Examples of disconnection and how it works

[Mimsey Borogrove]

Hi Exsomessenger, I was wondering why you disliked my post. I can't say I expected you to like it either. Perhaps you don't like my "That's the way it is, so accept it." point of view. I can sympathize with you because I have been cut off for several years now, but obsessing about it is stressful and unhealthy. You really have to act as if they have died. I read somewhere about this person who was leaving Int, and they gave them a box of undelivered mail that was gathering over the years. They are simply cut off by design.

What they do is cruel, but Ron decreed it that way to force you to rejoin, or get the hell out of the road. That is why they don't accept the "I won't talk about Scientology if you won't" paradigm. It is all or nothing. Sometimes life sucks. What else can one say?

I think in the book Blown for Good there is a way to force their hand, involving writing letters, and notifying the local police, Postmasters, the IRS, or some other Federal office and keep at it till the person is forced out of the Sea Org internally because they want the PTS sit to go away. But, you have to look at their point of view - do they want to leave? You could force them out and have them really hate you. Belief is a strong stumbling block to overcome.

If you really hate the situation, then I suppose you need to find a way to attack the Church, to hasten their demise. If you were in the CMO, perhaps you can use your knowledge against them - I dunno be creative. Look what Debbie Cook did with her report. Perhaps you could post nasty videos on YouTube. Mail every scio you know different people's doubt formulas copied off Marty's site - there are lots of ways.

Good luck,

Mimsey

 

[exsomessenger]

Hi Exsomessenger, I was wondering why you disliked my post. I can't say I expected you to like it either. Perhaps you don't like my "That's the way it is, so accept it." point of view. I can sympathize with you because I have been cut off for several years now, but obsessing about it is stressful and unhealthy. You really have to act as if they have died. I read somewhere about this person who was leaving Int, and they gave them a box of undelivered mail that was gathering over the years. They are simply cut off by design.

What they do is cruel, but Ron decreed it that way to force you to rejoin, or get the hell out of the road. That is why they don't accept the "I won't talk about Scientology if you won't" paradigm. It is all or nothing. Sometimes life sucks. What else can one say?

I think in the book Blown for Good there is a way to force their hand, involving writing letters, and notifying the local police, Postmasters, the IRS, or some other Federal office and keep at it till the person is forced out of the Sea Org internally because they want the PTS sit to go away. But, you have to look at their point of view - do they want to leave? You could force them out and have them really hate you. Belief is a strong stumbling block to overcome.

If you really hate the situation, then I suppose you need to find a way to attack the Church, to hasten their demise. If you were in the CMO, perhaps you can use your knowledge against them - I dunno be creative. Look what Debbie Cook did with her report. Perhaps you could post nasty videos on YouTube. Mail every scio you know different people's doubt formulas copied off Marty's site - there are lots of ways.

Good luck,

Mimsey

I would say that you answered your own question in the first sentence. I guess what I do not like is your assumptions and not questions. you seem to have it all worked out and that is great for you. but making less of others plights, while it might make you feel better about your own, does nothing.

I think the communications that I have seen from you are Condescending, filled with assumptions about the people that you speak of and to. That is your right but I do not have to like it.

good luck with pretending the people that have disconnected from you are dead.

 

[Ladybird]

...good luck with pretending the people that have disconnected from you are dead.

Sometimes the people you disconnected from or who disconnected from you really are dead.

It is bad enough to not be invited or told about births, illnesses, weddings and family reunions, but some funerals you will never get over. There are many stories on line about people who were not told about or allowed to attend a loved ones funeral. I missed a few, and there are many relatives who will not ever forgive me. My husband missed his mom's funeral and many of his family do not trust him and won't talk to him because of that. Chuck Beatty wrote some posts about people having to have "baby watchers" go along to funerals which creeped everybody out.

The disconnection goes on and on, in to the next generations. Our sons, born in the Sea Org, still have issues with the way we left them alone way too much because we were busy "saving the planet". They don't have much of a relationship with the extended family, and none with those still in scientology.

