Really, really REALLY leaving scientology

[Telepathetic]

I also work very hard at not using...what's the word?

 

[I told you I was trouble]

I echo what FTS is saying about dropping the scientology jargon. It works if you consciously make yourself find alternatives. It is forced and artificial at first, but the more you do it the easier it is to express concepts in non-scn jargon. Then as you do this, the process of thinking like a scientologist drops away and you are free!

Yeah ... I am going to start doing that ...

Lovely post FTS ... I think I get where you are coming from (again) ... I hope you stay though.

 

[Doc]

I read your story Free To Shine, and you are an inspiration to all ex scn's on a larger level than people may realize. Although we haven't gotten acquainted, I for one appreciate your positiveness and mature outlook about what being out of a cult and a cultic mindset looks like.

In my line of work, people with your extensive experiences in SCN who actually have the ability to overcome the conditioning and move on to a healthy mindset is rare.
You are, as I described in my thread, a 'precious gem'. You would be an asset to recovery groups around the world in a counseling role...think about it someday.

Here are some Indian proverbs, ones that you have already figured out:

"Those who have one foot in the canoe, and one foot in the boat, are going to fall into the river." - Tuscarora

"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep." - Navajo

"The one who tells the stories rules the world." - Hopi

"Don't let yesterday use up too much of today." - Cherokee

Cherokee Blessing
May the warm winds of Heaven blow softly on your home,
And the Great Spirit bless all who enter there.
May your moccasins make happy tracks in many snows,
And may the rainbow always touch your shoulder

 

[Telepathetic]

Doc,

Those are great,thanks!

Very nice what you said about FTS, I feel the same way. She is what I wish to become.

 

[Emma]

FTS, thank you for everything.

 

[Pixie]

I've been around here for quite a long time, and when I first arrived found great comfort in being able to tell my story and finding people who had lived similar situations. After decades of scio indoctrination dictating my responses to every situation in life, it took a long time to be able to stand back enough to be able to start spotting those automaticities. I did most of it alone, over a very long time and it was a very hard and slow process. The way I was raised and the way I lived most of my life always, always always had the immediate scientology 'filter' between me and the world as others saw it. Although aware of it, I felt it the right thing to keep peering through it, as I had been taught for so long. I worked a lot out for myself as I had no choice having been abandoned by the very thing that was supposed to help me.

For example, such simple things as immediately switching channels on tv should any bad news about scio come on, having my only real friends and acquaintances be scientologists because "no-one else understood", assigning someone mentally a label or a condition. Done without real thought or critical thinking, looking back shows me what a great deal of life that was right in front of me that I missed due to the prejudices.

And it IS prejudice of the most extreme kind, and I can see now how it is designed that way, thanks to threads here. Even if you should actually leave the organisation for a while after the odd ethics hiccup, looking elsewhere for solutions is short circuited before you have a chance to explore them, and you tended to end up back at Square One telling an Ethics officer why you were such a bad person.

I think if you allow yourself to start to look at other spiritual paths, you are well on the way to recovery.

So what happens if your view of life is so coloured by "how it should be" for your eternal salvation and the agonised future of every being on the planet, when the door is firmly closed? When you are chucked to the wolves/wogs in the real world to sink or swim? Told you are one of the small percent trying to destroy the world instead? I'm not talking about those who figured it out early on and walked, but those of us who were raised in scio or who for whatever reason spent 20/30/40 years under it's umbrella?

Well there are many stories here of how we coped as individuals. The distress, despair, self doubt and struggle to find ourselves again. Those stories need to be read as a first step, because not only do they inspire, they also shed light on HOW IT HAPPENS, how you can begin to seperate out from the 'circuits' that stop you thinking.

Then you discuss it.

And here's the crunch - we need to allow discussion of different viewpoints and to actually try and understand what others write even though internally you may be screaming "but you just don't understand!" or "everything you are saying is bullshit and why can't you see that (insert scio tech here) covers that!" We need to be willing to look and listen, to take a deep breath and begin to consider perhaps some of this could be valid.

