Hello New here

Discussion in 'New Member Introductions' started by lonidee210, Jan 8, 2017.

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  1. lonidee210

    lonidee210 New Member

    I am not an ex scientoloigest and I don't know anyone that is. I have lived an hour away from Scientologys Flag base my whole life. I have been to Clearwater thousands of times. I have talked to people standing outside many times. In Tampa I have said hi to them all the time. I truly thought Scientology was this self help thing that did some good in the world. I grew up in a Christian church so calling Scientology a religion was a stretch for me but if it makes you live a happy life good for you. I heard it was expensive to get into so that was the only reason I never looked into it. The past year there have been a lot of movies and shows about Scientology and of course I watched them(the headquarters is in my backyard). I was truly in shock at the stuff I heard. I kept telling myself that this all can't be true(FYI I am stupid). Then Leah Remini came out and told her story. I have watched her shows as well. I was like how can the headquarters of this church be so close to me and I have never heard one bad thing about it. I did not live under a rock so I did not understand. I always play the devils advocate on things so I can see both sides of a story. I did my own research and how have we lived our lives and let this "church" ruin people's lives. I feel horrible because I could have done something. I remember seeing people in Tampa that look like they haven't slept or eaten and did not seem well passing out flyers. I asked if they were feeling ok and they said yes. I had no freaking clue they were probably in some program to punish them. I should have got them something to eat! I am writing my representatives on this issue, but more has to be done. I am not gonna lie I AM PISSED that this is going on and everyone acts ok it's fine!! Families are being tore apart. They treat people like crap and the USA proudly gives them tax exempt status. WTF!! I am sorry for my long post. I just had to speak my mind. I am gonna do something, not sure what but the people of Florida needs to wake up. Thank you for reading!!
     
  2. TrevAnon

    TrevAnon Big List researcher

    Welcome!

    I was also never in.

    (Protip: Your post would be more readable if you use blank lines. Click edit below the post. :yes: )
     
  3. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    :welcome2: Lonidee!

    Exscn has a lot of members here who were never in Scientology but have since learned it is dangerous and destructive and want to see it exposed and brought to justice.

    You sound like a very nice person with a good heart and mind. Thank you for contacting your representatives.

    Do you know the story of how Scientology got into Clearwater in the first place, falsely accused your former Mayor Gabe Cezares, ran a black PR operation on him and took over the town? See links below:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabe_Cazares
    http://www.lermanet.com/garyweber/apology.htm
     
  4. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    Another newbie, welcome!

    Looks like Leah Remini is reaching a lot of people. That is a good thing.

    One aspect I'd like to point out is that while abuse can happen in any of the Scientology locations, it is more prevalent the higher up one goes, and extremely prevalent in the Sea Org locations. It is more rare to find abuse and punishment at the lower organizations (like the org in Tampa), although not unheard of.

    If you talked to new members at those "intro" organizations, they would just say they are taking some courses to learn how to improve their lives, it's helping them, and they'll probably laugh if you asked them about punishment and abuse. It would reinforce what they are being told about critics just not being well-informed, or actually lying.

    The lower intro organizations are not typically where you find the blatant abuses that are being spoken about on Leah's show, like RPF, forced abortions, beatings, etc. Abuse is not unheard of at the intro levels but is rare.

    This is just a distinction a lot of the general public first learning about the cult is not aware of, so I thought I'd bring it up here.
     
  5. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    It sounds like you really get it now. Thank you.

    They may not have been on a specific punishment like the RPF or a lower conditions assignment. Sea Org members can work 80 to 130 hours a week rather routinely even if they are upstat (have their statistics up). In fact, their statistics are probably up because they are simply working long hours in order to keep them up. If they don't then they don't get a day off every 2 weeks and they can't request an LOA (Leave of Absence). They can go many years without taking an LOA. It can be difficult to make a distinction between being punished and the day to day life of a Sea Org member. I did more 48 hours shifts than I can remember and many shifts much longer as a typical post routine.

