Advice please!

[xyz1000]

Hello this is my first post

(not sure if I am ok to post on here or not as I am still in scientology)

I am looking for some help to beable to leave scientology. I have been involved as public for 8 years. Have had auditing up to grade4. Resently since Oct 10 I have been very ill with alot of pain everywhere. I have been in and had assists ect but nothing has worked. For once I have been able to distance myself enough to rethink the whole deal. I really can not be bothered with the whole thing any more.

My problem is though that my son has also been having auditing for over a year now on a co audit. He is 13 and has been doing courses since he was 7!

I am due to go in tomorrow for a appointment to start yet another programme to help get me back on course. How can I handle this? I am a single Mum and am quite ill at present.Any advice would be a great help.
Thank you

 

[SchwimmelPuckel]

See a real doctor ASAP! - And don't ask permission.. You and I know they will Q&A the hell outta you for it and delay for a minimum of three months!

Good luck to you! - And don't be a stranger here.

 

[Tiger Lily]

Wow. . . . the first thing I would tell is get yourself to a medical doctor. I had some health issues and tried to go with an "alternative" practitioner who was a Scientologist. . . . I think there was good there, but it was a medical doctor who finally found the problem.

I would tell them that you're going to take a break, go to a doctor to "rule out" anything physical (of course it's physical . . . ). Then go to the doctor and do what s/he recommends. You can't be on course if you are "PTS" anyway and they will sell you tapes and books . . . thousands of dollars worth in my case to handle your "low responisibilty" and "PTSness" and "confront". Don't go there! Find out what's wrong and get yourself healed ASAP.

I was public and it was very easy to just "slip away". . . that's the easiest way to do it. Having your son "in" complicates it a little. Could he be on leave of absence because you are too ill to get him to his co-audit sessions? I saw people drift off and on courses all the time when I was in, and many co-audits had to find new twins.

Whatever you do, I wouldn't start anything new, period, but especially until you get you health back! And no matter what they say, Scientology can't fix it. Find out what your body needs from someone who is trained and who knows the actual medical research. . . a certified medical doctor. If you don't you will waste years of your life. I did that and I can tell you I lost the best years with my kids, and was not the mom I wanted to be. If I have any regrets, that's the biggest one.

-TL

 

[Tiger Lily]

Oh, and yes! It's great to have people who are "still in" posting!!

 

[MrNobody]

Hello this is my first post

(not sure if I am ok to post on here or not as I am still in scientology)

I am looking for some help to beable to leave scientology. I have been involved as public for 8 years. Have had auditing up to grade4. Resently since Oct 10 I have been very ill with alot of pain everywhere. I have been in and had assists ect but nothing has worked. For once I have been able to distance myself enough to rethink the whole deal. I really can not be bothered with the whole thing any more.

My problem is though that my son has also been having auditing for over a year now on a co audit. He is 13 and has been doing courses since he was 7!

I am due to go in tomorrow for a appointment to start yet another programme to help get me back on course. How can I handle this? I am a single Mum and am quite ill at present.Any advice would be a great help.
Thank you

Hi xyz1000.

Well, my advice certainly is not the best one available here, but here it is anyway: Grab your son and leave. Now.

That's it; in it's purest simplest form.

Now here's a question that I find more important and interesting: When is your appointment with a real medical doctor?

 

[NCSP]

Hello this is my first post

(not sure if I am ok to post on here or not as I am still in scientology)

I am looking for some help to beable to leave scientology. I have been involved as public for 8 years. Have had auditing up to grade4. Resently since Oct 10 I have been very ill with alot of pain everywhere. I have been in and had assists ect but nothing has worked. For once I have been able to distance myself enough to rethink the whole deal. I really can not be bothered with the whole thing any more.

My problem is though that my son has also been having auditing for over a year now on a co audit. He is 13 and has been doing courses since he was 7!

I am due to go in tomorrow for a appointment to start yet another programme to help get me back on course. How can I handle this? I am a single Mum and am quite ill at present.Any advice would be a great help.
Thank you

You are absolutely welcome here. Whatever your ultimate decision, please don't feel like you can't speak freely; getting over that fear is a great first step to leaving the cult!

How does your son feel about Scientology? Sometimes, the kids are actually relieved when their parents decide to leave. I would normally worry about the "Church" using him as a pawn, ie, threatening disconnection, but now is probably a good time, since they surely know they can't afford to make waves with all the recent publicity.

If you're comfortable telling in general terms where you're from, which org, etc. (and don't say anything you're not comfortable with), there may be someone here who's familiar with that particular place or even the people you'll be dealing with, and can offer specific advice.

Just know that you don't owe them anything, particularly your health. And even if it creates friction between you and your son, he will be much better off with a healthy mother than an obedient one.

