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My 3 1/2 hour conversation with a Scientologist

Wizard

New Member
Part 1

Here we go...

Hello everyone, this is my first time posting.

I've been lurking [edit ;) ] for at least 2 years, and read a great deal about Scientology. So mush so that I understand Sci-speak. I never joined the "church" but came across it online in 2002, during a time when I was fascinated by alternative beliefs and weirdness in general, i.e., my "ruin" would have been wanting to "go exterior" and have control over "MEST" :duh: I've always heard about Scientology here and there so I decided to do some reading. I read their side first; Dianetics, scientologydotorg, and the Science of Survival...And thank God I never joined. I came across Operation Clambake and this website saved me from the countless hardships and pain that many of yourselves went through.:bigcry: I've read all of the books (bare-faced messiah), watched the interviews (Jason Beghe) and read the stories (here). And I was able to get a peak into the abyss that is known as Scientology.

Cults are the ultimate form of spiritual rape and creator of emotional damage. They take advantage of kind people and turn them inside out. Through a friend of mine, I recently met someone who was in the Sea Org for a long time ago and that blew a few years ago, and things he told me were really sad, which I'll get into later:bigcry: Although I've talked with him, I have never actually met an active Scientologist in my life...

And this is where my story begins:

Last night I was visiting a friend in a Hotel in LA. It's a decent place, and he lives there paying month by month along with several dozen other tenants. It was late around 12:30am and we were chatting in the lobby about various story ideas for the latest script we were writing.

Not long after, a reasonably attractive women in her early 40s came into the lobby. My friend (about the same age as her) got up and went to go say hi before she went up on the elevator. He flirted with her for a bit (to my knowledge at the time, he met her a few days earlier, but only very briefly) and he got her to come over and sit down with us.

"This is my friend," He told her as they sat.
"Hi, nice to meet you," She said to me.
"Nice to meet you too." I said.

My friend continued with small talk for a bit then asked her, "So what are you doing up so late?"
"Oh, I had a busy day and I just got out of class."
"Wow at this time, what are you taking?"
"Oh, it's something called TWH."
...For a moment, alarm bells rang. Did she mean "The Way to Happiness"? No way, can't be.
"What's that?" He asked.
"Well, it means 'The Way to Happiness', it's something I'm studying."
That's when I knew she was Scientologist. She was a very nice and decent person but then I started to become really tense. Everything I've learned. Everything I read. Xenu, the RPF, Lisa Mcpherson, LRH and his lies...everything started to build inside of me to the breaking point. I wanted to save her! To get her out of this cult before it was too late!:bigcry: At the same time I didn't want to push on her beliefs, or argue with her. I knew she would clamp up and might walk away. So for the moment, I stayed silent and toyed with my blackberry.
"Huh? What is that?" He asked.
"Oh, it's really fun. And I also work with this group called the Citizens Commission on Human Rights."
"...Isn't that...Are you a Scientologist?" My friend knows very little about Scientology, but he knows enough since he's walked passed some of the Orgs in LA. Thankfully, he was never interested.
"Yes, and what are you?" she asked.
He seemed stumped for a few moments, and I laughed at her quick remark.
"Well, you know, I like to have my own beliefs, I dunno, I don't think people should just have one religion--" He stammered.
"Actually, in Scientology you can still be a member of any religion"
I sighed to myself, knowing it was a lie. I came so close to blurting out "they're a R6 implant!" but I didn't.
"So what's this course thing you're studying?" He asked. She pulled out a CCHR booklet and handed it over. He looked through it, and she talked for a bit about drugs and how everything in that booklet is true. After skimming through it, he handed it back.
"So do you worship Tom Cruse? I heard he's gay. What happens when your gay in Scientology?" My friend wasn't trying to enturbulate, we was kind of half joking/half flirting.
"Well, no we don't worship him. He's not Source, although he's close to Source." She replied with a friendly manner.
"What happens if your gay?"
"Well, I would direct you to the Scientology website."
"Yeah, well, I just don't think that religions should have dogmas and stuff--"
"Scientology doesn't have dogmas, we're open to all things," she said.
At this point I snapped. I couldn't take it anymore.
"So what happens if you read material from other than LRH?"
They stopped and looked at me. She eyed me for a second.
"...Well, uh, yes we can read other material. It's ok."
I knew she was lying, and it was driving me crazy but I tried to keep my cool.
"How far are you up the Bridge?" I asked.
"Are?...Are you a Scientologist?" She asked. She seemed a little surprised.
"Nope. So how far are you?"
"What's the 'Bridge'?" My friend asked.
"I...," she seemed cautious, "I've been in for over a year and a half."
"So you haven't gone up the OT levels yet?"
"...What's the OT Levels?" My friend asked again.
"It's called Operating Thetan," I told him. "It's like their path to enlightenment."
She was very surprised that I even knew this much. She was intrigued but cautious...as though it were all an elaborate hoax and I was some OSA spy making sure her ethics were "IN." :clap:
"Do you know about the OT 3 level and the 'Wall of Fire'?" I asked.
She was a little perplexed. So I decided to go hardcore...
"75 million years ago...

