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Thread: Hello

  1. #61

    Default Re: Hello

    Yeah seems that way, although their whole family went so whether that was a ploy to get the others hooked!

  2. #62
    BT-free since 2003! EZ Linus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hello

    I am really sorry to hear about your friend falling victim to the cult's seductions. I'm also sorry that I dropped out of this thread a few weeks back, but I seriously don't think I could have been of any help to you before your friend left. If they went to Flag, Saint Hill or the Freewinds, all three are highly indoctrinating and I wouldn't expect them to be any less of a Scientologist when, or if, they come back. I'm really sorry.

    In my experience, it is not likely or easy to target a specific person and lure them out 1-2-3; it's not a quick process. If they have family in, it's even harder.

    I dropped out of the thread for a couple reasons. Someone sort of gave you false hope and made it sound like it was easy to pull someone out, another or the same person suggested easing them out by way of FreeZone type Scientology, and last I looked, that Goodbye guy was trying to hijack the thread and I think he's most likely a troll. Aside from that, you seemed pretty green in terms of how Scientology worked, and how cults worked despite there being a Margaret Singer video here, and yet you have been working for what sounds like a Scientology managed company for over 10 years. (Tell me if I am misunderstanding anything. I have a bad short term memory these past two years.)

    But none of that matters. I don't think you can get your friend out at this moment. You can only plant seeds like someone suggested. That does work. Over time, that worked for me. When I was ready to leave, people that planted those seeds in me started to grow like crazy. But first, you should get out. Sounds like you have one foot in.

    Read Lifton's criteria and apply it to just your working environment alone. Then tell us if some of those descriptions ring true for you at all. And then apply them to Scientology too, when you were in, or however deeply you are involved now. I don't think it will matter the depth of your involvement because the points apply to the group, not you as a person.

    Back a few posts you asked some good questions too, like what made people here leave. I think maybe you wanted people's personal stories. I think we all have helpful stories. I got out for several reasons that all sort of came to a head. A bunch of bad things happened at once. I can tell most of the story as concisely as possible if anyone is interested, but not on this thread.

    I think you should stay in touch with your friend and let her/him know that you are always available. You don't have to "say" that. Just let them know there is a place to come to when they are ready to leave, or just talk about leaving, or even venting -- you're not going to tattle with a KR. Nor are you going to be "Anti" Scientology either, that way you are definitely a safe person to speak to honestly.

    Hope this helps.

    Oh, and the "What's true for you is true" thing. I used to believe that too. Hubbard buried these things in pseudo-science, NOT SCIENCE. Still, I would never believe anything different. I wouldn't see this clearly or agree if someone outside pointed this out. That's like looking at things as being God yourself, or a delusional sociopath, which was what Hubbard was. All, or most, Scientology tenets lead back to Hubbard's state of mind/viewpoint/world view. If medical doctors are after you, then that is fact. What's true for you is true. If your teeth are made out of glue, that is a fact. What's true for you is true. If the universe bends to your will...you get it. It's gibberish.

    We believed in gibberish. We were certain of gibberish. And very confident about it too. The cultic personality was pretty much that of a confident asshole, like Hubbard. Many of us anyway. I had my moments when I thought I knew it all. The opposite of who I really am -- an insecure dope.

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  4. #63

    Default Re: Hello

    Quote Originally Posted by EZ Linus View Post
    I am really sorry to hear about your friend falling victim to the cult's seductions. I'm also sorry that I dropped out of this thread a few weeks back, but I seriously don't think I could have been of any help to you before your friend left. If they went to Flag, Saint Hill or the Freewinds, all three are highly indoctrinating and I wouldn't expect them to be any less of a Scientologist when, or if, they come back. I'm really sorry.

    In my experience, it is not likely or easy to target a specific person and lure them out 1-2-3; it's not a quick process. If they have family in, it's even harder.

    I dropped out of the thread for a couple reasons. Someone sort of gave you false hope and made it sound like it was easy to pull someone out, another or the same person suggested easing them out by way of FreeZone type Scientology, and last I looked, that Goodbye guy was trying to hijack the thread and I think he's most likely a troll. Aside from that, you seemed pretty green in terms of how Scientology worked, and how cults worked despite there being a Margaret Singer video here, and yet you have been working for what sounds like a Scientology managed company for over 10 years. (Tell me if I am misunderstanding anything. I have a bad short term memory these past two years.)