Early on here I used to get upset at the constant Freezone and tech threads. I used to think "how can anyone possibly endlessly discuss that?" Yet I read quite a lot anyway and found some of the tech discussions actually did shed light on what had happened to me in auditing. The discussions on cognitive dissonance, TRs, indoctrination and most of all JARGON are invaluable insights into how we we ended up the way we did. It's an individual journey though and not one size fits all.

Arnie Lerma's 8 Steps out of Scientology is a valuable guide. Many people will stall on the later steps, and that's OK too - we do choose our futures and have a right to our beliefs.

I have said many times I am grateful for ESMB as it allowed me to shed those last lingering and very potent and hidden scio dictates on life. I have seen this board ebb and flow with different themes and personalities. As a new influx of exes arrive, the discussions change, the focus changes to the interests of those around at the time. Mini groups form of friends who cling to the familiar ways of thinking and shared real life experiences. It happens. Unfortunately sometimes that also means that the discussions become unbalanced, with those still seeing through scientology eyes drowning out the very pearls of wisdom that could show them a whole new world.

I wasn't going to do this, but for some reason this morning it seemed right. I have contributed a lot to this board and to the exscn site, in gratitude for being able to voice my thoughts. I have made some lovely friends and hopefully helped some along the way. However the current climate here is not nice and I find that I have little to add to discussions as it feels unsafe to disagree with the loudest posters. It will pass, it always does, but I have better things to do right now than watch another scientology inspired drama.

I really enjoyed bringing picket reports, media news, BFG stories and Anonymous info here for those who may have missed it elsewhere. I am sure someone can continue that for me. Scientology IS cracking apart and the crimes ARE being exposed at long last. People who are being tortured and hurt will be able to see daylight again and the and those held in thrall will have the spell broken and be able to see again. My heart cries for those who can't see they are still being manipulated, both "in" and "out" of scientology by it's very nature, yet I have also realised that as individuals we always have a choice and perhaps these very experiences will be what finally allows personal awareness.

It's not a matter of "graduating" or even "getting on with real life". There seems to be a current theme that it's actually not OK for some to post a lot, ie that means they are obsessed or don't have a life, yet celebrated when others reach a high post count. I think we all post exactly as much as we need and there should be no judgement on that. To do so is reducing conversation to stats, and we all know what that means.

Most of the dissention and upset I have seen on this board has originated with misunderstandings from those who are very hurt. Yes, it's not a "kindergarten", it's an internet site where people have been allowed to finally release some of the pain they have felt for a long time and to find a voice. If they are jumped on and attacked, then it is just a repeat of what they are trying to come to terms with from scientology, and it easily escalates into nastiness. Compassion for that true suffering in others, and empathy for the pain goes a long way towards our own healing and can ease any upsets if applied with kindness and patience.

Thankyou Lionheart and Headend (and Beyond Horizons) for helping me understand how to let go. Thankyou ABJ, Escalus, Nexus and numerous others for helping me learn how to write my feelings. Thankyou Pixie for your honesty and humour. Thankyou Neo for your courage, and to all those actually at the front lines doing something about it. Thankyou Tansy for reminding me that cynical humour can also be very funny at times and allowing me to laugh. Thankyou Schwimmy for your wonderful humour as well. Thankyou WO for your compassion and open heart, Tamasin for surviving and telling your story, the same for Twin A and Bea and all the many others. Thankyou Power Change, Olska and Knight Vision for daring to speak your truth. Hey, thanks even to the FZers who provided a bottom line to measure my progress away from scio against! Thankyou Emma for creating this board. Many I haven't mentioned, but you get my drift. What a wonderful mix of people I feel honoured to have met.

I'll be around somewhere... maybe... please be kind to each other.

FTS

I understand totally what you are saying here now. You have contributed massively on this board and have helped me wake up to so many things from your wonderful posts.

I have come upon a childrens story which I thought you may like to read if you are still lurking. It resonated with me very much regarding leaving cults, I hope you enjoy it.

