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Thread: Our Children...

  1. #21

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    I definately felt like my mother was pretty hands off when I was growing up. I realize now that this had a lot to do with the Scientology culture, but also her own culture as a child. I realize that my mother did well to care for me as a child by 1) breast feeding rather than barley water and 2) refusing to sign me up for the sea org.
    Yeah mom! It could have been so much worse.

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  3. #22
    Silver Meritorious Patron sandygirl's Avatar
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    As a mom this topic is the one that woke me up when it came to Scio. I feel very limited in what I can post because I have relatives in the SO (2 are minors) and do not want to cause them any trouble. Their parents signed all of their children over to the SO!!! They were promised to be together and were split apart within six months.!!I have a family member who was a nanny in ths SO before the forbidding of children. I have heard about the conditions there and it is frightening.

    The latest DM "handpicked" mission which came to our area (and I mean a total bunch of pricks) actually called me to ask my children's ages!!! I had seen other cycles parents were going through and that was the last straw in an already overflowing basket!! I got out and thank God every day that I did!

    Some things I have noticed as a public..

    Unsupervised kids running around the Org. as parents are on post.
    Dirty, hungry, bored and no structure in their lives.
    Kids being kept out of public schools because of the fear of evil psychs. waiting to drug them as they walk in the door! one friend of mine who was a staff member had a NINE YEAR OLD CHILD THAT COULDN'T READ!!!!She joked about her "out ethics" as a mom but, oh well, she's saving the planet!!!

    I hope to God a Child Protection Agency gets in there unannouced!!!
    I read a very disturbing post last night about the conditions of the children in FLO right now and I could barely sleep!!! I'm not tech savvy or I would link it!

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  5. #23
    Silver Meritorious Patron nw2394's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarmeloOrchards View Post
    In short, Scientology (meaning the tech) has only been beneficial to our family. The tech rocks. The church sucks.
    Sounds to me like you rock too. Welcome aboard anyway.

    Nick

  6. #24
    Still raging johnAnchovie's Avatar
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    Default Gut wrenching

    Aside from executives ordering staff to have abortions - right up to when I left, and kids telling me how a nanny had pulled them down stairs by their hair, where parents were pro-active, kids were protected.

    Your stories are heart breaking, I hope yu all find healing, particularly Gussepi and Bea.

    I am reposting this - I have psoted in several places - but it is very pertinent, and I think it sheds light on the very real issue, that of subsuming, the capitulation of one's own sense of self to that of the apparent greater power or force, once one does this he looses all, but if he/she recovers this sense of self esteem, an esteem based only on respect or love for self, not an esteem based on 'what one has accomplished' or even 'pride in accomplishement' just love and respect of self, then he is very difficult to overcome. This is one of my own stories from England.

    I had a troubled childhood thanks to the death of both parents when I was nine. One effect of this is that I remain highly sensitised or attuned to the needs of children, and I have always had a lot of time for kids. In Scientology’s fanatical inner core, called ‘The Sea Org’ kids are actually treated with quite some cruelty, and I could never come to terms with this. I bought time on my job, and I began working with the school, taking kids out on day trips and so on.

    Some of these children had been separated from their parents for as much as two years, parents doing 'more important duties' and training in Flag Land Base, one couple saw their child for maybe two days every month.

    There was this beautiful June Sunday morning, I was on my official ‘cleaning or hygiene time as it was known – essentially four hours out of an 105 hour working week, when you get to do your laundry - I noticed that all the children looked unusually down and upset, and were dejectedly mopping floors and dusting around inside the Manor, outside the grass was green, the sun shone and world looked beautiful. I asked the kids what was going on, I found that they all were doing a punishment detail, were under 'Ethics' 'lower conditions' this a system that punishes both physically and mentally, includes the withdrawal of any small privileges that they may have, kids as young as eight, and no older that twelve, who should be running around outside having fun were being subjected to a system of mental oppression and physical confinement that I would not wish on Serbian general convicted of war crimes, well maybe, but not anyone else. I did this stuff as an adult and it nearly drove me nuts, it breaks you while installing further pavlovian conditioning.

    I got really angry, I mean furious. These were really lovely children, but actually traumatised, often due to long months, and one case two years, of enforced separation from their parents. Not natural at all is it?

    Anyway, I marched up to the school where Angela – the school in charge and 'legal gaurdian' to many of thenow 'de-parented' kids -, looking rather apathetic herself, was browbeating a child into some kind of acquiescence to Hubbard’s dictates, I told her in no uncertain terms that I was taking all these kids with me to my riding centre, I actually paid for a guided hack for all ten of them, and thus began a very fulfilling twenty four months as big brother and protector of these kids. Not all the kids could sustain the discipline required to advance in riding, some did not have enough interest, but I worked intensively with four of them, and wept one day after months of work, when they preformed a perfect canter in the arena, really working with and listening to their ponies - just how I taught ‘em - with two of the parents looking on.

