Making sense of the madness you have escaped from!

[Wisened One]

Free To Shine:

Thank you for your wonderful, kind words and they've helped, A LOT! And Yes, no longer being part of such a 'dedicated, purposeful group' is also very lonely. Ever since,have been very 'anti-group'. Not only that: it's harder to be able to 'relax' and make non-scn friends, too. Our thought processes were SO specific and so ingrained with the 'entheta' and 'case' of all that weren't staff or at least active Public, that we had to work hard to get off our 'self-made pedestals (sp) and start loving and being more accepting of people for who they are, again.

I've managed to sift through nearly ALL the 'regular, this lifetime,while-in-this-body concepts, data'.... and have made peace with, replaced, found other authors, mixed it in with several different beliefs, etc...THOSE things, I'm good on for the most part.

WHAT I'm STILL having some trouble with (and only here and there when it hits me just so..)

Is the stuff dealing with What you do when you die, where you go when you die, what to NOW believe happens after death. ARE there any 'evil implants' to be steering clear of during death/after death? (I say no, yet sometimes....)

IF I still did believe in reincanation...now HOW do I enter a new body? (I do NOT want to even be reminded of LRH's junk on it...it's so ingrained, I'm trying to get rid of it out or at least 'figure' out what's what on it all, you know?

I guess my bottom line I've reached so far in all the 'heavier' concepts (like death, reincarnation,etc) is that ALL that matters, is what I deep down in my gut believe,matters. Period.

Now ONE little thing still bugs the snit outta me: Since the 'personal advanced power and OT' thing is bogus....is there NO 'advanced' state I can reach for, now?
(I mean, LRH's sounded SO 'exact' and something to go strive for with no questions regarding it, you know?)...

But NOW WHAT? Sad to say, I'll never believe in Scientology (as it is..especially their advanced stuff) again. Nobody has EVER 'shown me the OT'.

I guess I'll just have to slowly adjust to this fact.

Many other books, authors, concepts btw have been making a HUGE difference in my and Spouse's lives, so we are good.

I just have some holes still to fill regarding if there IS ANY OT to ever be attained, now? (even if it's a different definition, and thru different (or mixing) paths, etc?).

Thanks,

Wisened One.

 

[Free to shine]

I just have some holes still to fill regarding if there IS ANY OT to ever be attained, now? (even if it's a different definition, and thru different (or mixing) paths, etc?).

Thanks,

Wisened One.

Thanks I sent you a PM with my own views. I'm sure there are others out there too, because these are vital questions!

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Free To Shine:

Thank you for your wonderful, kind words and they've helped, A LOT! And Yes, no longer being part of such a 'dedicated, purposeful group' is also very lonely. Ever since,have been very 'anti-group'. Not only that: it's harder to be able to 'relax' and make non-scn friends, too. Our thought processes were SO specific and so ingrained with the 'entheta' and 'case' of all that weren't staff or at least active Public, that we had to work hard to get off our 'self-made pedestals (sp) and start loving and being more accepting of people for who they are, again.

I've managed to sift through nearly ALL the 'regular, this lifetime,while-in-this-body concepts, data'.... and have made peace with, replaced, found other authors, mixed it in with several different beliefs, etc...THOSE things, I'm good on for the most part.

WHAT I'm STILL having some trouble with (and only here and there when it hits me just so..)

Is the stuff dealing with What you do when you die, where you go when you die, what to NOW believe happens after death. ARE there any 'evil implants' to be steering clear of during death/after death? (I say no, yet sometimes....)

IF I still did believe in reincanation...now HOW do I enter a new body? (I do NOT want to even be reminded of LRH's junk on it...it's so ingrained, I'm trying to get rid of it out or at least 'figure' out what's what on it all, you know?

I guess my bottom line I've reached so far in all the 'heavier' concepts (like death, reincarnation,etc) is that ALL that matters, is what I deep down in my gut believe,matters. Period.

Now ONE little thing still bugs the snit outta me: Since the 'personal advanced power and OT' thing is bogus....is there NO 'advanced' state I can reach for, now?
(I mean, LRH's sounded SO 'exact' and something to go strive for with no questions regarding it, you know?)...

But NOW WHAT? Sad to say, I'll never believe in Scientology (as it is..especially their advanced stuff) again. Nobody has EVER 'shown me the OT'.

