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Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by Pip, Jul 11, 2011.

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  1. Ogsonofgroo

    Ogsonofgroo Crusader


    This is about as flocked as it gets imho, did you learn this from Blubber? Probably not, and whom ever 'persuaded' you was lying through their teeth due to the fact that there are tonnes of abstractions (ie. war, hate, famine, pollution) that make it a far from 'perfect' world.
    There are however many types of 'rose-colored glasses'.....
    'Yep! Looks great from here too!

    iyiyiyiyiyiyiyiyi :bigcry:
  2. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    Re: Win/Win?

    Steps A-E only work if one was suppressive in the first place. Why would I want to say I had knowingly suppressed Scientology or a Scientologist if I haven't.

    I have suggested that we draw a line under my past and start again but apparently the church does not work like that.
  3. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Re: Win/Win?

    Such is life.

  4. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    Re: Win/Win?

    Exactly. So it doesn't cover unjust expulsions. And why would it, when the organization itself is completely unfair, venal and downright freaking mean?
  5. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    I do understand where you are coming from, but just suppose you were with the love of your life in some idyllic location would you not think it was "just perfect". If someone were to say no its not, you are looking through "rose-coloured glasses" would it not suggest that they had a serious problem. You see reality is what we choose it to be. That I did get from my time in Scientology.
  6. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    Amen to that Sister! :)
  7. Ogsonofgroo

    Ogsonofgroo Crusader

    Hm, yes, but an individual is an infinitesimally small part of a much larger 'reality' that is not bound by what we ourselves see and think and do, and though one can ignore it and live in their own bubbles of 'perfection', that larger universe around you is still a reality that for the most part is not affected by you unless you get out and change things on a very large scale. Chances are that most concieved 'imperfections' in the non-perfect world are seen by many in much the same light.
    IOW, though one can choose to live only seeing their own little universe, it doesn't change the fact that there are countless Ones.
    People's mental flagellations often have the adverse effect of clouding their eyes.

    (yer gonna go blind! :p )
  8. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    Re: Win/Win?

    Yes you HAVE. At least from their point of view (Co$), not to mention Hubbard's as well.

    You absolutely insist on mixing Scientology with other practices (Christianity)
    Insisting on doing that in violation of Policy as well as technical bulletins I'm sure has to be a violation of Keeping Scientology Working, which is a High Crime.

    Pip, that's not the way I see it. I'm not saying you're a Suppressive Person.
    But that IS how I would have seen it during the years I was a staff member, due to the indoctrination I received. If you can't be handled in Qual or Ethics and your "misunderstandings" and disagreements can't be cleared up and you insist on continuing to Squirrel Scientology then there's one solution. :omg:

    The fate of the planet is at stake here. Every Man, Woman, and child could be negatively impacted for endless trillions of years if we don't Keep Scientology Working. :coolwink:

    EDIT: Coming forward 20+ years my beliefs changed a bit. As far as I'm concerned you can create any religion you wish as long as you don't harm others. If you want to Squirrel five different religions and combine them into Pipology I'm fine with that. Go for it.

    However, as Emma said in the ESMB Board FAQ's (under "What is the Purpose of this Board?):

    "This board is not meant to be a vehicle to plead your case, reconvert the fallen or preach your brand."

    So, if you wish to sell "ChristianScientology" (which you have acknowledged you DO) then this isn't the proper place to do so. :no:
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2011
  9. EP - Ethics Particle

    EP - Ethics Particle Gold Meritorious Patron

    It came to my attention that a thread should be initiated as follows:

    "I am a bald-headed chicken flicker!" :p

    What does the group assembled have to say about that! :confused2:

  10. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    I'm totally OK with it. As long as you don't mess with MY chicken. :omg::coolwink:
  11. Panda Termint

    Panda Termint Cabal Of One

    Pip, speaking as a person who is well experienced in the CofS up until 2008, I can guarantee that, based on the views you have expressed in this thread, you would never be considered a member nor a scientologist(tm) by the CofS as it exists today.