Meahwhile I hope and wish from the depths of my heart that you have happiness and love in abundance for the rest of your life.

Yertle The Turtle

On the far-away island of Sala-ma-Sond,
Yertle the Turtle was king of the pond.
A nice little pond. It was clean. It was neat.
The water was warm. There was plenty to eat.
The turtles had everything turtles might need.
And they were all happy. Quite happy indeed.

They were... until Yertle, the king of them all,
Decided the kingdom he ruled was too small.
"I'm ruler", said Yertle, "of all that I see.
But I don't see enough. That's the trouble with me.
With this stone for a throne, I look down on my pond
But I cannot look down on the places beyond.
This throne that I sit on is too, too low down.
It ought to be higher!" he said with a frown.
"If I could sit high, how much greater I'd be!
What a king! I'd be ruler of all that I see!"

So Yertle, the Turtle King, lifted his hand
And Yertle, the Turtle King, gave a command.
He ordered nine turtles to swim to his stone
And, using these turtles, he built a new throne.
He made each turtle stand on another one's back
And he piled them all up in a nine-turtle stack.
And then Yertle climbed up. He sat down on the pile.
What a wonderful view! He could see 'most a mile!

"All mine!" Yertle cried. "Oh, the things I now rule!
I'm the king of a cow! And I'm the king of a mule!
I'm the king of a house! And, what's more, beyond that
I'm the king of a blueberry bush and a cat!
I'm Yertle the Turtle! Oh, marvellous me!
For I am the ruler of all that I see!"

And all through the morning, he sat up there high
Saying over and over, "A great king am I!"
Until 'long about noon. Then he heard a faint sigh.
"What's that?" snapped the king
And he looked down the stack.
And he saw, at the bottom, a turtle named Mack.
Just a part of his throne. And this plain little turtle
Looked up and he said, "Beg your pardon, King Yertle.
I've pains in my back and my shoulders and knees.
How long must we stand here, Your Majesty, please?"

"SILENCE!" the King of the Turtles barked back.
"I'm king, and you're only a turtle named Mack."

"You stay in your place while I sit here and rule.
I'm the king of a cow! And I'm the king of a mule!
I'm the king of a house! And a bush! And a cat!
But that isn't all. I'll do better than that!
My throne shall be higher!" his royal voice thundered,
"So pile up more turtles! I want 'bout two hundred!"

"Turtles! More turtles!" he bellowed and brayed.
And the turtles 'way down in the pond were afraid.
They trembled. They shook. But they came. They obeyed.
From all over the pond, they came swimming by dozens.
Whole families of turtles, with uncles and cousins.
And all of them stepped on the head of poor Mack.
One after another, they climbed up the stack.

Then Yertle the Turtle was perched up so high,
He could see forty miles from his throne in the sky!
"Hooray!" shouted Yertle. "I'm the king of the trees!
I'm king of the birds! And I'm king of the bees!
I'm king of the butterflies! King of the air!
Ah, me! What a throne! What a wonderful chair!
I'm Yertle the Turtle! Oh, marvellous me!
For I am the ruler of all that I see!"

Then again, from below, in the great heavy stack,
Came a groan from that plain little turtle named Mack.
"Your Majesty, please... I don't like to complain,
But down here below, we are feeling great pain.
I know, up on top you are seeing great sights,
But down here at the bottom we, too, should have rights.
We turtles can't stand it. Our shells will all crack!
Besides, we need food. We are starving!" groaned Mack.

"You hush up your mouth!" howled the mighty King Yertle.
"You've no right to talk to the world's highest turtle.
I rule from the clouds! Over land! Over sea!
There's nothing, no, NOTHING, that's higher than me!"

But, while he was shouting, he saw with surprise
That the moon of the evening was starting to rise
Up over his head in the darkening skies.
"What's THAT?" snorted Yertle. "Say, what IS that thing
That dares to be higher than Yertle the King?
I shall not allow it! I'll go higher still!
I'll build my throne higher! I can and I will!
I'll call some more turtles. I'll stack 'em to heaven!
I need 'bout five thousand, six hundred and seven!"

