How the horror started in munich org 1983

[darksing]

I think it would be interesting to know how the bad times started. I have not a very good recall of it as it is a bit charged (understatement) but lets say it has been mid 83.
We had been called in to a mandatory staff meeting. We did not know why but followed that order. In front of us had been a CMO Int missionair and another women sayed to be the new CO CLO EU. As first action we had been told by CMO Int Mssnr that anybody who says something is declared SP on the spot. As a staff did not understand english too well she rose her arm and the CMO Int Mssnr instantly shoutet „out you are declared“. We could convince the lady that she did not want to backfire on her but that she did not understand her. Thus she had been undeclared instantly. Then we got the r-fac that our CO had been sent to RPF in Copenhagen and been replaced with a new one. The rest of the r-facs I do not remember. I think it anyway was not of any importance. The usual that we are in a state of emergency and blabla. The difference to a Sea Org is, that in a Class 4 org you listen but thats it. We are not dependend on Scn in any way. As we did not get good pay we had to work outside for making a living and anything they could do had been shouting. Did not affect our living too much.
This CO Int mssnr after that meeting did the first gangbang sec checks on staff and tought the EO and others how to deliver it. Then the gang bang sec checks started in munich. I call it Gestapo Sec Checks as it fits better. (I know from past life what the Gestapo could do. The only difference is body pain. But the rest is quite similar.)
Basically all the staff had been sec checked that way. I know only of me that did not get one. Never. I only got a Roll Back in Copenhagen in 84 but only with a single roll backer. As I had been Cl 5 I knew how to handle nuts people. Thus this had not much impact on me.
Then the usual way to sell auditing had been that the regges had a meeting with the C/S and he gave the regges info on PCs that have to go to ethics. Ethics found out by gestapo sec check, that the pc is disaffected and he has to buy at least one intensive of sec cheking. If he did not want that he had been declared or else put into heavier ethics trouble.
By the way: using pc data from session was the usual those days. If a pc had done a bad act and did say this in session then he had been blackmailed with that knowledge. Thus he had no chance to buy another intensive. I know only of one of that incidents in detail but I guess that this was common practice. And by the way, those that did that had a very miserable life after that and still have. That actions backfired on them just some month later.
Doing this procedure week by week munich org lost around 1500 from 2000 active publics. And staff went down from way over 200 fulltimers to less than 100. That was 1983.

My conclusions:
The ,you call it gang bang sec check, had been an invention from CMO Int. Ask Marc Yager as soon as he can speak again how and why this had been developed. By my opinion this kind of sec check restimulates some whole track incident. (not the nazi stuff but much earlier on the track) I could see big ridges floating around the office when such sec check had been given. Later I tried to audit that out but could not find the „basic basic“ of it. Guess it is some real (not implanted) GPM or part of it.

In case anybody has additional information on that I would like to get in comm. I think, no matter what happens the next months to corporate Scn we have to destimulate this area anyway. As this kind of procedure of how to handle staff and public as still the same as introduced in 83 I think nothing could be done so far to destimulate that incident that is behind the situation.

 

[Markus]