Please keep posting and try to draw strength from the fact that there will be a lot of people rooting for you!

 

[Nicole]

Hello this is my first post

(not sure if I am ok to post on here or not as I am still in scientology)

I am looking for some help to beable to leave scientology. I have been involved as public for 8 years. Have had auditing up to grade4. Resently since Oct 10 I have been very ill with alot of pain everywhere. I have been in and had assists ect but nothing has worked. For once I have been able to distance myself enough to rethink the whole deal. I really can not be bothered with the whole thing any more.

My problem is though that my son has also been having auditing for over a year now on a co audit. He is 13 and has been doing courses since he was 7!

I am due to go in tomorrow for a appointment to start yet another programme to help get me back on course. How can I handle this? I am a single Mum and am quite ill at present.Any advice would be a great help.
Thank you

Welcome xyz1000,

please go to a real doctor and take your son and leave.

They can't heal you and auditing isn't good for your son.

Nicole

 

[AnonyMary]

Hello this is my first post

(not sure if I am ok to post on here or not as I am still in scientology)

I am looking for some help to beable to leave scientology. I have been involved as public for 8 years. Have had auditing up to grade4. Resently since Oct 10 I have been very ill with alot of pain everywhere. I have been in and had assists ect but nothing has worked. For once I have been able to distance myself enough to rethink the whole deal. I really can not be bothered with the whole thing any more.

My problem is though that my son has also been having auditing for over a year now on a co audit. He is 13 and has been doing courses since he was 7!

I am due to go in tomorrow for a appointment to start yet another programme to help get me back on course. How can I handle this? I am a single Mum and am quite ill at present.Any advice would be a great help.
Thank you

Welcome, xyz1000



You need to take care of your health, first!! With a competent medical doctor. Not some alternative practitioner and the endless use of assists. I lost many years of health because I went along with the church mandates and programs that did nothing but keep me from getting a proper medical diagnosis and treatment. Your son needs you healthy! Not dead!

As for your son, he's a child. You are allowing him to become indoctrinated in Scientology and soon if you don't get better, they will pit him against you. They will say you are PTS ( and other hogwash). Let the kid finish hs course, do not re-sign him to another until you have gotten medivcal care and have had a chance to review everything and decide without pressure and under ill health what is best for the both of you.

You are under NO obligation to go in. Take your phone off the hook, get a real doctor appointment ( a non-scn who specializes in primary care or internal medicine) and keep your son close to you.

Do what is right. Don't let yourself be pressured. Come here for support. Hang in there!

((HUGGS))

Mary

 

[xyz1000]

Hi guys thanks for your replies so quickly. Just to let you know I have been to the doctor many times. I have had lots of blood tests and am now waiting for a specialist appointment at the hospital. The doctor thinks it could be ME or fibromyalgia. Which doesn't help really as alot of people see these conditions as beeing in your head! Trust me the pain is very real.
Do you think I should stop my son going too? Sorry the tech is quite drilled in at the moment and the last thing I want is him getting ill because of me stopping him going. Surely he has to have my permission though being under 18?

 

[Lurker5]

Hi

Hi xyz1000

You might want to read "When the Body Says NO, Exploring the Stress-Disease Connection", by Gabor Mate.

Wishing you well - and that you and your son get out, very soon.

 

[AnonyMary]

Hi guys thanks for your replies so quickly. Just to let you know I have been to the doctor many times. I have had lots of blood tests and am now waiting for a specialist appointment at the hospital. The doctor thinks it could be ME or fibromyalgia. Which doesn't help really as alot of people see these conditions as beeing in your head! Trust me the pain is very real.
Do you think I should stop my son going too? Sorry the tech is quite drilled in at the moment and the last thing I want is him getting ill because of me stopping him going. Surely he has to have my permission though being under 18?

You son won't get ill if you stop him from going. Just do it discretely. Let him finish th co-audit and then just don't re-sign him.

As far as the pain, I have no doubt it is real. I have been treated for such. excrutiating pain at times. What I really needed a regimine of cortisone to get rid of it all along but it took a specialist to know it and and treat it ( Polymyalgia Rheumatica). Getting the right doctor and diagnosis can make all the difference!

So, see the specialist first. Be prepared with a list of what is happening, when and where. What agrieviates it. What makes it better. Exactly where it hurts when it hurts. Do what he/she says medically, for a few months to see if you get relief, which is what you are looking for.

What is ME?

Oh, I see what you meant by ME. Seems like there is another poster here that appears to have stated he/she is diagnosed with this or something of that nature You may want to private message Prince Chief Xenu to compare notes after reading this page: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?p=543922

 

[AngeloV]

Dear xyz1000,

Welcome to the board. I'm going to give it to you straight because based on what you have posted, your health, your child's health and maybe your life are in danger.

1. Continue to go to your doctor(s) to find out what is wrong and take whatever medicine you need. You may have to try different ones before you find one that works.

2. DO NOT GO BACK TO THE CHURCH EVER AGAIN. STAY AWAY. They may seem to want to help you and your son with your health issues but they cannot. Their number one motivation is to get you to buy more auditing. IT WILL NOT HELP with your condition.

3. Tell your son that you do not have any more money to pay for services and that you need to get healthy again and work to get more money. That's why you are not going back. BTW, he needs your permission to go to the church.

4. You have to reject them. This is hard I know. They have been your 'friends' for a long time. But if you get real sick or die, what will happen to your son? He needs you and he needs you healthy. They will not do anything to help him (once the money runs out) if you die or are stuck in the hospital. He has no income.

You are a mother with a child who needs you. The church cannot and will not help if you suddenly become incapacitated and have no money. They will kick you to the curb. They will not help nor care for your son.

Please take care of yourself. Your son needs you.

 

[La La Lou Lou]

xyz1000, ME or Fibromylgia is not in the head.

Once doctors didn't 'believe' in it, but now most do, even the World Health Organisation.

I have been diagnosed with CFS/ME, it is a real condition and it is neurological.

Scientology can not 'cure' it.

There are things that can make the condition less awful.

Keeping away from stress is a key one.

Your son can only study there while he has parental consent. You can withdraw it now, or wait till he has finished his current course.

A good doctor is important, and yours is right, in order to discount any other condition he has to study your blood for something like 41 other things that have similar symptoms, things like Lyme disease, low B12, low Testosterone and heavy metal toxicity etc.

Best of luck!

 

[xyz1000]

Thank you for your advice. I know it's about the money. I don't have anyway of getting money I have spent alot and owe alot too. I guess the next stage they are waiting for is my son is able to work to start paying money in. He would be like fresh credit to the reg.
I think that is the reason why they wont want us to go. Do i just ignore the phone calls or tell them straight that I don't wish to invovled any longer? I have already had calls today that I have not replied to. Surely there are some rights to be hassled by their calls after that we have?
Will my son be fine to end the auditing now? I know when I have had incomplete cycles of auditing I have felt very unstable.
thanks again for any replies

 

[Voltaire's Child]

I'd say start distancing yourself from them. You're not staff, fortunately. Don't get into discussions with them about it, either. They'll just "q & a" you. They'll go on and on and on and on.

If you are confronted by them to where you can't get out of it, then give them a basic story (busy with job, family, etc) and stick to it. "Stonewall". Don't let it turn into a "Q & A".

And, yes, Schwimmy's quite right.

 

[olska]

Thank you for your advice. I know it's about the money. I don't have anyway of getting money I have spent alot and owe alot too. I guess the next stage they are waiting for is my son is able to work to start paying money in. He would be like fresh credit to the reg.
I think that is the reason why they wont want us to go. Do i just ignore the phone calls or tell them straight that I don't wish to invovled any longer? I have already had calls today that I have not replied to. Surely there are some rights to be hassled by their calls after that we have?
Will my son be fine to end the auditing now? I know when I have had incomplete cycles of auditing I have felt very unstable.
thanks again for any replies

Get your son out of there before the Sea Org recruiters go after him. Do not let him or anyone else talk you into leaving him in the clutches of the cult. Tell him the REAL reasons you want out of scientology -- money, what you've learned about the cult, or whatever it is.

Leaving an auditing action "incomplete" is not going to have a long-term effect on his mental health even though some people might try to tell you that. If he's having a "good time" with the auditing, he might be pissed off at you and thus a bit "unstable" for awhile, so do what you think is best about whether or not to do a sudden departure or let him finish a SHORT action...

The long-term answer is to get him involved in some other activity that he finds interesting -- sports? music? science projects? photography? where he will meet other young people with similar interests and thus make new friends, become part of a new community.

Soon he will be old enough to get a part-time job (will need a work permit from school) -- in my opinion, there is nothing quite as good for a young person than having a job with which they can earn their own "fun" money, money for games or CDs or whatever, those special clothes and things that you may not be able to afford. It's great for building self-esteem, confidence, and ultimately independence and adulthood.

Until then, there are lots of FREE or nearly free activities for 13-year-olds available in most cities -- youth baseball, soccer, basketball, etc., and music, drama, art, etc. at your local YMCA or community center, as well as school-sponsored after-school activities. A small fee for uniforms and/or supplies will usually cover it. Ask around at his school, and from other parents -- those not involved in scientology. And ask him what he'd like to do.

