The Thetan Paradox or How to Become a Scientologist for Free

Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by Justine156, Apr 30, 2018.

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  1. Justine156

    Justine156 Scientologist

    (Scroll down to the last paragraph if you're not interested in my comprehension of the thetan)

    It is believed that a thetan, or a soul, "lives" inside a human body. In Scientology, a human being is not his body, his mind, or his emotions, but a perfect, immortal thetan wearing an imperfect, mortal body. The flesh-wearing thetan is not perfect because of the flesh and its components (mostly our ability to have memories, bad emotions, retain chemical drugs, etc.), and to "free" itself, the thetan has to get rid of those components by getting rid of the memories and bad emotions through the concept of Auditing. When "successfully" done, the body becomes Clear, that is without the flesh-related components that "limit the thetan abilities".

    The thetan, being immortal, lives many lives. Traumatic memories or bad emotions are believed to originate from these many lives. Even though the thetan is believed to be immortal, he is dependant on the materialistic flesh of the human body and cannot live without being reincarnated in a new one when an old one dies. Now, when that new and imperfect human being grows up and becomes aware of Scientology either through their relatives or a Super Bowl commercial, their purpose is to "consciously free" themselves by climbing up the infamous Bridge that offers a step-by-step model towards salvation. To climb up that Bridge, the human being has to pay for expensive courses, trainings and auditing sessions in order to shed everything that is limiting the perfect thetan living inside of him. The problem, however, is that the human body not only suffers from its past lives, it also suffers from Body Thetans, or "dead aliens" from trillion of years ago, and the human being has to pay even more to get rid of those. The ultimate problem? The Bridge is incomplete.

    So here's the paradox. For trillion of years a thetan had (and still has) to live inside mortal human beings. When a human being dies, the thetan escapes the body and occupies a new one and somehow develops amnesia that refrain itself from becoming self-conscious (as far as I know, no child on Earth spoke about Scientological concepts without learning about them first). So the thetan needs to reincarnate itself ad infinitum in imperfect bodies that, in the best case, achieve the highest (but not the end) level of the Bridge during their short (in comparison to trillion of years) lifetime to simply die and reincarnate itself in another imperfect body whose purpose is to, again, climb up the Bridge.
    The problem here is the incompleteness of the path to salvation as the Scientological concept of salvation is currently unattainable no matter what you do or buy. Currently, the best thing a human being can do is to achieve OT VIII.

    Here I am. My name is Justine and I have never taken a single Scientology course or training. I have never read a single Scientology book. I am, however, conscious of being a thetan. I am a thetan that is self-aware. I am a thetan in a happy, healthy, and successful body. I don't have money problems; or at least I don't need more money to be happier than I already am. You can say that I have all the abilities of an OT VIII. Please bring any OT VIII and I'll show that person that I am as happy and powerful as they are. I am a natural Clear. I'm a huge Scientology believer, obviously, as I am conscious to be a thetan. Don't believe me? You can test me with Auditing and the E-meter. I do not show stress as I am very happy in my life. I can even fool the E-meter, I am that powerful. Any auditing session would be useless for me as I don't have any past trauma. You can audit me all you want you won't find any problem. No thank you, I'll wait for the OT IX instead.

    Can I join the Sea Org, buy nothing, and become a Scientologist for free?

    Edit: My point is that, either:
    - Scientology would happily accept me as a Scientologist and Sea Org member for free
    - Scientology would have to admit that to be a Scientologist or a Sea Org member one has to be sad, depressed, unsuccessful, or full of problems, and that happy people are not allowed to be Scientologists until they realize that they are full of problems so that they can pay Scientology to get rid of them. The concept of thetan would then self-defeats, as Scientology would only be a self-help solution for mortal human beings and NOT a place on Earth for thetans to live and enjoy themselves in "happy" (as far as the Bridge currently allows) bodies.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2018
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  2. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    It depends on your definition of "free".

    In the Sea Org, you are the property of senior management (David Miscavige). You will spend every waking hour, and SO people don't get much sleep, working to make money for Scientology, and will receive barely enough to live on in exchange.

    But, go ahead and join if you want to.
     
  3. Justine156

    Justine156 Scientologist

    My question is not if I want to, but if it is permitted in Scientology. I can even "study" Scientology on my own on the internet, and then answer any of their questions in relation to Scientology materials or LRH. I also cannot be an ex-Scientologist/SP as my face and my name appear nowhere in their files. How are they handling such cases?
     
  4. Jim Dandy

    Jim Dandy Patron with Honors

    :laugh:

    Thanks for joining ESMB Justine! Really. I mean it.

    :bwahaha:
     
  5. Jim Dandy

    Jim Dandy Patron with Honors

    Oh Terril where are you? You have a potential new member just across the Channel from you!
     
