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Thread: The E-meter Scam

  1. #41
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Now, about fooling the e-meter -- if you keep your hands relaxed, then for some reason it produces the readings that Hubbard called F/N (see the HCOB that I quoted at this thread)

    If you strain your hands, the e-meter needle will follow a different pattern that did not look like F/N to Hubbard. Still, it might look like F/N to some auditors -- there is nothing objective about F/N.
    “This OT shit is driving me insane. On a positive side, I laugh a lot these days because I’m at a funny farm”.
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  3. #42
    Clear as Mud Auditor's Toad's Avatar
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by Demented LRH View Post
    According to the scientist interviewed by Rock Center, changes in e-meter readings are caused by changes in the pressure produced by PC's hands. I totally agree with his assessment- the cans are the rheostats whose electric resistances change due to the pressure.
    Perhaps you missed the era of Foot Plates ?

    And Wrist Straps ?

    Maybe two permanent stainless steel in the studs could be implanted temples to eliminate these introduced abritraries.......DLRH how 'bout you volunteer so we can end this discussion ?

    Please get back to me after your studs are implanted.

    " Insist on yourself ; never imitate ".
    Ralph Waldo Emerson

    " Nothing is as at last scared but the integrity of your own mind "
    Ralph Waldo Emerson


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  5. #43
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    I would go as far as saying that interpretation of F/N depends on the auditor's state of mind.

    As I said before, I did not have a sec check, so I do not know exactly what questions are asked at the sec checks. But let's say they use this question -- have you damaged the CoS reputation in any way?

    1. This is a regular sec check.
    If the person says NO, the most likely response from the auditor is "your needle is floating" because the auditor does not expect this person to be an enemy of the church; it does not matter what kind of pattern the needle follows.

    2. This is a sec check done in response to someone's KR accusing the person of saying something against the church, Hubbard, CMO, etc.
    Let's assume that the person says NO.
    Regardless of the pattern of the needle movement, the auditor will interpret it as a non-F/N response because he does not want to stand accused of helping the enemy to escape, which is likely to happen.

    I came close to having sec check once because I said that I want to do self-auditing (I'm referring to Dianetics auditing).
    The ethics officer told me that he wants to make sure that an enemy like me would not go undetected. I am sure that he would have interpreted the e-meter readings as a non-FN motion; he already had a preconceived idea about me being an enemy.

    "Not so fast", I said and showed him quotation from Dianetics book saying that self-auditing can be done. The case was closed.
    “This OT shit is driving me insane. On a positive side, I laugh a lot these days because I’m at a funny farm”.
    L. Ron Hubbard

    No soy marinero, soy capitan del culto de mi padre.
    LRH era loco y estupido.

  6. #44
    Patron with Honors omnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    There's a lot of armchair science going on here.

    I recall the thread with Paul/DOF and one of the more vocal Anon folks that I think may have led directly to some of Paul's videos. It was a fascinating thread.

    I am entirely unconvinced of the idea of charge and blowing mass and whatnot, but I cannot debunk it entirely either, because I've never held the cans and observed the results. I'm intrigued by the pinch-test, for example, because it is measuring *something*, but nobody seems to have a very clear objective definition of "it" that I can grok.

    Therefore, I conclude that someone should dig up their old meter that they were going to throw away anyway someday and send it to me. I'm not personally invested enough to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on a kit, nor am I an EE, so I'm not going to build my own.

    Really, for whatever reason, the e-meter is something I'd like to check out, if only for my own curiosity.

  7. #45
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by omnom View Post
    Therefore, I conclude that someone should dig up their old meter that they were going to throw away anyway someday and send it to me. I'm not personally invested enough to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on a kit, nor am I an EE, so I'm not going to build my own.

    Really, for whatever reason, the e-meter is something I'd like to check out, if only for my own curiosity.
    I wish I had an e-meter so I could send it to you. But I never bought one for myself. I heard that the folks who recently left CoS sell their e-meters on eBay at a nominal price.
    “This OT shit is driving me insane. On a positive side, I laugh a lot these days because I’m at a funny farm”.
    L. Ron Hubbard

    No soy marinero, soy capitan del culto de mi padre.
    LRH era loco y estupido.

  8. #46
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by omnom View Post

    -snip-

    I recall the thread with Paul/DOF and one of the more vocal Anon folks that I think may have led directly to some of Paul's videos. It was a fascinating thread.

    -snip-

    If someone could locate that thread, it might be useful as a reference.


    Hubbard, 1952:

    "This is a cold blooded and factual account of your last 60 trillion years..."


