Panda Termint
Cabal Of One
Apparently. I still have trouble believing that nobody photo-copied them. Don't you?
BTW, phenom, you gave a WTF? on that post above, it's a parody post not anything I actually said.
Hubbard as a pedophile?
- Thread starter FreeThePeople44
- Start date
BTW, phenom, you gave a WTF? on that post above, it's a parody post not anything I actually said.
Rmack
Van Allen Belt Sunbather
oneonewasaracecar
Gold Meritorious Patron
Probably.I can jusht shee where thad quo you ashcribed ta me and the, um what, oh damn... Barbecued Bear!
La La Lou Lou
Crusader
Not sure of the relevance, but it's good to hear the Yardbirds again.
We have the affirmations, but can't rely on them for evidence. However it does seem likely that an overweight old man wouldn't be getting as much crumpet as he did in his youth.
Hubbard was like a red headed Benny Hill, and the CMO were like St Trinians girls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bxoAsvhcOI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tq_EPC82hzI
La La Lou Lou
Crusader
Victoria, we are being rude today! WELCOME!
I think you're perfectly right, Hubbard would have done something, anything and not felt guilt for doing it, if he actually wanted to do it.
SpectrumV
Patron
Gerry Armstrong had this to say at the recent Toronto conference about working on Hubbards biography with Omar Garrison.
Quoted from tonyortega.org
"After the FBI raid, and after Hubbard hid out in Nevada for a while, LRH came back to the California desert and started making training films.
Gerry says he was Props I/C and Sets I/C.
Then later was at the Gilman Hot Springs, setting up another operation. A raid threat. One of Gerry’s underlings, the LRH Gear I/C, brought a box of material and said, what should I do with this?
They were trying to find stuff to destroy that might incriminate Hubbard. But this was a pile of documents from Hubbard’s childhood and entire history. No, don’t destroy these, they have value.
He went to where they were stored, and took 20 or 21 boxes of old material. Gerry thought that it might form material for a library or archive and for public relations purposes.
"12:21 pm
Gerry says his last communication with Hubbard was in February 1980, when LRH went into permanent hiding.
Fun moment: He said he had money to purchase a car because he had an unlimited budget in a project to get Hubbard a Nobel Prize for the sauna program (Purification Rundown).
Talking about working with Omar Garrison, the writer who was hired by Scientology to write an official biography.
Interesting: Gerry said that having access to the actual Hubbard documentation helped him deprogram himself.
12:24 pm
Gerry says Omar’s nickname for Hubbard was “Johnny Goodbugger.”
Ha. The hero of Battlefield Earth is Johnny Goodboy Tyler, and Gerry says there was data in the documents that in his youth about buggery. Wow."
Buggery in Hubbards youth.
What was the data?
Was he doing or receiving said buggery?
The plot sickens.
Quoted from tonyortega.org
"After the FBI raid, and after Hubbard hid out in Nevada for a while, LRH came back to the California desert and started making training films.
Gerry says he was Props I/C and Sets I/C.
Then later was at the Gilman Hot Springs, setting up another operation. A raid threat. One of Gerry’s underlings, the LRH Gear I/C, brought a box of material and said, what should I do with this?
They were trying to find stuff to destroy that might incriminate Hubbard. But this was a pile of documents from Hubbard’s childhood and entire history. No, don’t destroy these, they have value.
He went to where they were stored, and took 20 or 21 boxes of old material. Gerry thought that it might form material for a library or archive and for public relations purposes.
"12:21 pm
Gerry says his last communication with Hubbard was in February 1980, when LRH went into permanent hiding.
Fun moment: He said he had money to purchase a car because he had an unlimited budget in a project to get Hubbard a Nobel Prize for the sauna program (Purification Rundown).
Talking about working with Omar Garrison, the writer who was hired by Scientology to write an official biography.
Interesting: Gerry said that having access to the actual Hubbard documentation helped him deprogram himself.
12:24 pm
Gerry says Omar’s nickname for Hubbard was “Johnny Goodbugger.”
Ha. The hero of Battlefield Earth is Johnny Goodboy Tyler, and Gerry says there was data in the documents that in his youth about buggery. Wow."
Buggery in Hubbards youth.
What was the data?
Was he doing or receiving said buggery?
The plot sickens.
No mystery there: He was never charged with anything in this country. As I understand it, one is charged after being arrested. The one thing he did well was run and hide and throw others under the bus.
WildKat
Gold Meritorious Patron
THANK YOU for noting that passage here. I noticed it too, and went "WTF?"
The sentence is incomplete or improperly constructed in the first place ("...there was data in the documents that in his youth about buggery.")
But how could he drop a bomb like that and not address or clarify it??? Tony is usually more astute than that.
We need to know what, exactly, the documents were, and what they say, exactly.
Intentionally Blank
Scientology Widow
There is also the statement in the "Affirmations" about being taught to masturbate at the age of 11. This strongly suggests abuse to me. Which would make him more likely to abuse as an adult.
http://holysmoke.org/sig/collections-hubbard.txt
lotus
stubborn rebel sheep!