I have written a lot of posts about disconnection, it happens all the time in scientology. Either it is enforced by RPF, Non-enturbulation orders, forced abortions, forced disconnection, canceling family time, cancelling leaves, sending a spouse to another org, forced divorces, forced marriages (for green cards), holding mail, reading and censoring mail, denial of access to the internet or other media, threats, etc, etc. Google any of the above and you will get hundreds of links and stories.

 

[Mick Wenlock]

Sometimes the people you disconnected from or who disconnected from you really are dead.

It is bad enough to not be invited or told about births, illnesses, weddings and family reunions, but some funerals you will never get over. There are many stories on line about people who were not told about or allowed to attend a loved ones funeral. I missed a few, and there are many relatives who will not ever forgive me. My husband missed his mom's funeral and many of his family do not trust him and won't talk to him because of that. Chuck Beatty wrote some posts about people having to have "baby watchers" go along to funerals which creeped everybody out.

The disconnection goes on and on, in to the next generations. Our sons, born in the Sea Org, still have issues with the way we left them alone way too much because we were busy "saving the planet". They don't have much of a relationship with the extended family, and none with those still in scientology.

I have written a lot of posts about disconnection, it happens all the time in scientology. Either it is enforced by RPF, Non-enturbulation orders, forced abortions, forced disconnection, canceling family time, cancelling leaves, sending a spouse to another org, forced divorces, forced marriages (for green cards), holding mail, reading and censoring mail, denial of access to the internet or other media, threats, etc, etc. Google any of the above and you will get hundreds of links and stories.

WE were never told about our grandson, have never been sent pictures - we only found out because of the interest and concern of a good friend and ex in Denmark. We got photos and videos of our grandson thanks to a newly out person who had some they had taken and were happy to send us.

Disconnection is unconscionable and is evil. Period.

 

[Free to shine]

Hi Exsomessenger, I was wondering why you disliked my post. I can't say I expected you to like it either. Perhaps you don't like my "That's the way it is, so accept it." point of view. I can sympathize with you because I have been cut off for several years now, but obsessing about it is stressful and unhealthy. You really have to act as if they have died. I read somewhere about this person who was leaving Int, and they gave them a box of undelivered mail that was gathering over the years. They are simply cut off by design.

What they do is cruel, but Ron decreed it that way to force you to rejoin, or get the hell out of the road. That is why they don't accept the "I won't talk about Scientology if you won't" paradigm. It is all or nothing. Sometimes life sucks. What else can one say?

I think in the book Blown for Good there is a way to force their hand, involving writing letters, and notifying the local police, Postmasters, the IRS, or some other Federal office and keep at it till the person is forced out of the Sea Org internally because they want the PTS sit to go away. But, you have to look at their point of view - do they want to leave? You could force them out and have them really hate you. Belief is a strong stumbling block to overcome.

If you really hate the situation, then I suppose you need to find a way to attack the Church, to hasten their demise. If you were in the CMO, perhaps you can use your knowledge against them - I dunno be creative. Look what Debbie Cook did with her report. Perhaps you could post nasty videos on YouTube. Mail every scio you know different people's doubt formulas copied off Marty's site - there are lots of ways.

Good luck,

Mimsey

This thread is not so much about getting scientologists out, it's about the effect they have on other non scientology family members and friends because they lie about why they have disconnected from you - or even that they have (in my case).

Sure you can put the family scientologist in the "they will realise one day and until then I won't worry about it" box, but in the meantime they create havoc with other extended family. That is something I can't personally ignore, as it is in my face on almost a daily basis and exsomessenger obviously has the same situation.

Yes, we need to educate others on what disconnection is and it's full effects on others, that was sort of the point of my OP, but you run into a brick wall where the scientologist has presented them with an "acceptable truth" and it seemingly shuts the door on further discussion.

As Ladybird says, it ripples on to the next generations as well and it really stinks.

