Leaving - need advice

[PirateAndBum]

Hi all, this is a great board. I'm so glad I found you all! I have been a Scientologist for over 30 years and have decided to leave the Church. I can't believe in all these years I never once looked at the "entheta" on the net.

About 3 weeks ago I met someone online that I was telling about Scientology. He came back to me with the datum that LRH had died under suspicious circumstances with psych drugs in his system. I of course thought this was complete BS. So, I went online to see where he might have found this crap! HAHA, the proverbial cat lept out of the bag in very short order. After reading the autopsy documents I knew I had been lied to in a very important matter; what other lies were there... OMG! For all of you this is old news, but for me is was a revelation and confirmation of doubts I have had since IG Bulletin #25 was placed in my hands a number of years ago - which I considered to be alter-is of the tech.

I devoured the data on the net, day after day, and it wasn't long before I knew that I could no longer be a member of the C of S.

Now, what you all could help me with is this: What is the best way to inform the Church? I have been a very active member of the field for many years, and my absence is already causing a flap Needless to say, the vast majority of my friends are Scientologists, including some family members. I have considered just not saying anything, but I don't see that that tactic is going to work too well, just trying to lay low, due to expectations for contribution which I am no longer inclined to make. I know that leaving the Church is going to get me declared a Super Person and I will thusly loose these friends and family members.

I have to say that it is quite an experience to come to this point after spending over half a lifetime dedicated to it. It is also quite freeing. It is something to experience coming out from under the squash of comformance. It is also enturbulating, wondering what is going to happen by doing this (action from the Church.) It also has smashed the stable datum of the "Bridge" and this is the most difficult issue to deal with. How am I to go OT now? So many things in the FZ, what is good, bad. So many uncertainties where there once was a stable datum.

Well, I could go on, but I think that's enough for now. Any advice on what might be the best way to depart would be appreciated.

Best,

P&B

 

[Zinjifar]

Suggestion? Probably keep doing what you're doing; reading, understanding, communicating. Take your time and get used to being 'out'. Depending on your own situation, Disconnection may or may not be an effective extortion tool against you, but, it sounds like you're prepared for the eventuality, which is good.

Unless you have unique and essential evidence or testimony to offer, that could help expose the 'Church' and stop its abuses, I think the most important thing for you is to find your own feet. You'll know what to do when it needs doing.

I'd highly recommend reading and then possibly posting your own story to the 'Through the Door' site, http://alley.ethercat.com/door/ .

And, of course, you can tell your story here and you'll almost certainly run into a lot of old friends

Welcome out!

Zinj

 

[jodie]

Hi and welcome to the Free World!

Bummer about still having family members and friends in. That is the hardest part to deal with.

Suggestion is that you do not do anything hastily, or rush. There is no need, no Thursday 2.00 pm deadline.

You know of course, if you formally inform the Church, they will try to handle you, find out which SPs you are connected to, and so on, and if you still persist in wanting to leave, you probably will be Declared. (heck, most of us on this Board are, so welcome to the Super Person Club).

Ultimately, none of us can tell you the best way to handle your situation, only you can do that, but we can be here for you, and some of the old timers can spell out more options.

There's plenty of places in the Free Zone to carry on getting the tech - especially take your time with that, research the different service providers, see what indicates for you.

Most of all, know that you are not alone in this - there are many here who will be here, to listen, or talk, as you go through this transition.

We are here for you.

- jodie

 

[Vinaire]

My first advice would be to carefully determine your new stable data. This will require determining exactly what was wrong with the existing stable data.

Things never exist as simply black and white. That is too simplistic.

This is an opportunity to really update your stable data as regarding rationality... what is rational and what is irrational?

What is the original technology and how it is consistent with its Eastern background? How that technology has been subverted through misunderstoods even by Hubbard himself?

What part of technology has hope?

It is a work in progress.

.

 

[nw2394]

Now, what you all could help me with is this: What is the best way to inform the Church?

There is no single right answer. Each person's situation is unique.

Personally I'd simply tell them that I don't want to participate any longer. That ducks the question a bit, but, realistically, if you want to do a formal doubt condition type of thing, it can take quite a while before you find your feet again.

If you want to continue your interest in the subject my old friend (and sometime adversay!!!) Terril Park (who posts on this board) knows just about anyone who is anyone in the more "standard" side of the field. And, if you don't want to do that, well, this board is a good place to just hang out with a wide spectrum of exes.

Nick

 

[Vinaire]

...
Now, what you all could help me with is this: What is the best way to inform the Church?
...

My approach has been to inform the Church that I am all for Scientology but not for the squirreling of Scientology.

I showed them how the Church was squirreling in their dealing with me and what they had to do in terms of following LRH tech and policy.

I have openly disagreed with the Church where they are squirreling, and they have left me alone.

They know they can exercise no power over me.

I am still in "good standing" with the Church.

The correct product of Scientology is SELF-DETERMINISM.

Use it, and tell the Church to use it too and not be robotic.

.

 

[Alanzo]

Who cares about the Church?

I think we get stuck in the "Doubt Formula public announcement" thing.

I say ignore the Church and just start building your new life. You've paid them every advantage. No need to continue that any longer. Take the advantages for yourself from now on.

Carefully examine what the exact effect would be of letting the church know your real position.

Who will this benefit the most?

Probably not you. They want to know if you are in or out so they can quarantine you and protect the rest of the group from your new understanding of and data about Scientology.

Part of being in a cult is to work against your own self-interests. Don't do that any more.

Do what benefits YOU.

That's what I think.

 

[Vinaire]

The best course is the course you embarked on originally which led you to Scientology.

Keep pursuing your original course. Reject those things in current Scientology that do not forward your original goals.

My goal has been knowing how to know, which is not necessarily what currently is being pushed under the label "Scientology."

.

 

[PirateAndBum]

Vinaire, I haven't had any squirrel handling from the local org to speak of and I'm not particularly interested in trying to explain my reasons for leaving, because, as many here have said, noone is going understand.

Alanzo, it isn't that I want to do a doubt formula annoucement. It's that we get 4-6 calls a day from the org. Many of the staff are good friends and are in mystery as to the cut comm. But your point is well taken, thank you.

I really don't want to put it on their lines Yet being out of comm is creating a situation that probably is going to result in a visit to my home.

I guess I'm just trying to prolong the inevitable. I wonder how long it will take to work up the ethics gradients to being declared for not answering the phone?

No doubt, they will try to handle us. Of that I am quite sure.

P&B

 

[Vinaire]

Vinaire, I haven't had any squirrel handling from the local org to speak of and I'm not particularly interested in trying to explain my reasons for leaving, because, as many here have said, noone is going understand.

Alanzo, it isn't that I want to do a doubt formula annoucement. It's that we get 4-6 calls a day from the org. Many of the staff are good friends and are in mystery as to the cut comm. But your point is well taken, thank you.

I really don't want to put it on their lines Yet being out of comm is creating a situation that probably is going to result in a visit to my home.

I guess I'm just trying to prolong the inevitable. I wonder how long it will take to work up the ethics gradients to being declared for not answering the phone?

No doubt, they will try to handle us. Of that I am quite sure.

P&B

I think that the Church is squirreling in their use of ETHICS. The use of ethics is slanted more toward PUNISHMENT than toward the use of rationality.

Also, it is obvious that the Church is longer operating on the goal to clear the planet with their emphasis on PR instead of spreading grass root technology.

.

 

[lionheart]

Vinaire, I haven't had any squirrel handling from the local org to speak of and I'm not particularly interested in trying to explain my reasons for leaving, because, as many here have said, noone is going understand.

Alanzo, it isn't that I want to do a doubt formula annoucement. It's that we get 4-6 calls a day from the org. Many of the staff are good friends and are in mystery as to the cut comm. But your point is well taken, thank you.

I really don't want to put it on their lines Yet being out of comm is creating a situation that probably is going to result in a visit to my home.

I guess I'm just trying to prolong the inevitable. I wonder how long it will take to work up the ethics gradients to being declared for not answering the phone?

No doubt, they will try to handle us. Of that I am quite sure.

P&B

I think it depends on whether you want to stay connected to friends and family who might stay in.

When I got declared in 82 I openly told everyone about the misuse that Scn was being put to. In many ways the decision was made for me by the declare, but essentially the situation is the same. I decided whether I wanted to stay out or get back in. Once I decided to stay out I just told people. Some stayed loyal to me and left Scn too, some stayed kindly disposed to me, but decided to stay in and so disconnected from me. Some said I was obviously an SP!

That is what will happen to you if you go public with them about your wanting to be out of the CofS. If that is what you decide, then tell as many people as you can what you have discovered about Scn and invite them to find out about it for themselves. Some will, some won't, some will stay friends, some won't.

If you decide you do not want to potentially get disconnected from family and friends, then you will have to devise strategies for not telling people what your viewpoint now is. I can't advise you how to do that as I have no experience of that strategy, but one or two people on here are using that strategy, so may be able to advise you.

Good luck!

 

[Veda]

I think that the Church is squirreling in their use of ETHICS. The use of ethics is slanted more toward PUNISHMENT than toward the use of rationality.

Also, it is obvious that the Church is longer operating on the goal to clear the planet with their emphasis on PR instead of spreading grass root technology.

.

Vin, I don't think this person wants to debate you, right now, on your unrealistic and imaginary idealized version of Scientology.

Scientology is pretty much as Hubbard designed it, but it's secretive, even from its own membership - thus there is confusion by well meaning persons such as Vin.

Nonetheless, if PirateAndBum wants to encourage Scientology Inc. to leave him alone, telling them that "Current management is squirreling Ron's tech," as simplistic and naive as that assertion may be, might just make them back off.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=53878&postcount=46

 

[Terril park]

Vinaire, I haven't had any squirrel handling from the local org to speak of and I'm not particularly interested in trying to explain my reasons for leaving, because, as many here have said, noone is going understand.

Alanzo, it isn't that I want to do a doubt formula annoucement. It's that we get 4-6 calls a day from the org. Many of the staff are good friends and are in mystery as to the cut comm. But your point is well taken, thank you.

I really don't want to put it on their lines Yet being out of comm is creating a situation that probably is going to result in a visit to my home.

I guess I'm just trying to prolong the inevitable. I wonder how long it will take to work up the ethics gradients to being declared for not answering the phone?

No doubt, they will try to handle us. Of that I am quite sure.

P&B

"Pirate and bum" is a cool nick!

If you wish to minimise personal interaction and problems with COS
just be elusive. They ring you up to confirm you for an event, say
"I'm coming." And don't. They wish to reg you, tell a story as to why you can't pay for anything. A true story is quite acceptable. But needs to be a story a reg can't bust down. If you can be tough and know something of policy ect, be quite overt about not wanting to be harrassed. Its not in
the list of SP actions to refuse to be regged.

They come to the door, don't let them in. Give any old excuse you wish, but politely cut the comm.

I can testify that these all work as I did them for many years. I too didn't
want to hurt these guys. In a sense they are me and I am them.

IMO the last stated action was non optimum. I was puzzled as for years I had been promoting how one can do all including upper levels outside COS.
Really high profile. St Hill didn't seem to know. Even after I told a couple of
call in people about " Tech outside COS", and the Freezone, still got call in.

Till DM did an event at St Hill. Then I got called by a sweet E/O and deadfiled.

In a broader view, if you still wish to follow the tech, you may wish to let people know they can do it outside the auspices of DM and COS. And much
cheaper! And with less hassle!

It may speed up a declare or something, but so what.

You got close family and friends in, the stealth route may be best.
Otherwise, just try to help your friends escape would be good.

Your call.

 

[Mick Wenlock]

Hi all, this is a great board. I'm so glad I found you all! I have been a Scientologist for over 30 years and have decided to leave the Church. I can't believe in all these years I never once looked at the "entheta" on the net.

About 3 weeks ago I met someone online that I was telling about Scientology. He came back to me with the datum that LRH had died under suspicious circumstances with psych drugs in his system. I of course thought this was complete BS. So, I went online to see where he might have found this crap! HAHA, the proverbial cat lept out of the bag in very short order. After reading the autopsy documents I knew I had been lied to in a very important matter; what other lies were there... OMG! For all of you this is old news, but for me is was a revelation and confirmation of doubts I have had since IG Bulletin #25 was placed in my hands a number of years ago - which I considered to be alter-is of the tech.

I devoured the data on the net, day after day, and it wasn't long before I knew that I could no longer be a member of the C of S.

Now, what you all could help me with is this: What is the best way to inform the Church? I have been a very active member of the field for many years, and my absence is already causing a flap Needless to say, the vast majority of my friends are Scientologists, including some family members. I have considered just not saying anything, but I don't see that that tactic is going to work too well, just trying to lay low, due to expectations for contribution which I am no longer inclined to make. I know that leaving the Church is going to get me declared a Super Person and I will thusly loose these friends and family members.

I have to say that it is quite an experience to come to this point after spending over half a lifetime dedicated to it. It is also quite freeing. It is something to experience coming out from under the squash of comformance. It is also enturbulating, wondering what is going to happen by doing this (action from the Church.) It also has smashed the stable datum of the "Bridge" and this is the most difficult issue to deal with. How am I to go OT now? So many things in the FZ, what is good, bad. So many uncertainties where there once was a stable datum.

Well, I could go on, but I think that's enough for now. Any advice on what might be the best way to depart would be appreciated.

Best,

P&B

Seriously P&B you do not need to do anything at all.

You are an adult - you OWE Scientology nothing at all, you certainly do not owe them an explanation or anything else.

This is probably the hardest thing to understand when you first get out. You no longer have any reason to explain to anyone what you are doing unless you choose to do so.

So if they call you to come in - just say "no thanks". Don't explain, just say no and put the phone down. If someone comes to your door just explain that you don't have the time to talk and close the door. Don't discuss, don't argue, don't explain.

Much more fun.

 

[PirateAndBum]

Vin, I don't think this person wants to debate you, right now, on your unrealistic and imaginary idealized version of Scientology.

Scientology is pretty much as Hubbard designed it, but it's secretive, even from its own membership - thus there is confusion by well meaning persons such as Vin.

Nonetheless, if PirateAndBum wants to encourage Scientology Inc. to leave him alone, telling them that "Current management is squirreling Ron's tech," as simplistic and naive as that assertion may be, might just make them back off.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=53878&postcount=46

True, I'm not interesting debating the tech/ethics/admin at this point.

I am curious why you say that statement is naive?

I know I don't owe C of S anything, but I am not upset with Scientologists in general, they, in the main, are sincerely trying to make a better world and are oblivious to the real scene. Telling them my thoughts on current management would go over like a plutonium balloon

I really appreciate all of your advice and support. It really helps to have people to talk to about this.

 

[PirateAndBum]

"Pirate and bum" is a cool nick!

IMO the last stated action was non optimum.

Which action were you refering to? Shutting the door in their face?

Trying to help my friends escape, hehe -- yeah, take every OL out of the field along with me, Clears & OTs arise! Nothing to loose but your certs

As much as I'd like that, I know that isn't gonna happen. It would however speed the approval lines on the goldenrod. I'm not interested in sowing upset in the field. My departure will be unsettling enough as it is without my adding to it. I guess I'm still feeling benevolent. Things will likely change as things heat up. Maybe I'm just mocking up problems and should relax.

 

[Veda]

True, I'm not interesting debating the tech/ethics/admin at this point.

I am curious why you say that statement is naive?

I know I don't owe C of S anything, but I am not upset with Scientologists in general, they, in the main, are sincerely trying to make a better world and are oblivious to the real scene. Telling them my thoughts on current management would go over like a putonium ballon

I really appreciate all of your advice and support. It really helps to have people to talk to about this.

I can only tell you my thoughts, which are that, while there is some "squirreling" by current management, the over-all pattern of Scientology is as designed by its founder.

I agree with you that most Scientologists are sincerely trying to make a better world, and are oblivious to the real scene.

Hope that you find the above links to be helpful.

 

[Vinaire]

Vin, I don't think this person wants to debate you, right now, on your unrealistic and imaginary idealized version of Scientology.

Scientology is pretty much as Hubbard designed it, but it's secretive, even from its own membership - thus there is confusion by well meaning persons such as Vin.

Nonetheless, if PirateAndBum wants to encourage Scientology Inc. to leave him alone, telling them that "Current management is squirreling Ron's tech," as simplistic and naive as that assertion may be, might just make them back off.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=53878&postcount=46

Thank you, Veda.

.

 

[Zinjifar]

I am curious why you say that statement is naive?

I kind of assume that he means that the naivete in the statement relates to the fact that *Ron* is Scientology's most prolific 'squirrel' and that 'outpoints' and abuses begin with Him; rather than 'current management'.

Zinj

 

[Pierrot]

I really appreciate all of your advice and support. It really helps to have people to talk to about this.

You can chose to become, lightly then more so, "disaffected" to begin with. So it's not a harsh move.

Then also apply the CofS PL about dealing with Official Organizations - that means you don't volunteer more info than needed for the situation at hand. And to the correct terminals so you don't disperse and don't mud your friends/family ties.

Other than that, in my opinion, honesty and integrity on your part will get you through. Good luck