But, as Yertle, the Turtle King, lifted his hand
And started to order and give the command,
That plain little turtle below in the stack,
That plain little turtle whose name was just Mack,
Decided he'd taken enough. And he had.
And that plain little lad got a bit mad.
And that plain little Mack did a plain little thing.
He burped!
And his burp shook the throne of the king!

And Yertle the Turtle, the king of the trees,
The king of the air and the birds and the bees,
The king of a house and a cow and a mule...
Well, that was the end of the Turtle King's rule!
For Yertle, the King of all Sala-ma-Sond,
Fell off his high throne and fell Plunk! In the pond!

And today the great Yertle, that Marvellous he,
Is King of the Mud. That is all he can see.
And the turtles, of course... all the turtles are free
As turtles and, maybe, all creatures should be.

 

[Patricia Curtis]

Love you, girl. See you in the cosmos!

 

[Doc]

Ah yes...good ole' Doc Suess. He has a way of teaching lessons like no other. This 'Yertle the Turtle' story is a classic. For those who have no patience to read the whole story and rhyme at the appropriate points, here is a synopsis. Although, I would recommend taking a few minutes and reading it....it is just one of Doc Suess's best stories.

Synopsis:

The story revolves around a turtle named King Yertle who is the king of a pond. He commands the other turtles to stack themselves beneath him so he may have a throne high enough to see and rule over more land.

A plain little turtle named Mack, who is standing at the bottom of the pile, complains, “I know up on top you are seeing great sights, but down here at the bottom we, too, should have rights.”

King Yertle refuses to listen to Mack’s pleas and commands more and more turtles to add to his throne. When King Yertle notices the moon rise above him as the night approaches, he decides to call for 5,607 more turtles for the stack to try to rise above the moon.

However, before he can give the command, Mack, strained and angry, burps, shaking the stack of turtles and tossing King Yertle off into the mud;

“And today the great Yertle, that Marvelous he, Is King of the Mud, That is all he can see. And the turtles, of course… all the turtles are free, As turtles and, maybe, all creatures should be.”

I understand totally what you are saying here now. You have contributed massively on this board and have helped me wake up to so many things from your wonderful posts.

I have come upon a childrens story which I thought you may like to read if you are still lurking. It resonated with me very much regarding leaving cults, I hope you enjoy it.

Meahwhile I hope and wish from the depths of my heart that you have happiness and love in abundance for the rest of your life.

Yertle The Turtle

On the far-away island of Sala-ma-Sond,
Yertle the Turtle was king of the pond.
A nice little pond. It was clean. It was neat.
The water was warm. There was plenty to eat.
The turtles had everything turtles might need.
And they were all happy. Quite happy indeed.

They were... until Yertle, the king of them all,
Decided the kingdom he ruled was too small.
"I'm ruler", said Yertle, "of all that I see.
But I don't see enough. That's the trouble with me.
With this stone for a throne, I look down on my pond
But I cannot look down on the places beyond.
This throne that I sit on is too, too low down.
It ought to be higher!" he said with a frown.
"If I could sit high, how much greater I'd be!
What a king! I'd be ruler of all that I see!"

So Yertle, the Turtle King, lifted his hand
And Yertle, the Turtle King, gave a command.
He ordered nine turtles to swim to his stone
And, using these turtles, he built a new throne.
He made each turtle stand on another one's back
And he piled them all up in a nine-turtle stack.
And then Yertle climbed up. He sat down on the pile.
What a wonderful view! He could see 'most a mile!

"All mine!" Yertle cried. "Oh, the things I now rule!
I'm the king of a cow! And I'm the king of a mule!
I'm the king of a house! And, what's more, beyond that
I'm the king of a blueberry bush and a cat!
I'm Yertle the Turtle! Oh, marvellous me!
For I am the ruler of all that I see!"