Children are able to handle TRUTH a lot better than many people think, so don't soft pedal it -- tell him the REAL reasons you want the both of you out of scientology. Show him some stories on the internet from exscientology kids if that's what it takes.

And (in case you didn't already know that) it's also ok to admit to your kids that you made a mistake, that you did something wrong or foolish -- you don't have to be, or pretend to be, perfect.

I too was a single mother -- I left scientology when my child was just a baby because I was unable to afford it and didn't want my child to end up in the cadet org so that I could continue. Child is now grown and has a family and is a hard-working, generous, ethical human being who knows a few people from the "old days" who are still involved, but thinks scientology is a major joke.

And yes, to echo others on this thread, see a REAL DOCTOR about your own health!

Wishing the best for both of you. My experience as a single mother is a real "success" story (it was mostly a pleasure and it all worked out well) and I'm happy to share with you anything that might help; but just as a general principle, I don't like to post too many details about my life and family on the public forum.

PM if you want, and good luck to you!

 

[Feral]

Hi guys thanks for your replies so quickly. Just to let you know I have been to the doctor many times. I have had lots of blood tests and am now waiting for a specialist appointment at the hospital. The doctor thinks it could be ME or fibromyalgia. Which doesn't help really as alot of people see these conditions as beeing in your head! Trust me the pain is very real.
Do you think I should stop my son going too? Sorry the tech is quite drilled in at the moment and the last thing I want is him getting ill because of me stopping him going. Surely he has to have my permission though being under 18?

In my 26 years of Scn I have never seen a physical condition handled by the tech, never.

Regarding your son, I would be most concerned about a smooth and harmonious resolution with him than the org. I would get well armed about what the cult is and does and take him through that.

They can do nothing about it, you hold all the right cards.

Good luck.

 

[i'mglib]

Hi, xyz1000,
You landed in the right place, for sure.

Feral is right, you hold all the right cards now. Your son is a minor, you get to decide what he does and doesn't do. There are a lot of people who wish they could be in your position, or turn back the clock, so they could say NO before their kids got older.

Do not let your son get anywhere near the Sea Org. There's a good chance if your son were to join the Sea Org, you would never see him again.

Everyone who says to just leave (change your phone, move, whatever) is right. The Church is made up of salesmen who know how to shoot down ANY argument you might present. They have spent 24/7 for years figuring out how to counter any possible objection you could tell them. Engaging in dialog is futile. Someone said to stonewall. This is good advice.

 

[Sekh]

Dear xyz1000,

get yourself and your son out of there ASAP. I'm not the first to tell you that here, and probably will not be the last, but that don't matter.

Your son needs you now, more than ever. Kids in that age are so vulnerable. They try to be tough, but they still need their mom for a long time to come.
You should take care of your health first, that's the most important thing. A real doctor, real medicine, no assists and purifs. The purifs make things only worse. The assists won't make you better.

Once you feel a bit better, you can feel like a better mother, and do nice things with your son. He should be just a kid, go to school, do sports, play games, maybe have a job, whatever it is boys do when they're thirteen.

Courses in Scientology and auditing sessions are no part of that. He should be outside, playing baseball or something, not holding the cans in the auditing-room.
It won't be long before they find him old enough to join the SEA ORG. Get him out of there before that happens, please! You know they will try to blackmail you into consent when you still owe them money.

There are always people here you can talk to, day and night, and for your son there is the site of Ex-Scientology Kids, where he can find others in the same situation.

http://www.exscientologykids.com/

for you and your boy. I wish you both strength and health and love. And freedom, that above all.

Sekh

 

[clamicide]

welcome

Glad you're here. I would NOT even have you son finish the co-audit. Then you are on reg lines immediately and ethics lines, etc. and if he is balking on re-signing there is a good chance they will try to turn him against you. The solution probably ends up with him being pressured to join staff or the sea org. Sorry. It's harsh, but I've seen it too many times. How does your son feel about scientology? Have you guys talked about it? He might be doing it because it makes you happy. If he's mature, you might be able to talk to him about the concerns you have. If he's not, then you have every right to pull the mommy card and do it with love.

I encourage you to read some of the stories on here and information on scientology. You will be amazed at how many OTs have left, and how OT was not what was promised. I KNOW it can be scary. Being on the internet looking at stuff about the church is something you are encouraged not to do. The doubts you have are normal. There's a reason you are questioning, and it has nothing to do with being PTS or PTS to the middle class or being third-partied. As you said, you have got some distance, and that's when you started looking.

Oh, and btw....something someone told me when I was first really questioning was that people don't get sick and die or go insane from reading the OT levels. It's not something you have to do, but it's something you should not be afraid of. It's one more control mechanism.