NBC interview: Marty Rathbun & cult harassment.. YT vids being taken down..

[degraded being]

I started out saying I understood and had compassion for him. Then I expressed my schadenfreude over his tears in my loveably obscene manner. Lonestar objected and still refuses to communicate with me directly despite polite efforts on my part to do so. I may be new here as a poster but I am not ignorant of much of what has gone on over the years. I've been to Clambake and xenutv for years. Ditto Lermanet and others. Dude just flamed me cuz he reacted. He refused my attempts at peacemaking. Don't know what else I could have done.

I think Lone Star has put himself on "quiet time" for a while.
Sometimes he bitch slaps me and then kisses and makes up.
I've got bruises all over and smeared lipstick, you can have that too
if you play your cards right.

 

[JustSheila]

I started out saying I understood and had compassion for him. Then I expressed my schadenfreude over his tears in my loveably obscene manner. Lonestar objected and still refuses to communicate with me directly despite polite efforts on my part to do so. I may be new here as a poster but I am not ignorant of much of what has gone on over the years. I've been to Clambake and xenutv for years. Ditto Lermanet and others. Dude just flamed me cuz he reacted. He refused my attempts at peacemaking. Don't know what else I could have done.

Yeh, I saw it. Not sure if you saw Mod3's post back to you acknowledging you didn't flame him? I didn't see you tick thank you, so you may have missed it. LS just writes that way sometimes, that's his personality. Don't feel singled out, LS has gone off on at least half of us and we still like him. He's not the type to hold grudges, but he has definite views - nothing wishy-washy about LS.

I probably went overboard on my post - it wasn't just directed at you and I'm sorry if it came across that way. All I wanted to do was fill in some gaps, because sometimes Newbs don't know the history of these things and then sometimes others don't want to take the time to explain what went on. Please ignore the post. Not worth deleting now as there are already two responses.

For the record, I think you're friggin' awesome and don't mind one bit when you correct me, either.

Can we get back to laughing about Scientology now?

 

[SPsince83]

Anyone that uses the word "fuckery" in relation to Scientology gets points from me.

Sheila is right....we've hashed this one for years now but it is still a worthy discussion. IMO, I'm slowly warming to his burgeoning humanity but he has ways to go. Why he still cherry picks the victims he helps is one sign that he's still hanging on to the raging ego. Once I read publicly that he's tried to help Gerry Armstrong without strings attached, then I'll start changing my opinion.

That no federal prosecutor will investigate the obvious RICO case makes it no less obvious. Under RICO patterns are more important than individual crimes. A prosecutor who was trying to do his job would pin Marty and the Headleys and all the ex-SO into admitting their specific guilt and then give immunity for testimony. This is not something Marty or anyone else can do about getting a prosecutor off his ass. I truly thought I made it clear that I was proud of Marty for coming so far, but that for me he had further to go. But Marty is not answerable to me. My opinion is not likely to effect his life in any way. I just don't see that me expressing schadenfreude in such a way deserved to be flamed by someone who didn't like it and frankly was a jerk about it.

But I get the tiredness of people for an old subject.

 

[SPsince83]

I think Lone Star has put himself on "quiet time" for a while.
Sometimes he bitch slaps me and then kisses and makes up.
I've got bruises all over and smeared lipstick, you can have that too
if you play your cards right.

Hey, dude didn't steal my money or kidnap me or send me to RPF! I'll get over it and be happy to be friends with Lonestar. Any attempt at reconciliation will be accepted on my part,

 

[SPsince83]

"Marty" goes together with "emotion" for some on this board.

If you discuss Marty, you will usually get a good dose of emotion.

Seems so

 

[SPsince83]

Yeh, I saw it. Not sure if you saw Mod3's post back to you acknowledging you didn't flame him? I didn't see you tick thank you, so you may have missed it. LS just writes that way sometimes, that's his personality. Don't feel singled out, LS has gone off on at least half of us and we still like him. He's not the type to hold grudges, but he has definite views - nothing wishy-washy about LS.

I probably went overboard on my post - it wasn't just directed at you and I'm sorry if it came across that way. All I wanted to do was fill in some gaps, because sometimes Newbs don't know the history of these things and then sometimes others don't want to take the time to explain what went on. Please ignore the post. Not worth deleting now as there are already two responses.

For the record, I think you're friggin' awesome and don't mind one bit when you correct me, either.

Can we get back to laughing about Scientology now?

Found and fixed.

How many scientologists does it take to change a light bulb? Either 27 or 1, One to change the bulb and 26 to check off the routing form. Or just ask an ot77 to postulate it into existence.

 

[Pooks]

The pattern of criminal behavior by upper management is well documented. Specific crimes would need to be addressed. I don't know how many ways I can say I will forgive him.

I think it's only fair for you to list the specific crimes that you keep referring to.

So basically I'm staying dox or STFU

 

[Techless]

i have hard time watching this "what should M+M be doing/not doing now" and because of all of their now obvious sins, crimes, etc...and yet we all share in that to whatever extent.

