The brown envelope they all waited for!

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Whattodo, Apr 1, 2017.

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  1. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron

    Hello, pretty new here.

    I was just wondering what people's reactions were when they started ot3 and read the material in that brown paper envelope for the first time?

    Did you then come out of scientology as you couldn't fathom what you had read or did you remain dedicated? Did you look into any of the facts stated in these materials?
  2. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    This is Ron's Journal '67, released publicly around the same time that OT 3 was released as a confidential OT course. Some people quietly left, but most stayed. It was taken very seriously.

    If Hubbard sounds strangely serene, it may be because this was recorded early in the morning after Hubbard - who was a night owl - had been "rising above the bank," for several hours, with the assistance of his favorite drunk, Rum and Coca-Cola.

    Everyone who did OT 3 had first done OT 2. Have you seen OT 2?
  3. tesseract

    tesseract Patron with Horrors

    From what I've read...
    The people who did OTIII had already "recalled" countless past live space opera stories in auditing.
    Consequently for many this was just one more (true) "space opera" story. :confused2:
  4. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron

    No I haven't read too much about level 2 but I'll take a closer look.
  5. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron

    That in itself is open to debate, do you think you've had past lives?
  6. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor


    I am quite surprised that anyone here is still doubting or debating this subject.

    It's beyond speculation and argument, because Dr. Hubbard scientifically and conclusively proved the observable/quantifiable results of past lives therapy!

    (financial results, for himself)
  7. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    People had really different reactions!

    Many were horrified, others thought it was a joke.

    Here are some great earlier ESMB threads addressing this question:
  8. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Gold Meritorious Sponsor


    HELPFUL TECH TIP: I suggest that the COS should make sure that anyone about to read the OT III PACK is fully set up and "sessionable" by asking OT III students the following, just before handing them their Wall of Fire materials:

    Have you had enough to eat?

    Have you slept enough?

    Have you had any drugs in the past week?

    Have you had any alcohol or aspirin in the past 24 hours?

    Have you had any milk today?*

  9. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    I'm sure my first reaction was shock, but I played along and got through it. It was not much later I made the decision "not ever going back".

    OTIII is so over-hyped and promoted, along with the hush-hush, don't-talk-about, BIG secret mystery that every Scientologist is told they MUST do ASAP, blah blah blah.

    Everyone who HASN'T done it is very sure it's just what they need, where all will be revealed.

    Everyone who's DONE it and woken up from the nightmare, will tell you it's a pile of BS.

    And those who've done it and haven't woken up, are VERY SURE they just need Solo NOTS, where all will be revealed! Or OTVIII, where all will be revealed! Or OT IX and X.... (which don't even exist)

    And so it goes.
  10. tesseract

    tesseract Patron with Horrors

    Decidedly not. Which is why I put "recalled" in quotes. I'm just a cult watcher btw. and was merely summarizing what many exes have told.
  11. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    I was mystified how or where I was supposed to be looking for them, so I turned to the student next to me, Doc Wellington, and old timer who AFAIK, was at st hill in the past. I asked him, and he said he could see them on his body. I thought something like "oh boy. I am over my head on this level" because I sure didn't see any. It was at AOLA when it was down on westlake in the 70's

  12. Out/Int

    Out/Int Patron with Honors

    I did mine at LA. I was PISSED. Some Sea Org kid on a bike kept circling the building I stayed in - where there were other "victims"...uh, I mean OT's.

    Kiwi House. Shit Hole!

    I was trying to get the hell out of LA and blow....Sea Org Spy turned me in and they talked me into staying telling me I did not have to believe - I just had to "do it".

    I did not last long...

    Felt it was a scam.
  13. lotus

    lotus autonomous rebellous

    Thank you to bring this issue to our attention.

    That is such a good question, it deserves to be properly answered.
    I created an online pool to survey celeb OT's who have bben kind enough to enlight us re: Reactions upon reading OT3 materials

    To this date, we have received those reply from our most enthousiat dedicated enthousiast who sent us a few snapshots to better mock-it up (reactions) for us, ESMBer readers, to get the picture.

    Kirsty Alley

    Kirsty , obviously was stunned and amazed! She was left without any word!

    After reading and completing those materials, she admits she had never been the same person.
    Her time track knowledge propulsed her to an unprecedented newly attained total control and Total certainly over lif and she recovered a pure theta communications cycle. - Scientits had discovered the golden mean, Kirsty made come true, the divine triangle's beauty!



    Tom Cuise

    Tom was so amazed has been kinda like the sudden cognition he was , finally, back home...on the right time track!