Well this is very interesting

I think it would be interesting to know how the bad times started. I have not a very good recall of it as it is a bit charged (understatement) but lets say it has been mid 83.
We had been called in to a mandatory staff meeting. We did not know why but followed that order. In front of us had been a CMO Int missionair and another women sayed to be the new CO CLO EU. As first action we had been told by CMO Int Mssnr that anybody who says something is declared SP on the spot. As a staff did not understand english too well she rose her arm and the CMO Int Mssnr instantly shoutet „out you are declared“. We could convince the lady that she did not want to backfire on her but that she did not understand her. Thus she had been undeclared instantly. Then we got the r-fac that our CO had been sent to RPF in Copenhagen and been replaced with a new one. The rest of the r-facs I do not remember. I think it anyway was not of any importance. The usual that we are in a state of emergency and blabla. The difference to a Sea Org is, that in a Class 4 org you listen but thats it. We are not dependend on Scn in any way. As we did not get good pay we had to work outside for making a living and anything they could do had been shouting. Did not affect our living too much.
This CO Int mssnr after that meeting did the first gangbang sec checks on staff and tought the EO and others how to deliver it. Then the gang bang sec checks started in munich. I call it Gestapo Sec Checks as it fits better. (I know from past life what the Gestapo could do. The only difference is body pain. But the rest is quite similar.)
Basically all the staff had been sec checked that way. I know only of me that did not get one. Never. I only got a Roll Back in Copenhagen in 84 but only with a single roll backer. As I had been Cl 5 I knew how to handle nuts people. Thus this had not much impact on me.
Then the usual way to sell auditing had been that the regges had a meeting with the C/S and he gave the regges info on PCs that have to go to ethics. Ethics found out by gestapo sec check, that the pc is disaffected and he has to buy at least one intensive of sec cheking. If he did not want that he had been declared or else put into heavier ethics trouble.
By the way: using pc data from session was the usual those days. If a pc had done a bad act and did say this in session then he had been blackmailed with that knowledge. Thus he had no chance to buy another intensive. I know only of one of that incidents in detail but I guess that this was common practice. And by the way, those that did that had a very miserable life after that and still have. That actions backfired on them just some month later.
Doing this procedure week by week munich org lost around 1500 from 2000 active publics. And staff went down from way over 200 fulltimers to less than 100. That was 1983.

My conclusions:
The ,you call it gang bang sec check, had been an invention from CMO Int. Ask Marc Yager as soon as he can speak again how and why this had been developed. By my opinion this kind of sec check restimulates some whole track incident. (not the nazi stuff but much earlier on the track) I could see big ridges floating around the office when such sec check had been given. Later I tried to audit that out but could not find the „basic basic“ of it. Guess it is some real (not implanted) GPM or part of it.

In case anybody has additional information on that I would like to get in comm. I think, no matter what happens the next months to corporate Scn we have to destimulate this area anyway. As this kind of procedure of how to handle staff and public as still the same as introduced in 83 I think nothing could be done so far to destimulate that incident that is behind the situation.

First of all nice to meet you here Darksing. May you please tell us more about this. Am Igetting it right that you believe the Sea Org Mission is responsible for the attacks that are happening right now? So you want to say that before that Scientology staff members in Germany did a great job and everybody was happy in Scientology Germany?

What do you think - who was responsible for this change? Who was the abuser who started this?

Best wishes
Markus

 

[darksing]

Hi,
not all has been that well before 83. But this is not the point right now.
I have only a limited view of the whole situation. Limited to munich area.
By my observation (limited as I noted above) the real bad things started with the introduction of the gang bang sec checks. And the introducer I saw had been a CMO Int mssnr. The people above that single person I do not see. Thus I need insider info on that.
My further opinion based on my limited observation is, that the whole story has a "mental" aspect behind it. My purpose at least for myself is to erase the charge behind it. If I could erase some 3rd D engram fine. But my case comes first so to speak. Thus I want to concentrate on that behind mental things and not on the who did what.
By my opinion we cannot continue up the bridge if we cannot handle the current situation. And in order to handle the current sit we have to find the exact time, place form event aso. For my track it started in 83 and is still going on, thus not handled.
To state again: the who did what is not very important. Has to be added to get the point communicated. I want that stuff handled and not endlessly talked about. At least for myself. As I had been contacting the charge behind it in 84 I almost dropped my body. My body could not stand that much charge. Now I think as I am much older it does not matter so much if I drop my body and thus I may have another try. But without additional info of what I could not confront I cannot go anywhere.
Thus my Q if there is anybody out there that knows more.

