Hubbard's Axioms & Logics

[Zinjifar]

NIT-WIT-GIT: that could have some serious marketing appeal.


Mark A. Baker

Nitwit Git? The true EP of the Bridge?

Zinj

 

[Vinaire]

This is an inetersting one from TROM:

We always tend to imagine a slave master as a rather muscular man armed with a large whip. Such a man is not even a novice at the gentle art of making slaves, for all the very best slaves are voluntary slaves and would not give up their slavery for anything. They are convinced that they are on the ‘road to freedom’, and need no whips to keep them on it.

Who is the slave master in Scientology?

Who is slave master in Christianity?

Who is the slave master on ESMB? (For those of us who are addicted to it)

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[Vinaire]

When it's compulsive it isn't play.


Mark A. Baker

True. Then it is blame, ridicule, guilt and shame.

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[Mark A. Baker]

Nitwit Git? The true EP of the Bridge?

Zinj

Nope. Neologism for christian. The side topic was biblical translation.

Nice try at attempting to bring the chat back on to the thread topic, though.


Mark A. Baker

 

[nw2394]

Any postulate limits one to the dimensions of that postulate.

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Nah - that takes interiorising into the thing one has postulated - or at the very least forgetting it that it was you that postulated it

Nick

 

[fnx3]

This is an inetersting one from TROM:



Who is the slave master in Scientology?

Who is slave master in Christianity?

Who is the slave master on ESMB? (For those of us who are addicted to it)

.

You know I can't help wondering why you don't join the TROM list with all these questions/insights you are having Vinaire :confused2: - you would get a very interesting discussion going.

 

[fnx3]

Nah - that takes interiorising into the thing one has postulated - or at the very least forgetting it that it was you that postulated it

Nick

Mmm ... I've got a bit of a feeling that that is exactly the problem with postulates

 

[Mark A. Baker]

Mmm ... I've got a bit of a feeling that that is exactly the problem with postulates

Technically its not a problem with postulates themselves but with confusions which may be associated with postulates. As long as there are no confusions the postulates are not problematic.


Mark A. Baker

 

[Vinaire]

Technically its not a problem with postulates themselves but with confusions which may be associated with postulates. As long as there are no confusions the postulates are not problematic.


Mark A. Baker

While a person is holding a postulate he is limited by it.

But if he is not fixated on that postulate then he can change it and free himself from its limitation.

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[Vinaire]

You know I can't help wondering why you don't join the TROM list with all these questions/insights you are having Vinaire :confused2: - you would get a very interesting discussion going.

I haven't yet read TROM completely even once. I have to read it thoroughly at least twice before I'll be ready to discuss it. Most of my questions are rhetorical, or, at the most, those questions are to myself.

I am not ready to join the TROM list yet.

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[fnx3]

I haven't yet read TROM completely even once. I have to read it thoroughly at least twice before I'll be ready to discuss it. Most of my questions are rhetorical, or, at the most, those questions are to myself.

I am not ready to join the TROM list yet.

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Well, that's just what it was set up to do - assist people as they get into TROM & have questions coming up as a result of even just reading it, not necessarily actually "doing" it.

Have you found this site yet - The Resolution of Mind

 

[fnx3]

... Most of my questions are rhetorical, or, at the most, those questions are to myself...

This statement of yours caught my attention - so you use the thread as a sort of public "blog" place?

OK - looking at this from a TROM point of view (which is a very efficient way of working out how TROM works - taking examples from every day events) - you would, according to the "Postulate Failure Cycle Chart Regarding an Effect", be originating a Self Determined (SD) Postulate of "Must Be Known" with the goal of causing a Pan Determined (PD) postulate of "Must Know" at receipt by Others - which results in creation of an Overt by Overwhelm of "forcing to know".

Of course, it doesn't seem like such a dramatic thing is taking place but it is on a micro level, the effect of such being no less diminished by viewpoint.

