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    Patron Meritorious Tom of Helatrobus's Avatar
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    Default Mark V vs Mark VII

    I just bought a Mark V meter and some materials from a local ex-Scientologist for about $100. I guess my main motivation, besides curiosity is to train myself and others in giving false reads. If I can get a F/N at will, then I think that's pretty cool - I'm a nerd.

    Also I might want to meter check my son to see if he's lieing to me. That way he can grow up to be an ex-ex-Scientology kid. Just kidding, but I'm sure I'll be tempted.

    Originally I wanted a Mark VI or higher. I wanted the more post modern plastic case. It was too pricey thought. I wasn't willing to spend over $200. But now that I've got the Mark V, I've taken a liking to the walnut wood box and the mechanical TA counter - very charming.

    After looking through many web pages on the electronic aspects of the e-meter, I can't see a substancial difference between a Mark V and Mark VII. They really use the same essential components. To anyone who knows, is there a real difference between the models? Is there any reason to have a Mark VII instead of a Mark V? Is there any difference in functionality?

    Also, the guy I bought the meter from told me the meter has been sitting in his basement for years. It is currently plugged in and charging as I type, but if the battery doesn't hold the charge, then I'm going to have to replace the battery (- I saw a cool web site with instructions on this). So how often does that battery need to be replaced? Does anyone know how long those batteries last on the shelf?

    Also, any ideas on where to get new cans - besides the supermarket!

    Thanks,
    Tom

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    Hej that's cool, a Mark V!
    I used to have two of those, but lost them somewhere long ago.

    As for the cans: We used to go and buy canned asparagus in some supermarket, then eat the asparagus and use the cans. Worked perfectly
    Weren't there cans included in the case?
    Suppose you could buy some in an Org's bookstore, if you don't like asparagus so much.

    I remember those meters had to be charged quite frequently, therefor I usually had two, one on the charging lead, the other one I audited with.

    I also remember there was a small "resistance-thing" (Jesus, my English! Where is it?) in the case, with which one could calibrate the meter, and that had to be done on a certain day.

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    Squirrel Extraordinaire Dulloldfart's Avatar
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    Buying cans at an org would cost more than you paid for the meter, I believe, merely in terms of cash and not counting the cost in stress and hassle. Maybe you can get some in the FZ.

    If buying at a supermarket, take a small magnet along with you and try out various cans to see if they are steel. VERY few cans in the supermarket are steel. The times I have looked there for some, either for an e-meter or for my food replicator, I had a real hard time finding ANY at all.

    A VII is more sensitive than a V, and the needle is lighter too. How much difference it makes in real life, others could say better than me.

    Calibrating on a certain day? Dunno what is being referred to here. Assume it's a joke.

    Paul
    PaulsRobot Iconic now available for use at www.PaulsRobot2.com. With Auto-Report. Video here. Introductory post here. Debug post here. Dipoles post here.

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    Electronically, the MK5, VI and VII are nearly the same once the extra gizmos are removed. If you can audit, they all work the same.

    Nickel-Cadium batteries as used in a Mk 5 last about ten years, if you are lucky. When they are dead they will not hold a charge, or even accept one, and often have corrosion leaking out of the seals in their metal case which can run up inside the connecting the wires and even onto the circuit board.

    Changing the battery is not easy as it's a special one, with a "tap" after one cell. Unless you are also an electronics nerd, I suggest you send it to a (non church) e-meter repair guy for the job to be done.

    I'm in Europe so the shipping and customs hassles may not be worth it, but someone here must know someone closer to you.

    Regards, Allen

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    Hi Paul!

    For the calibrating: It was "after a certain amount of auditing hours" I remember now. No joke!

    Cans: We knew exactly which brand of asparagus we had to take in order to have cans that worked.
    They were in a supermarket down in EG, might have been Woolworth. The same we bought the Corn Flakes and the toast for breakfast.

    Was an awful long time ago
    Possibly nowadays cans are not so useful anylonger

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    Squirrel Extraordinaire Dulloldfart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corsa View Post
    Hi Paul!

    For the calibrating: It was "after a certain amount of auditing hours" I remember now. No joke!

    Cans: We knew exactly which brand of asparagus we had to take in order to have cans that worked.
    Got it re the calibration.

    I remember once getting asparagus cans that worked great. But the last time I checked, the ones I could find weren't steel.

    Paul
    PaulsRobot Iconic now available for use at www.PaulsRobot2.com. With Auto-Report. Video here. Introductory post here. Debug post here. Dipoles post here.

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    Patron teadreamer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mark V vs Mark VII

    Does anyone know who can service and calibrate a Mk V in Britain ?

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    Default Re: Mark V vs Mark VII

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom of Helatrobus View Post
    I just bought a Mark V meter and some materials from a local ex-Scientologist for about $100. I guess my main motivation, besides curiosity is to train myself and others in giving false reads. If I can get a F/N at will, then I think that's pretty cool - I'm a nerd.

    Also I might want to meter check my son to see if he's lieing to me. That way he can grow up to be an ex-ex-Scientology kid. Just kidding, but I'm sure I'll be tempted.

    Originally I wanted a Mark VI or higher. I wanted the more post modern plastic case. It was too pricey thought. I wasn't willing to spend over $200. But now that I've got the Mark V, I've taken a liking to the walnut wood box and the mechanical TA counter - very charming.

    After looking through many web pages on the electronic aspects of the e-meter, I can't see a substancial difference between a Mark V and Mark VII. They really use the same essential components. To anyone who knows, is there a real difference between the models? Is there any reason to have a Mark VII instead of a Mark V? Is there any difference in functionality?

    Also, the guy I bought the meter from told me the meter has been sitting in his basement for years. It is currently plugged in and charging as I type, but if the battery doesn't hold the charge, then I'm going to have to replace the battery (- I saw a cool web site with instructions on this). So how often does that battery need to be replaced? Does anyone know how long those batteries last on the shelf?

    Also, any ideas on where to get new cans - besides the supermarket!

    Thanks,
    Tom
    Like everything else that is Cof$, even the latest, never released Mk 8 e-meter is obsolete due to the KSW mentality that refuses to allow innovation of any sort. Meanwhile, outside of the Cof$ on the web, there are plans available to build a "c-meter" which is all electronic and is designed to be tossed into a computer in an expansion card slot. Taking that a step further, there is no reason that the device couldn't be built as USB 2 or USB 3 device. Taking it further still, instead of cans for electrodes, the device can be worn via wrist strap and be wireless to the computer via bluetooth device plugged into the USB port. Going over to a computer for display purposes allows for other changes ... various display enhancements, the computer would log T/A changes, both the metering as well as audio and video of the session could be recorded, there is the possibility of remote auditing over the web, etc. That is all within just the functionality of an e-meter mated to a computer, but there is more.

    The e-meter is essentially a wheatstone bridge circuit that measures resistance, galvanic skin resistance in particular. There are aspects of the spirit/mind/body connections that cause minor changes in that parameter depending upon what the individual is busy looking at in his mind, true enough. But galvanic skin resistance is only one parameter. Even lie detectors, which are old and relatively crude devices, measure a lot more than that. There are brainwaves, pulse, blood pressure, and various changes to facial muscles that can be monitored as well. And its not like these are useless parameters to monitor ... its just that nobody within the Cof$ or independent/freezone has bothered to conduct a study, at least not one that I am aware of.

    Bottom line ... the rest of the world has moved forward. If IQ enhancement is what you are looking for, there are all manner of brain games and perception exercises available on the web and for generally well less than 10% of the cost of a single expensive of professional auditing. For about 50 or so dollars, you can get games that directly interface brainwave output to a computer. I saw a few advertised at Best Buy before Christmas. Now is as good a time as any to get with the times.

    Pete

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    Squirrel Extraordinaire Dulloldfart's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mark V vs Mark VII

    Quote Originally Posted by GoNuclear View Post
    Like everything else that is Cof$, even the latest, never released Mk 8 e-meter is obsolete due to the KSW mentality that refuses to allow innovation of any sort. Meanwhile, outside of the Cof$ on the web, there are plans available to build a "c-meter" which is all electronic and is designed to be tossed into a computer in an expansion card slot. Taking that a step further, there is no reason that the device couldn't be built as USB 2 or USB 3 device. Taking it further still, instead of cans for electrodes, the device can be worn via wrist strap and be wireless to the computer via bluetooth device plugged into the USB port. Going over to a computer for display purposes allows for other changes ... various display enhancements, the computer would log T/A changes, both the metering as well as audio and video of the session could be recorded, there is the possibility of remote auditing over the web, etc. That is all within just the functionality of an e-meter mated to a computer, but there is more.
    I hadn't thought of a bluetooth connection between the electrodes and the meter. Although my choice would be to stay with wired unless I had a *very* good assurance that there were not spurious signals showing on the display.

    This article by David St Lawrence on my iCans remote auditing blog, Testing New Meter Electrodes, includes several photographs of stick-on electrodes, a meter smaller than a cigarette packet that plugs into a USB port, and a highly versatile display. David says that he does almost all of his metering from the memory trace (last 30 or 60 seconds) and not the needle itself. He still notes instant reads, of course.

    Analogue meters are so, well, last-century dood.



    Paul
    PaulsRobot Iconic now available for use at www.PaulsRobot2.com. With Auto-Report. Video here. Introductory post here. Debug post here. Dipoles post here.

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    Default Re: Mark V vs Mark VII

    ..

    And don't forget . . .

    The device should bear a prominent, clearly visible notice warning that any person using it for auditing or counseling of any kind is forbidden by law to represent that there is any medical or scientific basis for believing or asserting that the device is useful in the diagnosis, treatment, or prevention of any disease. It should be noted in the warning that the device has been condemned by a United States District court for misrepresentation and misbranding under the Food and Drug laws, that use is permitted only as part of religious activity, and that the E-meter is not medically or scientifically capable of improving the health or bodily functions of anyone.......each user, purchaser, and distributee of the E-meter shall sign a written statement that he has read such a warning and understands its contents and such statements shall be preserved" (United States of America, Libelant, v. An Article or Device... "Hubbard Electrometer" or "Hubbard E-Meter" etc., Founding Church of Scientology et al., Claimants, No. D.C. 1-63, United States District Court, District of Columbia, July 30, 1971 (333 F. Supp. 357).

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