Policy is out-tech

Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by TomKat, Apr 10, 2018.

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  1. TomKat

    TomKat Patron with Honors

    Although the same person ostensibly wrote the Red as well as Green volumes, where the green volumes use technical insight to control or motivate staff, it is out-tech. Any evaluation is out-tech. If someone is told the reason he wants to leave is due to his own overts or misunderstoods, that is out-tech. If someone is told he is in a condition of confusion or treason, that is out-tech. If someone is told ANYTHING from any HCOB in order to control him, that is out-tech. You just can't eat your cake and have it too.* If the HCOBs are right, then the HCOPLs are wrong.

    And the OT levels are out-tech also, where the PC is given incidents to run.

    Also NOTs, not run as a limited process but as a rundown, is out-tech because it is an out-of-ARC process, and out-of-ARC processes are only supposed to be used in assists.

    I ditched most of the tech decades ago, but being on this forum has brought back some of my thoughts on the matter from the 80s.

    *Yes, "eat your cake and have it too" is the original expression; it was changed by boneheads who also say things like "could care less" instead of "couldn't care less" or "hone in" instead of "home in."
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  2. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    According to tubs hubbard there was to be 'no case on post' which (I suppose) justifies green on white being contrary to red on white ... having said that I doubt many around here 'could care less' what tubs intended because all of his tehk was nonsense, though some of it was useful at the time.

    The misuse of the expression 'couldn't care less' is seriously annoying though!

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  3. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Gold Meritorious Patron

    Hubbard wrote huge amounts of tech and policy about Ethics yet he was less ethical than most people. He took drugs, was a heavy smoker, cheated on his wives, married his second wife bigamously and then lied on TV that he'd even married her, took other people's discoveries and claimed them for his own etc etc.

    He told us we didn't need medicines because the tech would handle all illness yet he was chronically ill himself and often took medicines.

    He pretended he could leave his body and travel all over the universe yet those closest to him said his biggest wish was to go exterior, which he and Mary Sue never managed to achieve. He was just imagining all the OT stuff and pretending it was real.

    He said having "case on post" was forbidden yet those who worked with him talk about his vicious temper which could erupt at any time.

    To sum it up, Hubbard was full of shit so it probably isn't worth trying to reconcile the things he wrote in HCOBs or HCOPLs. In fact he probably didn't even write all of them. I personally know someone who wrote a lot of the HCOPLs that came out of Saint Hill in the 1960s and they were signed L. Ron Hubbard.
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  4. pineapple

    pineapple Patron Meritorious

    I think "I could care less" was originally "As if I could care less!" (said sarcastically). Used that way it actually makes sense, but I doubt that most people who say "I could care less" know that.

    As for "eat your cake and have it too," what have the boneheads changed it to? I always heard it reversed, as "have your cake and eat it too," which I think makes equal sense.

    "Hone in" I think is just a corruption of "home in," -- but -- "hone" means to sharpen, so when you "hone in" you're sharpening focus, getting down to the nitty-gritty, as we used to say. So even this actually makes some sense, though again I doubt that people who say this think about that.
  5. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    Hubbard defined ethics very consistently. You just have to look at it like a narcissistic sociopath would.

    Anything which might adversely affect Hubbard was "out ethics", while anything which benefited Hubbard was "in ethics". Thus, it was "in ethics" for a registrar to talk an elderly person into putting all their retirement savings "on the Bridge", because that resulted in money to Hubbard. Meanwhile, it was "out ethics" to report child abuse in the Sea Org to police, because that would result in "out PR" and unwanted attention from authorities.
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  6. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    As ITYIWT says, this 'I could care less' business is seriously annoying, and why practically every american gets it wrong is baffling, but they do. Another one regularly abused is 'The proof of the pudding is in the eating' where the 'eating' part is omitted time after time.

    Then there's...

    'forward slash' - aaaggghhh! Slash and backslash will suffice thank you.
    everythink/nothink/somethink etc. As spoken by many brits, especially scousers.
    died in the wool
    kerb vs curb
  7. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Strat, have you heard anyone seriously calling a female a mole (instead of a moll) yet? That always makes me laugh.

  8. F.Bullbait

    F.Bullbait Oh, a wise guy,eh?

    Recall a time you "died in the wool"...


  9. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    Yes, using the definition of mole as "a spy who achieves over a long period an important position within the security defenses of a country".
  10. JackStraw

    JackStraw Silver Meritorious Patron

    Let's not forget "Money is the root of all evil" when it's "Love of money is the root of all evil."

