Vinaire
Sponsor
Thanks for the update Vinay. Please do keep us posted.
Say "hello" to Mrs V for me too please.
Yes, I did; and she says "hello" back to you.
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Vinaire's Story
- Thread starter Vinaire
- Start date
Yes, I did; and she says "hello" back to you.
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FoTi
Crusader
Vinaire
Sponsor
Not really, because there is no commission in this for me. I do this out of sheer joy.
It is just my desire that Idenics should be known and used. My efforts are toward my exchange back to the society, which supports me as an engineer.
Mike maintains the purity of Idenics and exchanges Idenics training with the individuals. That is how he earns his living, and that is perfectly okay.
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Tiger Lily
Gold Meritorious Patron
Vinaire, I just got done reading your story. I really enjoyed it; you write very well. I know the Cambridge area and I could picture a young MIT student and everything you were experiencing.
I know that you said you will write more when you are up to it. I just wanted you to know that it will be received with interest when you do!!
Specifically I would love to know the process of realization that Scientology wasn't where you wanted to be, and how you got out. It's obvious that it started very well for you, so it would be interesting to see what changed the tide, and how you ended up getting declared.
(If you have posted this already somewhere, could you direct me there?)
Thanks,
-TL
I know that you said you will write more when you are up to it. I just wanted you to know that it will be received with interest when you do!!
Specifically I would love to know the process of realization that Scientology wasn't where you wanted to be, and how you got out. It's obvious that it started very well for you, so it would be interesting to see what changed the tide, and how you ended up getting declared.
(If you have posted this already somewhere, could you direct me there?)
Thanks,
-TL
Vinaire
Sponsor
Thank you, TL.
Maybe I should write all that some day. Keep in mind, at that time, I was newly from a very different culture, and I lacked differentiation between American culture and the culture in Scientology and Sea Org.
So, all the time I was observing and inspecting everything that I came across in this culture. I did not gobble up any reality wholesale. I absorbed what I found useful and rejected what I found silly. What you may call Hubbardian, it was all American to me.
So, I never latched on to Hubbard as a savior, as many Amaricans in Scientology seem to have done. Nor did I end up hating everything that Hubbard did.
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Maybe I should write all that some day. Keep in mind, at that time, I was newly from a very different culture, and I lacked differentiation between American culture and the culture in Scientology and Sea Org.
So, all the time I was observing and inspecting everything that I came across in this culture. I did not gobble up any reality wholesale. I absorbed what I found useful and rejected what I found silly. What you may call Hubbardian, it was all American to me.
So, I never latched on to Hubbard as a savior, as many Amaricans in Scientology seem to have done. Nor did I end up hating everything that Hubbard did.
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Tiger Lily
Gold Meritorious Patron
I think that's part of the reason that I'm so interested in what you have to say. You seem to have maintained the ability to just look at what happened and accept the good and the bad for what it is. Right now I'm struggling to reconcile what I observed that was good and workable and helpful (my greatest spiritual awakenings were through Scientology) with the obvious evil that exists there (I almost lost my soul to it). It's people like you that have insights into how that could happen.
-TL
(I was one of those Americans that latched onto LRH as a savior. . . I'm a little wiser now about saviors)
Vinaire
Sponsor
To me Scientology didn’t express any new truths; it only re-expressed the ancient truths in a neatly organized manner. I liked that re-organization as it made a hell a lot of stuff clearer to me.
But looking from the viewpoint of a person who has never been exposed to the the Vedas, I can see how they would be wow’d by this data and would swallow it whole hook and sinker, along with Hubbard’s opinions that were thrown in to manipulate people. Hubbard does deserve credit for reorganizing those truths, but he did that in a self-serving manner that ended up hurting people, which was not good.
What might help you is the study of the Vedic background which is very well expressed by Swami Vivekananda. You may find it on my site here.
