The Edge interview with high level scientology defector (Bill Franks)

[Gadfly]

And Why would "Ron" say to Hana Eltringham (Now Whitfield) who was Deputy Commodore at the time:

"It's all just hypnosis"

While walking through a passageway?

As I see it, Hubbard DOES state things as they are, very often, but unknown to the suckers who follow him and his system, he OFTEN USES THOSE AGAINST THE PERSON TO MANIPULATE AND TRAP THEM.

As an example, and there are MANY, Hubbard correctly and very well discusses "fixed ideas". He explains how they are bad, how they interfere with learning, and how a person with them believes that he or she already knows it all. Hubbard well explains that it is good to spot and get rid of "fixed ideas". But then, Hubbard slyly and adeptly gets his followers to accept and adopt a whole new set of fixed ideas!

I think sometimes Hubbard just slipped, and really said what he thought, without any concern for the big manipulation aspect. When he said, "it's all just hypnosis" to Hana, he may have let his guard down (which he rarely did), and he was stating the truth as he viewed it. But, maybe not.

Now, there ARE various angles to that statement.

First, from a viewpoint of Hinduism and "maya", it is ALL an "illusion", and in a certain sense, we are each hypnotised by the "fixed reality", and especially by our OWN thoughts and considerations. From that view, it IS "all hypnosis".

Second, modern visualization and affirmation techniques, that actually derive from eastern practices and ideas, are simply, a form of intentional self-hypnosis. The acceptance of ANY set of considerations and agreements results in the perception and experience of a specific "version" of "reality". Many New Age practices are based on THAT idea (even if they don't know it or state it in exactly those terms).

So, again Hubbard stated something that DOES contain "truth", but in the end, he used it AGAINST YOU, and he did not convey the data in a way that empowered you. As I see it, he knew exactly what he was doing - and it was NOT so much to help you (other than as a pretense) as it was to "help Ron".

I first read about fixed ideas through my involvement with Scientology. I liked the data, but didn't know WHERE Hubbard had borrowed the idea from. Hubbard packaged a large assortment of different and unrelated ideas as "Scientology". At first I thought that I liked "Scientology", because I appreciated the data on "fixed ideas". It wasn't "Scientology" that I liked, but this ONE isolated idea, an idea that Hubbard INCORRECTLY LABELED AS BEING "Scientology". The notion of Scientology as an "integrated body of knowledge" is a PR gimmick. "Scientology" is largely a "mock-up" that Hubbard foisted on the world. And, it exists for any person to the degree that you think that it does.

[Magoo]

Have you ever had any unkind thoughts about L. Ron Hubbard?

Standard Security Check of 1961 (second one down in the link), and several other Security Checks:

http://www.religio.de/books/kaufman/isd-5i.htm

A small sampling of some of the 1961 Sec Check sex related questions:

Have you ever had anything to do with pornography?

Have you ever practiced homosexuality?

Have you ever exhibited yourself sexually?

Have you ever practiced sodomy?

Have you ever made a practice of having sex with a member of your own sex?

Do you collect sexual objects?

Have you ever practiced masturbation?

QUACK!!!!

Thank GOD and the Net I (and so many others) are out of that
mental institution disguised (and not very well) as "religion".

WTFU to anyone still "in". Come on, man, PLEASE ***look*** at both sides, and ask yourself: Why can't C of $ say that?

Is this HONESTLY The group you thought you joined way back when?

This is IT?

Freedom does NOT reign there. Suppression does.

Sorry to tell ya, but that is a fact.

Tory/Magoo

PS: The Very FACT That IF you listen to any of us, someone will be there to "handle you" proves my point.

[Mick Wenlock]

I remember.

The motorcycle guy.

I thought you were hot.

Ooh thank you - money enroute in brown envelope!!

[Mick Wenlock]

Exactly!

He already had them conned. Why give up the game?

The Anabaptist Jacques

Well this is a man who was all excited about getting his war record and medals - even when he had not earned the ones he was claiming,

[Mick Wenlock]

Personally, I don’t think this very likely.

As I said, the only MP I can find that was definitely murdered in the year indicated (1979) is Airey Neave. It is pretty certain that the INLA were responsible.

Then, there was Walter Travers Scott-Elliot who was murdered in 1977.

I’d like to see some hard evidence.

Of course, it is possible that the GO just claimed to have done this to keep recalcitrant members in line.

I suppose it is possible that it wasn’t actually an MP, but some government civil servant?

Axiom142

I actually don't think it is credible at all.

In 1979 to have been involved in something like this (and I agree with you Ax, Neave was most definitely assassinated by independent Irish republican dissidents) the GO would have had to have been certifiable. Given the ongoing war against the provos, the draconian steps that British counter intelligence was taking, including infiltrating the provos, false flag recruitment, and a lot of stuff we are never likely to hear about , leaving some document around with the words "murder" and "MP" in it strikes me as ludicrous. Even if it were someone merely speculating, it would be incredibly dangerous.

Does that mean BF is telling porkies? probably not given the fact that he was probably wading through paperwork by the yard it may have been speculation about what someone else was doing. Which would make more sense.

anyway - FWIW

[Moosejewels]

This week Tom Smith interviews a high level defector from the
scientology organization. Among the topics discussed are Fair Game
orders issued against elected officials of a major Western government.
Take a visit to scientology's version of the Twilight Zone. Listen to
The Edge this Friday, 8 June 2012 and Sunday 10 June 2012 from 2 - 3
p.m. eastern U.S. time on http://www.hawkradio.com or
http://theedgewithtomsmith.com As always, a podcast will be available
after broadcast.

Very interesting interview.
Thanks for posting.