Does Intelligent Disobedience Work on a Scientologist?

Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by chipgallo, Jun 27, 2018.

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  1. chipgallo

    chipgallo Patron Meritorious

    The crash of Air Florida Flight 90 into the Potomac River is cited in chapter 4 of the book "Intelligent Disobedience: Doing Right When What You're Told to Do Is Wrong " as a case study. I was on the ground in the DC area on the day of the incident in 1982 and read later on the a.r.s. newsgroup that the captain (Larry Wheaton) was a Scientologist.

    Apparently the airline had previously corrected some deficiencies in Wheaton's skills as a pilot, a key data point in understanding what happened that fateful day. The book uses his interactions with a copilot as an example of the need for intelligent disobedience, where a difference of opinion in the cockpit should have been escalated into tactical adjustments that might have avoided the crash and loss of life. But would this have been enough?

    I have to wonder if Larry Wheaton's training in Scientology impacted his ability to assimilate contradictory (to him at least) information being given to him in the precious seconds before the plane hit the bridge and fell into icy waters. It is speculative to say that in this case the practice of TRs and other drills might diminish one's cognitive abilities. As a long-time Scientologist, Wheaton would potentially have had many hours of drilling and auditing as well. If this conditioning is a factor in life-or-death situations, it needs to be considered in attempts to mitigate the negative aspects of their behavior.

    [This Sun Sentinel article gives a recap of the story. They don't mention the OTVII in the captain's seat. Crew Resource Management aka CRM seems antithetical to Scientology training.]
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
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  2. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    A major part of Scientology admin training involves how to get compliance from juniors, and to retain certainty in overcoming backflash and Q&A.

    Being able to admit, as a senior, that you were wrong and a junior was right, is NOT Scientology.
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  3. screamer2

    screamer2 One Wealthy-Ass Son-of-a-Bitch

    Knowing what I know now, I would never board an airplane with a $cientologist as a pilot. Especially not an OT. There aren't any parking spaces in the air.
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  4. Little David

    Little David Silver Meritorious Patron

    That was my first thought when I read about this airplane crash years ago, I wouldn't want to fly in a plane piloted by a Scientologist, I'd prefer a pilot with better judgement.

    "Widow Of Air Florida Pilot Donates To Scientology"

    The Associated Press, February 10, 1984

    "I was flabbergasted," Dade Probate Judge Francis Christie said after
    learning that Joanne Wheaton donated part of the $300,000 workers' compensation
    to the group.

    The money was supposed to have gone into the estate of Larry Wheaton to
    pay off any debts, and at least part was to be safeguarded until the couple's
    two sons, Eli, 2, and Joshua, 8, turn 18, Christie told The Miami Herald
    in a story published Thursday.

    The judge has appointed a lawyer to seek return of the money.
    Wheaton's Air Florida jet crashed Jan. 13, 1982, onto a crowded bridge
    in Washington and then into the ice-filled Potomac River. Only five of the
    79 people aboard survived.

    Wheaton, 34, and his wife were ardent Scientologists and had made sizable
    contributions to the church. He was earning $72,000 a year as a pilot.
    The case of Wheaton's estate had gone before Christie because he had left
    no will. The judge learned of the disbursal of the money during routine questioning
    at a hearing.
  5. chipgallo

    chipgallo Patron Meritorious

    In 1981, while working as Ethics Officer at DC Org, I was sent to Lake Erie org. While there I met a person whose 2D (husband or boyfriend) had died while piloting a small plane. Her attitude was casual, asserting that he had only "dropped his body." It was apparently no big thing for her, although it is possible that she had received auditing to deal with the loss. This kind of attitude would be alarming in a pilot but Captain Wheaton's philosophy about death is uncertain or at least no one close to him has come forward. Some org staff were reported to believe he was a "hero" for not killing more people on the bridge (!).
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2018
  6. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor

    Yeah, but let's not dwell on the negatives of Scientology and consider the very positive side---

    In the event of a tragic plane crash of a Scientology airline, piloted by Scientologists, where large numbers of people avoidably were killed--the Scientology executives of that airline would go out to personally to the homes of the deceased and offer spiritual counseling to families and hat them on how their dead relative was severely out ethics to an SP, which caused them to go PTS, rollercoaster and die in a crash.

    This extraordinary service would be offered at no cost to grieving family members, but only on an "introductory session" basis for less than an hour. This is reasonable in order to not cause the PC to go criminal by accepting priceless technology without properly exchanging for it.
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  7. chipgallo

    chipgallo Patron Meritorious

    Thankfully, commercial aviation is not an overt (heh) asset in its corporate portfolio.
  8. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    I was in the Sea Org when this happened and only vaguely aware of it at the time. This is the first time I’ve learned that the pilot was a long term Scientologist. Reading the article the first thing that comes to my mind is “The Supreme Test of a Thetan”.