Swami Vivekananda
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But looking from the viewpoint of a person who has never been exposed to the the Vedas, I can see how they would be wow’d by this data and would swallow it whole hook and sinker, along with Hubbard’s opinions that were thrown in to manipulate people. Hubbard does deserve credit for reorganizing those truths, but he did that in a self-serving manner that ended up hurting people, which was not good.
What might help you is the study of the Vedic background which is very well expressed by Swami Vivekananda. You may find it on my site here.
Swami Vivekananda
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Tiger Lily
Gold Meritorious Patron
Yes-- that's exactly what happened. It blew me away and I bought it all. Your viewpoint on what LRH was doing makes a lot of sense to me; puts it in a framework that I can work with to try to make sense of it; the good/bad dichotomy. Thanks
I have actually read some of the Vedic Hymns since Scientology and liked what I was reading, but I haven't really delved into them. I went to Amazon to order a book by Swami V. and he's written so many!! (I prefer books to reading on the Internet so I can take notes in the margins) Which one would you recommend to start with?
-TL
Vinaire
Sponsor
You may buy the 9 volumes of "The Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda." They are not expensive at all.
You may find used copies that are still cheaper. But the data in them is invaluable.
Those who may like to have this data free, please use the link from my site that I provided earlier.
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Tiger Lily
Gold Meritorious Patron
You may buy the 9 volumes of "The Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda." They are not expensive at all.
You may find used copies that are still cheaper. But the data in them is invaluable.
Those who may like to have this data free, please use the link from my site that I provided earlier.
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I will, thanks so much!!
-TL
lkwdblds
Crusader
We have somewhat parallel time tracks
Vinaire, I read your posts just now and enjoyed them very much. you are skilled at expressing your feelings. One thing that impressed me is that I share quite a few experiences in common with you. I am American, which is quite different than you but I was born into the Jewish faith. I did not find what I was looking for in Judaism and got involved with Buddhism in 1967 and meditated nearly daily for over 2 years. I feel a strong affinity for the Japanese culture and feel I have a long time track there and I also admire India and its cultures. Here are some of our similarities:
1. I just finished writing my story - The Old Days-Life on the Apollo 1973 and it is right next to your story when one goes to click on a story.
2. I studied Math and Engineering and worked as a computer programmer in Fortran on the Apollo program and later at NASA in Houston. I am not in your league in this area by the way. I have just a Bachelors degree from Cal State Fullerton in Math. I would not qualify for MIT let alone maintain 4.0.
3 You joined Scientology in 1969 and I joined in June of 1970.
4. We both had huge wins on the HAS Course
5. I went to the big 20 year anniversary at the Long Beach Arena and it seems as if you attended that event as well.
6. We both joined the Sea Org in 1971.
7. We were both on the Bolivar in '71 doing the same course (also Excalibur)
8. We were both shy around girls
9. You had a boy and girl born in '86 and '88. My boy and girl were born in "82 and '87.
10.We both experienced large wins in Scientology and also large losses.
11. I knew Mike Goldstein of Idenics very well in the '73 to '75 period. My Brother was on staff at the Denver Org and I stayed at Mike's house when I went there to visit my brother. When Mike, and my Brother quit Scientology in 1983 I was fiercely loyal to the Church and was afraid of any contact with Mike Goldstein but since I am now out of the Church maybe I should give it a
look. You seem to have the power to inspire others spiritually with you words and deeds. Would swami be the correct word to use, what about guru?
Please write more when the inspiration is in you because you have a lot to say and say it well.
P.S. You have to admit, our timetracks have quite a bit in common.
Very best to you, lkwdblds
Vinaire, I read your posts just now and enjoyed them very much. you are skilled at expressing your feelings. One thing that impressed me is that I share quite a few experiences in common with you. I am American, which is quite different than you but I was born into the Jewish faith. I did not find what I was looking for in Judaism and got involved with Buddhism in 1967 and meditated nearly daily for over 2 years. I feel a strong affinity for the Japanese culture and feel I have a long time track there and I also admire India and its cultures. Here are some of our similarities:
1. I just finished writing my story - The Old Days-Life on the Apollo 1973 and it is right next to your story when one goes to click on a story.
