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Analysis of Church writings

Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by MarkWI, May 28, 2007.

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  1. MarkWI

    MarkWI Patron Meritorious

    Hello,
    I spent all weekend reading a very nice site of a Scientologist.
    I suggest critics and good standing scientologist to read it.
    I enjoyed most the Disconnection topic, but the entire site is worth reading.

    http://www.algonet.se/~tourtel/interests/hubbard.html
     
  2. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    What a bunch of lies!!!!!!

    This is just one of them.

    ?Note: Neglect of this PL has caused great hardship on staffs, has cost countless millions and made it necessary in 1970 to engage in an all-out, international effort to restore basic Scientology over the world. Within 5 years after the issue of this PL, with me off the lines, violation had almost destroyed orgs. ?Quickie grades? entered in and denied gain to tens of thousands of cases. Therefore actions which neglect or violate this policy letter are HIGH CRIMES resulting in Comm Evs on ADMINISTRATORS and EXECUTIVES. It is not ?entirely a tech matter?, as its neglect destroys orgs and caused a 2-year slump. IT IS THE BUSINESS OF EVERY STAFF MEMBER to enforce it.? LRH

    I was on the Original Class VIII Course when the "Quickie Grades" were enforced into existence by LRH.

    There were 5 people taken from the "no Grades in state" to putting their Grades 0 to IV in, then Power, in 5 hours. Then the CC. Then all the way to OT 6 in under 3 weeks.

    LRH boasted about it on the Class VIII tapes........most likely edited out now.

    Everyone of those 5 people blew Scio within 3 weeks of returning to their Orgs as OT 6 - Class VIII's.

    If you did not do the "Quickie Grades" on your pc. you were thrown overboard.

    In October, 1969 I came to the ship and protested to LRH about the "Quickie Grades" and the damage it was doing world wide.

    For my troubles I was held on the ship for 3 months, comm eved and vilified.

    My 10 Centers were taken from me......

    Alan
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 2, 2012
  3. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

    5 hours for ALL of that!? Are you kidding?
    Was this because of a push for stats?
     
  4. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor


    The author of this website is Michel Snoeck. There may well be much
    good stuff on his website, but I'm not going to go check it all out.

    He was on one of our forums for a while, and someone mentioned that
    Barbara Schwarz http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbara_Schwarz
    was crazy and he blew up, defended her and said she was a friend of hers.
    He then posted stuff from our forum to ARS for Barbara to read. Caused trouble, and he threatened me when I took him off the forum. Or before, can't recall now.

    Anyone who considers themselves in agreement with Barbara Schwartz is
    IMO suspect of being a can or two short of a six pack.
     
  5. beyond_horizons

    beyond_horizons Patron Meritorious

    She's doing what comes naturally when you’re satisfactorily indoctrinated. Ron surely would have been proud of her ... far more so than he was with his own son Q.

    You Go Girl! ... Show'em what scientology is all about! :)
     
  6. beyond_horizons

    beyond_horizons Patron Meritorious

    I don't get what your saying here and with out having to read through someone elses rendition of all this ... sum it up for me!

    Are you saying these 'quicky grades' are a good thing or bad thing for the individual? Yes/No?

    Are you saying hubbard formulated them and it was bad for your cash flow in your 10 orgs to do them? Yes / No?

    And because you didn't want to do them you got busted? Yes / No? :confused:
     
  7. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    This is a question for bb. Or maybe Roland (ami).

    Do you know how this data is taken by opinion leaders such as Chris B. on "standard tech" forums, such as yours or Mike's? Is it assumed that Alan is lying about LRH being behind quickie grades, rather than LRH lying about being "off the lines"? Or are LRH's lies here in KSW1 acknowledged as such?

    Paul
     
  8. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    It is a fact that quickie grades existed in the period Alan talks of. Brought
    a friend down to St. Hill who did 0-4 in 30 mins and was awarded a condition of power in her auditing! Quickie carried on until " Tech Degrades" in 1970,
    so Alan may have got his point across in the end. :)

    Basically the buck stops with LRH. I will quote here data that backs up Alan's statements.

    HCOB 3 april 1966 DIANETIC AUDITING COURSE

    "Due to the fantastic speed of results today, it is not possible for a student
    to get enough auditing experience using the standard tech of 0- VI"

    " AND we have the gigantic problem amongst us that Scientology works
    too fast in an auditors hands and forbids him to overun a result. Therefore HOW CAN HE EVER LEARN TO AUDIT? He can't, running scientology, as he'll
    never get enough practice on live PCs.

    " You can audit a PC for a long, long time and you ~can~ get auditing practice." [ referring to with dianetics]

    I recall that one of the reasons for the HSDC was that auditors could actually get practice. Its clear from the above data grades were quicked because they take lots of time now.