    Tom , upon reading OT3 material, cognited this day would be the Day1 of his new life, . An unprecedented world wide Cruise's cruise would begun, and Tom devoted his life to his World wide tour of enlighting earth population on earth issues and total awareness


    The Earth WW Cruise Cruise awareness had gone viral and a new day had come for ''what is $cientology'' true knowledge and recognition in order to put the ethics in..on this planet. Tom knew that His holliness Dadid 1er would support him a and be proud of such dedication so he will be entitled a special rooming in the nuclear bunker buil especially to save the $cienotology homo nuovos specy, to be flewn on target two the day war has come.


    John Travolta
    John was amazed..and deeply troubled though!


    Although Jonh admits he decompensated the next following weeks to recover a sort of balance
    and find the energy to step back on track.


    But, obviously, upon reading OT3 materials, John decided to be total cause on mankind time track, in ensuring the futur of human specy. ..immediately, without any reasonableness he knew he would took responsability. John knew he would be total cause over the next wall of fire and save mankind.


    Hopefuly, we will be provided with other's celebs exciting input, to soon be shared share with you!
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2017
  14. Veda

    Veda Sponsor


    Excuse me for taking some of these accounts - including in the earlier linked threads - with a grain of salt. IMO, some, now, are embarrassed, and have engaged in some historical revisionism so as not to appear silly.

    Getting through OT 3 was a huge deal. People were in the "No Interference Area" and were "at risk."

    Very few people read the theory part of OT 3 and said, "This is nuts, I'm out of here."

    They dutifully completed the OT 3 course and were happy and relieved to have successfully completed the level.

    Now there attention was on the next level, and the ultimate prize of Operating Thetan.
  15. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    How did you come to your statement that Very few.....and ...were happy ...

    Were you a Tech Sec? On the resign line? A C/S for this level and OTIV?

    I am not trying to put you on the spot ,,,, just asking .

    I also wonder what % had their attention on chasing OT or were largely of the frame of mind...or in a query state about what had transpired.

    Just vaguely it seems to me that I didn't hear or notice that a lot of people who did OTIII moved on to 4. Why so? Was quandry about benefits, $ or other things part of the scene?

    PS, just coz I am in one of my J & D moods and want to jibe you a bit, I would like to inform you I have taken up Hubbards C/S hat and programmed you for just that . The J & D rundown.

    At the same time, I do want to say I truly appreciate your very valuable contributions here. :thumbsup::clap:
  16. Whattodo

    Whattodo Patron

    Yeah I was speaking in general on that point and not specifically meaning in a scientology sense.

    Those that have been scientologist, would you say that the people who reached the higher levels that OT3 was the main catalyst for people then leaving?
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2017
  17. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    A re-post from many years ago:

    People have been leaving the CofS since 1954 when Scientology was incorporated as a Church. Before that, people left Dianetics, some of the better remembered are J.A. Winter (who wrote the Introduction for 'DMSMH'), and John Campbell (who published the first article on Dianetics in his 'Astounding Science Fiction' magazine). They left in 1950 and 1951.

    Then came the transition to Scientology, after Hubbard lost the rights to the name 'Dianetics', and decided to drive former business partner, supporter and benefactor, Don Purcell, bonkers by concocting - pretty much overnight - "Whole Track Maps," and then the book 'History of Man' ("This is a cold blooded and factual account of your last 60 trillion years.") And more left.

    Richard DeMille, who wrote some pieces now attributed to Hubbard, left around 1953. There were many others.

    Around 1954, Hubbard, applying his "religion angle," wrote a for-display-to-Raw-Meat&Homo-Saps&Wogs 'Creed', and made Scientology a "Church," and more left.

    In 1959, L. Ron Hubbard Jr. left.

    Lots of people left in the early 1960s with the era of 'Security Checking', deciding that any group that insists that its members undergo metered interrogation, with such questions as "Have you ever had any unkind thoughts about L. Ron Hubbard?" was not for them.

    By 1965, Hubbard wrote 'Keeping Scientology Working', invented the SP Doctrine and SP Declares, Disconnection, the Fair Game Law, and the very confidential, "deadly serious," and vital to your survival, history of the universe&your mind, and starting calling himself 'Source', and many more people left. Amongst them was the first person to have been a 'Doctor of Scientology' (the Class 12 of that day), Jack Horner.

    In 1967 came the Sea Org and Xenu, and more left.

    By the late 1960s and early 1970s, the Commodore and his ashtray-carrying 13 year old girl servants were a law unto themselves on the 'Flagship', the "safest and sanest place in the universe," and more left.

    John McMaster, 'The World's First Real Clear' and the 'Pope' of Scientology, left.

    Writer William Burroughs came along, was involved briefly, did the Clearing Course then, upon completion, when asked if he wished to sign up for OT2, said, "No thanks," and left.

    Many others left.

    Then came the RPF and the RPF's RPF, and more left.

    By early 1977, Hubbard had written his "LSD, Years after they had Come of off' HCOB, in which he described people who had ever taken LSD as "zombies," and soon after told them that they were required to wear rubber suits and run around for hours, and more left.