 

[TheSneakster]

WE were never told about our grandson, have never been sent pictures - we only found out because of the interest and concern of a good friend and ex in Denmark. We got photos and videos of our grandson thanks to a newly out person who had some they had taken and were happy to send us.

Disconnection is unconscionable and is evil. Period.

No argument there, Mick. This makes me sad to tears.

My family was pretty much destroyed out the starting gate due to the serious mental illness of my mother. I grew up in a various foster homes and a Christian children's home due to unfortunate and unhappy circumstance.

That there are people in this world deliberately making others suffer from a destroyed family makes my blood boil.

 

[This is NOT OK !!!!]

Oops - error!

 

[Ladybird]

No argument there, Mick. This makes me sad to tears.

My family was pretty much destroyed out the starting gate due to the serious mental illness of my mother. I grew up in a various foster homes and a Christian children's home due to unfortunate and unhappy circumstance.

That there are people in this world deliberately making others suffer from a destroyed family makes my blood boil.

(((HUGS))) to Sneaks. Life is tough sometimes for everyone and I understand about unfortunate and unhappy circumstances. My mom died right after I was born and I grew up in boarding schools mostly.

I agree with you that people who deliberately destroy families and cause people to suffer especially in the name of saving the planet and "greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics" make my blood boil too!

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

Dear Exsomessinger, I am not trying to be condescending to anybody, especially on this board. I do poke fun a lot, and if people are offended, so be it. But you miss my point. What good does it do for me to sit here and every day feel all upset that the church has forced disconnection between me and family members? What does it gain? Nothing. Why should I go through life upset and stressed out by the injustice of it all?

I do not think for a minute they are actually dead, but effectively, they are. I can not communicate with them, nor they to me, and any communication about me gets censored. I am a non-entity proven by deeds done by the church "for the greatest good". So why should I upset myself? It is what it F**king is. Period. No. I am getting on with life and I sincerely hope the hell they wake up.

What do you want me to tell you? Hold your head up and send letters they will never get every day? Try and convince them of something they will not accept? Try and beat your head against a wall trying to tell non scientologists how it is when they have no reality that what you are saying is true? If you feel that is what you have to do, go for it.

I really feel for people and these stories are some of the hardest ones to read, because they fly in the face of common decency, because they are so hurtful. Because Ron Hubbard put "clearing the planet" above all else, that no other dynamic, no other part of existence trumps his purpose. And they believe it. They (and I was one) believe in the greatest cop out ever - you live forever, and thus you can't be harmed, and you have had families in earlier lives. That alone justifies ALL of their crimes against man, except they do not see them as crimes.

Sorry if I am ranting, but perhaps some day the disconnection orders will mean nothing and communication will be restored. I hope it is soon, but in the mean time, I have to get on with life and let what is done take care of itself. Sorry if it rubs some people the wrong way, but I am done with being a victim.

Mimsey

 

[exsomessenger]

Okay mim, not really sure what you are trying to accomplish here. All I did was comment on a thread that has some meaning to me.

I in no way tried to tell you what you should or should not do. Unlike yourself. rant away and do you buddy.

how ever you feel you nned to handle it is a okay with me. Of course when you make comments that the way you are handling it is the only real way to handle it could tend to rub some the wrong way. We all have to learn lifes lessons in different ways and it takes some longer then others.

again all I have gotten is your plight and how you assume that everyone else is a victim or feeling sorry for them selves. I think you are mission the point of this thread. but hey mby it is me and I'm okay with that BTW.

so good luck with doing you.

 

[shanic89]

Try and beat your head against a wall trying to tell non scientologists how it is when they have no reality that what you are saying is true?

Ah this is where something can be done! Proof of others actions can be gathered. Have a person that does not believe/understand disconnection attempt to participate in your communications with someone that has disconnected from you. Watch the utter disbelief as your communication is rebuffed when someone that does not comprehend disconnection sees it in action. Watch the horror story spread though friends and family as the witness attempts to relay their utter contempt at the practice from their first hand experiences. Then watch as the empathy for your plight grows as others come to understand your plight.