End of Part 1
 
Last edited:

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
well, so far we've got about a 1/2 hour :)

3 more hours? Somebody's gonna be in trouble...

Welcome aboard.

Zinj
 

Wizard

New Member
thanks :happydance:

Yeah, what I was most surprised about was how cool she was :D

I've seen many video's where Scientologists basically just walk away or ignore the entheta and stuff.

She was really nice.
 

AngeloV

Gold Meritorious Patron
Welcome Wizard

Good of you to join us. Welcome to the board.

Please do continue your story; it's very intriguing.

Oh, and good on you for investigating scio as much as you have. Knowledge is the best insulator against BS.
 

byte301

Crusader
thanks :happydance:

Yeah, what I was most surprised about was how cool she was :D

I've seen many video's where Scientologists basically just walk away or ignore the entheta and stuff.

She was really nice.

She's just a baby scilon. The nice hasn't been slapped out of her yet.

And welcome! Can't wait to hear the rest of your story.:yes:
 

FinallyFree

Gold Meritorious Patron
Welcome to the Board Wizard! I ran into this as a scientologist once when I was still in. When it happened to me (running into someone I thought was "raw Public" and didn't know about scn) my biggest fear was that the person was say something I couldn't argue against, or that the person was a S.P. (how could you know about scn and *not* be "IN").

You see the trouble with scn is, for some - like me, they have a hint that their faith is not what you hope it is. People like you pull the thread and everything starts to unravel. Part of the brainwashing is a protection mechanism to prevent this from happening, i.e. "what's true for me is true for me", “hubbard is source (which you mentioned she said)” etc., etc. Being that she was still relatively new I am sure this was part of her fear.

When I read that you started on the Zenu story I cracked up instantly!

Please continue!
 

pollywannacracker

Patron Meritorious
:welcome: Wizard!

Can't wait to hear the rest of your story! Having the correct information to disseminate is always the best way to wipe Scn off the face of the earth.

Does she now know she's swimming with :shark:?
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Part 1

Here we go...

Hello everyone, this is my first time posting.

I've been trolling for at least 2 years,


Perhaps you mean "lurking". I hope so, anyway.

and read a great deal about Scientology. So mush so that I understand Sci-speak. I never joined the "church" but came across it online in 2002, during a time when I was fascinated by alternative beliefs and weirdness in general, i.e., my "ruin" would have been wanting to "go exterior" and have control over "MEST" :duh:

That wouldn't be a "ruin". That would be a goal. A "ruin" is something that is RUINING one's life that one wants to "handle".