    Then, in July 1977 came the FBI raids, and two years later came the court-ordered release of thousands of pages of secret Scientology documents, revealing much of Hubbard's secret spying and covert attack tech, and even more left.

    Then Hubbard decided that almost everyone was "Clear" and needed to exit Missions (which he was in the early stage of looting), and go "up lines" and spend their money there; and, while in hiding from (real or imagined) subpoena servers, Hubbard even wrote a "Common Sense Moral Code" - making him an authority on "morality" - that advised, amongst other things, against being sexually promiscuous so as to avoid having "ground glass in the soup," and more people left.

    This was followed, a few years later, by Hubbard responding to the Mission Holders Meeting of late 1981 by sending his #1 henchman, David Miscavige, to "handle" the next Mission Holders meeting of late 1982, and more left.

    Then, roughly around that time, came the partial unearthing of Hubbard's past by way of the "Shannon documents," obtained through the Freedom of Information act (by a curious non-Scientologist), and more left.

    By July 1984, there was Gerry Armstrong vs. Church of Scientology, and the further unearthing of Hubbard's past, and even more left.

    Then came books like 'Messiah or Madman?' and 'Barefaced Messiah', and many more left.

    Then came the Internet.


    From late 1976 "OT Summit."


    I'm not saying some people didn't leave, only that most (at any given time) stayed. An exception was the exodus of late 1982 and 1983, and that had nothing to do with OT 3.

    IMO, and from my observation, most people on "Advanced Courses" did not have their attention on things like "space planes" and how improbable it was that "space planes" that looked like "DC 8s" were used to transport "boxed" populations - at speeds faster than light - from other star systems in the galaxy. OT 3 was regarded as a vitally important area of "case" that needed to be "handled."

    They (we) already knew about "ice cubed thetans" from Hubbard's earlier writings and lectures.

    They (we) knew about the "cold blooded and factual account of your last sixty trillion years" from the book History of Man.

    They (we) knew about the long detailed list of ancient implants in the OT 2 materials authoritatively told to them (us) by Hubbard, and had been exposed, repeatedly, to Hubbard's hypnotically suggestive "helpful advice" such as, while on the e-meter, "Never proceed past a non reading item. To do so can be very deadly." :nervous:

    They (we) had read Keeping Scientology Working innumerable times, a small sampling of which is below:

    "We're not playing some minor game in Scientology. It isn't something cute to do for lack of something better.

    The whole agonized future of this planet, every Man, Woman, and Child on it, and your own destiny for the next endless trillions of years depend on what you do here and now with and in Scientology :unsure::ohmy::yes:

    This is a deadly serious activity. And if we miss getting out of the trap now, we may never again have another chance. :spacecraft:
    [See 'Implantology'] Remember, this is our first chance in all the endless trillions of years of the past . Don't muff it now because it seems unpleasant or unsocial to do Seven [Hammering out of existence incorrect technology], Eight..."

    They (we) knew Hubbard had made himself the "Commodore" and was served by a group a young slave/servant girls (as young as 12) called "Commodore's Messengers."

    They (we) knew about the regularly appearing SP Declares, and many knew about announcements like this one that had appeared in the Auditor newspaper.


    In short, they (we) were in a cult and, to be specific, a Destructive Cult. They (we) were deceived, tricked, and manipulated :blush: Many were ripped off:shark:, had years of their lives stolen, their children stolen, and were harmed in other ways.

    Over time, many of these same people reviewed their experiences, learned more and, gradually, freed themselves from Scientology's influence.

    Each individual is different.

    This is an awkward area. The thread YOU NOW TALKING TO YOU THEN touches upon it.

    Hope this helps. :)
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2017
  18. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    Great post Veda!:thumbsup:

    I was in back at the time of the big push to get people moved up out of missions and into the orgs and AOs. I remember well, a lot of people were suddenly declaring natural Clear or past life Clear. It was epidemic. And the accusation that missions were clinging to people that needed to move up and onto OT. It was really pretty blatant.

    A lot of people fell for it. Including me. I had a lot of pressure from family to do the OT levels. But the vast majority of my friends never even got past Clear. Actually I can't think of even one that did, at that time.

    Of course, years later, all those natural or past life clears were suddenly deemed unclear. Time to redo it all again. Wash rinse repeat.
  19. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    Right. Because anything I spit out traces a (rough) sine curve too. Ahem.

    How does that happen, anyone? Is it shooped or what? I understand the usual trajectory but what about the curve at the beginning? Did he move his head down fast?

  20. tesseract

    tesseract Patron with Horrors

    Yes, I think the kid did just that. I know other similar pics taken with flash, for example of beer mugs breaking during doing a toast and beer spilling everywhere, same about the curved trajectories of liquid.
    Sorry for derail. I like to puzzle about whether a pic is shooped or not. :eyeroll:

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