    If their org's stats are down then the whole crew can be ordered onto rice and beans for months. The regular food is prepared in a large institutional type kitchen and when you use large kettles to cook in bulk it is often overcooked and loses a lot of nutritional value and they may be given very little time to eat. There is no way to snack between scheduled meal times unless you use your own money which is probably anywhere from $3.00 to $50.00 per week. Sometimes I got no pay at all. I have to think that org stats have been down for years so it may be possible that these people are not eating very well for extended periods.

    You may also be seeing a lot of foreign workers. They may actually prefer the opportunity to be in the US under these conditions rather than where they were, especially if they believe that eventually they will be permitted to stay in the US.

    It's a very complicated situation.
     
  6. lonidee210

    lonidee210 New Member

    Thanks everyone
    I am learning more everyday. I just want to bug the crap out of them. I feel like if everyone wakes up and demands thier tax exempt be taken away that would really hurt them. It won't finish the cult but soon it would fall apart.
     
  7. Knows

    Knows Gold Meritorious Patron

    Thank you for posting and welcome.

    Would you be so kind as to spend a little time writing to the IRS, your State AG, Congressman, Senator and Govenors about Scientology and ask that they remove their Tax Exempt Status.

    Get 20 others to do it. Then ask them to get 20 others to do it.

    What ever you can do will help.

    That is what is needed and wanted- to put it in Scientologese. LOL

    WELCOME and thank you again!
     
  8. This is NOT OK !!!!

    This is NOT OK !!!! Gold Meritorious Patron

    If you were driving along Ft. Harrison Blvd in '83-'84 and then 87'-'88 and saw a stressed out looking young man in a business suit pacing around and looking rather hunted and tired, that could have been me!
     
  9. exsomessenger

    exsomessenger Patron Meritorious

    Do you remember the man that used to stand in front of the entrance to the FH reading from the Bible? Would have been 87-88. He was pretty larger than life and hard to miss. I must have walked past him hundrededs of times. I even tried to talk to him once or twice. Glad you stayed true to you.
     
  10. This is NOT OK !!!!

    This is NOT OK !!!! Gold Meritorious Patron

    I remember him. As a clam, I of course thought "DB" and carried on.
     
  11. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    Welcome lonidee,

    You can ask all your friends to watch the A& E show and you might also want to watch the Clearwater hearings and some of Mark Bunker's videos especially the one about the Lisa McPherson story and protests.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clearwater_Hearings

    https://m.youtube.com/user/XENUTV
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2017
  12. aurabass

    aurabass Patron

    Hello - also a new participant.
    I purchased and read Dianetics decades ago and did an online inquiry from here in Knoxville TN. Thankfully I learned that I would be required to travel to Nashville many times to participate and that 370 mile Round Trip was cost and time prohibitive.

    The Alex Gibney film of GOING CLEAR I viewed on HBO this year was very influential and the follow up of Leah Rimini's AFTERMATH has been incredible.
    I have watched the 6 completed episodes at least twice each and look forward to the 7th and a renewal that will add another season.
    Those visual presentations inspired me to purchase the GOING CLEAR book and TROUBLEMAKER written and read by Leah -
    and I added INSIDE SCIENTOLOGY by Janet Reitman

    Leah's book and her reading of it was extremely entertaining and informative and she deserves a lot of credit for what she has accomplished.

    After reading much of Mike Rinder, Marty Rathbun, and Tony Ortega's blogs and those books I'm feeling somewhat expert (but I realize there is much more to know)
    I find the situation to be fascinating since I have a long time friend who got into Scientology a long time back and who's son became an expert Auditor in the northeast (Boston)

    Looking forward to learning more from this forum.
     
  13. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    Welcome aurabass

    There certainly are thousands of hours of material available to view.
    Our member Veda often references the scientological Onion article and Veda's post will often pull together many Hubbard materials show how they jive with the origins of and resulting behavior patterns and historical events of the Scientology organizations literally forcing themselves upon society and attempting to inhibit and even destroy utterly any critics or opposition.
    Enjoy your books. You might even want to jot down a few notes and questions to bring here. You will certainly have the opportunity to discuss them here.
     
  14. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Goldenrod SP


    If you want to know how Hubbard started all this craziness I would highly recommend the book Bare-Faced Messiah by Russell Miller.
     
