_PTS's Avatar
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    Jun 2009

    Default Re: VV: Scientology - Mike Rinder on "The Hole," Indoctrination, Confessions, ...

    In today's edition of the Underground Bunker is an interview with the most recent escapee from international management, Paul Burkhart. He personally witnessed Scientology's international management team being held as prisoners in The Hole:

    SCIENTOLOGY’S SPACE MAN: The newest defector from church management opens up

    In 2009, Scientology’s fortunes took a major hit when several of its highest ranking former officials talked to the
    St. Petersburg (now Tampa Bay) Times for a blockbuster series titled “The Truth Rundown.” Led by Mark “Marty” Rathbun, who at one time ranked second only to Scientology leader David Miscavige himself, these former executives gave the public its first glimpse into a bizarre world that included a private Scientology prison named “The Hole.”

    That was also the year that Marc Headley revealed what was happening at Scientology’s secretive California “Int Base” in his book Blown for Good. Since then, these defectors — including Amy Scobee, Mike Rinder, Tom DeVocht, and Jefferson Hawkins — have provided a compelling picture of Scientology that eventually was portrayed last year in Alex Gibney’s Emmy-winning film Going Clear.

    But what of more recent defectors from Scientology’s management ranks? In 2012, we profiled John Brousseau, the last person to leave Int Base and go public about it. He drove away from the base one day in 2010.

    Getting information about what is happening in Scientology’s upper management has been difficult since these important officials walked away. It’s coming up on six years since Brousseau made his escape and was tracked down by then-spokesman Tommy Davis for a famous encounter. In 2012, two more key Scientology figures left the base, which we reported at the time. One of them, Ron Miscavige Sr., will be telling his story later this year when his book, “If He Dies, He Dies,” is published by St. Martin’s Press. The other escapee, Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard’s granddaughter Roanne Horwich, has not talked publicly since making her exit.

    But now, there is another defector from the ranks of Scientology’s international management who has come forward.

    We met him in Seattle, on our book tour. And now, we’re ready to tell his story. His name is Paul Burkhart, and he left the Sea Organization in August 2013.

    Not only is his information on the inner workings of Scientology only a couple of years old, he also worked at Int Base from 1999 to 2009 in a key position that allowed him to observe some of the significant events that took place during that time.

    For the first time in years, we have a new eyewitness to what happened at Int Base, in the Hole, and with Shelly Miscavige. And we were curious to how his memories stack up to what we’ve been told by Rathbun, Rinder, Headley, Scobee, and Brousseau.


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