Since I've read those affirmations of him and his ''special'' relationship with Snake Thomson, ''teaching'' him hypnotism... :confused2:
I've said to myself a big WTF
My thought is what happened with Thompson might have been a tipping point into shaping LRH narcissism tendency to later morph into a pleasure to practice human abuse of all kind - especially toward children who he denied rights and used to meet his deeds and needs.
Hopefully we may know one day and hopefully it may help to understand how such a mind became so cruel and abusive... :confused2:
I've said to myself a big WTF
My thought is what happened with Thompson might have been a tipping point into shaping LRH narcissism tendency to later morph into a pleasure to practice human abuse of all kind - especially toward children who he denied rights and used to meet his deeds and needs.
Hopefully we may know one day and hopefully it may help to understand how such a mind became so cruel and abusive... :confused2:
lotus
stubborn rebel sheep!
I have the same thought :confused2:
A narcissist pervert abuser hypnostist mindfucker guru who has a collection of slave chidren to be his servants....who thinks he is the messiah and is allow to torture smallchild, kill foetus, drug and hypnotise his own kids...who had said : Men shall be my slaves,,''
well...usually also sexually abuse children...(90-95% chances) otherwise...he would be a case of interest to study! (may be impotency and no interest in sex...rare but can happen)
Considering what happend to Gerry Armstrong in terms of decades of ostracization amongst the $cientologists\exes\indies\freezone communities for the release of LRH admissions...I doubt the release of sexual abuses against kids would be welcome...I would think of it twice prior going public with such story
Gizmo
Rabble Rouser
I have the same thought :confused2:
A narcissist pervert abuser hypnostist mindfucker guru who has a collection of slave chidren to be his servants....who thinks he is the messiah and is allow to torture smallchild, kill foetus, drug and hypnotise his own kids...who had said : Men shall be my slaves,,''
well...usually also sexually abuse children...(90-95% chances) otherwise...he would be a case of interest to study! (may be impotency and no interest in sex...rare but can happen)
Considering what happend to Gerry Armstrong in terms of decades of ostracization amongst the $cientologists\exes\indies\freezone communities for the release of LRH admissions...I doubt the release of sexual abuses against kids would be welcome...I would think of it twice prior going public with such story
There was a time when kids in chain lockers on the Apollo just wasn't mentioned by anybody, anywhere - it was all hush hush.
Ron being a child serial molester might well be like putting kids in the chain locker once was - not to be talked about for fear of retribution.
More & more is coming out. OSA, while no dead or entirely toothless, does not yield then kind of impunity to the law it could once get away with.
Time to encourage anyone who has facts that can further blow up the myths about the old bastard to get a bull horn & be heard !
(my bold)
I think the "impotent" statement, as funny as it might be, can be safely dropped, since he provably fathered a few children. Therefore, all we have left is a statement of "erectile dysfunctionality", and even that one would be hard to prove.
Anyway, no matter how we slice and dice it, he was just a jerk and an insult for anything pretending to resemble anything human.
Enthetan
Master of Disaster
Yes, Ron had kids. The last kid, Arthur, was born June 6, 1958, when Ron was 47. The Sea Org ship days (1967-1976) were when Ron was in his late 50's and 60's.
Older guys on this board are aware of what happens to your abilities in that area as you get older.
oneonewasaracecar
Gold Meritorious Patron
True. The affirmations also indicate that he had problems with sexual desire and for a cult leader in the sexual revolution he had surprisingly few sexual partners.
I suspect he had no sex at all during his 50s, 60s and 70s.
He surrounded himself by scantily clad adolescent girls. Clearly their clothing, or lack thereof had a sexual element, but I doubt he had actual sex with them. This does not mean he did not commit other sex crimes with these children, but I am skeptical of this.
The reason I am skeptical sexual abuse took place is that none of these children (who would be in their 50s now) have spoken about this. Hana Eltringham has also said nothing.
Rathbun and Rinder would have known about operations to monitor the messengers. There would be a permanent surveillance budget. If it were true, there are numerous potential lines of evidence. Those messengers would have children now who would want to know why PIs had been following mummy since they were born. None of these have spoken out.
I think the primary reason he selected young girls for his messenger service is it gave him plausible deniability that he had ordered criminal acts. If someone was to try to testify against him, they would have to concede that they actually received orders from a 12 year old girl. Anyone would would admit this would essentially branding them self as an incredible witness.
Even if it were acknowledged that Hubbard did use this communication system, how could it be proven that the child didn't make the order herself and say it was from Hubbard?
Who would initiate a massive covert operation against numerous governments on the basis of orders from a 12 year old girl in hot pants and a halter top? Hubbard created the messenger service to insulate himself before engaging in operation Snow White.
Enthetan
Master of Disaster
Correct. The Messengers' job was to receive verbal orders from LRH, and relay them (despite all prior policy about verbal orders). The HCOPL about the Messengers made it such that an order from a Messenger was to be treated as an order from LRH, even if the Messenger originated the order, rather than relaying it. This further insulated LRH.
As you said, and as I and others said on other threads, having orders passed on by adolescent girls created a sufficient level of unreality to outsiders that it would be unlikely that anyone would try to pin the order on LRH.
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