Hope springs eternal.

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

This thread is not so much about getting scientologists out, it's about the effect they have on other non scientology family members and friends because they lie about why they have disconnected from you - or even that they have (in my case).

Sure you can put the family scientologist in the "they will realize one day and until then I won't worry about it" box, but in the meantime they create havoc with other extended family. That is something I can't personally ignore, as it is in my face on almost a daily basis and exsomessenger obviously has the same situation.

I did not mean to derail your thread, and I guess to some extent I have disconnected from them much as they have disconnected from me. I get the point of the havoc, and perhaps since I do not have that much of it going on in my life, I don't have to deal with that aspect daily.

But when it does happen, it is because the church just won't let it alone. They go out of their way to enturbulate people, pull strings, make people disconnect, cut com lines. Every once in a while they go nuts because someone wants to do some bridge action, and suddenly I am the why they are PTS and so they have to pass around DA packs and Black PR me, and stir the pot till the person finishes and goes away. Then it all calms down.

What I supposed to do? I tell my side of the story when and if the occasion arises. That and hope for a better day.

Mimsey

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

Sorry if I got bent out of shape - I am not happy with the situation and I guess it shows.

Mimsey

 

[Free to shine]

Ah this is where something can be done! Proof of others actions can be gathered. Have a person that does not believe/understand disconnection attempt to participate in your communications with someone that has disconnected from you. Watch the utter disbelief as your communication is rebuffed when someone that does not comprehend disconnection sees it in action. Watch the horror story spread though friends and family as the witness attempts to relay their utter contempt at the practice from their first hand experiences. Then watch as the empathy for your plight grows as others come to understand your plight.

Hope springs eternal.

Well that was kinda the purpose of this thread.....

I have done what you suggest, however it was not enough to overcome the "acceptable truth" lie they have been fed. I STILL get "you need to communicate..."

 

[Free to shine]

I did not mean to derail your thread, and I guess to some extent I have disconnected from them much as they have disconnected from me. I get the point of the havoc, and perhaps since I do not have that much of it going on in my life, I don't have to deal with that aspect daily.

But when it does happen, it is because the church just won't let it alone. They go out of their way to enturbulate people, pull strings, make people disconnect, cut com lines. Every once in a while they go nuts because someone wants to do some bridge action, and suddenly I am the why they are PTS and so they have to pass around DA packs and Black PR me, and stir the pot till the person finishes and goes away. Then it all calms down.

What I supposed to do? I tell my side of the story when and if the occasion arises. That and hope for a better day.

Mimsey

The bolded part is so true. Disconnection sucks, in all it's forms and personally I think it is a subject that needs to be discussed as much as possible. I also know how hard this can be for those who suffer from it, but the idea is to shine the light on the insidious ways it can affect daily lives. To get the truth out there more and more - disconnection is not an isolated incident here and there!

Oh how I would love to post details... but I won't... because that would make the situation even more difficult for others affected.

 

[Illegal Alien]

www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?18180-A-DECLARE..SHATTERED-CHILDREN..DISCONNECTION

This will never go away and when ever I am able to tell this stroy I will jump at the opportunity to expose this side of scientology. Disconnection is heart renching and on the bad days I look for people to tell this story to.
I want to clarify for anybody who has heard the churchs comments on disconnection pay attention to this.
IT IS NOT A PERSONAL DECISION IT IS ENFORECED BY THE CHURCH,PERIOD.

 

[exsomessenger]

www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?18180-A-DECLARE..SHATTERED-CHILDREN..DISCONNECTION

This will never go away and when ever I am able to tell this stroy I will jump at the opportunity to expose this side of scientology. Disconnection is heart renching and on the bad days I look for people to tell this story to.
I want to clarify for anybody who has heard the churchs comments on disconnection pay attention to this.
IT IS NOT A PERSONAL DECISION IT IS ENFORECED BY THE CHURCH,PERIOD.