    The whole HCOB is on page 233 in the following 522 page PDF.

    Every Scientologist who spends any serious time in Scientology will know The Supreme Test and every staff member takes it as their Northern Star, guiding every thought. KSW tells us there is only one way but The Supreme Test tells us how to define the one way as “This would be forwarding a purpose not destructive to the majority of the dynamics. “ Well, who decides that? Hubbard of course.

    The Supreme Test provides the much needed rational for arbitrarily countermanding Hubbard’s own scripture to expediently serve his purposes for the moment. Scientologists become accustomed to the authority figures in Scientology making these adjudications for them so they cease being able to think for themselves. Thinking becomes reduced to compliance and force toward a purpose but they are no longer able to prioritize that purpose or assess it’s potential for harm.

    Putting a long term Scientologist in the pilot’s seat of a startup airline where this same Supreme Test mentality was the dominant mindset was a formula for disaster. Scientology isn’t the only place where people behave like this. We see it happening all around us but I think this was double jeopardy.

    [PDF]Technical Bulletins -

    Level IV and up Remimeo Scn Execs
    HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, Sussex

    This of course is a rather savage and brutal datum for it thrusts aside all justification, reasonableness, excuses and even does not take into account the size or obstacles of the opposition.

    But please note that the datum is not “are things all right around him” as this is a passive test and could mean only that he was simply sitting still.

    Whether things are currently all right or not is beside the point. The thetan who is making things go right may be tackling a mountain of confusion and of course things are not all right because what he is attacking is mainly wrong. It is whether or not he is making things go right in spite of “hell or high water” that is the test.

    Many beings live lives of quiet correctness without ever once making anything do anything. Things around them just happen to be orderly. The social system props them up. But someday—bang—the society gets into a turmoil which knocks out the props. THEN we see that there were too few present who could MAKE things go right and that is the end of the society. Thus died all old civilizations. Their people lived in a system correctness and things went right only so long as nothing was going wrong. Then one day things go wrong. These sophisticated but weak beings never were able to MAKE things go right and so the whole society collapses.

    One might also ask, “What is meant by right?”
This would be forwarding a purpose not destructive to the majority of the dynamics.

  9. chipgallo

    chipgallo Patron Meritorious

    I concur but with the caveat that Wheaton had received correction as a pilot on several occasions. Was he a flawed pilot who happened to be a Scientologist or because he was a Scientologist? What possible CRM (crew resource management) action would have worked in the limited time that the crew had? The answers may be unknowable due to missing facts.

    Failing to enable the engine deicing as part of the pre-flight checklist is not a philosophical error and may simply reflect the crew's inexperience in cold weather operations.
  10. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Obviously we are speculating on Scientology influence as one of many variables and it is probably impossible to know the part it played if any here. Many people involved in Scientology are decent and successful in spite of Scientology and in part even because they have capitalized on some aspect of Scientology that they personally have interpreted and applied constructively according to their own moral compass. Of course many Scientologists have never peaked behind the curtain and actively avoid any peaking. On the surface The Supreme Test makes a lot of sense. If you are leading a military unit in active combat with limited resources and compressed time you make it go right or you die. Scientologists are taught to think like everything is a do or die situation and therefore balanced and reasonable behavior can constantly be set aside for the greater good. We can even speculate that this is why the airline hired him or he applied to that airline or both.

    In general I think the longer someone is into Scientology the more their learning processes become robotic - to play on Hubbard's use of the term. Scientologists struggle to incorporate Scientology maxims into their logic like muscle memory because it really doesn't make much sense in real world application. They hope that if they read further and harder it will eventually fall into context. We can speculate how this kind of learning process might effect someone learning any subject with a potential for catastrophic failure. In Scientology you learn to compensate for a lack of real world experience by making Gumby dolls but that doesn't translate well into things like flying a passenger plane.
  11. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor

    Unbelievable, but with a cult---quite believable.

    And it would not be surprising at all if senior Scn management started a hidden-data-rumor-line that the super theta pilot was so "cause" that a movie was made about him and the OT "miracle" that he performed.


    Sound far fetched? LOL

    Then I offer up just one (of hundreds) of examples of an off-line rumor that top Scn gurus (Hubbard, Miscavige, et al) started in order to "control human emotion and reaction" (Hubbard's definition of public relations.

    How about this one?

    How many times have veteran Scientologists heard the "fact" that MR ROBERTS was made about the extraordinary OT adventures and courageous achievements of L. Ron Hubbard during WWII.

    Don't get me started, I might have to open up an entirely new thread just to start listing the hundreds of crazy rumors that Scientologists spread amongst themselves at the covert behest of the Operating Liar atop the command channel.

    Anyone still not believing that the most ethical people on the planet would resort to such propaganda "BIG LIES" on their own members? LOL. Sure, okay, I feel the cringe, I know it's hard to look. But, if I start that thread, here's a preview of coming attractions. . .