    From old timer John Sanborn:

    "In a (early/mid 1950s) Phoenix Congress... he talked about spooky whole track stuff. He had a floodlight on the floor in front of this little platform shining up, because that makes you look ghouly. And his face looked really weird and outer space and really crazy... and he talked weird... I think he was trying to drive people a little bit wacko so they'd fall into his hand a little bit."




    Hubbard, 1963:

    "Now, I'll give you an idea - an idea of this. For instance, I know - I know where I was and who I was, and know with good certainty, who I was and where I was in the last eighty trillion years. See, I know that; that's not much of an argument with me. But the small details of that are liable to go fritter-fritter here and there. You know, what did I have for breakfast two trillion years ago? No. Nix, man. Nah. Did I even eat, you see? That sort of thing is getting pretty dim."


    Hubbard, 1966:

    "Many persons experience unreality at the start of [ancient implants told to the person] GPM running. This leaves when you see the meter reads."
    Visit the Ex Scientologist Message Board web site for selected content from ESMB and more: http://exscn.net/

  9. #47
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by omnom View Post
    Really, for whatever reason, the e-meter is something I'd like to check out, if only for my own curiosity.
    If you ever get hold of one, be careful of any immediate conclusions you draw. Story:

    I have a friend locally who's recently become interested in Scn-related matters. I've been trying to steer him away from Scn itself. He's visited a couple of times. He tried building an e-meter and some months ago brought over what he had made, and I checked it over, and it didn't really work at all. A couple of weeks ago he came over with a Mark V that he had obtained from somewhere, that seemed to work OK. I put him on the cans, set the sensitivity, with the TA at around 2.5, nice loose needle, and did a "stress test" with him able to see the dial: think of something very stressful. I got a nice read after a couple of seconds, said "that," and "that" again a few seconds later (a similar read, not identical), and asked if he'd found something stressful. He smiled and said yes. I didn't want any details. I said that was all we were going to do and he put the cans down.

    He had very little time left for his visit. He had wanted to get some reality on using a meter and now had it. He had experience of using PaulsRobot3 to discharge anything stressful, so I wasn't too concerned about stirring something up.

    I mentioned that the meter read first on "the session," the communication between the auditor and the pc, and that if he played with the meter himself, just having random things running through his mind and looking at the meter dial, then the needle would just rise (move to the left, showing increasing resistance) and rise, finally stopping around TA 6* with a stuck needle. He laughed and said that was exactly what had happened with him. I told him it happened like that to most people. Since the meter reads first on the session rather than the pc's "case," it was probably reacting to his lack of confidence in the auditor (himself), as he knew dick about operating a meter. Conversely, he had a lot of confidence in me, and so the meter was able to read on his life like it was meant to.

    *TA 2.5 = (approx) 8000 ohms and TA 6.0 = 292,000 ohms per this link:
    http://www.freezoneearth.org/allmete...k/Freesolo.htm


    Paul
    PaulsRobot Iconic now available for use at www.PaulsRobot2.com. With Auto-Report. Video here. Introductory post here. Debug post here. Dipoles post here.

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  11. #48
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by Veda View Post
    If someone could locate that thread, it might be useful as a reference.
    http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthrea...turday-June-20

    Paul
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  13. #49
    Patron with Honors omnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by Dulloldfart View Post
    If you ever get hold of one, be careful of any immediate conclusions you draw.
    To be honest, I'd probably play with it a bit out of curiosity, then check out a metering course online to familiarize myself with a very basic understanding of how to use it. Thank you for the heads-up, though. I appreciate it.

    Anything I'd come up with would be only my own curiosity - nothing I would be doing would be scientifically admissible, nor an authority. I just really want to see it in action (on me) without having to go sit at the mall in some downstat booth and don't plan on giving out contact information to Div 6.

  14. #50
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    Default Re: The E-meter Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by omnom View Post
    I just really want to see it in action (on me) without having to go sit at the mall in some downstat booth and don't plan on giving out contact information to Div 6.
    Go to the mall! Really, do it, assuming this is a possibility for you. It won't cost you anything (leave all cash and plastic at home), and you should have enough confidence in the person operating the meter for it to read properly. And it's certainly easier than buying one or making one. Plus you can ask the guy questions, then check his answers with us afterwards.

    For an email address, use Mailinator at http://www.mailinator.com. It's wonderful. You choose an address, any address, like dogfude@mailinator.com. No sign-up at all. To check your inbox go to http://dogfude.mailinator.com. Use too simple a name and there will be messages already for other people who have used that same name. No privacy at all. Check out a few, like http://paul.mailinator.com for instance — you'll see that "paul" gets hundreds of spam messages a day and so is useless if you want to actually receive (and read) something personal there.

    Paul
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