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L Ron Hubbard's abuses and violence

Discussion in 'L Ron Hubbard' started by Free to shine, Nov 17, 2011.

  1. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    That's not necessary. See earlier post on first page.

    This thread is mainly about doctrine and events, it's not a philosophical discussion of how we are all responsible for our own conditions.
  2. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    Excerpt from Judge Breckenridge's summation in 1984, after hearing testimony and reading documents from the 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, and 1970s:

    "The organization clearly is schizophrenic and paranoid, and this bizarre combination seems to be a reflection of its founder LRH. The evidence portrays a man who has been virtually a pathological liar...

    "The writings and documents in evidence additionally reflect his egotism, greed, avarice, lust for power, and vindictiveness and aggressiveness against persons perceived by him to be disloyal or hostile.

    "At the same time it appears that he is charismatic and highly capable of motivating, organizing, controlling, manipulating, and inspiring his adherents..."
  3. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

    Last edited: Nov 18, 2011
  4. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

  5. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

  6. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

  7. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

    Miscavige wasn't the first with this:

    Last edited: Nov 18, 2011
  8. randomx

    randomx Patron with Honors

    There is an irony here which I`ve not seen pointed out before.

    According to Scientology... It can make one more able, more ethical.
    Able to live a life of dedicated loyalty to survival actions.
    Able to be more honest. Get on with others. Live with the truth.
    Be of high moral character.

    Yet those who availed themselves to that are the same people that Scientology now turns around and calls liars and apostates as soon as they actually apply what Scientology was supposed to have given them.

    What sort of people are coming off the other end of Hubbard`s production line ?

    Scientology wants to have it both ways.

    "We make people better. We are in control."
    "People can spend years in Scientology and come out worse. We can`t control them."

    I saw in one of the above posts; " of Hubbard at the time ...." (unflattering)

    Who took these photos ? Where are the photos now ? Anyone know ?

    One picture is worth a thousand words."
  9. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

    Here are some excerpts from one of my all time favourite posters, our loved Afaceinthecrowd. If you haven't read his thread Shooting Stars, I've bumped it. I can't quote all of the great posts by Face, here are a few (!) that show the real nature of Hubbard from someone who saw it all.

  10. Captain Koolaid

    Captain Koolaid Patron Meritorious

    This thread really is terrific, unfortunately those who would really benefit from it won't read it, because "it besmirches the good name of LRH".
  11. Petey C

    Petey C Silver Meritorious Patron

    I may be wrong, but I don't think Hubbard slapped and punched SO members.
  12. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

    No not the way DM does. He just got others to do it, though in post #23 I did find an example. Hubbard's violence was more of the mental kind.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2011
  13. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    Yet there are plenty of examples of physical abuse originating from Hubbard the Source of planetary enlightenment and salvation, but Sea Org members were often numb to it, not seeing it as physical abuse, since, most of the time, Hubbard, the Commodore, was not walking around overtly slapping people. "Commodores" usually don't slap people.

    Even before Scientology, the violent "smash" mentality appears to have been present. His first wife wrote of physical abuse, as did his second, however, according to court records, his second wife was also subjected to a combination of physical and mental abuse. In addition to that is an account from John Sanborn. From another thread:

    As for Hubbard's third wife, there's no record of any physical abuse; she was abused in a different way.

    It is somewhat odd that the primary complaint about Scientology, for some, seems to have become that its current dictator slaps and punches people. Nonetheless, here's an excerpt from Jesse Prince, former senior Sea Org executive, re. Hubbard's instructions to spit and slap as punishment. Even then it was mixed with a psychological element, "Tell him that it was from Ron."

    "To make a long story short, I read an advice from L. Ron to Miss Cabbage ordering him to spit in John's [Aczel's] face, and tell him that it was from Ron. Miss Cabbage complied with his order and reported the result. I saw the advice that came back to the compliance report of spitting in John face, and L. Ron was very pleased to hear the news, and escalate the situation by suggesting that someone should slap the hell out of John... Similar degrading actions were taken with David Mayo, and this soon spread to others deemed SPs..."

    From the same thread where this quote was first presented on ESMB:

    Note to Free to shine, I didn't place the Jesse Prince excerpt in a quote box, as it's a singular quote, and the linked original is already in a quote box, but not part of the regular content of ESMB, thus making ESMB's search function inoperative on the quote. However, I will do my best to format things as you requested. :)
  14. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    duplicate deleted
  15. Infinite

    Infinite Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller

    Godwin in 5. Is that a record for here?
  16. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

    Thankyou Veda, much appreciated. :biggrin:
  17. Infinite

    Infinite Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller

    DOX on Jesse's statement:

  18. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

    From our ESMB poster Ozzie.

  19. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

    Ya never know. Ya might just catch one - or two - sneaking a peak, and having a revelation . . .
  20. Ogsonofgroo

    Ogsonofgroo Crusader

    An ironic paradox, a dingy dichotomous dingle-berry...

    And thats just the good parts :grouch:


    Ozzie's thread can be found HERE, a very good read, I'm glad someone bumpered it.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2011