What's new

Time to Turn the Tables

Feral

Rogue male
Many of us have been Scios for years, we are used to playing the game by the cults rules. Most of us see the flaws in their 'ethics codes' and policy, but still some of the exes play the role in the game that the cult wants them to play.

They play 'silent dissenter' or 'quietly ARCx public' or many other unhappy parts.

In the components of a game reference from Hubbard in the PDC lectures those roles are best described as 'broken pieces'.

Perhaps there could be a better role to play. It would change the world of scientology over night if all the exes simply spoke their mind.

For example; The org calls you up for the 1000th time to go to an event, you tell them that you hate events as they remind you of how the cult was taken over in the '80s by DM.

You sit down and actually tell the dearest scios friends how you feel and why, being as careful as possible not to exceed their reality.

You openly question the 10,000,000 members to the org staff.

Or to ask why we need multi million dollar buildings when the ideal org PL did not mention "new buildings", perhaps students and pcs would be the place to begin.

OK, you get the idea. So, if you know all this yourself and there is no way you can continue in the cult....what do you have to lose? Some friends might disconnect from you, losing friends is painful, but aren't they already lost to you? And what kind of friend knows what we know yet says nothing? The ones that do see the truth will thank you.

You might get declared too......I think that is the highest honor a flawed and dying cult like scientology can bestow upon a person.

Some of you are vulnerable as you have kids in the SO, a zealot spouse or business dealings with scios etc. I understand that and have no easy answer to those complexities.

In all the world, except scientology, it is not a crime or high crime to say so when you get bad results, to point out the flaws and out right lies in PR or to ask why the results are just not there, in fact it is a normal civic duty.

I am mostly talking here to you lurkers who are parked and wish you every happiness and success.

After 15 years as a flag public on solo nots, I know for me, my sanity and state of mind I need to break the chains that were draped over me in those endless eligs and ethics cycles every 6 mths. This is my way. It may not be yours.

Whatcha think?
 
Last edited:

Good twin

Floater
Yes, Kevin. I have been sorting this out for a while now myself. I have been weighing out what is at stake and how to maximize my impact when I do come out. I belong to a ...um... WEB (for lack of a better word) of Exes, all with varying connections. My comm lines into the church are decreasing in value rapidly. The Ex community is getting stronger and larger just as rapidly. I am working on mending some of the other broken pieces in my circle. Things are coming along nicely. I have heard of Exes doing just what you propose. Just speaking honestly and from the heart. One in particular I heard about really let it rip. The consequence? None so far. Utter silence. Non confront in the extreme. But it WAS heard. As others will be heard. The tables are turning. Faster than you might think......:yes:
GT
 

ttamaad

Silver Meritorious Patron
Totally agree.

When compassion, empathy and common sense are considered counter productive, and the way to get more out of the troops, is to shout louder and threaten a life devoid of any basic necessities then something more needs to be done

With the great people here speaking their mind and voicing their disapproval, we will be part of the turning tide.
 

Terril park

Sponsor
In all the world, except scientology, it is not a crime or high crime to say so when you get bad results, to point out the flaws and out right lies in PR or to ask why the results are just not there, in fact it is a normal civic duty.

Also in COS. Per KSW 1, Senior policy, reports, and elsewhere.

They don't work and get you in trouble. The civic duty remains however.
Its one thing we do here, and some work on informing authorities, protesting etc.
 

KnightVision

Gold Meritorious Patron
Many of us have been Scios for years, we are used to playing the game by the cults rules. Most of us see the flaws in their 'ethics codes' and policy, but still some of the exes play the role in the game that the cult wants them to play.

They play 'silent dissenter' or 'quietly ARCx public' or many other unhappy parts.

In the components of a game reference from Hubbard in the PDC lectures those roles are best described as 'broken pieces'.

Perhaps there could be a better role to play. It would change the world of scientology over night if all the exes simply spoke their mind.

For example; The org calls you up for the 1000th time to go to an event, you tell them that you hate events as they remind you of how the cult was taken over in the '80s by DM.

You sit down and actually tell the dearest scios friends how you feel and why, being as careful as possible not to exceed their reality.

You openly question the 10,000,000 members to the org.