 

[Markus]

Please read my PM

Hi,
not all has been that well before 83. But this is not the point right now.
I have only a limited view of the whole situation. Limited to munich area.
By my observation (limited as I noted above) the real bad things started with the introduction of the gang bang sec checks. And the introducer I saw had been a CMO Int mssnr. The people above that single person I do not see. Thus I need insider info on that.
My further opinion based on my limited observation is, that the whole story has a "mental" aspect behind it. My purpose at least for myself is to erase the charge behind it. If I could erase some 3rd D engram fine. But my case comes first so to speak. Thus I want to concentrate on that behind mental things and not on the who did what.
By my opinion we cannot continue up the bridge if we cannot handle the current situation. And in order to handle the current sit we have to find the exact time, place form event aso. For my track it started in 83 and is still going on, thus not handled.
To state again: the who did what is not very important. Has to be added to get the point communicated. I want that stuff handled and not endlessly talked about. At least for myself. As I had been contacting the charge behind it in 84 I almost dropped my body. My body could not stand that much charge. Now I think as I am much older it does not matter so much if I drop my body and thus I may have another try. But without additional info of what I could not confront I cannot go anywhere.
Thus my Q if there is anybody out there that knows more.

Hallo Darksing ich habe Dir eine persönliche Nachricht geschickt. Ich bin auch gerne bereit Dir zu helfen wo immer ich kann.

Ganz liebe Grüße
Markus

 

[Terril park]

Hi,
not all has been that well before 83. But this is not the point right now.
I have only a limited view of the whole situation. Limited to munich area.
By my observation (limited as I noted above) the real bad things started with the introduction of the gang bang sec checks. And the introducer I saw had been a CMO Int mssnr. The people above that single person I do not see. Thus I need insider info on that.
My further opinion based on my limited observation is, that the whole story has a "mental" aspect behind it. My purpose at least for myself is to erase the charge behind it. If I could erase some 3rd D engram fine. But my case comes first so to speak. Thus I want to concentrate on that behind mental things and not on the who did what.
By my opinion we cannot continue up the bridge if we cannot handle the current situation. And in order to handle the current sit we have to find the exact time, place form event aso. For my track it started in 83 and is still going on, thus not handled.
To state again: the who did what is not very important. Has to be added to get the point communicated. I want that stuff handled and not endlessly talked about. At least for myself. As I had been contacting the charge behind it in 84 I almost dropped my body. My body could not stand that much charge. Now I think as I am much older it does not matter so much if I drop my body and thus I may have another try. But without additional info of what I could not confront I cannot go anywhere.
Thus my Q if there is anybody out there that knows more.

You might try contacting Rons Orgs Munich. One friend of mine connected to them worked with the very top execs before she left.

 

[Enthetan]

Hi,
not all has been that well before 83. But this is not the point right now.
I have only a limited view of the whole situation. Limited to munich area.
By my observation (limited as I noted above) the real bad things started with the introduction of the gang bang sec checks. And the introducer I saw had been a CMO Int mssnr. The people above that single person I do not see. Thus I need insider info on that.
My further opinion based on my limited observation is, that the whole story has a "mental" aspect behind it. My purpose at least for myself is to erase the charge behind it. If I could erase some 3rd D engram fine. But my case comes first so to speak. Thus I want to concentrate on that behind mental things and not on the who did what.
By my opinion we cannot continue up the bridge if we cannot handle the current situation. And in order to handle the current sit we have to find the exact time, place form event aso. For my track it started in 83 and is still going on, thus not handled.
To state again: the who did what is not very important. Has to be added to get the point communicated. I want that stuff handled and not endlessly talked about. At least for myself. As I had been contacting the charge behind it in 84 I almost dropped my body. My body could not stand that much charge. Now I think as I am much older it does not matter so much if I drop my body and thus I may have another try. But without additional info of what I could not confront I cannot go anywhere.
Thus my Q if there is anybody out there that knows more.