"Huh? What is that?" He asked.
"Oh, it's really fun. And I also work with this group called the Citizens Commission on Human Rights."
"...Isn't that...Are you a Scientologist?" My friend knows very little about Scientology, but he knows enough since he's walked passed some of the Orgs in LA. Thankfully, he was never interested.
"Yes, and what are you?" she asked.
He seemed stumped for a few moments, and I laughed at her quick remark.
"Well, you know, I like to have my own beliefs, I dunno, I don't think people should just have one religion--" He stammered.
"Actually, in Scientology you can still be a member of any religion"
I sighed to myself, knowing it was a lie.


Not exactly. One can be a member of some other church and be a Scn'ist. But as time goes on and the person's involvement deepens, his or her time away from CofS would be resented by staff and there'd be pressure to make him or her into more of a fanatic. But there's no actual PROHIBITION.

I came so close to blurting out "they're a R6 implant!" but I didn't.
"So what's this course thing you're studying?" He asked. She pulled out a CCHR booklet and handed it over. He looked through it, and she talked for a bit about drugs and how everything in that booklet is true. After skimming through it, he handed it back.
"So do you worship Tom Cruse? I heard he's gay. What happens when your gay in Scientology?" My friend wasn't trying to enturbulate, we was kind of half joking/half flirting.
"Well, no we don't worship him. He's not Source, although he's close to Source." She replied with a friendly manner.
"What happens if your gay?"
"Well, I would direct you to the Scientology website."
"Yeah, well, I just don't think that religions should have dogmas and stuff--"
"Scientology doesn't have dogmas, we're open to all things," she said.
At this point I snapped. I couldn't take it anymore.
"So what happens if you read material from other than LRH?"
They stopped and looked at me. She eyed me for a second.
"...Well, uh, yes we can read other material. It's ok."
I knew she was lying,

Not really. You are right that Scn'ists aren't open to other things- that's something I definitely noticed when I was in, but it's not true that they can't read other stuff.


and it was driving me crazy but I tried to keep my cool.
"How far are you up the Bridge?" I asked.
"Are?...Are you a Scientologist?" She asked. She seemed a little surprised.
"Nope. So how far are you?"
"What's the 'Bridge'?" My friend asked.
"I...," she seemed cautious, "I've been in for over a year and a half."
"So you haven't gone up the OT levels yet?"
"...What's the OT Levels?" My friend asked again.
"It's called Operating Thetan," I told him. "It's like their path to enlightenment."


Good description.

She was very surprised that I even knew this much. She was intrigued but cautious...as though it were all an elaborate hoax and I was some OSA spy making sure her ethics were "IN." :clap:
"Do you know about the OT 3 level and the 'Wall of Fire'?" I asked.
She was a little perplexed. So I decided to go hardcore...
"75 million years ago...

It's against her religion, such as it is, to hear or read any OT stuff (also Key To Life, Life orientation course, Pro TRs, and the Ls) before getting to that point on the "bridge".
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Well, he's done some. Needs to check diff between ruin and goal, lurk and troll, and it's not true that Scn'ists can't read other stuff.
 

Been Done Had

Patron with Honors
Well, he's done some. Needs to check diff between ruin and goal, lurk and troll, and it's not true that Scn'ists can't read other stuff.

Huh? Of course there's TONS of things you can't read when you're in good standing. I can read ANYTHING I WANT.

When I was in I couldn't read psych texts. The newspaper. Self help books. Anti materials -- Messiah or Madman, OCMB, THIS WEBSITE. And what about God's of Eden being the subject of an ethics order? I'm sure there are many other specific books and subjects which are verbotten.

Oh, and don't watch Alien, it's restimulative. Was Communion on the naughty list too? And William Cooper's On a Pale Horse. Didn't people get in ethics trouble for reading that too?

And by "can't read" I interpret that as being dissuaded from reading (don't read the paper it's entheta) to ending up in ethics and on the cans for FDSing; Madman or Messiah.

That's my experience.
 

Wisened One

Crusader
She's just a baby scilon. The nice hasn't been slapped out of her yet.