I remember reading this story and thanks so much for posting it again. NO it is not easy to talk about and yes it makes people mad but it is a topic that needs to stay in the forfront of this battle. I'm with you and I feel for you in a total non victim way. As I am not a victim I know that FTS and people like are not as well. This is just simple not okay and there is nothing that should make anyone stop talking about it.

It is not about wallowing is sorrow but more about not accepting this complete crime that is being forced onto the good people who really want to see the planet be a better place. There are no easy answers.

I do believe that not talking about it is the srong thing to do. Being real and honest about your emotions is right. When my extended family told me that I am welcome to be around them as long as I do not bring up the church or my family in. I told them that i could not and would not promise this as I simply could not. I did say that I do not dwell on it but I was not going to back away from it if it came up.

Look I get all the people that are quick to say good roads and weather. kill them with kindness etc. what is funny is that it is assumed that we (or at least I) have not done all of this and more. Believe me when I say I have done everything that I could think of to "do the right thing." but as FTS says when there is this acceptable truth on the lines it is hard to battle against it. When I have tried the first responce I have gotten is I do not want to know anything about scientology. Of course I tell them that the ones that are in the church are getting exactly what they want.

All I really can say is that there is no easy answer to all of this. it is not like if the ones in wake up that everything is just going to be okay as well. there are years of pain and hurt built up.

The last thing I want to say is that the reason that I am writting this is not for people to come and tell me how to love them and play nice. It is so that people see what lengths the COS will go to destroy families.

 

[Challenge]

I don't originate my status to Scios I run across. Why should I do OSA's damn job for them? If they bring it up, I don't have a problem discussing it with them, sometimes it's along the lines of a one way flow - you need to handle that. Other times, we talk. But mainly, the few I am in com with off and on, either know it and ignore it, or don't know.

What I need to work on is pulling the string and find out what was said about me. Though, I don't really want to know, but just to handle it somewhat. The last one I spoke to said she heard I was a squirrel - I wish I had my "swinish suspicion" working that day.... some fun there no doubt.

Grace Aarons site: www.religiousshunning.org

Mimsey

Mimsey, thanks for posting that link to Gracie's site.

 

[Free to shine]

I remember reading this story and thanks so much for posting it again. NO it is not easy to talk about and yes it makes people mad but it is a topic that needs to stay in the forfront of this battle. I'm with you and I feel for you in a total non victim way. As I am not a victim I know that FTS and people like are not as well. This is just simple not okay and there is nothing that should make anyone stop talking about it.

It is not about wallowing is sorrow but more about not accepting this complete crime that is being forced onto the good people who really want to see the planet be a better place. There are no easy answers.

I do believe that not talking about it is the srong thing to do. Being real and honest about your emotions is right. When my extended family told me that I am welcome to be around them as long as I do not bring up the church or my family in. I told them that i could not and would not promise this as I simply could not. I did say that I do not dwell on it but I was not going to back away from it if it came up.

Look I get all the people that are quick to say good roads and weather. kill them with kindness etc. what is funny is that it is assumed that we (or at least I) have not done all of this and more. Believe me when I say I have done everything that I could think of to "do the right thing." but as FTS says when there is this acceptable truth on the lines it is hard to battle against it. When I have tried the first responce I have gotten is I do not want to know anything about scientology. Of course I tell them that the ones that are in the church are getting exactly what they want.

All I really can say is that there is no easy answer to all of this. it is not like if the ones in wake up that everything is just going to be okay as well. there are years of pain and hurt built up.

The last thing I want to say is that the reason that I am writting this is not for people to come and tell me how to love them and play nice. It is so that people see what lengths the COS will go to destroy families.

 

[Mark A. Baker]

Mimsey, thanks for posting that link to Gracie's site.

The Aaron's are charming people who have done a great job in advocating an end to religious shunning for many years.


Mark A. Baker