I guess I'll just have to slowly adjust to this fact.

Many other books, authors, concepts btw have been making a HUGE difference in my and Spouse's lives, so we are good.

I just have some holes still to fill regarding if there IS ANY OT to ever be attained, now? (even if it's a different definition, and thru different (or mixing) paths, etc?).

Thanks,

Wisened One.

WO,

Just because you never saw an OT in Scn, why can't you still believe in that - maybe not the Scn definition, but the belief that you can have "powers"? I'm not being flippant or insincere - I guess since I've only been out about 2 years I still have some questions and this thread and another have brought them to the surface.

I still believe that I have powers. These are the same powers I had before I got into Scn. I can be exterior at will. I can make things go right - as we all can - since we all got out of Scn.

I still believe in past lives and future lives - I just don't know if I want to come back again. Planet earth is not the nicest place in some respects.

I personally can't get into "God", since I'd had a bad experience with a different religion before Scn. (Man, I can sure pick religions - both of them expel you for leaving the group.) But I did read a fun book last summer - God Rides a Harley - it's about God and the 10 commandments.

I think my thoughts are twirling around in my head, I can't seem to form a question here.

 

[Free to shine]

WO,

Just because you never saw an OT in Scn, why can't you still believe in that - maybe not the Scn definition, but the belief that you can have "powers"? I'm not being flippant or insincere - I guess since I've only been out about 2 years I still have some questions and this thread and another have brought them to the surface.

I still believe that I have powers. These are the same powers I had before I got into Scn. I can be exterior at will. I can make things go right - as we all can - since we all got out of Scn.

I still believe in past lives and future lives - I just don't know if I want to come back again. Planet earth is not the nicest place in some respects.

I personally can't get into "God", since I'd had a bad experience with a different religion before Scn. (Man, I can sure pick religions - both of them expel you for leaving the group.) But I did read a fun book last summer - God Rides a Harley - it's about God and the 10 commandments.

I think my thoughts are twirling around in my head, I can't seem to form a question here.

I think pretty much the same as you! Discovering our own inherent abilities is such a buzz. No permission needed!

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

I think pretty much the same as you! Discovering our own inherent abilities is such a buzz. No permission needed!

Free to Shine,

This is true. But I got so much cr@p when I first went exterior in session - I'd only be "in" Scn for three weeks - that I don't do it as often as I'd like or when I'd like. But before Scn I was exterior a lot. I was 9 months old the first time I remember going exterior this life time.

I think a lot of my inherent/natural abilities have been put "on hold". So many of them got suppressed/invalidated while in Scn. I'd get "you're just a Clear, you can't be doing that". Now my response would be: "you're just an A Hole, you shouldn't be allowed to speak".

I think it all just takes time to settle out all the inval/eval, etc.

I swear, it feels like some huge cog is sitting on the tip of my tongue, but I just can't grasp it. But it feels huge and will blow a lot of my residual charge from Scn. If it comes to mind or out of my mouth, I'll do my best to share it - it just feels like it's going to be something that we all might be able to get something from. (I'm all good on a cog that might help others. )

 

[Free to shine]

Free to Shine,

This is true. But I got so much cr@p when I first went exterior in session - I'd only be "in" Scn for three weeks - that I don't do it as often as I'd like or when I'd like. But before Scn I was exterior a lot. I was 9 months old the first time I remember going exterior this life time.

I think a lot of my inherent/natural abilities have been put "on hold". So many of them got suppressed/invalidated while in Scn. I'd get "you're just a Clear, you can't be doing that". Now my response would be: "you're just an A Hole, you shouldn't be allowed to speak".

I think it all just takes time to settle out all the inval/eval, etc.

I swear, it feels like some huge cog is sitting on the tip of my tongue, but I just can't grasp it. But it feels huge and will blow a lot of my residual charge from Scn. If it comes to mind or out of my mouth, I'll do my best to share it - it just feels like it's going to be something that we all might be able to get something from. (I'm all good on a cog that might help others. )

A cognition burp? What a lovely idea!

This subject is something I have been dealing with particularly in the last few months, since I first posted my story.

The whole idea that everyone has an identical bank, and that there is only ONE way step by step to handle it, now seems such utter rubbish and invalidation to me. We are all different!