    I actually gained the necessary qualifications to be an officially recognised teacher with all the necessary clearances required for working with children. I have this certificate with me to this day. I am proud of it.

    We were surrounded with wild life, I would often find wounded or ill wild animals on the road or in the forest, badgers, rabbits, even a baby deer, having established a very proactive relationship with a local wildlife rescue centre, I used this as a tool to broaden the children’s worldview, I would have small groups help to deliver ‘first aid’ to the animals I rescued before delivering them to the wildlife centre, in the case of the baby deer, this took a little longer, as a special box had to be found to transport the animal, trying to keep excited children quiet around such a creature was big job, but they did very well. We got dogs, and I would load kids and dogs into one of my buses and take them to Bangor Stand, and let them run wild, I don’t know if I was a good teacher, but the kids had fun, and the parents were actually very appreciative.

    The Hubbard Personnel Dept. was not appreciative however. The Senior Personnel officer was aiming to get these kids on almost full time training and indoctrination to turn them in fanatical sycophants of Hubbard and his Scientology cult, a state that would allow them to work at the highest, most secret top level of the organisation, known as Religious Technology Centre. They were supposed to finish the legal minimum of schooling each day and then all go to Saint Hill – cult HQ in UK - and partake in very intensive indoctrination, or if not partaking that day, then on cleaning and other work details. Being the transport main operator, I would often pick up stressed out, almost psychotic, pale faced exhausted children from the base, as we called it, they having done up to five hours in these indoctrination sessions and such like. I had two physical fights with personnel people over this, but eventually worked out a compromise where I would get a batch of kids one day, and they the same batch the next.

    One of the saddest experiences I had was when I had ‘my’ kids join a barbeque at the riding centre, where parents and schools who had children doing lessons all joined up at an open day, my batch of kids refused to join the other children, they hung around me, the little ones actually clung to me. They were frightened of these ‘wog’ kids, (wog is a word that Hubbard used extensively to describe anybody not in Scientology, it was made into common parlance, meaning we were superior to these backwards savages outside of our cult, the children were particularly susceptible to this form of
    asocialisation) they were actually scared and intimidated, having never actually spent any time outside the confines of the weird world of Scientology. I don’t like to think what the ‘wog’ parents thought.

    I look back now on this time with mixed feelings of the sense of joy I got out of providing something special for a really lovely bunch of kids, and sadness that no one else took this up after I was promoted out to an external posting. I hope that my action will have broadened their minds, made them see that there is something out side of Scientology, that maybe there is another way to do things aside from Hubbard’s mad ramblings and Miscavich’s insane rages and dictates, maybe..

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  8. #25
    Patron AnonymousID-V42B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bea Kiddo View Post
    As for me, and my children: they are both dead. Enforced abortion. I was married at the time. There was no real reason to abort. I did it for the Sea Org. So I could stay.

    I would have a 14 year old and a 6 year old now.
    A little interjection here, but...

    This is to Bea and everyone else who had this sort of thing:-

    It's not the same, I know. And not to make light of it. But...

    Y'all got over 9000 kids now. Okay, we're a little crazy, we all wear masks, and we might get a little rowdy. But hey. We're rowdy because we don't like bad things happening to our mommies and daddies and aunties and uncles, and brothers and sisters.

    Last edited by AnonymousID-V42B; 7th March 2008 at 04:03 AM. Reason: added a note
    "If David Miscaviage declared hell suppressive, I would make at least a favorable reference to the Devil in /b/."
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  10. #26
    Floater Good twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnonymousID-V42B View Post
    A little interjection here, but...

    This is to Bea and everyone else who had this sort of thing:-

    It's not the same, I know. And not to make light of it. But...

    Y'all got over 9000 kids now. Okay, we're a little crazy, we all wear masks, and we might get a little rowdy. But hey. We're rowdy because we don't like bad things happening to our mommies and daddies and aunties and uncles, and brothers and sisters.

    thanks sweetie!

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  12. #27
    Gold Meritorious Patron gomorrhan's Avatar
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    The only effect I know for sure that scientology has had on my children is that they were disconnected from me. I don't know if they've had a good or bad time of it, they seem to live well and do well with their mother who is the custodial parent, and apparently still a scientologist. While I was in the hospital recently, she emailed my sister to tell her to buy and use an assist handbook for use with an unconscious person, which is how I know she's still "in". I can IMAGINE that it must have been hard for my kids to be separated, but I don't really know anything about it. The effect it had on ME was devastating.