OK, you get the idea. So, if you know it is true and there is no way you can continue in the cult....what do you have to lose? Some friends might disconnect from you, losing friends is painful, but aren't they already lost to you? And what kind of friend knows what we know yet says nothing? The one that do see the truth will thank you.

You might get declared too......I think that is the highest honor a corrupt cult like scientology can bestow upon a person.

Some of you are vulnerable as you have kids in the SO, a zealot spouse or business dealings with scios etc. I understand that and have no easy answer.

But

I couldn't agree more. I have read a lot of leaving stories and new member posts or had talks or PM's with so many ex members who are 'afraid' to go public for one reason or another. I am convinced that ex members are in fact (by default of their silence and 'keeping cover')... allowing the Co$ to continue manipulating and controlling them AND others. They are 'hiding' in the hopes of 'avoiding' their 'punishment' for having realized that the Co$ and or Scn. is a Fraudulent and Criminal as well a waste of time and money.

I have found it to be true that 'ANY DECISION MADE OUT OF FEAR, IS THE WRONG DECISION'. Any such decision serves only to prolong the inevitable of facing up to one's aggressor and the consequences. One does not 'avoid' the consequences by 'remaining silent'. The consequences are already 'squashing one' or 'suppressing one'. In other words the Co$ is actively achieving their aim. The ex member will remain at effect to the Co$ until the decision is made to and actions are started to become cause.

The ability of the Co$ to continue it's reign of suppressive influence over oneself, loved ones and friends is in direct relation to the willingness of those affected to overtly take bold, honest and legal steps to defend what is right and expose what is not.

Waiting is not the answer. Being clever about it can be and probably is needed if one knows members still 'in'. Develop a strategy to contact as many of them as possible and give them some truth about it. It's best to make an impact with everyone possible still in, then if one is 'declared' or 'disconnected from'... the situation can evolve to a higher profile stance. Ex members have unlimited resources at their disposal these days.

I think we, the ex-members have not even begun to realize the power of our voice and our witness to the truth. No Gov't agency is going to 'handle them for us' unless we cause the tide to turn first. Many are already actively doing their part, but I believe the majority have yet to make themselves heard.
 

klidov

Silver Meritorious Patron
^^^THIS^^^

just in the short time I have been a member here, I have seen certain individuals grow stronger. (We do sometimes cling to what we know.)

Everyone who has moved on deserves a :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
 

EP - Ethics Particle

Gold Meritorious Patron
Right's right and wrong don't belong to nobody - never did!

...deletions...

After 15 years as a flag public on solo nots, I know for me, my sanity and state of mind I need to break the chains that were draped over me in those endless eligs and ethics cycles every 6 mths. This is my way. It may not be yours.

Whatcha think?

Kevin, the day is almost upon us! Stay tuned....:yes:

Roy and the EP's
 

Good twin

Floater
See Kevin. There is much bubblin to the surface as we speak. This forum has served to heal many a broken piece, and it has banded together many who thought they were alone. Trouble brewin for Co$. Each story told here has helped to make others a little braver; a little less broken. Sharing the victories of those who have been brave enough to speak out has made many stronger and more determined. So please keep sharing and speaking out. You are being heard. WE are being heard.:yes:
 

Stan D'Teque

Patron with Honors
Amen to that, Father Feral. I've just sent Feral the first 4,000 or so words of "Thirty Years in the Fourth Reich" for his perusal and hopefully pleasure. Right now I have about a week left before I can "come out in all my naked glory" - a scary and somewhat sickening thought if you take it literally - I doubt my aging body has too much aesthetic appeal these days. However, I have a plan I'm working off and once that's complete, out I come. Lurkers please listen when I say get yourselves a plan of what you need to do so you can come out into the light. You just have to remember the Co$ has NO PLAN!! Nor any idea for that matter - they are totally on cope. The more we push, the further they go under, the faster it all ends and the less people get hurt.
 

ttamaad

Silver Meritorious Patron
Right now I have about a week left before I can "come out in all my naked glory" -

Not to hijack this thread, Stan, but good luck and good wishes. Somehow I feel I know you well already, but keep with the plan and we'll catch up for a beer in all your naked glory :D
 

Iknowtoomuch

Gold Meritorious Patron
Amen to that, Father Feral. I've just sent Feral the first 4,000 or so words of "Thirty Years in the Fourth Reich" for his perusal and hopefully pleasure. Right now I have about a week left before I can "come out in all my naked glory" - a scary and somewhat sickening thought if you take it literally - I doubt my aging body has too much aesthetic appeal these days. However, I have a plan I'm working off and once that's complete, out I come. Lurkers please listen when I say get yourselves a plan of what you need to do so you can come out into the light. You just have to remember the Co$ has NO PLAN!! Nor any idea for that matter - they are totally on cope. The more we push, the further they go under, the faster it all ends and the less people get hurt.