This was not just in Germany. It was also happening in EUS around that time (1983 or so) as well. The person running it in FOLO EUS at the time was the D/CO Suzanne Beals, and she was doing it to public as well.

One incident I remember was that there was a company owned by three public Scientologists which employed a bunch of other Scientologists. One of the partners had been found out by the org to have been in an out-ethics situation, and had been pressured to have the company buy an IAS patronship ($50K or so) as his "amends project". His other two partners, when they found out, balked saying the company didn't have the funds, and canceled the donation. Suzanne had a bunch of SO members show up in the company office and did gang-bang sec checks on all of them.

This, coupled with other incidents including the Don Larson mission which RogerB tangled with later on, leads me to think that there was a coordinated effort by DM to weed out anybody in Scientology who objected to the exercise of his arbitrary power.

 

[darksing]

This was not just in Germany. It was also happening in EUS around that time (1983 or so) as well. The person running it in FOLO EUS at the time was the D/CO Suzanne Beals, and she was doing it to public as well.

One incident I remember was that there was a company owned by three public Scientologists which employed a bunch of other Scientologists. One of the partners had been found out by the org to have been in an out-ethics situation, and had been pressured to have the company buy an IAS patronship ($50K or so) as his "amends project". His other two partners, when they found out, balked saying the company didn't have the funds, and canceled the donation. Suzanne had a bunch of SO members show up in the company office and did gang-bang sec checks on all of them.

This, coupled with other incidents including the Don Larson mission which RogerB tangled with later on, leads me to think that there was a coordinated effort by DM to weed out anybody in Scientology who objected to the exercise of his arbitrary power.

Thanks for this information. Very helpfull indeed.
It is clear now that this action had been not an accidential incident but a well planned operation.
My opinion back in 1984 had been that the goal for this operation had been to finally close scn due to weaken it from the inside and then with a good outside push finalizing the job.
I had been made wrong due to the fact that scn is still there and "operating". But recent information in sight makes me think, that scn in fact no longer exists.
Why? Can you achieve the product? No way. No way to go OT.
Thus in actual fact Scn is already closed down.
The corporate structure still exists but this structure gets out no product at all. And they themself pave the way that after legally closing down the corporate structure itself everybody would be happy. Back in 1984 this action would have triggered much protest. But now with all the data of internal beatings from top and all that stuff that can be seen on CNN it is save to close Scn in the near future.

 

[Enthetan]

My opinion back in 1984 had been that the goal for this operation had been to finally close scn due to weaken it from the inside and then with a good outside push finalizing the job.

I'm thinking that DM would like to run off with the assets of Scn, and retire someplace. The problem is, he can't run off with the POWER. I think he likes being able to beat up people and have them cringe from his power and domination of them. He can't stand to give all that up.

 

[Blue Spirit]

This, coupled with other incidents including the Don Larson mission which RogerB tangled with later on, leads me to think that there was a coordinated effort by DM to weed out anybody in Scientology who objected to the exercise of his arbitrary power.

Pretty obvious now is it not ?

 

[Blue Spirit]

LRH Predicted This

Thanks for this information. Very helpfull indeed.
It is clear now that this action had been not an accidental incident but a well planned operation.
My opinion back in 1984 had been that the goal for this operation had been to finally close scn due to weaken it from the inside and then with a good outside push finalizing the job.
I had been made wrong due to the fact that scn is still there and "operating". But recent information in sight makes me think, that scn in fact no longer exists.
Why? Can you achieve the product? No way. No way to go OT.
Thus in actual fact Scn is already closed down.
The corporate structure still exists but this structure gets out no product at all. And they themself pave the way that after legally closing down the corporate structure itself everybody would be happy. Back in 1984 this action would have triggered much protest. But now with all the data of internal beatings from top and all that stuff that can be seen on CNN it is save to close Scn in the near future.

CORRECT.

See my signature line in red below.

Also check out:
http://www.sc-i-r-s-ology.pair.com/founder.html
(read the left menu = 5 items

for later extensions of the insanity.