    What I would like to say to them is this:

    I was going through a very serious crisis, and concerned that I might be dangerous to myself and others, and the Church fed this idea by declaring me a "Suppressive Person". I was compliant with this, and decided it would be best for you if I left, and if I didn't insinuate myself into your lives. I thought it would be best for you if I cut the cord, so that you wouldn't be influenced by a pattern that repeated itself in my family over generations. In my own way, I was trying to protect you, despite the damage it would do to disconnect, and to be disconnected, myself. I know, now, that this was a huge error. All I can do at this point is be available (and keep surviving, which seems to have been extraordinarily difficult, recently) when you need me, and make sure you know I am here, and that I am willing to help with college, or with connections into the work areas you are interested in. I am very sorry for my poor judgment being involved with that Church, and words cannot express how sorry I am that you paid the price for my ignorance and poor judgment when I was a teen parent.
    going somewhere?

    Scientologists: do you think you can confront the truth? http://www.carolineletkeman.org/sp/ <==== duplicate that

    Kevin G. Brady gomorrhan@hotmail.com
    44 Phillips Street, Apartment 2L
    Wickford, RI 02852
    (401) 626-6776

    "I'm Kevin Brady, and I approved this message" - Kevin Brady

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  14. #28
    Crusader Bea Kiddo's Avatar
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    Kevin, thank you for sharing. My father, who got declared when I was 3 and we disconnected from for 25 plus years, whom I have recently found, has essentially given me the same frame of mind as you in regards to his decision to not be in our lives while in Scientology. I understood this. (The only other thing he mentioned was that leaving us there with Scn, he knew that we would be in decent hands. He knew, though there were quirks in the religion, we would not end up on drugs, or into violent crime, or on the street. Though we were to a degree, not to an extreme degree).

    ----

    As a child growing up not knowing why he did that, or if he would ever come back, I would only suggest to you that you make sure your children know how you feel so they can at least hear it from you, and make their own decision about it.


    I dont think it is totally your right, or the moms right, to decide that. The children should be involved.

    Be well.

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  16. #29
    Crusader Bea Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnonymousID-V42B View Post
    A little interjection here, but...

    This is to Bea and everyone else who had this sort of thing:-

    It's not the same, I know. And not to make light of it. But...

    Y'all got over 9000 kids now. Okay, we're a little crazy, we all wear masks, and we might get a little rowdy. But hey. We're rowdy because we don't like bad things happening to our mommies and daddies and aunties and uncles, and brothers and sisters.

    Thank you. Beautifully said. I love it. I may still think of myself as a sister, cause well, er uh, , I dont have too many grey hairs yet....

    Thanks to all of you. You guys are all great...

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  18. #30
    Patron with Honors ChaoticPsychotic's Avatar
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    As a small child, my parents worked full time for a mission. It was Palo Alto mission which then became Redwood City mission. My mom then went on to work at Delphi full time.

    Mission staff would seem like it should be a lot less grueling that SO or Org Staff. Not the case. My dad worked for 18 years. He worked from about 8 or 9 am until around 10pm to 12am.

    I blame Scientology for this - I essentially grew up with out my father around. He would sometimes make it home for a 1/2 hour dinner break. I would sometimes go all week without seeing my dad. My mom sometimes would have to pack up dinner and bring my little bro and I to the mission to see dad in between reg cycles.

    I was a very active child in school. I was always participating in sports events, school plays, the choir etc. Every time I had a game, play, performance of some sort, my dad was told well in advance. It never seemed to make a difference. He rarely made it. Mom worked at the school so she was always there. Someone had to drive me to the soccer game so she was always there. My grandparents would make it a lot, especially if I had a solo performance or lead role in a play. My aunts and uncles occasionally would show up to lend their support. Always though, every time I would ask "is my daddy here yet?". He would sometimes make it in time to catch the last 10 minutes. But really that rarely happened. It was always the mission first, me second.

    Fast forward to my adult life... for some reason I am still waiting for my daddy. I see him more now than I did as a child. I am thankful for this. There are still times though - like for his only grandchild's 2nd birthday - that he isn't able to make it. These days it's because he is busy volunteering for the local Org. His grandson is now 3 3/4 years old. I sometimes hear him say... "is Grandpa here?".


    Daddy, I love you and I am still waiting for you. Please see that the church is not as important as your family.

    I love you.

    Your daughter
    "The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently" - Nietzsche

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