That's great news. I'm sending BFG my story as soon as I'm done writing it. I wont be speaking my name till the 500 stories are posted publicly though.
 

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
See Kevin. There is much bubblin to the surface as we speak. This forum has served to heal many a broken piece, and it has banded together many who thought they were alone.
This has certainly been true for me. Just a year ago I went into debt to support my daughter, newly posted on staff, by buying the basics through her, and a copy for herself! I really believed they were a big breakthrough, blah blah blah. :duh: I wanted to support her, since she and her boyfriend were such new Scns. If only I had seen this board a year earlier, that would have been the perfect opportunity to tell her I don't support the church and will never buy their stuff!! But I didn't know. I was already on ext. courses when the new books came out, so I continued doing them on the new books, but I answer the lessons honestly that I don't agree with the books. (Now I have stopped sending lessons in altogether.) I have already been giving the orgs my viewpoint. I submitted a thread here entitled "I answered a survey honestly!" I have already been talking to my friends about this stuff, because how can you NOT? Once you learn the truth, you can't go back. Just a couple of months ago I was still terrified of Flag and orgs and the phone calls and letters. There was one girl that called me from Flag every single month at least for 2 years, I never returned the call. I finally wrote her a letter. She wrote back that she liked my glitter pens. I had an extra glitter pen and sent it to her. Never heard from her again. Not a thank you, nothing. Maybe the pen got stolen from her letter? Anyway, I replied briefly and honestly that I wouldn't be staying at the Sandcastle any more, here's a pen. Hope you like it. My MAA called for the first time in 2 years. I wrote her a letter about how happy I am. I told her I found God. :omg: Haven't heard from her again. I still never answer my phone, but because of this board I can actually listen to the messages and hit "delete" with impunity. This is an entirely new state for me! I was honest even when I was still in the church. I have no idea how I didn't get into more "trouble" than I did, because I was pretty outspoken with my disagreements. I guess they had bigger fish to fry. One of my girlfriends reminded me that it was just a few weeks ago that I freaked when she said she might check out the FZ because I would have to disconnect from her! Like I would ever do that now! But I was still thinking that I would be forced to if she went to the FZ. Anyway, I think it is a natural occurrence once you change the way you live and think to start talking the new talk. You can't help it. Henning's emails to me used to give me anxiety attacks. He just sent me this "product-officer" type email today. I just wrote back that the recent video I sent him says it all. That is not the way I usually replied to him!!! (The video was one WO posted on another thread that was very uplifting.) Gosh I don't usually talk this much! Anyway, my point is that things can't be forced. I think the natural outcome of this board is going to be a growing tidal wave that wipes out CoS without even trying, just doing what it is that we do here, waking up slowly or quickly, wandering out of our fogs...
 
Last edited:

Stan D'Teque

Patron with Honors
Right on, Happy Girl. This is a tidal wave and I think those at the top of the Co$ actually do know it too. The more of us who do the most we can do to show we don't agree with the Co$ any more , the faster that ship will sink and then we can rescue whoever can't swim by themselves. This board has been sooooo therapeutic for me - I wouldn't have survived without it. Some of you know me and what I've been through and it's really hard sometime to look at what I've been living these last thirty years without feeling VERY depressed. Knowing there's a lot of people who contribue to this board and who do care has started to crack the "TRs in for life" that's had me emotionally hard as a rock for way too long. Hell, the worst part of it has been to admit to myself that I've been sooooooooo wrong for staying with such an organizaton as the Co$ despite all the data to the contrary that I saw. Thanks guys.
 

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
Right on, Happy Girl. This is a tidal wave and I think those at the top of the Co$ actually do know it too. The more of us who do the most we can do to show we don't agree with the Co$ any more , the faster that ship will sink and then we can rescue whoever can't swim by themselves. This board has been sooooo therapeutic for me - I wouldn't have survived without it. Some of you know me and what I've been through and it's really hard sometime to look at what I've been living these last thirty years without feeling VERY depressed. Knowing there's a lot of people who contribue to this board and who do care has started to crack the "TRs in for life" that's had me emotionally hard as a rock for way too long. Hell, the worst part of it has been to admit to myself that I've been sooooooooo wrong for staying with such an organizaton as the Co$ despite all the data to the contrary that I saw. Thanks guys.
:hug:
 

Whitedove

Patron Meritorious
You know, I tought alot about 'coming out' lately. I actually would like to have an SP declare. Believe it or not! :omg: Because that would mean, to me, I have my soul back, completely.

Maybe I will do it eventually but there is someone who is still very much 'in' and if I was to do this it will do more damage to some people very close to me. So, for now, I'm staying in the dark but I hope I can come out one day.
 
Great thread

I thought I'd add a success story here.

A few days ago we had a family member return from Flag. We got in comm with her and after a long comm cycle started to find a reality she could handle regarding what is going on. We brought her awareness up to the outpoints she could confront, and then started sharing what is really happening in a way she could handle it.

By the end of the conversation, we had shared everything and she was done with the group. One of the key points we discussed was what she felt about the new OT8s, which was they were a huge outpoint, and she didn't see anything worthy of respect. Later in the comm, she again referred to her goal of freedom and going clear, and we were able to point out that this was a totally false promise, as it wasn't available for them to sell, and brought her back to the point of the seeing the top of the bridge was false.

I guess my key point here is that there is in almost anyone an awareness, but coming with it is a refusal to confront. If you can bring the confront up, the doors open.
 

dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
I thought I'd add a success story here.

A few days ago we had a family member return from Flag. We got in comm with her and after a long comm cycle started to find a reality she could handle regarding what is going on. We brought her awareness up to the outpoints she could confront, and then started sharing what is really happening in a way she could handle it.

By the end of the conversation, we had shared everything and she was done with the group. One of the key points we discussed was what she felt about the new OT8s, which was they were a huge outpoint, and she didn't see anything worthy of respect. Later in the comm, she again referred to her goal of freedom and going clear, and we were able to point out that this was a totally false promise, as it wasn't available for them to sell, and brought her back to the point of the seeing the top of the bridge was false.

I guess my key point here is that there is in almost anyone an awareness, but coming with it is a refusal to confront. If you can bring the confront up, the doors open.

That is incredibly wonderful Voldemorte. This could even be useful for Anon protests in which anon's might discuss outpoints.

I do realize it was family, which is super as NO disconnection, but a little more detail on how the confront was brought up, or what got the conversation going onto the outpoints would be wonderful.

So very happy for you and the family member.:eyeroll:
 

Pixie

Crusader
This has certainly been true for me. Just a year ago I went into debt to support my daughter, newly posted on staff, by buying the basics through her, and a copy for herself! I really believed they were a big breakthrough, blah blah blah. :duh: I wanted to support her, since she and her boyfriend were such new Scns. If only I had seen this board a year earlier, that would have been the perfect opportunity to tell her I don't support the church and will never buy their stuff!! But I didn't know. I was already on ext. courses when the new books came out, so I continued doing them on the new books, but I answer the lessons honestly that I don't agree with the books. (Now I have stopped sending lessons in altogether.) I have already been giving the orgs my viewpoint. I submitted a thread here entitled "I answered a survey honestly!" I have already been talking to my friends about this stuff, because how can you NOT? Once you learn the truth, you can't go back. Just a couple of months ago I was still terrified of Flag and orgs and the phone calls and letters. There was one girl that called me from Flag every single month at least for 2 years, I never returned the call. I finally wrote her a letter. She wrote back that she liked my glitter pens. I had an extra glitter pen and sent it to her. Never heard from her again. Not a thank you, nothing. Maybe the pen got stolen from her letter? Anyway, I replied briefly and honestly that I wouldn't be staying at the Sandcastle any more, here's a pen. Hope you like it. My MAA called for the first time in 2 years. I wrote her a letter about how happy I am. I told her I found God. :omg: Haven't heard from her again. I still never answer my phone, but because of this board I can actually listen to the messages and hit "delete" with impunity. This is an entirely new state for me! I was honest even when I was still in the church. I have no idea how I didn't get into more "trouble" than I did, because I was pretty outspoken with my disagreements. I guess they had bigger fish to fry. One of my girlfriends reminded me that it was just a few weeks ago that I freaked when she said she might check out the FZ because I would have to disconnect from her! Like I would ever do that now! But I was still thinking that I would be forced to if she went to the FZ. Anyway, I think it is a natural occurrence once you change the way you live and think to start talking the new talk. You can't help it. Henning's emails to me used to give me anxiety attacks. He just sent me this "product-officer" type email today. I just wrote back that the recent video I sent him says it all. That is not the way I usually replied to him!!! (The video was one WO posted on another thread that was very uplifting.) Gosh I don't usually talk this much! Anyway, my point is that things can't be forced. I think the natural outcome of this board is going to be a growing tidal wave that wipes out CoS without even trying, just doing what it is that we do here, waking up slowly or quickly, wandering out of our fogs...