  6. Jim Dandy

    Jim Dandy Patron with Honors

    They are scouring LRH policy right now to find out exactly how to handle you. I'm thinking False Purpose Rundown (FPRD) would be toward the top of their list. Of course an "interview" on the meter to make sure your needle doesn't "rock slam". If not then I think they will view you as a highly prized "raw meat" who can definitely be "recovered" in time before you do something to warrant "illegal PC" status.

    Hey, all this cult lingo is kinda fun. It's been awhile for me!
     
  7. George Layton

    George Layton Silver Meritorious Patron

    A Trillion years?
     
  8. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Posted by Justine 156 and snipped.


    Almost anyone can become a scientologist (via the SO) 'for free'' ... you just turn up and join up. There is the small matter of signing an SO contract first but that's no biggie, it's only for a billion years.

    When you leave you will be handed a bill (a freeloaders bill) but it isn't legally binding so ... you will have had the pleasure of being a scientologist ... for free!


    You should do it, I think you would love it.

    Yawn.
     
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  9. Justine156

    Justine156 Scientologist

    This is surprising, I did not know that. So you confirm that if I enter the Flag building right now, say that I want to join the SO and buy absolutely no material at all, I would be accepted as a Scientologist for free and enjoy all the benefits and status of an OT VIII member?
     
  10. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    I didn't say that ... I said you can 'be a scientologist ... for free'.

    If you do the above, they will accept you (I expect) and they will tell you that you will be able to climb the bridge to OTVIII while working your contracted post ... for free (there are no benefits and there is no longer any status) but you will never actually achieve it on staff and if you leave they hand you the bill for everything you have done (but it will all be for staff/post courses and maybe a little auditing).

    Once you buy any basic course (or even read a cult book) they consider that you are already a scientologist ... you can consider that too if you like ... there is no need to join officially.
     
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  11. Justine156

    Justine156 Scientologist

    I didn't say you can't be a Scientologist for free, the Free Zone is a proof that you can. I'm talking about being a Scientologist in the "eyes" of the Church of Scientology and its organizations.

    If you say that I'd have to buy any basic course or book, then you say that I could not join the Church of Scientology for free.
     
  12. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Whatever ...

    What is your actual point?

    The Freezone isn't proof of any such thing ... it still costs money, though less than with the cofs.
     
  13. Justine156

    Justine156 Scientologist

    Please read the first post:

     
  14. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    You have altered it since I first read it!

    OK ... Scientology would (almost certainly) and happily accept you as a Scientologist and Sea Org member for free.
     
  15. Justine156

    Justine156 Scientologist

    True, sorry about that.

    Ok. I find this extremely surprising for a business-like cult, and I'm not endorsing it or whatever. It would be interesting to test that theory as I'm not aware of anyone who has not paid a single thing but still is high ranked in the Church.
     
  16. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Loads of people have done that (many of us did) ... but, as mentioned earlier, if they leave they are handed a bill (often huge) at that point and are expected to pay it. If they stay (for the rest of their lives) ... it's 'free' (if you are speaking purely in a monetary sense).
     
  17. Jim Dandy

    Jim Dandy Patron with Honors

    You will have to go through a process. I forgot what it's called, some of our ex-SO members will remember. Takes at minimum a month.

    But nuthin's free. Or, admission is free, you pay to get out. Lol... Sometime's with your life.

    But other than that, no, you will not be given the status of an OT VIII member. You will be considered a Pre Clear.
     
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  18. Jim Dandy

    Jim Dandy Patron with Honors

    Hubbard had a saying about "Making the able more able". They prefer getting people in who are successful. So don't worry about not accepting you because you aren't "broken down" enough.

    They use people's "ruins" as a hook to drag them in. But on their initial assessment test I'm sure they'll find something about you that is a "ruin". It's designed to do so. Lol...

    The Oxford something or other Assessment No it has nothing to do with Oxford University.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2018
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  19. Justine156

    Justine156 Scientologist

    So my next question is: what's the point of joining the Church if you're already happy and you don't need to read the materials? What does the Church of Scientology offers to people who do not want to pay for auditing and courses? My guess would be that they would have the authorization to hang out inside the empty Orgs and to promote the Scientology religion everywhere and recruit new members. Is that correct?
     
  20. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    As I said before, there are ways to get in without paying cash to buy stuff, namely by becoming staff/SO. But that just means that they extract labor from you without providing much of an exchange.

    If your actual question is "Can I join and be considered a high status Scientologist, but without doing anything which contributes to the Gross Income statistic of Scn?", then as far as I know, the answer is no.

    You can be very pleasant and fun to be around. But if your existence does not, in some measurable way, contribute to the cash flow, then you are a distraction and will be tossed out.
     
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