Hey, we all had the chance to get into and go through the mind/meat/brain-shredder that we did. The idea of experiencing a 'MindF-k"is now rightly our own to discuss and ponder -and so we do. (An apt word to describe of, I feel) Those 'never-ins' who seem more interested in the topic, vs. the very real rest of us who still are processing, often just creeps me out in funny ways. Voyeurism? Hopefully all just with the idea of merely comprehending, and mostly, simply put; just trying to get past and beyond.

It haunts me still, that the bad thing(s) that the 'idea' which started it, (and endless debate on what that may be) still often wins and it's become this glue, that one cannot totally clean off from. I don't believe anything is permanent down here though.

In my mind, the sins I have done, I can now make 'worse than' anything you may have done....and of course you are free to make yours less than or greater than mine. I did steal cookies out of the jar - I did have bad thoughts of wishing a few others wiped from this life. I don't give a flying F, cause of that relativity thing, and never did follow thru with the worst and much else. I only can go on now, with some idea that I'm not, and never was out to kill or mess up others lives. Different perhaps from those that've since been unable to disprove, show or 'confess' totally otherwise. No point in debating who was worse. yes still though, real crimes, need to be addressed, and no clue on how best to proceed with that, not in this world anyway....there is no system for justice anymore. Plz debate on your own as you like, but just don't try to convince me that there is something like that now.

I cannot say with any knowledge of, or inside info, that M+M are anything other than 2 humans that went through the same meat-shredder. I DO know that they were a lot closer to the whole nucleus of it, in their time, but have a very strong feeling that decompression works the same for them as anyone else. (which is as unique as there are humans) Doesn't justify anything really, and I ain't trying to.

My point: Would YOU feel safe confessing anything and everything to the world, in these days and times? For me: Hell fucking NO. My problem has been and always will be saying too much, and comes back to fuck me. Real life experience here that has made me so very weary. And in actuality no major crimes of the century - but it's life now, eh?

the most saintly of all human saints, can get buried in a nanosecond, if they even mentioned a very slight transgression from years ago, AND mostly: IF there's someone there just waiting to bury them. Thus it's not hard for me to see various 'high up there folk' in the scn org: having a very good reason for their considered amount of discretion with their own valuable lives. And all lives are valuable. Taking payoffs make sense, especially when you have no money, its not the dignified human thing to do, but if you cannot eat, what's the point in thinking you'll be around to ever admit all your sins to begin with if you cannot exist.

It sucks to have to realize that's the world we live in as of now, scn is only such a tiny microcosm of. SO my feelings are not just with the amazingly interesting and curious 'passion play' of scn. What I'm yapping about takes a much larger view of things, I hope?!? I'm happy to be just another dork - have so many wonderful friends cause of it.

Thanks so much to ESMB for allowing me to blabble all this out. My later night rant and all, and usually only is when I actually feel like blabbling anyway (yes: my new word...) is greatly appreciated to even have outlet to dare speak about.

I just so hope that the built up hatred and all that has accumulated, can dissipate in a useful, peaceful way. (i"m sure I live in some dreamland for sure) It does need to though cause it IS there! My personal feelings though are much more ugly and as messed as anyone's. I just see a good point in trying to express that crap thru non-harmful, and maybe inspiring way. I will try though, to do in musical form, where it may get 'thru' better, (at least with my limited capabilities) and without some sneaky spiral of hate death-trap (def: of Scn), which has never worked for me most all the time anyway. I KNOW most here do the same.

In the meantime, all this social media crap is just some yapping way for everyone to assert their own yap. While actually, the descent of the -scarier than all hell - bigger picture gets buried in all the noise.

M+M will, I believe, arrive at a point which brings some peace, to everyone still pissy about it all, but it's got to happen for them first, before the rest of us. I'd afford them that right, and the direction seems sincere so far.

I think we're all so much better from our experiences. And mostly: capable of effecting a really needed change, they are proving to be trying to do same. Sue me if I'm wrong.

Best to all -

 

[Sindy]

Very nice post Techless. xoxoxo

 

[Techless]

Very nice post Techless. xoxoxo

Ahhh, thanks sweetie! You know it always is this thing that cracks me up: I fail miserably when I'm fully conscious, can though tell you all about quantum physics for sure! But in the netherworld of relaxed, half unconscious, I feel like I can cut through my own BS and just say whatever. Scares me though sometimes, as I mostly have to bite my tongue and shut the F up. Sad...yet heart still beats.

But so happy I've not been buried yet here on ESMB, and with all the kindred spirits, often allusive - but jeez, aren't I that too?

Ya get what ya get.

We need to have a get together sometime-eh? Might you have corp helicopter to come get me for nice dinner at Lawyer's Prime Rib??

 

[Sindy]

Ahhh, thanks sweetie! You know it always is this thing that cracks me up: I fail miserably when I'm fully conscious, can though tell you all about quantum physics for sure! But in the netherworld of relaxed, half unconscious, I feel like I can cut through my own BS and just say whatever. Scares me though sometimes, as I mostly have to bite my tongue and shut the F up. Sad...yet heart still beats.