    The original class VIII tapes may be available in the FZ.

    No one on the standard tech forums does quickie grades AFAIK. Chris Black
    recently commented that the grades processes in the new red vols got some commands wrongly stated on quadding up.
     
  9. Tanstaafl

    Tanstaafl Crusader

    Ye Gods! That's horrific! :mad:

    Did this friend stay in long? What did they make of the experience?

    What year was it?

    Thanks.
     
  10. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    BAD! BAD! BAD!

    No.

    The were bad for my honor and integrity; and the honor and integrity of the pc; and the honor and integrity of Scio.

    I got busted because LRH did not want to know!

    I impacted him and the SO with such force that I put him in bed for 6 weeks. (Might have been a slight mis-estimation of effort on my part.) :eyeroll:

    Imagine you are beginner at learning the piano - but you want to be a great world renowned concert pianist - you go in to an Org to get some processing - you f/n in 10 mins - are you now a great world renowned concert pianist?

    Of course not - yet you f/ned -

    It is this continuous false states and unrun case conditions that has destroyed Scio.

    I have not met a Scio or exScio yet who is not a by-passed case of magnitude.

    Alan
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 2, 2012
  11. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    He did? After not saying much about it when I first posted about it (and here and here and here) on your forum in August 2005? I hope he gave correct attribution.

    You no-answered my question, by the way, bb. :)

    Paul
     
  12. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    I answered all I could. I havn't kept the forum comments in my e-mail box,
    and couldn't recall details.

    With your help I can read again and comment. :) Not sure if I can do a google search on the various forums websites.
     
  13. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Ha! I was ambushed. Cool. :) Which forum do your posts come from, or is it several?

    I as you have, commented adversely on the HCOPL KSW. I note that you
    take KSW rather seriously from your old posts. Without the inflexibility.

    You should look in on FreezoneOrg right now. May give you a few laughs. :)
     
  14. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    Click here, bb, and use the search box. You'll have to log into Yahoo at the same time.

    Paul
     
  15. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    Those four are all FreezoneOrg, as it says in the Subject line of each post.

    Yes. :)

    Paul
     
  16. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Post 665 on FZorg is not what you were referring to. It was though a real blast from the past to see Joe Keldani's post etc! You and I and others were contributing.
     
  17. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    No, that 665 is roughly the 665th post selected by me to be archived and indexed on my main site. The original forum post number is not referenced, although the date and time is.

    All I can remember from Joe Keldani is he was going on and on about some eval he was doing and he was complaining about me making assumptions about what he was going to say and invalidating it before the fact, so I told him to hurry up and say it so I could invalidate it after the fact. Which he found amusing.

    24,000 posts ago on that forum, I just had a quick look. Whatever happened to Joe? And remember Charlie from then too? Whatever happened to her? She didn't hang around long.

    Paul
     
  18. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    I just checked--it's on the IFA forum. He didn't. Since he says there are only a few, he should know there is a complete list of the 28 Grades processes in the new Tech Vols with incorrect flow commands here in Scienowiki. God, what would these Class VIIIs do without me? :)

    Paul
     
  19. MarkWI

    MarkWI Patron Meritorious

    The web site I referred is analyzing the issuance of HCOB/HCOPLs and point out that latest HCOB/PL may not have been written nor authorized by LRH, in other words controversial issues like 'disconnection' and 'heavy ethics' may have been originated by someone else (guess who?) and issued under LRH name.

    What I like about this site is that it does not give you conclusions nor bypassed charge, just investigate facts.

    Beside that I liked very much the first hand knowledge about Quickies grades posted by Alan, Terry, Paul.
     
  20. beyond_horizons

    beyond_horizons Patron Meritorious

    Well, well, how special!

    Who actually developed the levels? And when did hubbo actually blow and go into hiding? That would be an interesting story!

    I always felt that what ever scientology givith in the beginning it soon taketh away in the end! One had to have been a survivor before scientology to have survived it.

    - 1. Blame
    - 1.3 Regret
    - 1.5 Controlling bodies :nazi:
    - 2.2 Protecting bodies
    - 3. Owning bodies
    - 3.5 Approval from bodies
    - 4. Needing bodies
    - 5. Worshipping bodies
    - 6. Sacrifice
    - 8. Hiding :hide:
    -10. Being objects
    -20. Being nothing
    -30. Can't hide :storm: as in a Bluebird motor home, in a secluded wooded area in Northern California!

    How many scientologist these days, for status and the sake of the pissing contest, still claim to be in telepathic communications with the hubbo?

    This to me appears to be one of the sources of the essance that has been projected into that group, that comes across as icky, sticky and parasitic!

    What a wonderfull 'path out' that turned out to be? :no: