Freewinds Asbestosboat's future victims?

[programmer_guy]

DM is not cleaning "asbestos" anything, but he does visit the ship. So... just thinking out loud. I have a few friends who went to Freewinds. They seem to be fine, so far. Not exposed or it takes some years to kick in? Anyone?

Apparently, getting cancer from asbestos requires the inhalation of the fibers over a long period of time. So, short time exposure does not cause cancer.

A short visit, by public, won't be a problem BUT a long time staffer, there, might develop cancer.

 

[Stat]

Apparently, getting cancer from asbestos requires the inhalation of the fibers over a long period of time. So, short time exposure does not cause cancer.

A short visit, by public, won't be a problem BUT a long time staffer, there, might develop cancer.

Good info, Prog. Thank you.

 

[Nicole]

Thank you, German brother.

May be I will info them, I just need enough dox first re: the ship.

And how does DM is oblivious to all the above in his visiting Freewinds?

Safe enough at this point? Too psychotic to care? Not aware?

I hope you see where I am coming from.

I am a sister

I understand you. I have the example from my father in law and I see a big risk for Freewinds visitors even DM. DM is ill in his mind, he is megalomaniac. Who knows what he think and I don't want to know what he thinks.

Apparently, getting cancer from asbestos requires the inhalation of the fibers over a long period of time. So, short time exposure does not cause cancer.

A short visit, by public, won't be a problem BUT a long time staffer might develop cancer.

I have other informations. It exists people, they had only ones contact with Asbestos and they got cancer. It is different from person to person and the "form" of the asbestos

But the longer the contact the higher the risk.

 

[AnonKat]

Blue Asbetsos Freewinds

I remember reading that more than just the tiles contained asbestos on the ship, right?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1812597877036181124#

 

[AnonKat]

lung cancer

Apparently, getting cancer from asbestos requires the inhalation of the fibers over a long period of time. So, short time exposure does not cause cancer.

A short visit, by public, won't be a problem BUT a long time staffer, there, might develop cancer.

Actually even inhaling a little bit could (but might not) cause lungcancer in the long run. Because the Asbestosfibers hook themselves into lining of the lungs

 

[Stat]

I am a sister

I understand you. I have the example from my father in law and I see a big risk for Freewinds visitors even DM. DM is ill in his mind, he is megalomaniac. Who knows what he think and I don't want to know what he thinks.


I have other informations. It exists people, they had only ones contact with Asbestos and they got cancer. It is different from person to person and the "form" of the asbestos

But the longer the contact the higher the risk.

Thank you, German sister. I stay corrected.
And I get your point.

 

[programmer_guy]

I am a sister

I understand you. I have the example from my father in law and I see a big risk for Freewinds visitors even DM. DM is ill in his mind, he is megalomaniac. Who knows what he think and I don't want to know what he thinks.


I have other informations. It exists people, they had only ones contact with Asbestos and they got cancer. It is different from person to person and the "form" of the asbestos

But the longer the contact the higher the risk.

Very interesting.
Here is one source of info:


http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/asbestos

5. What factors affect the risk of developing an asbestos-related disease?

Several factors can help to determine how asbestos exposure affects an individual, including (2, 6):

* Dose (how much asbestos an individual was exposed to).
* Duration (how long an individual was exposed).
* Size, shape, and chemical makeup of the asbestos fibers.
* Source of the exposure.
* Individual risk factors, such as smoking and pre-existing lung disease.

Although all forms of asbestos are considered hazardous, different types of asbestos fibers may be associated with different health risks. For example, the results of several studies suggest that amphibole forms of asbestos may be more harmful than chrysotile, particularly for mesothelioma risk, because they tend to stay in the lungs for a longer period of time (1, 2).

It seems that there are a lot of variables, here.
But it still seems to me that it requires more than a short term exposure.

 

[Dulloldfart]

Excerpts from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesothelioma:

Mesothelioma, more precisely malignant mesothelioma, is a rare form of cancer that develops from the protective lining that covers many of the body's internal organs, the mesothelium. It is usually caused by exposure to asbestos.​

And further down the page:

Symptoms or signs of mesothelioma may not appear until 20 to 50 years (or more) after exposure to asbestos.​

Paul

 

[programmer_guy]

Excerpts from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesothelioma:

Mesothelioma, more precisely malignant mesothelioma, is a rare form of cancer that develops from the protective lining that covers many of the body's internal organs, the mesothelium. It is usually caused by exposure to asbestos.​

And further down the page:

Symptoms or signs of mesothelioma may not appear until 20 to 50 years (or more) after exposure to asbestos.​

Paul

Hmm... 1 to 3 months of exposure, as said in that article, could be enough in some cases.
Is that the usual sensitivity in most individuals?

 

[Nicole]

Very interesting.
Here is one source of info:


http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/asbestos



It seems that there are a lot of variables, here.
But it still seems to me that it requires more than a short term exposure.

Yes, there are lots of variables. I read it too. BUT the DOSE can be with one visit very high. We don't know how much Asbestos is there in the air. It must get proofed. Doesn't exist public health authority that can view the Freewinds. They can control the air and the material. Other is speculation.

BUT I wouldn't go on this ship.

 

[programmer_guy]

sauerlaenderin,

Yeah, we are doing a lot of speculating.
Still trying to read various sources of info on this subject.

Some people may be more sensitive to this substance than others. :confused2:

It still seems to me that for most people, it requires prolonged exposure. But I am willing to be corrected.

 

[Stat]

Yes, there are lots of variables. I read it too. BUT the DOSE can be with one visit very high. We don't know how much Asbestos is there in the air. It must get proofed. Doesn't exist public health authority that can view the Freewinds. They can control the air and the material. Other is speculation.

BUT I wouldn't go on this ship.

One thing I know for sure.

 

[AnonKat]

sauerlaenderin,

Yeah, we are doing a lot of speculating.
Still trying to read various sources of info on this subject.

Some people may be more sensitive to this substance than others. :confused2:

It still seems to me that for most people, it requires prolonged exposure. But I am willing to be corrected.

Watch and learn

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1812597877036181124#

Also

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asbestos

Amosite and crocidolite are the most hazardous of the asbestos minerals because of their long persistence in the lungs of exposed people. Tremolite often contaminates chrysotile asbestos, thus creating an additional hazard. Chrysotile asbestos, like all other forms of asbestos, has produced tumors in animals. Mesotheliomas have been observed in people who were occupationally exposed to chrysotile, family members of the occupationally exposed, and residents who lived close to asbestos factories and mines.[24]

Asbestos exposure becomes a health concern when high concentrations of asbestos fibers are inhaled over a long time period.[25] People who become ill from inhaling asbestos are often those who are exposed on a day-to-day basis in a job where they worked directly with the material. As a person's exposure to fibers increases, because of being exposed to higher concentrations of fibers and/or by being exposed for a longer time, then that person's risk of disease also increases. Disease is very unlikely to result from a single, high-level exposure, or from a short period of exposure to lower levels.[25

 

[programmer_guy]

This one may be better (the other takes too long to load)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RtpOVDtN-k

 

[Nicole]

sauerlaenderin,

Yeah, we are doing a lot of speculating.
Still trying to read various sources of info on this subject.

I am reading too, maybe we find answers.

Some people may be more sensitive to this substance than others. :confused2:

Yes, I found the same. It exists people they are having the Asbestos in the body, but they won't get ill and other get ill.

It still seems to me that for most people, it requires prolonged exposure. But I am willing to be corrected.

Here I see it different, if you are going in a room that is full with little parts of Asbestos and you take a deep breath, than you might have the same Asbestos in your lung, than a person that works three month in a room with less Asbestos. The cancer comes from the little Asbestos particles in your lung. The body can't make it away..... The end result is a tumor. The more Asbestos is in the lung, the higher is the risk.

You understand what I mean.


SL

 

[Bullwinkle]

According to the asbestos abatement training I underwent in preparation for removing asbestos impregnated roofing materials, it takes only one fiber of asbestos embedded in the lung to cause mesothelioma and 20-40 years for mesothelioma to develop. Smoking increases the chances of developing lung cancer as well, providing a suitably sticky resin in the lungs to entrap and encapsulate fibers.

Clearly, repeated and prolonged exposure to fibers from friable asbestos increase the likelihood of developing mesothelioma, and most folks who develop it have done so after such exposure. I knew a man 20 years ago who'd been a mechanic and had developed the disease after many years of doing brake jobs.