Sure we may have had some similar experiences back on the track, walked alongside each other a while, but now it makes no sense to me that anyone buys the concept of being squeezed into a pre-defined box as the only explanation!

Once you are free to explore your abilities, it is quite mind blowing. I was very lucky to be taken under the wing of some great people when I first went on the net, and they helped me recognise gifts I had that would surely not be allowed a Clear in Scio!

I know there are those that won't agree with me, and that's fine, because we are all different.

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

A cognition burp? What a lovely idea!

This subject is something I have been dealing with particularly in the last few months, since I first posted my story.

The whole idea that everyone has an identical bank, and that there is only ONE way step by step to handle it, now seems such utter rubbish and invalidation to me. We are all different!

Sure we may have had some similar experiences back on the track, walked alongside each other a while, but now it makes no sense to me that anyone buys the concept of being squeezed into a pre-defined box as the only explanation!

Once you are free to explore your abilities, it is quite mind blowing. I was very lucky to be taken under the wing of some great people when I first went on the net, and they helped me recognise gifts I had that would surely not be allowed a Clear in Scio!

I know there are those that won't agree with me, and that's fine, because we are all different.

That's a very interesting viewpoint - how can we all be handled with the exact same thing. We are all different.

I'll have to go read your story, if I haven't already. It's so hard to catch up and keep up with this board. There are so many posts every day. And with all the protests and keeping up with that. I don't know if I'll ever get caught up.

I have so many questions sometimes, I then I think, why bother. If I just sit back and relax, it seems that my questions get answered in their own way.

 

[Free to shine]

I have so many questions sometimes, I then I think, why bother. If I just sit back and relax, it seems that my questions get answered in their own way.

That's true! Often I will think of some subject I want to ask or post about and within a day the appropriate thread appears. I spent weeks here reading and reading, and I certainly didn't cover it all. The stories interest me most, where I can identify with what happened to others.

Otherwise to keep up with the recent postings, I check Today's Posts. It's becoming my homepage.

Yes, relax.

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

That's true! Often I will think of some subject I want to ask or post about and within a day the appropriate thread appears. I spent weeks here reading and reading, and I certainly didn't cover it all. The stories interest me most, where I can identify with what happened to others.

Otherwise to keep up with the recent postings, I check Today's Posts. It's becoming my homepage.

Yes, relax.

Yes, I go straight to "today's posts", then if I have more time to waste, I'll start looking at the older threads. I got thru your story last night. I felt like wasting a lot of time. But actually, I find some or many of the posts therapeutic - helps me to as-is some of my own experience in Scn.

 

[Zinjifar]

I just have some holes still to fill regarding if there IS ANY OT to ever be attained, now? (even if it's a different definition, and thru different (or mixing) paths, etc?).

Thanks,

Wisened One.

Possibly the first thing to do is dump the use (even 'internally') of the terms OT, Operating Thetan, 'at Cause' and even 'Clear'. Whatever else they may be, they're part of Ron's paradigm trap and, there isn't even a clear or consistent definition of any of them within Scientology itself.

Take stock of your own goals and take a look around for other, non-Scn concepts and I think you'll find other perfectly usable words and concepts that may or may not really exist, but which don't keep changing definitions depending on manipulative opportunism.

Zinj

 

[Wisened One]

This is a very helpful thread thanks!

Wisened One

 

[EP - Ethics Particle]

Lookie what I found! 15Jan2007...

Hi Emma Darlin',

I hadda find my own pink hat - and on an "Ethics Particle" at that!

You (and we) have come a long way baby!

Love,

Mike

Without using any "tech" at all, how does one go about recovering from Scientology?

Take me for example. I have no freezone or independant field. I won't do Avatar, Landmark or any other cultic Scn derivation. I can't find a psych who has any clue about leaving a cult. I don't have a lot of money.

Does life just gradually win over? Does time really heal? Is talking it about it in this type of environment enough?

Do you read? Find a hobby? Go back to school? Get a new religion? Concentrate on your career?

How do you fill the void?

Some might say "what void?" But there is a void. A deep one.

10 years ago I thought I had all the answers. I had "the tech" to handle anything. I had the answers to life itself. I was training to be an auditor. I was in the most ethical group on the planet. I had found kindred spirits. I was shouldering the responsibility of the planet. I was a "big being". I could do the impossible.

How does one get over that loss?

 

[Wisened One]

Bump