I think someone pointed out the effect of this "blogging" of yours a few days ago on this thread. Oh yes, here:

Vinaire, you post a lot of messages in ratio to the number of replies. And most of your messages generate a sprawling confusion as you jump from question to question, invoking as many concepts as possible without actually supplying an intelligent conclusion.

I post this because I value the idea of a discussion of the axioms but you cluttered yours up with so much meandering that I feel overwhelmed and angry for being suckered into reading it.

(It took me quite a deal of clarification before I could drop the Scientological meaning of "pan determined" & adopt the TROM meaning which is, a postulate which seeks to alter to yr own in others.)

 

[Vinaire]

Well, that's just what it was set up to do - assist people as they get into TROM & have questions coming up as a result of even just reading it, not necessarily actually "doing" it.

Have you found this site yet - The Resolution of Mind

Thank you for providing this site. I am studying the Beginner's Guide. It is making things simple for me by explaining those formulas with examples.

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[Vinaire]

This statement of yours caught my attention - so you use the thread as a sort of public "blog" place?

OK - looking at this from a TROM point of view (which is a very efficient way of working out how TROM works - taking examples from every day events) - you would, according to the "Postulate Failure Cycle Chart Regarding an Effect", be originating a Self Determined (SD) Postulate of "Must Be Known" with the goal of causing a Pan Determined (PD) postulate of "Must Know" at receipt by Others - which results in creation of an Overt by Overwhelm of "forcing to know".

Of course, it doesn't seem like such a dramatic thing is taking place but it is on a micro level, the effect of such being no less diminished by viewpoint.

I think someone pointed out the effect of this "blogging" of yours a few days ago on this thread. Oh yes, here:


(It took me quite a deal of clarification before I could drop the Scientological meaning of "pan determined" & adopt the TROM meaning which is, a postulate which seeks to alter to yr own in others.)

Yes, you can say that. But I can't see how that is an effort on my part to overwhelm others.

Maybe those who are very unstable may feel overwhelmed, I admit.

How would you rate Christian missionaries in this respect?

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[Vinaire]

TROM does seem to provide a datum of comparable magnitude to evaluate Hubbard's Axioms and Logics.

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[Leon]

Nah - that takes interiorising into the thing one has postulated - or at the very least forgetting it that it was you that postulated it

Nick

You're only likely to interiorise into them if/when you begin to assert that your postulates are important - and hence, you solidify them.

 

[Leon]

This statement of yours caught my attention - so you use the thread as a sort of public "blog" place?

OK - looking at this from a TROM point of view (which is a very efficient way of working out how TROM works - taking examples from every day events) - you would, according to the "Postulate Failure Cycle Chart Regarding an Effect", be originating a Self Determined (SD) Postulate of "Must Be Known" with the goal of causing a Pan Determined (PD) postulate of "Must Know" at receipt by Others - which results in creation of an Overt by Overwhelm of "forcing to know".

That's a bit of an enforced knowing on your part, fnx3. How about Vinaire is just on a "How can I get to know this better?" postulate. There is really a close harmony between TROM making something known and people willing to to know it - a bit of cogitating on the way, allowing new ideas to settle in, helps a lot.

 

[Mark A. Baker]

While a person is holding a postulate he is limited by it.

That is the point of a postulate.

But if he is not fixated on that postulate then he can change it and free himself from its limitation.

Ergo, no problem.

QED


Mark A. Baker

 

[Leon]

One of the things I like about TROM is that the concepts of make known, Know, Make not known, and Not know embrace all of the Scio concepts of As-is, alter-is, is-ness and not is-ness as well as the entire set of ARCU concepts all in one. Where Scio has them as seperate and somewhat disrelated, TROM has unified the concept structure.

 

[fnx3]

That's a bit of an enforced knowing on your part, fnx3. How about Vinaire is just on a "How can I get to know this better?" postulate...

Yes, so it was & thanks for setting it out like that Leon as I hadn't quite been able to put my finger on it, the "enforced" part - yep, feels a bit uncomfortable being an "enforcer"

However, my observation was pertaining to Vinaire's use of the thread not his getting to know TROM better.