    Or "to coin a phrase" when you are using some trite, overused (but I repeat myself) expression when it should be "to quote a phrase."

    Coin, of course means to invent of to make something new.

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  11. Bill

    Bill Gold Meritorious Patron

    My personal hate: "That begs the question" when "that raises the question" is meant. "Begs the question" is a logic error in which one assumes already true what one claims to be proving.
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2018
  12. JackStraw

    JackStraw Silver Meritorious Patron

    Quite right, though it is a tougher one to explain.

    From www.worldwidewords.org:
    This one really bugs people who know some logic and are familiar with the classical languages. From my attempts to research the point, it also seems to cause trouble for dictionary writers and compilers of style guides, so much so that I’ve not found two authorities that entirely agree on the nature of the problem or which senses of beg the question are acceptable.
    You can easily find examples of the sense you quote, which is used just as though one might say “prompt the question” or “forces one to ask”.

    The original sense is of a logical fallacy, of taking for granted or assuming the thing that you are setting out to prove. To take an example, you might say that lying is wrong because we ought always to tell the truth. That’s a circular argument and makes no sense. Another instance is to argue that democracy must be the best form of government because the majority is always right. The fallacy was described by Aristotle in his book on logic in about 350BC. His Greek name for it was turned into Latin as petitio principii and then into English in 1581 as beg the question. Most of our problems arise because the person who translated it made a hash of it. The Latin might better be translated as “laying claim to the principle”.

  13. TomKat

    TomKat Patron with Honors

    "Couldn't care less" becomes "could care less" (opposite meaning) because: stupid people rule!
    "Jibe" (to be in accord) becomes "jive" (to lie) because: stupid people rule!
    "Eat your cake and have it too" (impossible) becomes "have your cake and eat it too" (probable) because: stupid people rule!
    "Home in" (as in a homing beacon) becomes "hone in" (to sharpen) because: stupid people rule!
    "Wreak havoc" (create chaos) becomes "wreck havoc" (destroy chaos) because: stupid people rule!
    "Free" (of charge) becomes "for free" because: stupid people rule!"
    "Wait in line" (queue of people) becomes "wait online" (computer network) because: stupid people rule!
    "Catercorner" becomes "cattycorner" because: stupid people rule!
    "Slash" (opposite of backslash) becomes "forward slash" because: stupid people rule!
    "Losing one's temper" and "having a temper" now mean the same thing because: stupid people rule!
    "Literally" is commonly used to mean "virtually" because: stupid people rule!
    "Nuclear" becomes "nukeular" because: stupid PRESIDENTS rule!
  14. pineapple

    pineapple Patron Meritorious

    One that really annoys me is "heart wrenching" instead of "heart rending."

    But you know, you can't go around obsessing about* this stuff. The stupid will always be with us, and there's no way you can make them conform to your idea of how they should talk. All you'll accomplish is to make yourself unhappy. For the sake of your own peace of mind, the best you can do is learn to live with it.

    *I used to be bothered by "obsessing about" and "obsessing on" but have learned to accept them.
  15. phenomanon

    phenomanon Canyon

    What's a "scouser"? I love that word!:)
  16. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Someone from Liverpool (where the Beatles came from) in the north-west of England.

  17. JackStraw

    JackStraw Silver Meritorious Patron

    and the conflation of "imply" with "infer", also really annoying.

    Gives support to my new favo(u)rite saying: Half the population has a below average IQ."

  18. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

  19. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Gold Meritorious Patron

    When Micky Dolenz of The Monkees was in England he heard the expression "randy scouse git" and liked it so much he wrote a song with that title.

    Randy = horny
    Scouse = from Liverpool
    Git = doesn't really have a meaning - it's just a rude word to call someone
  20. Cat's Squirrel

    Cat's Squirrel Gold Meritorious Patron

    I remember that; he wasn't allowed to use the title (Randy Scouse Git) so he ended up calling the song "Alternate Title" instead.

    I believe he heard the words from an episode of "Till Death Us Do Part", a sitcom which was very popular at the time and had a Liverpudlian character (played by the actor Anthony Booth; non-Brits may not know that his daughter Cherie later married Tony Blair).

    Incidentally, Scousers are so named because of the popularity there of a type of stew called lobscouse, especially amongst the sailors;

    Last edited: Apr 11, 2018