    I hope that you take this comment in the spirit in which it was tendered. You may be able to make some aspects of scientology work in your own life but, in truth, you'd be horrified by what you found passing for a "religion" within the walls of this institution. Scientology (as it is actually practiced) is NEVER going to be what you wish it was.
  12. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill


    When the cult was going to (which they did but only after I first walked away in disgust) expell me for posting to a critical forum, I was actually upset about it til they went too far in their handlings.

    I learned that I was better off without them. And I think that you might eventually learn that lesson, too. I highly recommend it!
  13. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    An individual is as small or as large as they consider they are. History is studded with beings who have changed "reality" for large numbers of people for the better. The appearence is that these beings change things on the outside but in actuality it is because of the changes they have made on the inside. The more one's subjective reality is perfection the greater their effect on the external environment. This is the very essence of metaphysics. In truth there are not "countless ones" there is only one.

    I agree there is no point in "beating oneself up" because of the state of the world, but what is necessary is to change one's perception of the world.
  14. ClamSource

    ClamSource Patron with Honors

    As far as most people are concerned:

    The world is this big:

    They are this big:
  15. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    Re: Win/Win?

    Perhaps from the church's point of view but not from LRH's unless I am very much mistaken.

    Forget about the ChristianScientology bit for a moment and look at the love and understanding. Since when was love and understanding mixing practices? And as for KSW it is its very essence. In fact it is a High Crime not to practice love and understanding, particularly in auditing.

    Ron wrote quite a bit about not confusing SP with P.T.S. Yes I was P.T.S. but not SP. As I have written elsewhere I was P.T.S. to the Church of Scientology, so as long as I either handle or disconnect I am not an ethics case. I have never seen disconnect as a permanent condition, but sometimes necessary so that I might get case gain. My mission now is to handle the cofs but as you so rightly say I shall be up against a lot of indoctrinated staff members.

    I happen to believe that the fate of the planet is at stake, but Scientology without being clothed with love just becomes part of the problem.

    Thanks for that link to "What is the purpose of the Board". Might I quote the first line "The board is for ex-Scientologists of all 'denominations' to get together and talk things over". I am not selling ChristianScientology because it is beyond price. What I am selling is a "brand". ChristianScientology is the brand for love and understanding. Just as if I told you the currency for the U.S.A. is Dollars and Cents, so I am saying the currency for Heaven is love and understanding, or the denomination (currency) is ChristianScientology.
  16. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    Well there you go - you've got your first follower, but it seems Type4_PTS is already making demands.
  17. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    Thanks for that P T. So as from 2008 I am not, as far as the cofs is concerned, a Scientologist. Well since once upon a time they considered me a Scientologist, that makes me officially an ex-Scientologist.

    I am well aware that Scientology "as it is actually practiced" is never going to be what I wish it to be, so that is why I have to do all I can to make it what is should be, and I can't think of a better use for my life.
  18. Pip

    Pip Patron with Honors

    Thanks for that V C I can't think of any person or group that I would be better off without. Mind you I could name many that would consider they are better off without me :lol: - but you are not one.:wink2:
    Love, Pip

    P.S. A central part of my thinking is Advita Vedanta where there can't be such a concept as "them and us" so the idea of "being better off" without some thing, person or group has no meaning.
  19. Ogsonofgroo

    Ogsonofgroo Crusader

    No shit? To see what? Things your way? In my own case my perception of the world changes and continues to do so from the first second I wake up and, goes on until I am asleep again.
    What is really important is that one continue to learn everything one can, relentlessly, and without jumping to conclusions. Too many conclusions can stiffle the flow and direction of ideas imho, sort of like putting on blinders.

    Edit> I am sorry but I cannot help but think of oxymorons when I see 'Christianscientologist', but in a twisted and sides-ways sortta way. :whistling:
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2011
  20. Panda Termint

    Panda Termint Cabal Of One

    And, just so you know, that is perfectly fine with me. I wish you all the best. :)