 

[Telepathetic]

Welcome Darksing,

A very similar event took place in our Org. and as far as I know it occured globally. That's where I met that crazy mother f'ing Larson. What a crazy time that was

Anyway, glade you are here now.

TP

 

[AnonKat]

If you want it clear cut find anything by Jesse Prince or David Mayo

Former RTC Inspector General Jesse Prince discusses the death of L. Ron Hubbard

Jesse Prince is one of the highest ranking former officers of the Church of Scientology to have to courage to come forward and tell his story. In this post, he discusses the tension between current CoS head David Miscavige and his then-rival to the throne, Pat Broeker, in the months preceding Hubbard's death.
In the weeks since he first came forward with his story, Jesse Prince has been travelling around the country to meet with many CoS opponents, and, in some cases, filing affidavits on their behalf. For these actions, he has been targeted as 'fair game' for the CoS, which has put both him and his friends and supporters under extreme pressure from the Office of Special Affairs (OSA), the church's investigation unit, also known as 'Scientology's Secret Service.' He has nonetheless made several posts to alt.religion.scientology, including that from which this excerpt has been taken.

Click here to read the entire post in its original format.

From a post by Jesse Prince (September 5, 1998):

[ ... ]

Now let"s go back in time to an afternoon in the late summer of 1984. I am sitting in one of many legal/litigation meetings at Author Services, Inc., or ASI. I am in RTC, a nonprofit religious corporation which ostensibly has absolutely nothing to do wth ASI, a for-profit corporation. But David Miscavige finds it convenient at the moment to be the Chairman of the Board of ASI, and, since David Miscavige runs Scientology (no matter where he places himself corporately), he can order all of us to meet wherever and whenever he wants us to.

The subject of this particular meeting concerns the LRH probate case in Riverside, California, and, as always, more corporate "sort-out." Lawyers have advised that there is still too much evidence to prove that LRH is incompetent to manage his own affairs. This is crucial, since the case has been brought by LRH"s son Nibbs, who has claimed that LRH is incompetent to manage his own affairs and that his estate is being stolen by the Church of Scientology under David Miscavige's leadership. Nibbs is hoping to take over LRH's assets if he can prove that LRH is incompetent. So this is a very serious threat.

LRH has repeatedly said he wants different lawyers to represent him, and that he wants different legal advice on how to win this case against Nibbs. But DM has decided that the lawyers LRH already has (and who were chosen, of course, by DM) are the best possible legal counsel. LRH specifically doesn"t like the fact that these attorneys are advising him to back away from managing Scientology"s affairs. Part of the reason for this is that DM feels (and has told the attorneys) that LRH is losing his grip on reality.

In truth, DM was not the only one who knew that LRH was an old man past his prime, with no real "new ideas" or "brilliant revelations" for quite some time. All he could do was say the same thing, over and over: "There are more BTs! Many more than people realize!" Hubbard really was a bit senile at the end there - his brain pretty well fried by a wide range of drugs which he used for his "research" -- and this scared the hell out of his top messengers and others near him.

For many years, LRH's top aide, Pat Broeker, and his wife, Annie Broeker, looked after the daily care of LRH. Pat was the financial conduit between LRH and the vast reserves of liquid cash mounting in the multiple corporations of Scientology which LRH always had at his disposal. David Miscavige would be called by Pat to bring hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars in cash in briefcases to cover "basic expenses" for LRH and his small crew of four staff. Often the prearranged meeting place was near Las Vegas. On many of these occasions, Pat and Dave would go to a casino and gamble away thousands of dollars of LRH's money, just hanging out having a good time together.