And welcome! Can't wait to hear the rest of your story.:yes:

..I was gonna suggest that...especially if she's doing a basic course like TWTH. (But they she could be either re-treading it or simply doing it as a seasoned Public). But her reactions make me also think she's a newbie, so they are calmer and will 'confront' more (imo) with less ridges (so to speak).

And that answer of hers about TC is kinda strange...imo.....'but he's close to source'....:puke:

Please.....continue, tho! :drama:
 

well_that_sucked

Patron with Honors
Minor details Fluffy dog, minor details

What I wanna know is did he break the charm by rubbing her nose in the stupidity that is Scientology or what?

After all anyone that buys into Hubbard's con has either been duped and tricked, or is a complete and willing idiot. (with an emphasis on idiot)
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Huh? Of course there's TONS of things you can't read when you're in good standing. I can read ANYTHING I WANT.

When I was in I couldn't read psych texts. The newspaper. Self help books. Anti materials -- Messiah or Madman, OCMB, THIS WEBSITE. And what about God's of Eden being the subject of an ethics order? I'm sure there are many other specific books and subjects which are verbotten.

Oh, and don't watch Alien, it's restimulative. Was Communion on the naughty list too? And William Cooper's On a Pale Horse. Didn't people get in ethics trouble for reading that too?

And by "can't read" I interpret that as being dissuaded from reading (don't read the paper it's entheta) to ending up in ethics and on the cans for FDSing; Madman or Messiah.

That's my experience.

Not exactly. There is no "source" on any of that. The only thing I was ever told not to read (and this DID lead to my leaving the cult) was alt.religion.scientology. But as far as books and magazine articles go, I was never ever told what not to read. Ever. In fact, I was told it would be a good idea to read those things to point out what wasn't true. A bunch of us used to get together and laugh at them. I remember being asked to report on some of those books when I found them and mentioned them- and I was NEVER in OSA or the PR area.

There's NO prohibition against reading the papers, books on other religions, and so on. The op says that the Scn'ist said she could read about other things. I take that to mean books, articles and so on about other belief systems, philosophies and so on. But be that as it may, I always read critical stuff. Nobody threw a hissy til I wandered onto alt.religion.scientology and started communicating with "The SPs".

I took psych courses in college. There's no prohibition against that. Scn'ists don't like 'em and I've seen people say they didn't want to take Psych 101 (often a prerequisite in many BA programs) but I've never seen any prohibition against it.

Nobody told me not to watch sci fi movies, either. It sounds to me like you were being told stuff by staff members and were taking it as "source" in a way. It wasn't.

I'd never have fallen for that. I'd have asked for the reference which is what good little culties (as I was, once upon a time) are trained to do.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Oh, and don't watch Alien, it's restimulative. QUOTE]


OMG! Someone I knew who was on OT level's told me the SAME thing!


And that makes it an official prohibition? There's always someone running off at the mouth "evaluating for" other culties in CofS. That doesn't make it official. Stupid yes, official no.

Although this does remind me- isn't it interesting that a group that so often talks about not invalidating people or evaluating for them does exactly those things on a constant basis?
 

Wisened One

Crusader
Huh? Of course there's TONS of things you can't read when you're in good standing. I can read ANYTHING I WANT.

When I was in I couldn't read psych texts. The newspaper. Self help books. Anti materials -- Messiah or Madman, OCMB, THIS WEBSITE. And what about God's of Eden being the subject of an ethics order? I'm sure there are many other specific books and subjects which are verbotten.

Oh, and don't watch Alien, it's restimulative. Was Communion on the naughty list too? And William Cooper's On a Pale Horse. Didn't people get in ethics trouble for reading that too?

And by "can't read" I interpret that as being dissuaded from reading (don't read the paper it's entheta) to ending up in ethics and on the cans for FDSing; Madman or Messiah.

That's my experience.

This post is true. Our Org was like this, as well. Fluff, your Org musta been soft er sumthin'....(Soft-boiled Org? :D )
 
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