This is an excellent post and I understand totally how you feel. I remember just six or seven months ago getting a bona fide KR written on me a copy of which was sent to my email address. I felt physically sick, I went totally nuts and totally effect of the whole experience. Had I not had someone there to help hold my hand I'd probably still be in a state, but luckily, a friend I used to have while in had been mailing me at the time and it was him who helped me wake up. But even during waking up, and I was convinced it was a scam at that stage, I still felt paranoid. Now it was only someone still in that I'm still in contact with as a friend, but it floored me. I couldn't get it into my head that it meant nothing, to me it was still a big deal.

Anyway, yes, it does take time, and although my own journey has been quite rapid, there are still so many other ways that I just may not be aware of and that's what scares me. What other weird behaviours did this cause without my knowing. Hell it was only a week ago I realized that having a row with someone doesn't make them an arch enemy!!!!!

When I came to the board first I thought that people were exaggerating when they said it takes years. I used to laugh!!!!! And every once in a while I convince myself I'm fine, then something else crops up here, like the story you have just told and wakes me up to something else. And for me now, THAT is what this board is really all about. That is it's foundation, waking up, learning, helping, sharing, nourturing each other, being honest and learning to trust again. The humour threads help to ease the weirdness and the depression one can feel when reading a sad or shocking story, but the roots of the board are helping more than we realize, sharing all this with each other and realizing things about yourself, learning about yourself and the effects it had. It's the bits we don't know that we have to find out, only then can we move on.

Great post as always Happy Happy Happy Girl!! :thumbsup:
 

Pixie

Crusader
This is an excellent post and I understand totally how you feel. I remember just six or seven months ago getting a bona fide KR written on me a copy of which was sent to my email address. I felt physically sick, I went totally nuts and totally effect of the whole experience. Had I not had someone there to help hold my hand I'd probably still be in a state, but luckily, a friend I used to have while in had been mailing me at the time and it was him who helped me wake up. But even during waking up, and I was convinced it was a scam at that stage, I still felt paranoid. Now it was only someone still in that I'm still in contact with as a friend, but it floored me. I couldn't get it into my head that it meant nothing, to me it was still a big deal.

Anyway, yes, it does take time, and although my own journey has been quite rapid, there are still so many other ways that I just may not be aware of and that's what scares me. What other weird behaviours did this cause without my knowing. Hell it was only a week ago I realized that having a row with someone doesn't make them an arch enemy!!!!!

When I came to the board first I thought that people were exaggerating when they said it takes years. I used to laugh!!!!! And every once in a while I convince myself I'm fine, then something else crops up here, like the story you have just told and wakes me up to something else. And for me now, THAT is what this board is really all about. That is it's foundation, waking up, learning, helping, sharing, nourturing each other, being honest and learning to trust again. The humour threads help to ease the weirdness and the depression one can feel when reading a sad or shocking story, but the roots of the board are helping more than we realize, sharing all this with each other and realizing things about yourself, learning about yourself and the effects it had. It's the bits we don't know that we have to find out, only then can we move on.

Great post as always Happy Happy Happy Girl!! :thumbsup:

Keep writing, and keep letting it out. :yes:
 
Top