But as LRH felt his grasp on the Scientology empire weakening, he became extremely suspicious of Dave and ordered me to give him a security check to see if Dave was trying to prevent LRH from having his way with the church as he was used to having. Basically, LRH was upset that he could not simply romp from one fake corporation to another, wreaking havoc in his wake, as he had always done. And he was being advised by attorneys whom Dave had hired that in order to protect his money, he should disappear for a while. All of these circumstances added up for LRH, and he was not at all sure he could trust DM. He was afraid DM was trying to take over. Sure, he had practically raised Dave from a pup, but still, who could be trusted in this business?

So I was ordered to sec check DM to determine his real motives for passing along legal advice that he back off from his own church. When I walked into Dave"s office he was crying like a child who had taken a crap in his pants and now stank to high heaven. Dave swore up and down to me that he was only following LRH"s own orders to get an "All Clear" -- meaning to get LRH dismissed from all the outstanding litigation -- so that LRH could travel freely again, without fear of subpoenas or worse.

LRH had been in hiding, not only from the public but also from 95 percent of all his staff, for the last fifteen to twenty years anyway. Dave was extremely indignant at being asked such incriminating questions, but because of the questions I was asking him, he was fairly certain that LRH would soon assign him to the RPF (the Rehabilitation Project Force, Scientology"s political prison).

In the security check Dave made sure he told me about the trips to the casinoes, the heavy drinking and the women he and Pat had enjoyed together. Dave freely confessed his sins and Pat Broeker"s sins as well. He said if he was going to go down, he was going to make sure Pat Broeker went down as well. He was very critical of Pat, saying he had a long history of alcohol abuse and recklessly spending LRH's money. Of course, the person who received the report of Dave"s sec check was Pat Broeker. So it didn"t surprise me a bit when Dave and Pat suddenly became best buddies again. I seriously doubt that anything but reports full of glowing praise for Dave ever went to LRH. In retrospect I realize both Pat Broeker and David Miscavige had an interest in keeping the status quo with LRH, since both of them had dreams of one day being the new dictator of Scientology once the current Ding Dong king was dead.

LRH went on spending his millions freely on property and "research" (all this really meant was that he was buying more and more drugs for himself) and buying exotic animals like buffalo, llamas, swans and peacocks at the ranch at Creston.

LRH seemed resigned to follow the legal advice of Dave"s lawyers and stayed away from Scientology. However, he made it known that he was still very salty about the whole deal and refused to make contact as he had done in the past.

About a year and a half later he became very ill.

- From a post by Jesse Prince ([email protected])

Back to the Mysterious Death of L. Ron Hubbard

http://home.earthlink.net/~snefru/deathoflrh/prince-death.html

 

[La La Lou Lou]

AnonKat, very interesting, to find out what was really happening. But the OP was talking about 83 in Munich, any data on that period?

 

[Balthasar]

Doing this procedure week by week munich org lost around 1500 from 2000 active publics. And staff went down from way over 200 fulltimers to less than 100. That was 1983.

Welcome darksing!

The Munich Org used to be huge and busy (at the old location Lindwurmstrasse) when I was there doing my first Scn Course.

A couple of years ago I went into the new Munich Org when I once again dropped by (I am not anymore much in this area though).

Anyway, I needed a book so I went into the Org in the morning.
Also I wanted to see what's going on in the new place.

The first thing I noticed was that very few people were comming into the building.
Maybe 5 or 6 or such number, not much more all together.

Maybe they were all late and still sleeping?
Was I one of the few who could make it so early at 10:00 am?
Who the heck would know?

It was nothing like the old times where there were much more people doing TR 0 on the Comm Course alone at any such hour, than there were people entering the entire building, me included!

I demanded then to see the course room but the person I chatted with informed me that there would be currently renovation work going on.
Didn't look much activity going on, with or without renovation.
But the woman tried to disperse my worries if there would be enough students to twin on the academy levels if I wanted to do so.

But I only wanted my book, so I left quickly this sad place and went for a coffee and ordered also one of these beautiful sweet "plum pizzas" (Zwetschgendadschi) with an extra portion of whipped cream!
Guten Appetit!