    THE BERLIN WALL FALLING DOWN (because of Scientologists auditing out alien BTs in their back bedroom at home).

    Scientology: It's a cringe-fest! Cringe-a-Palooza! Prepare to line-cringe!

  12. ILove2Lurk

    ILove2Lurk Lisbeth Salander

    From the where is he now files.

    B**** K**** former longtime Flag FSM, made man and good earner on the streets
    would hang around AOLA and brag about his wins of curing different people at a
    distance once he got on OT7. One of his "come ons."

    Rumor has it is that said FSM had to flee LA for parts unknown -- sorta like a
    witness protection program -- after it became more common for members to
    quit and ask for refunds and the COS would try to "claw back" the FSM's cut.

    Best to leave town in the night, which he did from what I heard.

    Badda bing, badda boom.
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2018
  13. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor



    And true!

    Ergo, truly hilarious!

    I once overheard B**** K**** proudly announce to a half dozen spellbound believers (whose rapt attention he held with smirking marionette control by means of his spellbinding tales of his OT powers) this gem:

    "I'll never have to work again!" He then smirked and taunted his personal parishioners with buzz words that he knew would have them drooling like Pavlov's PCs. Words like "I'm already retired and set for life!"

    That came at the tale end of a number of OT feats, including his paranormal powers of investing (with Reid Slatkin).

    Like all things Scientology, you only get to see the preview trailer-teaser, never the actual footage of how the movie ends. If anyone takes a peek at the last scene, they are declared and destroyed.

    The final scene in any Scientology movie is ruin. The very thing is purported to handle. But a far worse ruin, one that the ruined party paid a fortune for with money and time.

    B**** K****'s miracle investment prowess of course ended with losing all his "principal" on account with Slatkin.

    And worse, the bankruptcy trustee attorneys sued him ("clawback") to return any and all profit distributions he took over the years.

    This charming little story is reflected countless times in all of the OT success stories Scientologists tell each other, typically framed in language such as: "So, now I have total certainty that I will never again be plagued by [ description of ruin] for the rest of eternity!" See how it works? They show you the thrilling infomercial but never the actual footage of what happens in real life.

    I knew B**** K**** and always stayed as far away from him as possible, because (being an SP with considerable street smarts) I always thought he was an arrogant, lying asshole. But when I was involved with Scientology a small part of my mind held out some cringefully stupid possibility that maybe totally arrogant jerks like B**** K**** had possibly attained one or more of Hubbard's promised "powers".

    CONSOLATION PRIZE: Everyone that has ever lived has a gullibility threshold, beyond which they make naively incorrect decisions and hold unfounded beliefs. What else, then, is religion? What else then are financial decisions & deals that do not do what they guarantee will happen? What else then are failed marriages and countles other human foibles where they make a decision that turns out to be ridiculously and obviously wrong----in after-sight? Being human I too learned by trial and error not to put screwdrivers into live electrical outlets and other lessons. Now it all seems pathetically silly to have entertained magical thinking rather than to accept and embrace the reality of the unknown. None of this gets B**** K**** off the hook for lying and tricking so many folks in order to get his 10% cut of Hubbard's fraud. He knew he was lying. That's what all those smirking "tells" were all about, and why I was instinctively repulsed by him at every turn. Perhaps he has changed in the past two decades, I have no idea. I never hear of him posting anything about the fraud that he helped enable and perpetrate.

    Hey BK, I know you can heal terminally ill beings at great distances with just your mobile phone and a Jesus-like superpowers. Can you also heal yourself?
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  14. ILove2Lurk

    ILove2Lurk Lisbeth Salander

    I don't think he's the type that learns how to use a computer or knows how to post stuff.
    They may not not even have Internet connectivity where he's hiding out. Not sure. :hysterical:

    I haven't seen him for decades, so I can't say, but I suspect he's still a "true believer"
    of sorts . . . in the money (gelt), that is. Where else can you talk someone into doing a
    $5 million cash donation and pull down a quick $500K for yourself. Mind numbing!

    He hasn't done any services since about 2000, but has been "kicking up" to the boss
    of the family through 2006. He's done (tech-wise) and definitely "on the down low." No
    social media, no Facebook, no footprint to speak of on the Internet.

    Lisbeth would know. :whistling:
  15. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor


    Even loyal good earners get whacked, like Tommy Belotti, as Don Paul Castellano's, enforcer/bodyguard/driver that fateful night the Don was hit in front of Sparks steakhouse in NYC.

    The guy you are talking about was a "good earner" for Don Commodore and Don Miscavige. But he got spooked somehow and applied Ron's "BlueBird-Motorhome-get-in-the-wind" tech

    Wonder what spooked him, musta been scary cuz i know he is a gargantuan money/status whore. LOL