But so happy I've not been buried yet here on ESMB, and with all the kindred spirits, often allusive - but jeez, aren't I that too?

Ya get what ya get.

We need to have a get together sometime-eh? Might you have corp helicopter to come get me for nice dinner at Lawyer's Prime Rib??

I wish but please tell me when you come here again and we'll for sure get together this time.

 

[Churchill]

Found and fixed.

How many scientologists does it take to change a light bulb? Either 27 or 1, One to change the bulb and 26 to check off the routing form. Or just ask an ot77 to postulate it into existence.

None. The lightbulb really has got to want to change itself.
(old joke, stolen from God only knows where)

 

[Purple Rain]

Look, I understand he is making amends and doing a good job of it. And I do understand he was a victim, as is Dopey Davey for that matter. I can forgive him. But these guys have more amends to do than the average Sea Org, or outer ex-staff SPs.

And I'm sorry, but these CST and RTC assholes don't get a hug from me just cuz they left. I'm proud of them for having the guts to leave. I know how hard it is. But they have CRIMES to answer for. REAL crimes not just missing a w/h or auditing past a floating t/a. Murder, extortion, blackmail and kidnapping are FUCKING CRIMES. In ANY society. Do you who disagreed with me disagree with THAT? And if Marty is guilty of these crimes, he belongs in prison. Along with all the others already there who were manipulated into committing such crimes by a con man. If that makes me self-righteous, so be it. I don't think it does. I don't owe the church amends, it owes me.

I truly hope Marty finds peace. And I WILL forgive him. Just not yet.

Who do you think you are to grant forgiveness - the freaking pope?? Who are you anyway?

 

[Sindy]

None. The lightbulb really has got to want to change itself.
(old joke, stolen from God only knows where)

That sounds like a variation of the "How many psychiatrists does it take to change a lightbulb?"

Answer: "Only one but it takes a really long time and the light bulb has to want to change."

 

[Sindy]

Who do you think you are to grant forgiveness - the freaking pope?? Who are you anyway?

Well, yeah. There's that too.

 

[Sindy]

OK, so I guess it's alright for others to criticize Marty, cite his earlier misdeeds, and ask him sensitive questions.

I still won't be doing so, in the current atmosphere, because I don't want to get into trouble (and IMO there are more important issues), and I think Marty may start talking anyway given enough time.

I would like to hear from you after you see the documentary. I just watched the vid Marty just put up on his blog and I am in tears. This is so obviously affecting him deeply and it's the absolute most genuine and authentic I have ever seen him. I, for one, think he's quite courageous. Not because he's standing up to Miscavige but because he's digging deep. He's really looking. He's owning it.

 

[I told you I was trouble]

I would like to hear from you after you see the documentary. I just watched the vid Marty just put up on his blog and I am in tears. This is so obviously affecting him deeply and it's the absolute most genuine and authentic I have ever seen him. I, for one, think he's quite courageous. Not because he's standing up to Miscavige but because he's digging deep. He's really looking. He's owning it.

Yes, that's exactly how I see it ... and the reason he seemed to get so upset (about not being able to even make friends without "disclosing" to them that he is the cofs public enemy number 1) appeared to me to be more on behalf of Mosey and the baby than himself.

Mosey has shown him what real love and acceptance is and he may never have experienced that before, having spent most of his life in the cult.

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

..

How many scientologists does it take to change a light bulb?

ANSWER: 6

1. PC: The light bulb.

2. AUDITOR: The trained Scientologist that will "listen" to the bulb until the change happens.

3. C/S: The senior technical authority that will know when the PC has reached "EP" and ask them if they want to attest to being changed.

4. EXAMINER: The quality control minister that will authenticate the change by asking "Do you want other light bulbs to be changed?" on an e-meter.

5. SUCCESS OFFICER: The Scientologist that confirms the "win" of an unprecedented, orders-of-magnitude nature.

6. REGISTRAR: The spiritual advisor that makes the final determination if the bulb is changed by asking the bulb if they are now ready to be changed again--and prepared to pre-pay for that re-change today.​

 

[Emma]

I think it's only fair for you to list the specific crimes that you keep referring to.

So basically I'm staying dox or STFU

Yeah..I keep hearing about these "crimes" Rathbun & Rinder "must have committed" but no one ever tells me what they are or offer up any documentation or evidence of these mysterious "crimes".

Being in their respective positions in the CoS would have meant they committed certain "crimes" every day, but as I understand it they make no secret of those & have admitted they acted badly. But thats not enough..there must be more.....

I also keep hearing "they haven't told all...they need to tell all" but again no-one seems to know what that "all" is that they haven't told.

So what are these crimes, this "all" that needs to be spilled by Rathbun & Rinder?

 

[Smurf]

Hey, I was trying to be nice to you. I'll give you points for not being passive aggressive this time. Why won't you address the point?

What do you expect from a Texas cowboy??

Yippee-yi-yo.. and all that.