    But none of that matters. I don't think you can get your friend out at this moment. You can only plant seeds like someone suggested. That does work. Over time, that worked for me. When I was ready to leave, people that planted those seeds in me started to grow like crazy. But first, you should get out. Sounds like you have one foot in.

    Read Lifton's criteria and apply it to just your working environment alone. Then tell us if some of those descriptions ring true for you at all. And then apply them to Scientology too, when you were in, or however deeply you are involved now. I don't think it will matter the depth of your involvement because the points apply to the group, not you as a person.

    Back a few posts you asked some good questions too, like what made people here leave. I think maybe you wanted people's personal stories. I think we all have helpful stories. I got out for several reasons that all sort of came to a head. A bunch of bad things happened at once. I can tell most of the story as concisely as possible if anyone is interested, but not on this thread.

    I think you should stay in touch with your friend and let her/him know that you are always available. You don't have to "say" that. Just let them know there is a place to come to when they are ready to leave, or just talk about leaving, or even venting -- you're not going to tattle with a KR. Nor are you going to be "Anti" Scientology either, that way you are definitely a safe person to speak to honestly.

    Hope this helps.

    Oh, and the "What's true for you is true" thing. I used to believe that too. Hubbard buried these things in pseudo-science, NOT SCIENCE. Still, I would never believe anything different. I wouldn't see this clearly or agree if someone outside pointed this out. That's like looking at things as being God yourself, or a delusional sociopath, which was what Hubbard was. All, or most, Scientology tenets lead back to Hubbard's state of mind/viewpoint/world view. If medical doctors are after you, then that is fact. What's true for you is true. If your teeth are made out of glue, that is a fact. What's true for you is true. If the universe bends to your will...you get it. It's gibberish.

    We believed in gibberish. We were certain of gibberish. And very confident about it too. The cultic personality was pretty much that of a confident asshole, like Hubbard. Many of us anyway. I had my moments when I thought I knew it all. The opposite of who I really am -- an insecure dope.
    Thanks for you comments and your being a bit hard on yourself.

    I'm not one foot in, I did a purif a few years back but didn't buy into it. I bombarded them with many questions during the purif and I don't think they could give me all the answers or they contradicted themselves. Nice people but many of them I felt were out of touch with life, reality and a bit sheltered. I do recall some of what they said made sense, but I was pretty outgoing, confident and self assured so I wasn't their ideal victim. They didn't chase me much after I got back home, maybe one or two calls tops after. I also think I pissed on their bonfire abit when they claimed I had improved my iq score by 10. I inturn said it was the same test and I could remember the answers so I was able to move on and answer more questions. I didn't think it was an accurate way to measure any improvements and was surprised they hadn't considered this fact.

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  6. #64
    Gold Meritorious Patron TheOriginalBigBlue's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hello

    Quote Originally Posted by Whattodo View Post
    Thanks for you comments and your being a bit hard on yourself.

    I'm not one foot in, I did a purif a few years back but didn't buy into it. I bombarded them with many questions during the purif and I don't think they could give me all the answers or they contradicted themselves. Nice people but many of them I felt were out of touch with life, reality and a bit sheltered. I do recall some of what they said made sense, but I was pretty outgoing, confident and self assured so I wasn't their ideal victim. They didn't chase me much after I got back home, maybe one or two calls tops after. I also think I pissed on their bonfire abit when they claimed I had improved my iq score by 10. I inturn said it was the same test and I could remember the answers so I was able to move on and answer more questions. I didn't think it was an accurate way to measure any improvements and was surprised they hadn't considered this fact.
    Right. If they were honest they would factor that into the test results or just use another set of questions. Stay in long enough and you will have done that same test 5 - 10 times or more getting a higher IQ each time.

    Then of course there is the PR Personality, the sociopath with the thin social veneer who instinctively knows the answer you want. Ironically, this test teaches people to emulate that ability and the Church claims it as a win.

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  8. #65

    Default Re: Hello

    For those that have been involved in scientology what was the trigger point or series of events that made you leave? Did you route out or blow if that's the right terms? I'm quite interested to hear people's experiences outside of the high profile cases you usuallt see on video clips or programmes.

  9. #66
    Comfortably Numb strativarius's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hello

    Quote Originally Posted by Whattodo View Post
    For those that have been involved in scientology what was the trigger point or series of events that made you leave? Did you route out or blow if that's the right terms? I'm quite interested to hear people's experiences outside of the high profile cases you usuallt see on video clips or programmes.
    There have been several threads on this subject. I started one myself a couple of years ago and got some very interesting responses. You can find it here.
    To err is human, to purr is feline - Alexander Pope

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