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Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by GreyWolf, Nov 21, 2010.
A very good interview with Tory and Steve Hassan.
Than you, GreyWolf! Didn't know there was a new video out! This is excellent material for helping those deal with friends or family still in.
BTW, here is the Derren Brown Voodoo video that Hassan refers to. Excellent!
Thanks Mary for the link. Now I don't have to look it up for myself.
Very informative and highly amusing videos from Tory and Steve.
Sadly, I can't watch voodoo, it's copyrighted by channel 4 in my country.
Thanks GreyWolf for posting this!
Sharone---sorry you cannot see it, as it's quite interesting.
Here's a brief rundown of it.
He (Darren Brown) ask a young woman into the Forest, and asks her beliefs on psychic healing. She says she's tried a few and "knows they work".
He says he'd like to try something with her.
He asks her to stand up--and uses strong eye contact.
(Which Steve mentioned IS a form of hypnotism).
He asks her to hold out her right arm, looking deeply into her eyes. "Just rest that there"...she holds arm out.
He now picks up voodoo doll, and says, "I'm going to show you something, a doll. The thing is, it doesn't have a soul.
(she still holding arm out). So we need to give it a soul, for it to work,-that's what we're going to do now. (He sets doll down)
By taking this---You happy if I take your ring for a moment?
She says "uhuh"--he slides ring off her finger, into his pocket, and picks up doll, saying, "excellent--as he puts her arm back down.
And the ring goes into....the center here, (the doll) and this makes it the soul--of the doll--and your soul. (he ties doll all up)
He turns away from her, tying the doll more.
I just think it's interesting, for me, that we tend to believe what feels good. If we decide something is nice--we decide it's true.
Can you feel anything at the moment? What are you aware of? (It shows him still tying up the doll, facing away from her, still)
She says her legs are really heavy. Can you move them?
Can you move your feet? No? (He turns back to her)
She says, frustrated, "I'm trying".
He faces her now, holding out the doll and says again,
"you can't move them".
But you can move your arms, right?
Just flap your arms a bit. (She starts flapping her arms).
Thanks, just so you can see you can move them, for a moment...and then watch.
He ties the doll, now from bottom up through it's arms,
and her arms begin to flap less and less, closer to her body, until they stop.
What happens now? Can you move your arms?
He: You trying? She: Yeah.
He: Now look at me, this will be perfectly comfortable, there's nothing unpleasant about this.
(he's tying the dolls head up, now).
He: I want you to just count all the way backwards from 10-0 outloud.
She begins: 10, 9, 8 ....7...6...5 (her mouth is jammed open) He closes her mouth, which was dropped open.
Can you talk? Her eyes wide open, mouth trying to but she cannot talk.
He sits down.
See for me, it's all about questioning things, I think, and not taking them at face value. Like at the moment you cannot speak, but the only reason you can't speak is that you BELIEVE you can't speak because of what I'm telling you.
The interesting thing is if I tell you that you CAN speak--all that does is give you permission to question that belief, and then you find that you can speak, can't you? He's looking at her, while he says the above. She looks a bit concerned, confused maybe--looking somewhat surprised as she tries to talk. He again says, "Yeah?" and she says "Yeah" quite clearly. He: "Because what we believe isn't necessarily real" (as he stands up, facing her).
This certainly isn't even a real voodoo doll, he shows her,
and even the real voodoo dolls we use are for healing, not putting curses on people.
One of the ways I got you to believe in it was to invest in that belief (as he unties the doll), and one of the ways I got you to do that was to invest part of yourself in it, and that was putting your ring in it.
He unties it all the way, opens it up--showing there's nothing in it.
Which in fact, there's nothing in it, there is no ring in there (showing there's nothing in doll)--- your ring is still on your hand.
She holds up her hand, sees her ring and bursts out laughing, shocked.
She explains she could see him taking the ring, how her legs where heavy, she couldn't talk once counting.
((even I was sure he explained the ring after the con, until I re-watched it, and realized no, he doesn't. I had to replay it--and at 2:15 or so, it shows it's all slight of hand. He LOOKS like he quickly takes her ring and puts it in his pocket, which begins the con. Actually it began way earlier---but that sort of locked her 'in".
End of Darren's, as they walk off, she still saying she cannot believe it.
Cults do the very same thing, in different ways)).
Hope that helps
PS: for anyone lurking: Don't think it's true re *your* organization? Think of the restrictions. Remember YOU pre-joining. How much have you changed, really?
Read, LOOK, Listen, Make up your *own* minds.
Thank you Tory for the outline of the video of Derren Brown's voodoo.
I'm sure I have seen it before. Quite remarkable, really.
It was good seeing you and Steve Hassan talk about cults, I still find it incredible you were in Scientology for thirty years.
You are an amazing lady, Thank you for all you do.
You're most welcome, Sharone
Thanks for your kind words!
Oh! Here is Part 2---re Medical abuses, And more on Cults
with Steve and myself:
Tory, you are one of my hero's
Thanks, GreyWolf! That means a lot to me!
Have a wonderful week, leading up to
Thanksgiving. Despite many of us having
very difficult times due to our Economy---we
all still have a *lot* to give thanks for!
This net, and chatting with each other is one
big one, for me.
My best ...