And all through the morning, he sat up there high
Saying over and over, "A great king am I!"
Until 'long about noon. Then he heard a faint sigh.
"What's that?" snapped the king
And he looked down the stack.
And he saw, at the bottom, a turtle named Mack.
Just a part of his throne. And this plain little turtle
Looked up and he said, "Beg your pardon, King Yertle.
I've pains in my back and my shoulders and knees.
How long must we stand here, Your Majesty, please?"

"SILENCE!" the King of the Turtles barked back.
"I'm king, and you're only a turtle named Mack."

"You stay in your place while I sit here and rule.
I'm the king of a cow! And I'm the king of a mule!
I'm the king of a house! And a bush! And a cat!
But that isn't all. I'll do better than that!
My throne shall be higher!" his royal voice thundered,
"So pile up more turtles! I want 'bout two hundred!"

"Turtles! More turtles!" he bellowed and brayed.
And the turtles 'way down in the pond were afraid.
They trembled. They shook. But they came. They obeyed.
From all over the pond, they came swimming by dozens.
Whole families of turtles, with uncles and cousins.
And all of them stepped on the head of poor Mack.
One after another, they climbed up the stack.

Then Yertle the Turtle was perched up so high,
He could see forty miles from his throne in the sky!
"Hooray!" shouted Yertle. "I'm the king of the trees!
I'm king of the birds! And I'm king of the bees!
I'm king of the butterflies! King of the air!
Ah, me! What a throne! What a wonderful chair!
I'm Yertle the Turtle! Oh, marvellous me!
For I am the ruler of all that I see!"

Then again, from below, in the great heavy stack,
Came a groan from that plain little turtle named Mack.
"Your Majesty, please... I don't like to complain,
But down here below, we are feeling great pain.
I know, up on top you are seeing great sights,
But down here at the bottom we, too, should have rights.
We turtles can't stand it. Our shells will all crack!
Besides, we need food. We are starving!" groaned Mack.

"You hush up your mouth!" howled the mighty King Yertle.
"You've no right to talk to the world's highest turtle.
I rule from the clouds! Over land! Over sea!
There's nothing, no, NOTHING, that's higher than me!"

But, while he was shouting, he saw with surprise
That the moon of the evening was starting to rise
Up over his head in the darkening skies.
"What's THAT?" snorted Yertle. "Say, what IS that thing
That dares to be higher than Yertle the King?
I shall not allow it! I'll go higher still!
I'll build my throne higher! I can and I will!
I'll call some more turtles. I'll stack 'em to heaven!
I need 'bout five thousand, six hundred and seven!"

But, as Yertle, the Turtle King, lifted his hand
And started to order and give the command,
That plain little turtle below in the stack,
That plain little turtle whose name was just Mack,
Decided he'd taken enough. And he had.
And that plain little lad got a bit mad.
And that plain little Mack did a plain little thing.
He burped!
And his burp shook the throne of the king!

And Yertle the Turtle, the king of the trees,
The king of the air and the birds and the bees,
The king of a house and a cow and a mule...
Well, that was the end of the Turtle King's rule!
For Yertle, the King of all Sala-ma-Sond,
Fell off his high throne and fell Plunk! In the pond!

And today the great Yertle, that Marvellous he,
Is King of the Mud. That is all he can see.
And the turtles, of course... all the turtles are free
As turtles and, maybe, all creatures should be.

 

[Free to shine]

Oh goodness me, thanks for the Yertle story! Takes me back a bit. I can just see DM's turtles starting to tumble, this has been an amazing year.

 

[The Anabaptist Jacques]

Free to Shine,

You have been an inspiration for me because your posts comes from the heart. Without that, words are meaningless. Bless you and fare thee well!

The Anabaptist Jacques

 

[lionheart]

Yes, FTS and Pixie, it has been an amazing year and this next one will see even more turtles burbing and leaving the turtle pile!

Soon DM will be left alone at the top of his imaginary pile of slaves, he will suddenly notice the slaves have all freed themselves and Ron's nightmare affirmations will be over!

 

[Emma]

Yes, FTS and Pixie, it has been an amazing year and this next one will see even more turtles burbing and leaving the turtle pile!