2. I studied Math and Engineering and worked as a computer programmer in Fortran on the Apollo program and later at NASA in Houston. I am not in your league in this area by the way. I have just a Bachelors degree from Cal State Fullerton in Math. I would not qualify for MIT let alone maintain 4.0.
3 You joined Scientology in 1969 and I joined in June of 1970.
4. We both had huge wins on the HAS Course
5. I went to the big 20 year anniversary at the Long Beach Arena and it seems as if you attended that event as well.
6. We both joined the Sea Org in 1971.
7. We were both on the Bolivar in '71 doing the same course (also Excalibur)
8. We were both shy around girls
9. You had a boy and girl born in '86 and '88. My boy and girl were born in "82 and '87.
10.We both experienced large wins in Scientology and also large losses.
11. I knew Mike Goldstein of Idenics very well in the '73 to '75 period. My Brother was on staff at the Denver Org and I stayed at Mike's house when I went there to visit my brother. When Mike, and my Brother quit Scientology in 1983 I was fiercely loyal to the Church and was afraid of any contact with Mike Goldstein but since I am now out of the Church maybe I should give it a
look. You seem to have the power to inspire others spiritually with you words and deeds. Would swami be the correct word to use, what about guru?
Please write more when the inspiration is in you because you have a lot to say and say it well.
P.S. You have to admit, our timetracks have quite a bit in common.
Very best to you, lkwdblds
Vinaire
Sponsor
Thanks, that is an interesting summary. Our paths may have crossed in Programs Bureau on Flagship Apollo too.
You seem to have a much better memory of those days than I have. I just don't care for those memories. What you have written may help me recall some of the incidents from Bolivar, USLO, and Apollo (RPF and Programs Bu). It won't be a narrative though.
I still cannot place you, but your description reminded me of Larry Reeves.
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You seem to have a much better memory of those days than I have. I just don't care for those memories. What you have written may help me recall some of the incidents from Bolivar, USLO, and Apollo (RPF and Programs Bu). It won't be a narrative though.
I still cannot place you, but your description reminded me of Larry Reeves.
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everfree
Patron Meritorious
That's the main thing that attracted me, in my ignorance, to CofS in the first place. Sadly, I had seen some of the. most sordid aspects of life in the US which left me - a ridiculously naïve, idealistic young person - with a burning desire to make things better, to prevent such things from happening again.
I also had family members and friends who worked in social services so I knew that existing social service programs weren't going to change things despite the hard work of caring people.
So when I first sat in a reg office and they told me about DMSMH, how it could be read by anyone and used to help people fix their own problems, I was captured by the possibility of a low cost grass roots psychotherapy movement. I thought that it could truly transform society.
Of course over time I found out that CofS doesn't really work that way and I became accustomed to the idea of charging astronomic fees only affordable by a tiny percentage of the population.
Interestingly I had already run across what I later learned was at least partly a Dianetics offshoot called co-counselling which somehow didn't excite me in the same way. I didn't know too much about it at the time (still don't, actually) but got the idea that it required a fair amount of skill which put out of the ability of your average person.
Looking back co-counselling is probably closer to what I had envisioned dianetics to be than CofS is.
Nevertheless, over the years I have come to appreciate the complexity of human behavior and relationships. I think that all but the simplest issues are out of reach of an average person to handle through psychotherapy, it takes too much training and understanding so my original idea of a transformational grass roots movement is not possible as such.
Which isn't to say that a grass roots psychotherapy (or other forms of lay social service) movement couldn't be worthwhile. I think it's great that you tutor in math, Vinaire, and I'm sure that whatever potential idenics has for helping people will find it's fulfillment in hand such as yours so I wish you luck.
KnightVision
Gold Meritorious Patron
So as with Dntics and Scn... are you ready to put your 'stuff' up to academic scrutiny?
If not.. when will we learn... unreal.
Vinaire
Sponsor
What will happen will happen. I am now introducing the subject of Idenics to the professional community of engineers and doctors.
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Vinaire
Sponsor
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