When we were tearing off asbestos impregnated roofing, we saturated the roofing materials, then used manual means (not a roof cutter) to cut it before scooping it up with shovels and double bagging and duct taping the debris bags for removal to the dump, where it simply was discarded with all the other regular garbage. We were in Tyvek suits and wore respirators through the whole process.

Granted, the single or infrequent exposure to less friable asbestos in the form of tiling doesn't carry the same risk as roofing tear-off or pipe-insulation removal, but as I said, it takes only one fiber in the lung to cause disease.

It is unconscionable to hand out dust masks and ice chippers to a group of folks who are ostensibly your parishioners and tell them to go to town on asbestos tiling, especially when the church has ridiculously more than enough money to fund certified abatement at no risk to poorly equipped volunteers.

 

[Enthetan]

Since we have known for years that the Freewinds was stuffed with asbestos in the wall, ceilings, around pipes, etc, and that Freewinds was originally built to be a car ferry and not a passenger "cruise ship", and asbestos flooring and asbestos mastic (glue sludge for holding the floor tiles) were commonly used up through the 1980's, I would tend to be surprised if the floor tiles and mastic were not asbestos based.

^ This is an example of a run-on sentence. I heard scientology can help me with that.

Given that it was supposed to ferry cars, with gas tanks full of flammable gasoline, one would think that the original builders would have been EXTREMELY afraid of fire on board the ship, and would have put asbestos everywhere.

 

[AnonKat]

Given that it was supposed to ferry cars, with gas tanks full of flammable gasoline, one would think that the original builders would have been EXTREMELY afraid of fire on board the ship, and would have put asbestos everywhere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewinds

MV Freewinds is a cruise ship operated by International Shipping - Miami and owned by San Donato Properties, which is a company connected to the Church of Scientology. She was built in 1968 by Wärtsilä Turku Shipyard in Turku, Finland for Wallenius Lines as MS Bohème for service with Commodore Cruise Line. She was the first cruise ship built in Finland. Her ownership passed to a Church of Scientology-controlled company in 1985.[1] In April 2008, the Freewinds was sealed, and work stopped on refurbishments, due to "extensive contamination" with blue asbestos.[6] As of June 2009 its DNV listing states that the ship is "in operation".[7] 19 June 2009 she was in Saint Kitts beginning her 21st year of Caribbean cruising.[8]

 

[secretiveoldfag]

To go back to the photographs, they are dated between 12 May and 27 May 2010, a period when the failboat was in the Lesser Antilles, shuttling from Barbados to St Lucis and perhaps a third port as there are regular gaps in the information. 13 May was a Thursday so start of the week and its stats; 27th likewise.

It seemed to me these people were from some relatively impoverished Eastern European country, not Slavs, though one of the man looked Slavic. They are not smart enough to be Americans - they have bad dentition, bad hair, and are obviously poor enough to answer the call for slave labour. Are there orgs in Romania, or Bulgaria? Poland, anyone?

As for the tiles they might or might not contain asbestos but they seem to be damped down. The problem (as I understand it) is with air-borne dust which arises when the boat is underway and gets into the ventilation ducts. Apparently she vibrates something awful and the asbestos being god knows how old is friable.

Am I right in thinking that normally MEST work like this would be done by Sea Org or RPF? Where IS everyone these days? And how come it wasn't included in the $28 million spent 2009-2009?

As for cases of mesothelioma I know of one certain example (as certain as can be without reading the death certificate), which is Pamela Mallison, one-time IAS reg who lived on board for 9 years, got ill, was shipped off to the RPF at Saint Hill Manor, EG, and died there eventually of lung cancer. I would say, from memory, in 2006.

So far I have not identified any other similar cases but CoS is very coy about causes of death. They would probably describe mesothelioma as "natural causes".

 

[Enthetan]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewinds

Earlier in the same article:

The boat that eventually became known as the Freewinds was originally ordered by the Sweden-based Lion Ferry as the second in a pair of two car/passenger ferries for use on their new Bremerhaven (West Germany)—Harwich (United Kingdom) service, with provisions made for cruise service during the northern hemisphere winter season.