Soon DM will be left alone at the top of his imaginary pile of slaves, he will suddenly notice the slaves have all freed themselves and Ron's nightmare affirmations will be over!

More of this will happen this year.

Look at the last 12 months. So many leaving or at least looking. ANZO is in crisis, law suits are pending, books have been published, more and more websites are going up, the protests continue.

Scn is screwed.

 

[lionheart]

More of this will happen this year.

Look at the last 12 months. So many leaving or at least looking. ANZO is in crisis, law suits are pending, books have been published, more and more websites are going up, the protests continue.

Scn is screwed.

Yes, mostly thanks to the internet actually!

And your part in this has been considerable!

The other day, Mrs L was reading the Times article from WWP and we discussed how openly available all the crimes and misdemeanors of the CofS now are. It is public knowledge and so the CofS can only fail.

 

[Doc]

Thought I would share another Doc Suess story on FTS’s thread since she expressed this subject so well. Here is another great lesson from Doc Suess:

The Sneetches

Sneetches are a race of odd, yellow creatures who live on a beach.
Sneetchland is populated by two types of Sneetches: the Star Belly Sneetches, born with a yellow star on their stomachs, and the Plain Belly Sneetches, born with no stars.

Some Sneetches have a star on their bellies, and some do not. Sneetches who have stars on their bellies are part of the “in crowd”, while Sneetches without stars are shunned and consequently mopey.The Star Belly Sneetches flaunt their belly stars as proof of their superiority and refuse to mix with the "inferior" Plain Bellies. They snub them at every occasion and prohibit their Star Belly children from playing with Plain Belly kids. The Plain Belly Sneetches, for their part, feel inferior to the Star Belly Sneetches and envy them their belly star status symbols.

Everything changes when a clever man named McMonkey McBean arrives with his ‘Star-On-Off’ machine. The Plain Belly Sneetches eagerly pay him to put stars on their bellies so they can join the ranks of the "superior" "in" Star Bellies. This infuriates the Star Bellies, who can no longer tell the "good" sneetches from the "bad", since now everyone has belly stars.

The previous "in" sneetches therefore get together and decide that not having belly stars is the new "in" status symbol, and pay McBean to take off their belly stars. Next follows a crazy on-again, off-again race as the Star Belly Sneetches run through McBean's machine to add or take off stars and the Plain Belly Sneetches keep imitating them. This escalates, with the Sneetches running from one machine to the next until no one is sure who is who.

Finally, both Star Bellies and Plain Bellies run out of money and McBean drives off with their cash, laughing "You can't teach a sneetch." By this time, no-one can tell who's a Star Belly or Plain Belly any longer.

In the end, the Sneetches decide to abandon their silly status games and to treat each other as friends and equals, vowing never again to discriminate against others who look different.

 

[anonomog]

Dear Free to Shine,
I am a serial lurker, reading and gathering and reading...and reading. That is my role. In my lurking I have grown very fond of the exes as their life stories unfold in humour or pain. Unknowingly I grew and learnt too.

Through stories and posts I have learnt a lot about the CO$, but even more about courage.

Your empathy, compassion, wisdom and strength against the odds shines brightly in each post. I will miss your posts and wish you well and hope you continue to shine on all the people in your life.

The internet is often seen as not real life. Maybe you can't reach out and touch the person you are speaking to, but the impact of your words do.

Shine on





Seeker Of Truth
seeker of truth

follow no path
all paths lead where

truth is here

e e cummings

 

[lionheart]

Thanks Anonomog!

I've passed your message on to FTS in case she doesn't see it here.

 

[Tom of Helatrobus]

Shine on you crazy diamond!

In a million years our involvement with Scientology won't even be remembered. Scientology won't be remembered... So our eturnity has to begin sometime. We might as well get on with it.

 

[lionheart]

I've passed your message on to FTS, Tom.

Although she is not currently visiting ESMB, I am happy to pass on any posts to her so she will see your good wishes.