  15. aurabass

    aurabass Patron

    Thanks for the suggestion ThetanExterior
    I just now added RUTHLESS and The Unbreakable Miss Lovely to my Audible Collection of Scientology books.
    I will look for Bare-Faced Messiah
     
  16. aurabass

    aurabass Patron

    Thank you dchoiceisalwaysrs - I have many questions
    Like Why are Scientologists so afraid of the online criticism from escaped or disaffected former members? Are they so uncertain of their "superior" abilities they fear being dissuaded by those who have not advanced up the bridge?
     
  17. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    One problem CofS Scientologists have is "Ethics." Not the philosophical subject, but the threat of visiting the org "Ethics Officer." What is terrifying is the penalties he can enforce, like a mandatory security check (costing literally thousands of dollars) and the threat of "disconnection," of literally being barred from speaking with friends, family, business associates for decades. It's a big deal.

    Paul
     
  18. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Scientologist's primary goals are to go up the Bridge - to attain spiritual freedom and abilities for themselves, and for every other person on the planet to do the same, and then for every other person, alien, thetan on other planets to go up the Bridge.

    For an individual to go up the Bridge they are handling their own "case" or mental aberrations such as the Reactive Mind and now we know also malevolent BTs (ancient dead alien thetans that glom all over us). Exposure to things that restimulate (reactivate) engrams or old alien implants, etc. are bad for your case. You need to get case corrective actions done which are very expensive and time consuming and often result in getting sent to ethics for handling. Ethics tends to be very unpredictable - imagine someone like Nurse Ratched figuring out what to do with you, maybe she is having a good day, maybe not.

    If you research critics online then you are deliberately choosing to sabotage your own case and also exposing yourself to SPs which makes you PTS (Potential Trouble Source). That means you are willing to sacrifice the success of Scientology which means you are willing to sacrifice the future of the entire planet so that means a sure trip to Ethics and as others have pointed out sec-checks, which aren't classified as private auditing, can easily cost thousands.

    If you researched critics in the old days you could be declared an SP yourself. That was still relatively easy for the Church to manage damage control and gossip but now days there is the ubiquitous internet which is impossible to control so the Church is compelled to come down on it even harder. If you are declared an SP then you lose your good status and access to the only workable spiritual technology in the universe. And of course everyone you know is ordered to Disconnect from you.

    This link answers your question about online criticism:

    http://suppressiveperson.org/about/

    This link takes you down a very deep rabbit hole:

    http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthre...-for-newcomers&p=550308&viewfull=1#post550308
     
  19. aurabass

    aurabass Patron

    thanks Paul,
    From my reading I got the penalties and fear of penalties by the practitioners - ethics, SP, etc.
    I think I get why the rank and file fears ethics and SP doubts are met with punishment. What is more of a puzzle is the apparent illogic in a policy from the top that seems to admit that even superior "clear" OT Scientologists can be polluted or perverted by critics if exposed. That seems to indicate a lack of trust in the "superior minds of the clear spirits". If the power of clear cannot best the reactive criticism - that is, face the criticism and remain impervious and "clear" - it seems to portend a massive problem. Even given the ability to avoid the obvious opponents, the accidental exposure might be unavoidable. In order to operate in the real world contact with opponents is necessary if Clearing the Planet is the goal.

    That brings me to the next problem - If Clearing the Planet is the goal every defection is a setback and it seems the first reaction to any doubt or question is to attack and amplify rather than reason and clarify. Perhaps that is the problem that has resulted in contraction rather than growth. It seems they prefer to eliminate rather than equivocate. So if someone is 75% on board the reaction is to push them out as opposed to being patient or tolerant of lingering doubt. A glass one quarter empty approach for everyone.

    But I get that I am attempting to apply good sense to the senseless. This fear based enforcement system holds zero appeal to this reactive mind. I am reminded of a recent course that taught methods for handling deniers and doubters of climate science. It appears that SCN has zero use for that kind of ability.
     
  20. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    It isn't. But it's complicated. "The Scientological Onion" explains it all pretty well. Here's the short version:

    http://exscn.net/content/view/178/105/

    Ambry's full piece is linked at the end of that page. It's a good read.

    Paul
     

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